Solving the dreaded one-bomb problem

[Winter_Fare]

Possibly a weighted mean? You'd still get a spread of values, but bombs would be less damaging.

 

[KeithD]

Then it seems the simpler solution is to get rid of that Red-H at 4.5, rather than waving it at the authors as if it really means something. Allow the readers to make their own decisions based only on the average.

BINGO. Not because I agree this is a good move to make--because I've been advocating that here for over a decade. Bingo because it illustrates my point. I've been advocating it for over a decade and where any engagement on the issue with the site management is concerned . . . crickets.

This whole discussion is just spitting in the wind here.

And even when that's pointed out to posters, they just go "duh" and continue spitting in the wind--on the same thread.

 

[Britva415]

Laurel once pointed out to me that a 1* vote isn't an invalid vote.

But she clearly thinks that some of them are, or they wouldn't get swept.

 

[oggbashan]

I see the problem is that the new reader assumes votes 1 to 5 have an equal weight and are all vaild. The explanations for the votes reinforces this view. If so, any story above 3.00 ought to be good.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

Some of you are a bit late to the party, as I have pressed the issue with red H some time ago quite aggressively, because I've seen many authors voice the same opinion. Needless to say I was shot down quite decisively there, which is actually quite fine. Once you press the issue in a definitive manner, people respond honestly, so it still served its purpose on some level. Suffices to say that there is no consensus about the red H. The thread is here:
https://forum.literotica.com/threads/two-hot-stories-have-disappeared.1580996/

 

[Bazzle]

My contest stories all get 1 bombed. Once the sweep happens they jump up.
But...
I think my Halloween story finished the competition at 3.9. No where near winning or even a H. Yet in the last few months has crept up to 4.4. So for a contest it was awful, but on its own in Fetish not too bad.
For me, the conclusion was that my fetish stories are too niche for the contests, and Fetish section doesn't get the viewer numbers to help.
My highest total voter number is 61, the story has been up for 6 months.
Many authors in other sections get 61 votes in a hour.
So for my stories in Fetish that in a competition struggle to get over the 25 votes 2x 1 bombs can kill a story. Yet if you are getting 100's of votes on a story, 2x1 means nothing?

In the last competition I clearly had 6 1 bombs as my vote went from 30 to 24 in the sweep, instantly removing me from the competition . Not that I would have won.

Hey ho.

I will keep plugging away.
B

 

[AwkwardlySet]

My contest stories all get 1 bombed. Once the sweep happens they jump up.
But...
I think my Halloween story finished the competition at 3.9. No where near winning or even a H. Yet in the last few months has crept up to 4.4. So for a contest it was awful, but on its own in Fetish not too bad.
For me, the conclusion was that my fetish stories are too niche for the contests, and Fetish section doesn't get the viewer numbers to help.
My highest total voter number is 61, the story has been up for 6 months.
Many authors in other sections get 61 votes in a hour.
So for my stories in Fetish that in a competition struggle to get over the 25 votes 2x 1 bombs can kill a story. Yet if you are getting 100's of votes on a story, 2x1 means nothing?

In the last competition I clearly had 6 1 bombs as my vote went from 30 to 24 in the sweep, instantly removing me from the competition . Not that I would have won.

Hey ho.

I will keep plugging away.
B

I don't know much about contests here, but are you saying that votes don't get weighed in any way depending on the category they belong? So if one was to post a story in I/T category and someone else posts a story for the same contest in let's say Sci-fi, it is only the final score that counts?

 

[Bazzle]

I don't know much about contests here, but are you saying that votes don't get weighed in any way depending on the category they belong? So if one was to post a story in I/T category and someone else posts a story for the same contest in let's say Sci-fi, it is only the final score that counts?

There is no weighting at all

 

[nice90sguy]

write better stories, and get lots of fives

Which are you planning on doing first?

 

[Lifestyle66]

I don't know much about contests here, but are you saying that votes don't get weighed in any way depending on the category they belong? So if one was to post a story in I/T category and someone else posts a story for the same contest in let's say Sci-fi, it is only the final score that counts?

That is correct. The final average score is all that matters, regardless of which category you post.

I posted my Valentine's Day entry to Loving Wives: "The Real Gift: Her Fantasy". That category historically has about a 1.0 lower rating for stories than other categories, particularly when the subject is "extra-marital sex" (as my stories are.) That story now has over 27k views and 290 ratings for an average 3.49.

