Supreme Court decision.

[RhumbRunner13]

The SC ruled today that the Cleveland school voucher system is constitutional even if the vouchers are used at religiously oriented schools. Why was this so difficult? It seems to me that the "vouchers" (money) being given to people are monies that belong to the people in the first place, not the government! JMO.

Rhumb

 

[JazzManJim]

The SC ruled today that the Cleveland school voucher system is constitutional even if the vouchers are used at religiously oriented schools. Why was this so difficult? It seems to me that the "vouchers" (money) being given to people are monies that belong to the people in the first place, not the government! JMO.

Rhumb

You know. The church is going to take over now. We're going to round up the infidels, athiests, and Unitarians and have them shot or something.

Honestly, it's not that tough a decision for me either. Give the people the freedom to send their children to the school of their choice, within the budget of the voucher.

 

[metal_minx]

i'm not surprised, just dissapointed that they still refuse to try and really make an effort for better public schools

 

[Mischka]

Re: Re: Supreme Court decision.

You know. The church is going to take over now. We're going to round up the infidels, athiests, and Unitarians and have them shot or something.

As shocking as it may be, even us atheists believe that people have the right to choose a religious setting for their children's education. Imagine that. Allowing private religious instruction instead of trying to combine it with a public educational setting.

 

[RawHumor]

Does anyone remember Bob Dole? (Whoah, that's twice I mentioned his name today, but this time it's not in a sexual context). When he ran against Bill Clinton, he wanted to let parents send their kids to a different PUBLIC school instead of the one they had to go to because of geography.

Democrats hated the idea because the good schools would get more kids and, thus, more money and the bad schools would get worse.

GW Bush comes along with school vouchers for private schools and the Democrats hate that idea because then you could use public money (in their opinion) to send your kids to a religious school.

Who are the ones for Freedom of Choice again?

 

[patient1]

I'm childless & maybe I will be for life.
May I have a refund for not using the public schools?
Or parks?
What if I don't call the police, should I get my money back for not using that?
What if I never have a fire?

If it's a "my money"argument, a voucher should at least be based on the person's taxes, not on tuition at any school.

Some things are best done as a community.
We benefit from neighbors that can read, write, & balance a checkbook. Local economies benefit from educated workforces.
Property values benefit from services that can be performed cheaper collectively, as well as the absence of bored youths with no future on the streets all hours of the day & night.

Just because your kids or grandkids don't attend, doesn't mean public education isn't your concern, or shouldn't be.

 

[TWB]

It is, to me, a clearly unconstitutional mixture of church and state.

This court sucks.

 

[brokenbrainwave]

personally I have a HUGE problem with school vouchers. Why should my tax money go to support some mom and dad that choose not to use the school available? Sorry I was under the impression you were to pull yourself up by your own bootstraps in the USA. Hell I did it, and did not get a freakin voucher to attend a better school. If mom and dad don't like the public school little johnny is in, then figure out a way to pay for it. Our schools are junk so how is taking monies that could be used to help them going to make things better? I just dont get this idea.

 

[TWB]

Oh, and it was another 5-4 decision.

 

[Private Vasquez]

I admit to being uneducated in this matter...but it seems to me that this takes away from the public schools. Instead of trying to improve the public schools that no one wants to send their kids to, they're given a voucher to go to a better/private school? Somehow that doesn't make much sense to me. But I could be way off base there, which has been known to happen.

 

[TWB]

I admit to being uneducated in this matter...but it seems to me that this takes away from the public schools. Instead of trying to improve the public schools that no one wants to send their kids to, they're given a voucher to go to a better/private school? Somehow that doesn't make much sense to me. But I could be way off base there, which has been known to happen.

Are you sure?

 

[Private Vasquez]

As sure as a plastic chick with no brain can be.

 

[Wrong Element]

GW Bush comes along with school vouchers for private schools and the Democrats hate that idea because then you could use public money (in their opinion) to send your kids to a religious school.

Who are the ones for Freedom of Choice again?

How does objecting to public money (and it is public money--it's not merely "opinion") being used to fund religious education affect one's belief in freedom of choice? I spent 11 years in Catholic schools--no one told my parents they couldn't send me there.

Vouchers are a Trojan horse to defund the public schools.

 

[RawHumor]

How does objecting to public money (and it is public money--it's not merely "opinion") being used to fund religious education affect one's belief in freedom of choice? I spent 11 years in Catholic schools--no one told my parents they couldn't send me there.

Vouchers are a Trojan horse to defund the public schools.

My point is that the same people complained about Dole's idea to allow a choice of public schools.

 

[Guest]

WHITE HOUSE PREPARING FOR POSSIBLE SUPREME COURT RESIGNATION

WHITE HOUSE PREPARING FOR POSSIBLE SUPREME COURT RESIGNATION

The White House is preparing for a possible retirement by a Supreme Court judge, administration sources said on Thursday.

A retirement announcement could come from the court in the coming days as justices complete deliberations for the current term.

