So who's getting fucked now?

[JackLuis]

You!

Just lay back and enjoy it, there is nothing you can do but spread your cheeks and grin.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

You!

Just lay back and enjoy it, there is nothing you can do but spread your cheeks and grin.

And who do you think told him to make that commercial? You should have put this in my Clever Democrats thread.

 

[JackLuis]

And who do you think told him to make that commercial? You should have put this in my Clever Democrats thread.

I didn't want to intrude.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

I didn't want to intrude.

Yeah, I bet.

 

[Boota]

Honestly, I'm fine with my government investing in saving our own economy. The alternative would have been catastrophic. As far as the payback claim, didn't most people already know that? That was widely reported when the deal came out as to how the money would be handled.

The most important thing is that it seems to have worked. And unlike the banking industry the money went where it was supposed to go. No taxpayer funded million dollar bonuses.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Honestly, I'm fine with my government investing in saving our own economy. The alternative would have been catastrophic. As far as the payback claim, didn't most people already know that? That was widely reported when the deal came out as to how the money would be handled.

The most important thing is that it seems to have worked. And unlike the banking industry the money went where it was supposed to go. No taxpayer funded million dollar bonuses.

I don't know. We could have used that money to invade another country. That seems like a much more prudent use of our tax dollars if you ask me.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

or increase the welfare payments or do something smart like invested it in Medicare or Social Security fund (pay back some of those IOU's sitting in the drawer in Washington).

 

[DeeZire]

or increase the welfare payments or do something smart like invested it in Medicare or Social Security fund (pay back some of those IOU's sitting in the drawer in Washington).

You would rather pay people to sit on their asses collecting SS than allow auto workers to keep their jobs in the private sector? Socialist!

 

[Zeb_Carter]

You would rather pay people to sit on their asses collecting SS than allow auto workers to keep their jobs in the private sector? Socialist!

When did I say that? You better start reading what I type. I said no such thing, but now that you mention it they could increase the SS payment structure instead. I mean the money in SSA is mine, the government owes it to me plus interest. It's not a free handout as you imply. It is earnings of the individual who worked all his life paying a portion of his earnings, which, I admit his employers were forced to match. And you would deny those payments? You are a heartless sob aren't you?

 

[Pure]

nice article, jack.

let it be noted that both parties --or sizeable portions of them-- have supported these weird moves and subterfuges.

that's because the alternatives are rather unclear: 'let 'em fail' [no bailouts] is heard from the far right, but of course NOT from any politician facing elections, esp in areas dependent on GM.

 

[LaRocha]

There is high interest in the GM IPO later this year. The government should get some serious money back out of that, since we own the company...

Gov is currently selling shares of Citi and making an excellent profit. Bought in at 3.15 and started selling from 5 down to 4.30.

 

[DeeZire]

When did I say that? You better start reading what I type. I said no such thing, ...

Zeb, you said that instead of bailing out GM, we should

do something smart like invested it in Medicare or Social Security fund (pay back some of those IOU's sitting in the drawer in Washington).

You're implying that we would have been better off by letting GM fail so we could shore up SS. For someone who supposedly favors the private sector, your flip-flop is stunning. Do you not realize that putting hundreds of thousands of Americans out of work is the exact opposite of shoring up SS? As long as those hundreds of thousands of Americans are still working and paying into SS, it will be viable. When they stop paying into it is when the shit's going to hit the fan, and yet that's what you favor.

Zeb, dude, try utilizing a little logic before you go off half-cocked.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Zeb, you said that instead of bailing out GM, we should


You're implying that we would have been better off by letting GM fail so we could shore up SS. For someone who supposedly favors the private sector, your flip-flop is stunning. Do you not realize that putting hundreds of thousands of Americans out of work is the exact opposite of shoring up SS? As long as those hundreds of thousands of Americans are still working and paying into SS, it will be viable. When they stop paying into it is when the shit's going to hit the fan, and yet that's what you favor.

Zeb, dude, try utilizing a little logic before you go off half-cocked.

Dude...your logic is half-cocked...being for the free market means the government never interferes and GM goes under or downsizes and starts all over again a wiser, leaner company. How is me wanting my tax dollars put back where they belong (they were stolen from my by the politicians) screwed up logic?

 

[DeeZire]

Because putting your tax dollars back where they belong results in less tax dollars keeping SS afloat when all those unemployed workers quit paying into SS.

Obviously, at this point our discussion has become circular, so you go ahead and rail at the government, and I'll go ahead and make some money so I can pay into your vanishing SS.

ETA: A point you're missing: the money that went to GM is not real money, it's deficit spending. If we can utilize deficit spending to make money, we're coming out ahead. But if we choose your solution and just use the deficit spending to shore up SS, we're going even deeper in the hole.

Another fallacy in your argument: The idea that we live in a free market economy. In order for that to be true, we'd have to end corporate welfare, not just for GM, but for all industries, including oil and coal, and farmers, and all the special interests that buy legislation. Good luck with that. (BTW, what's your position on campaign finance reform? Do corporations have the right to buy the political process? Does anyone have the right to buy the political process?)

 

[JackLuis]

In my OP the article seemed to say that we weren't getting the money back, the Government just loaned more of it it to GM and they used it to "pay us back", so why move the money at all?

Looks to me like the Treasury is silly, pouring more money down a rat hole, but I don't live in Detroit.

 

[TE999]

The Obama administration and the Dems couldn't let GM go belly up because they would jeopardize all those unionized auto worker votes they count on every election...the truculence and greed of said unions half to blame for GM's insolvency.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Because putting your tax dollars back where they belong results in less tax dollars keeping SS afloat when all those unemployed workers quit paying into SS.

Obviously, at this point our discussion has become circular, so you go ahead and rail at the government, and I'll go ahead and make some money so I can pay into your vanishing SS.

ETA: A point you're missing: the money that went to GM is not real money, it's deficit spending. If we can utilize deficit spending to make money, we're coming out ahead. But if we choose your solution and just use the deficit spending to shore up SS, we're going even deeper in the hole.

Another fallacy in your argument: The idea that we live in a free market economy. In order for that to be true, we'd have to end corporate welfare, not just for GM, but for all industries, including oil and coal, and farmers, and all the special interests that buy legislation. Good luck with that. (BTW, what's your position on campaign finance reform? Do corporations have the right to buy the political process? Does anyone have the right to buy the political process?)

What are you stupid? Not real money?

 

[amicus]

I would venture that the bulk of auto sales by GM, if there were any at all, were to replace government vehicles and those to keep the overpaid UAW workers happy and employed and all there retiree's still getting a hefty retirement check and medical bennies each year.

Government, we the people, own slightly over 60% of Gm...such a deal.

Amicus

 

[al_Ussa]

I infinitely prefer DOING the fucking to someone else, but maybe that's just me.

 

[JackLuis]

I infinitely prefer DOING the fucking to someone else, but maybe that's just me.

I'd prefer it too, but they don't even kiss you.

 

[al_Ussa]

I'd prefer it too, but they don't even kiss you.

I know. What is with that!