The Christianity of Christmas

[Cheyenne]

Mostly business interests.


Only 9 weeks left, get your shopping done!

It IS just about done. Probably at least 90% or more. We just loaded up boxes of presents last night to take to my mom's house today to store until Christmas eve with the nieces and nephew. Have a few more things on order that aren't delivered yet and a couple more things to get and then the family is done. That leaves the kids we adopt at work from a local school. I won't know which kids I get this year until probably early November but based on past years, I even have things purchased for them already. Some dolls, princess outfits, etc. I just need to get kids in the right age group for the gifts I already have and then add a few more gifts specific to the child.

 

[Mansa Musa]

It's when agendas get involved that religions turn ugly.

Religion is an agenda. Christianity, theoretically, should be the simplest religion on the planet. Instead, Judaism is added to the mix, cuz Jeezuz wuz a Jew. And you can´t forget the pandering to the converted masses, of course. The Golden Rule is the simplest idea on the planet. Yet, people have to find some way to compound it with frippery about avoiding pork or burning incense on special days.

 

[Darktan]

I was at the grocery store today and I noticed that they already have their Christmas stuff out. I remember a conversation I had with a frustratingly liberal friend of mine who said that Christmas decorations shouldn't be displayed in stores because it violates the rights of people with other faiths.

I have two issues with that, of course. One, isn't forcing a store to remove their Christian symbols a violation of the store owner's freedom of expression? Secondly, and more importantly, if the symbols consist of Santa Claus and Christmas Trees, are those really Christian symbols?

Is Christmas even really exclusively Christian anymore? It seems that the secular interests of Christmas have almost completely eclipsed the religious aspects of it.

Now, let's not get too far from the truth. People still believe that Christmas is a time for fellowship and an opportunity to show human kindness and compassion to our fellow human beings. But, it does that almost without mentioning religion at all.

Hasn't Christmas more or less been co-opted by seculars, not to mention business interests?

We're ignoring the real issue here. Having Christmas decorations and songs from October to the end of December is annoying as hell and must be stopped religious, secular, or otherwise.

 

[English Lady]

We're ignoring the real issue here. Having Christmas decorations and songs from October to the end of December is annoying as hell and must be stopped religious, secular, or otherwise.

Amen Brother!

 

[Sean]

We're ignoring the real issue here. Having Christmas decorations and songs from October to the end of December is annoying as hell and must be stopped religious, secular, or otherwise.

Tesco had Christmas puddings and Christmas cakes on sale from mid September.

 

[MechaBlade]

I was at the grocery store today and I noticed that they already have their Christmas stuff out. I remember a conversation I had with a frustratingly liberal friend of mine who said that Christmas decorations shouldn't be displayed in stores because it violates the rights of people with other faiths.

I have two issues with that, of course. One, isn't forcing a store to remove their Christian symbols a violation of the store owner's freedom of expression? Secondly, and more importantly, if the symbols consist of Santa Claus and Christmas Trees, are those really Christian symbols?

Is Christmas even really exclusively Christian anymore? It seems that the secular interests of Christmas have almost completely eclipsed the religious aspects of it.

Now, let's not get too far from the truth. People still believe that Christmas is a time for fellowship and an opportunity to show human kindness and compassion to our fellow human beings. But, it does that almost without mentioning religion at all.

Hasn't Christmas more or less been co-opted by seculars, not to mention business interests?

Yeah, you're friend's dumb. Christianity is hella secular.

 

[The Heretic]

I was at the grocery store today and I noticed that they already have their Christmas stuff out. I remember a conversation I had with a frustratingly liberal friend of mine who said that Christmas decorations shouldn't be displayed in stores because it violates the rights of people with other faiths.

I have two issues with that, of course. One, isn't forcing a store to remove their Christian symbols a violation of the store owner's freedom of expression?

A store, or any business is not a government entity, it is a private sector business, so if they show symbols of any faith, at any time, they are not violating any person's rights. Your friend (who sounds like a knee jerk liberal) needs to remember that it is a separation of church and state, not church and person (or business). The purpose is not to allow the government to mandate a religion (or a lack of religion). Private (as in non-governmental) display of religion is allowed. To not allow it would be to violate the rights of those people who own the business.

Secondly, and more importantly, if the symbols consist of Santa Claus and Christmas Trees, are those really Christian symbols?

Not really. Those are thought of as secular symbols of Christmas.

Is Christmas even really exclusively Christian anymore?

....

Hasn't Christmas more or less been co-opted by seculars, not to mention business interests?

No and yes, to a certain degree.

 

[Hester]

these days christmas is as christian as halloween is pagan.

 

[breakwall]

these days christmas is as christian as halloween is pagan.

That's true.