"It could be Rehnquist. It could be O'Connor. We could get surprised by Stevens," said a White House source. "We are ready for this."

But Bush's inner circle believes the court will likely stay intact through the mid-term elections -- unless there are over-ridding health concerns. "Florida still hangs in the air over there," said one insider.

PLAN A: ALBERTO

President Bush's White House Counsel Alberto Gonzalez, 47, [pictured above] remains a frontrunner and first pick of senior Bush advisers if an opening materializes, well-placed sources claim.

Democratic operatives are believed to have a meaty "ENRON File" on Gonzalez -- a development that is causing little concern at the White House.

"So he received $7,000 in campaign contributions from ENRON back in Texas?" asks one top Bush source. "What congressman or judge hasn't? This will not disqualify or prevent the first Latino from sitting on the Supreme Court."

 

[RhumbRunner13]

BBW..........

"Our schools are junk so how is taking monies that could be used to help them going to make things better? I just dont get this idea."

We have spent hundreds of billions in this country while watching our government controlled schools become EXACTLY what you describe, JUNK! Many of us have realized that government is completely inept at anything resembling business. They do not run a postal system, rail system, retirement program, medical system or educational system very well. Education at all levels is business! You hire teachers and provide "factories" for them to produce the product of "knowledge transferance" to your target market, "kiddies"! The government run factories simply SUCK, and just as when Packard sucked, those that fail should be allowed to quietly leave the business, not have tons of money poured in to prop up an inferior product.

Rhumb

 

[Mischka]

Question about the school voucher proposal. I can see the arguments for both sides, and in theory I actually lean towards giving people their tax dollars to spend on the school of their choice.

But how does this work in the long run? How do the public schools estimate their funding and needs on an annual basis? Do the public schools hire and fire teachers as the demand fluctuates? Do we convert some of the public school buildings into private schools? Will the system require some sort of oversight to ensure that private for-profit schools don't spring up overnight and suck away the money without providing a decent education?

As much as I like the idea of freedom of education, the implementation of the idea strikes me as a logistical nightmare.

 

[RawHumor]

As much as I like the idea of freedom of education, the implementation of the idea strikes me as a logistical nightmare.

I believe that they have vouchers in Milwaukee and a few other cities, but I don't know too much about the results.

I've heard that they were having great success in Milwaukee, but that may have just been political rhetoric. It's tough to tell what's real these days when it comes to information and facts.

 

[brokenbrainwave]

Rhumb, believe it or not I agree!

but my issue is more along the lines of creating another social program headed by waste and mismanagment. your correct the feds in no way can be in control of education. the DOE is insanely ran, filled with corruption and worse, poorly planned thinking. how can we be sure this new govermental agency would not be ran in the same manner? dont fool yourself into thinking that a Department of Vouchers or some other kind of pork would be created. however, with that said, why would it be fair for me to pay for the public schools, and for people to send little johnny to private school?

note: I no way am I supporting public schools, I just refuse to support paying for both.

 

[patient1]

Be it public or private, school choice seems like a way of running away from a problem rather than solving it, kinda like having an affair rather than putting the energy into your marriage.

People should commit to their community, or move out of it.

 

[RhumbRunner13]

Question about the school voucher proposal. I can see the arguments for both sides, and in theory I actually lean towards giving people their tax dollars to spend on the school of their choice.

But how does this work in the long run? How do the public schools estimate their funding and needs on an annual basis? Do the public schools hire and fire teachers as the demand fluctuates? Do we convert some of the public school buildings into private schools? Will the system require some sort of oversight to ensure that private for-profit schools don't spring up overnight and suck away the money without providing a decent education?

As much as I like the idea of freedom of education, the implementation of the idea strikes me as a logistical nightmare.

Good questions Misch! How does GM know how many auto assemblers to hire? Or how many Impalas to produce versus Cavaliers? What happens when auto sales drop? They work on a 6 month to one year projection. Seems to me the schools would only have to go to the local hospital to determine their "demand curve" five years in advance!

Rhumb

 

[Mountain Man]

Hey,

I send my kids to private school...I want a voucher to help me pay for it....

I pay taxes and should be helped by the government.....

 

[brokenbrainwave]

Be it public or private, school choice seems like a way of running away from a problem rather than solving it, kinda like having an affair rather than putting the energy into your marriage.

People should commit to their community, or move out of it.

possibly the smartest post in this thread. even though I detest hillary, she had it right, it takes a villiage to raise a child, and that includes parents taking an active role in the schools. accountability does not stop with the teachers.

 

[Mischka]

Ooh, I don't know if it's a good idea to allude to the auto industry. They lay off massive amounts of workers with little warning. I'd like a bit more sercurity in my teaching staff than that. A veteran teacher is invaluable. Hiring a new crop of teachers to meet a fluctuating demand is just going to add to the learning curve, and take away from the time for instruction.

 

[RawHumor]

even though I detest hillary, she had it right, it takes a villiage to raise a child

BBW, I may have just lost all of my respect for you.