So, if you want to win a contest, you must account for such things when writing your story and choosing which category to post. My story might have rated much higher in Erotic Couplings, Group Sex, or Mature. But it would also not have 27K views, probably half of that number in those others.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

That doesn't make sense for so many reasons. In my opinion stories participating in a contest should all go into the same category to avoid biases. Like create a category called Contests and all stories participating for the said contest should go there and stay until voting is done. Readers would still be able to filter through contest stories based on tags. When voting for the contest ends and awards are attributed, then the stories could go into a category of their author's choosing and look like any other normal story. Nothing else seems fair to me, but I guess that is no wonder, all things considered. Oh look, I moaned about a Lit practice... again

 

[Lifestyle66]

That doesn't make sense for so many reasons. In my opinion stories participating in a contest should all go into the same category to avoid biases. Like create a category called Contests and all stories participating for the said contest should go there and stay until voting is done. Readers would still be able to filter through contest stories based on tags. When voting for the contest ends and awards are attributed, then the stories could go into a category of their author's choosing and look like any other normal story. Nothing else seems fair to me, but I guess that is no wonder, all things considered. Oh look, I moaned about a Lit practice... again

If there were just a "Contest" category, then you'd only get views from people who look at that category. And some of us don't search for tags, but read from the category list, with titles and descriptions indicating what we might like.

So, your solution would also be trying to change reader behavior. And that's an up-hill battle.

Basically, learn to live with the readers you want to see your stories. And learn to write to their needs. Or write whatever you like, and take their reactions.

 

[NotWise]

That doesn't make sense for so many reasons. In my opinion stories participating in a contest should all go into the same category to avoid biases. Like create a category called Contests and all stories participating for the said contest should go there and stay until voting is done. Readers would still be able to filter through contest stories based on tags. When voting for the contest ends and awards are attributed, then the stories could go into a category of their author's choosing and look like any other normal story. Nothing else seems fair to me, but I guess that is no wonder, all things considered. Oh look, I moaned about a Lit practice... again

For what it's worth, something like that has been done as a writers challenge. I think there were six of them. The last happened shortly after I opened an account here. They were the "friendly anonymous writer's challenge" (abbreviated fawc, if you want to look it up) hosted by a contributor named Slyk_Willie (I think I have the name right). The last contest was in memoriam.

Slyk_Willie would set conditions on a story (for instance, all participating stories must begin with a line he provides) and all of the stories were initially posted in Chain Stories. After the votes were tallied, Laurel reassigned the stories to the category selected by the author.

It was an interesting challenge. Because of the event construction, a lot of stories got little attention. It might have been a little unfair, because writers with many followers could get a lot more attention than others.

I think we all like the attention that comes from posting in the open categories.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

If you want to be fair, and I suppose that is the whole point of contests, you have to be ready to do some miniscule things that readers might dislike. Start teaching them the new way and in a while they will get the hang of it. You have to break some eggs to make an omlet.

 

[MelissaBaby]

Which are you planning on doing first?

I plan for every story to be better than the one before. It doesn’t always work. The fives seem to take care of themselves.

 

[Lifestyle66]

If you want to be fair, and I suppose that is the whole point of contests, you have to be ready to do some miniscule things that readers might dislike. Start teaching them the new way and in a while they will get the hang of it. You have to break some eggs to make an omlet.

You are one writer. And even the most popular contests only have about 100 entries (fewer than 100 writers, due to those who post multiple entries.)

Now, which is easier: Train the millions of Literotica readers' habits, who are looking for what THEY want and shift them to better appreciate what you write? OR ... change you and the less than 100 other writers to write better stories which the readers might like?

FAIR is "Here's how things work and here are the rules. Now analyze those and do your best."

 

[KeithD]

I don't know much about contests here, but are you saying that votes don't get weighed in any way depending on the category they belong? So if one was to post a story in I/T category and someone else posts a story for the same contest in let's say Sci-fi, it is only the final score that counts?

There is some significant category weighing for contests here, yes. Setting a 25-vote minimum to qualify is a bow to the categories with lesser activity than those of I/T or LW. Being able to win with 25 votes over an I/T story with 300 votes and only one percentage point lower than yours in score is a functional weighing of votes in your favor.

 

[KeithD]

That doesn't make sense for so many reasons. In my opinion stories participating in a contest should all go into the same category to avoid biases.