Christmas has become by far the most commercial holiday, there's no doubt about it. And I, being a deist, don't celebrate it as a Christian holiday myself. But there is no denying that I become sentimental around this time of year. I feel that Christmas, regardless of your faith, is a fine opportunity to reconnect with family.

It may be that Christmas could become, over time, a truly pan-religious celebration. If we allow it.

 

[Ishmael]

That's true.

Christmas has become by far the most commercial holiday, there's no doubt about it. And I, being a deist, don't celebrate it as a Christian holiday myself. But there is no denying that I become sentimental around this time of year. I feel that Christmas, regardless of your faith, is a fine opportunity to reconnect with family.

It may be that Christmas could become, over time, a truly pan-religious celebration. If we allow it.

You are missing the most revelant product of the Xmas season as it relates to Lit.

Over the years, every year. The most interesting dramas unfold here. Lance returns, people unload their feelings, perceptions, etc. Shortly after the first of the year a collective exhaustion sets in and the place is boring as shit until May or so.

Starts earlier every year too. *chuckle*

Ishmael

 

[breakwall]

You are missing the most revelant product of the Xmas season as it relates to Lit.

Over the years, every year. The most interesting dramas unfold here. Lance returns, people unload their feelings, perceptions, etc. Shortly after the first of the year a collective exhaustion sets in and the place is boring as shit until May or so.

Starts earlier every year too. *chuckle*

Ishmael

If you say so.

And I may question your definition of 'relevant'.

 

[Ishmael]

If you say so.

And I may question your definition of 'relevant'.

The season as related to Lit. It seems that the drama builds every year and peaks between T'giving and Xmas. It's an interesting phenomena.

Ishmael

 

[breakwall]

The season as related to Lit. It seems that the drama builds every year and peaks between T'giving and Xmas. It's an interesting phenomena.

Ishmael

Is there a day when Intrigued sticks her head out of a hole and predicts six more weeks of drama?

 

[Ishmael]

Is there a day when Intrigued sticks her head out of a hole and predicts six more weeks of drama?

LMAO

Lance hasn't hunted her down this year. Yet anyway.

Ishmael

 

[Little Tighty]

LMAO

Lance hasn't hunted her down this year. Yet anyway.

Ishmael

He mentioned her just last week.

 

[Ishmael]

He mentioned her just last week.

They were meant for each other.

Ishmael

 

[JustSkye]

Christmas isn't remotely Christ or Christian related...we made it that way.

 

[breakwall]

He mentioned her just last week.

She's the Joker to his Batman, the Newman to his Jerry, the Lucy to his Linus.

 

[JustSkye]

Is there a day when Intrigued sticks her head out of a hole and predicts six more weeks of drama?

She plays elsewhere now.

 

[breakwall]

Christmas isn't remotely Christ or Christian related...we made it that way.

Do you mean it isn't that way anymore?
I would argue that those who oppose Christmas in any form feel that it is very much a Christian holiday.

 

[JustSkye]

Do you mean it isn't that way anymore?
I would argue that those who oppose Christmas in any form feel that it is very much a Christian holiday.

Well, no, to me, it hasn't been that way in a long time. But, I also mean it didn't originate as a true Christian holiday. It's pagan.

 

[breakwall]

Well, no, to me, it hasn't been that way in a long time. But, I also mean it didn't originate as a true Christian holiday. It's pagan.

I still think that's a moot point.
Christmas having it's roots in paganism has absolutely nothing to do with the significance of it as a Christian celebration. Scratch the surface of any religion and it is merely an amalgam of earlier faith traditions. This doesn't cheapen or devalue these religions in any way.

That's like saying "Well, the Mona Lisa is shit. I mean, it's all based on a piece of wood."

 

[Ishmael]

Do you mean it isn't that way anymore?
I would argue that those who oppose Christmas in any form feel that it is very much a Christian holiday.

Bingo.

Ishmael

 

[JustSkye]

I still think that's a moot point.
Christmas having it's roots in paganism has absolutely nothing to do with the significance of it as a Christian celebration. Scratch the surface of any religion and it is merely an amalgam of earlier faith traditions. This doesn't cheapen or devalue these religions in any way.

That's like saying "Well, the Mona Lisa is shit. I mean, it's all based on a piece of wood."

Well, supposedly going by dates and seasons, from what I have gathered, he wasn't even born in winter. Easter, and the circumstances, hold more meaning for me than Christmas. But, that's just me.

 

[Ishmael]

Well, supposedly going by dates and seasons, from what I have gathered, he wasn't even born in winter. Easter, and the circumstances, hold more meaning for me than Christmas. But, that's just me.

I think you're missing the point by getting buried in the details. You can move the date to any date on the calendar and Breaks point is still valid.

Ishmael