That doesn't serve the selection needs of readers, so it's not going to happen here. These contests stopped being real contests to begin with when they weren't being judged blind by knowledgeable judges. They actually are just to encourage writing and to provide a bit extra exposure.

 

[KeithD]

For what it's worth, something like that has been done as a writers challenge. I think there were six of them. The last happened shortly after I opened an account here. They were the "friendly anonymous writer's challenge" (abbreviated fawc, if you want to look it up) hosted by a contributor named Slyk_Willie (I think I have the name right). The last contest was in memoriam.

Slyk_Willie would set conditions on a story (for instance, all participating stories must begin with a line he provides) and all of the stories were initially posted in Chain Stories. After the votes were tallied, Laurel reassigned the stories to the category selected by the author.

It was an interesting challenge. Because of the event construction, a lot of stories got little attention. It might have been a little unfair, because writers with many followers could get a lot more attention than others.

I think we all like the attention that comes from posting in the open categories.

It also went down the tubes because some of the participants formed a voting and commenting block when they weren't supposed to be revealing to anyone which story was theirs.

For every solution to a problem here there are three "get-arounds-to-get-ahead" maneuvers manufactured.

 

[Bazzle]

There is some significant category weighing for contests here, yes. Setting a 25-vote minimum to qualify is a bow to the categories with lesser activity than those of I/T or LW. Being able to win with 25 votes over an I/T story with 300 votes and only one percentage point lower than yours in score is a functional weighing of votes in your favor.

Totally, BUT the 1 bombs effect those with 25 votes more than those with 300?

 

[AwkwardlySet]

There is some significant category weighing for contests here, yes. Setting a 25-vote minimum to qualify is a bow to the categories with lesser activity than those of I/T or LW. Being able to win with 25 votes over an I/T story with 300 votes and only one percentage point lower than yours in score is a functional weighing of votes in your favor.

I understand the logic here, but there is another side to the problem. If you have like 100 votes and a 4.90 score, one 1* would bring you down by 0.04-0.05, speaking off the top of my head. That is a big change in score, one that would easily change the line up. Even a 2* would be devastating. That obviously leaves a lot of space for some other contestant to fight his vulnerable competition. Now if you have a 4.90 score in I/T and you have like 1000 votes, one 1* would maybe bring you 0.01 down or maybe not even that, depending on rounding. You can see the problem there. I am not talking about bombers who do it because something in your story offended them, I am talking about one person or two being able to manipulate the outcome easily in this way. There are plenty of alts going around and I am certain one can get away with it.

 

[KeithD]

Totally, BUT the 1 bombs effect those with 25 votes more than those with 300?

Yes, but chances are high they will get swept away, and 5 votes also affect stories with fewer votes a lot more than then they affect stories with hundreds of votes.

My contest stories jump dramatically in score with the contest sweep. That's because my categories get far lesser votes than some others.

 

[Bazzle]

Yes, but chances are high they will get swept away, and 5 votes also affect stories with fewer votes a lot more than then they affect stories with hundreds of votes.

My contest stories jump dramatically in score with the contest sweep. That's because my categories get far lesser votes than some others.

Yup, my example of the Halloween challenge. I was on 30 votes, then the wonderful sweep happened. Bingo I was on 24

 

[KeithD]

I understand the logic here, but there is another side to the problem. If you have like 100 votes and a 4.90 score, one 1* would bring you down by 0.04-0.05, speaking off the top of my head. That is a big change in score, one that would easily change the line up. Even a 2* would be devastating. That obviously leaves a lot of space for some other contestant to fight his vulnerable competition. Now if you have a 4.90 score in I/T and you have like 1000 votes, one 1* would maybe bring you 0.01 down or maybe not even that, depending on rounding. You can see the problem there. I am not talking about bombers who do it because something in your story offended them, I am talking about one person or two being able to manipulate the outcome easily in this way. There are plenty of alts going around and I am certain one can get away with it.

No, I don't see the problem because I don't see that you've posted anything that counters what I've posted.

Also, I must say I'm still reeling and laughing from your comment about retraining the readers on anything here.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

No, I don't see the problem because I don't see that you've posted anything that counters what I've posted.

Also, I must say I'm still reeling and laughing from your comment about retraining the readers on anything here.

I can see your wonderful personality is showing itself once again. I actually thought to discuss something here, despite your previous behavior. I won't be making that mistake again.