So when is this "Honest" discussion regarding race relations goint to occur?

[Que]

You manage to secede and I would move there. My mom's place in Oregon is incredible, but I suspect my politics would not be welcome in the locale.

 

[Sean Renaud]

And since I left it out, Nor Cal could care less if we So Calers died in a fire. Hell they might appreciate us not stealing their water.

What do you mean a dead black man doesn't mean anything? If you mean killed by another black man you have a point and that isn't anything to do with whites or race relations. Every time a black man is killed by a white man even when as in this case he clearly contributed to the situation, it is national news and cause for a riot.

There was no basic level of responsibility to be had in this situation. it was a justified shooting, period. You do not start a gunfight with our body and your fists skiddles style and live to tel,l especially if the guy you assaulted was a cop.

Sometimes you will start to make sense then you take a turn for the surreal. You cannot keep framing this shooting the way the initial completely wrong reports have it and have an credibility on that issue.

I mean exactly what I said, a dead black man doesn't mean shit in this country. Both cases have something to do with race relations. I know you don't like hearing it or you want to pretend Obama and Holder are magic but no. To quote Morpheos "You hold all the keys and guard all the gates." Most of the time when a white man, even a COP kills a black it gets a blurb at best unless we can push the person as 90% innocent out the gate. And it happens constantly.

No, it was not a justified shooting. The evidence does not support that. The reports make it sound credible if you take some very liberal license that ignores the evidence but like I already said, dead black people don't matter. It's okay that you're American. I don't expect any better of you.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Here's the snag at the end of the day. Perception heavily colors reality. If I feel like I don't matter, then I feel like I don't matter and you need something a little better than "stop being silly" to make it sink in. I think there are sufficient riots and protests not just in Ferguson but around the country to make it clear that as a whole African Americans do not feel like we matter.

So you can continue telling us we're being silly if you like. Good luck insulting us into your point of view though.

 

[smoothg103rd]

When I was at the barbershop them ignorant dummies was talking about shooting cops. Saying shit like we just need to pop about 3 cops, and they will get the message. I didn't want to post this cause I don't want to be a conspiracy to shit. But they were saying shit like something gotta give, shit like this can't be happening, boycott Black Friday. I told them dummies, you are not going to get away with killing a cop. You will do life in jail or worst. Violence is only going to bring more violence. And yall saying shit like this, is the reason they shoot and kill us now. When you act like a animal you get treated as such.

 

[Que]

And since I left it out, Nor Cal could care less if we So Calers died in a fire. Hell they might appreciate us not stealing their water.



I mean exactly what I said, a dead black man doesn't mean shit in this country. Both cases have something to do with race relations. I know you don't like hearing it or you want to pretend Obama and Holder are magic but no. To quote Morpheos "You hold all the keys and guard all the gates." Most of the time when a white man, even a COP kills a black it gets a blurb at best unless we can push the person as 90% innocent out the gate. And it happens constantly.

No, it was not a justified shooting. The evidence does not support that. The reports make it sound credible if you take some very liberal license that ignores the evidence but like I already said, dead black people don't matter. It's okay that you're American. I don't expect any better of you.

I agree it comes down to point of view.

That doesn't mean your point of view is equally valid. Between your point of view and mine, which is most likely clouded by real life experiences and innate feelings about things. Yours, right? Doesn't mean you are wrong, but it's worth considering.

There is now zero controversy that he physically got some portion of his body inside the confined space of that cop car.

You want to argue that maybe, just maybe he thought better of his blatant attack and backed off, wilson's adrenaline was pumping and wilson over-reacted...ok maybe.

But the whole shot for no reason thing is not even in the ballpark of reality.

 

[Que]

Here's the snag at the end of the day. Perception heavily colors reality. If I feel like I don't matter, then I feel like I don't matter and you need something a little better than "stop being silly" to make it sink in. I think there are sufficient riots and protests not just in Ferguson but around the country to make it clear that as a whole African Americans do not feel like we matter.

So you can continue telling us we're being silly if you like. Good luck insulting us into your point of view though.

100% that your feelings are valid and without a doubt based on real world experience. I do not find you to be a thin-skinned individual. When you felt dismissed, undervalued and ignored I am sure your gut was right.

But you do matter to a lot of people. Family, friends, I am sure the service was likely the closest you got to a world where color doesn't matter and probably some times it did there too.. You do not live the sort of life that would result in your being one of these victims if you want to call them that.

If you were shot, and it got this kind of publicity there would be major open questions because such an altercation is out of your nature and everyone that knows you would be screaming that. Not just family and a co-conspirator.

If wilson were some over-reacting, spoiling for a fight, racist asshole he would not have been working that neighborhood. Especially alone. No way he did what some people claim in broad daylight in front of a live, studio audience of only black faces. If he had ever been abusive to people in that neighborhood, people would be coming forward with tales. This was a good cop and a good shooting. Doesn't help the grieving Brown family. Doesn't help those that mostly because he looks a certain way, wrongly think, that could have been someone I love. Think about the people you love. The dumbest, most drunk crazy uncle, cousin or neighbor you have. Anyway at all he would go after a cop that way?

 

[Sean Renaud]

When I was at the barbershop them ignorant dummies was talking about shooting cops. Saying shit like we just need to pop about 3 cops, and they will get the message. I didn't want to post this cause I don't want to be a conspiracy to shit. But they were saying shit like something gotta give, shit like this can't be happening, boycott Black Friday. I told them dummies, you are not going to get away with killing a cop. You will do life in jail or worst. Violence is only going to bring more violence. And yall saying shit like this, is the reason they shoot and kill us now. When you act like a animal you get treated as such.

Says the guy who calls me a bitch for holding that view? ROFL.

I agree it comes down to point of view.

That doesn't mean your point of view is equally valid. Between your point of view and mine, which is most likely clouded by real life experiences and innate feelings about things. Yours, right? Doesn't mean you are wrong, but it's worth considering.

There is now zero controversy that he physically got some portion of his body inside the confined space of that cop car.

You want to argue that maybe, just maybe he thought better of his blatant attack and backed off, wilson's adrenaline was pumping and wilson over-reacted...ok maybe.

But the whole shot for no reason thing is not even in the ballpark of reality.

We're not really talking facts however. We're to a large point talking emotions and no matter how many times you say you love me if I don't feel it it doesn't count.

There is controversy onw how he got some portion of his body inside the cop car and honestly a cop grabbing a kid and hauling him into the car to intimidate him sounds WAY more probable than he reached in for a gun that was likely on his right hip. However the cops own story has him outside the car. So I'm curious where you get the no controversy there.

Maybe Wilson just shot him cus he could and we live in a country where you'll defend him. You're more interested in defending one cop who undeniable killed a man than you are in getting roughly 13% of your population to think you GIVE A SINGLE FUCK ABOUT THEIR LIVES. BUT YOU DON'T AND THAT'S THE KICKER.

The whole shot for no reason and scenario should never have happened is entirely within the realm of reality. ::Shrug::

 

[Que]

When I was at the barbershop them ignorant dummies was talking about shooting cops. Saying shit like we just need to pop about 3 cops, and they will get the message. I didn't want to post this cause I don't want to be a conspiracy to shit. But they were saying shit like something gotta give, shit like this can't be happening, boycott Black Friday. I told them dummies, you are not going to get away with killing a cop. You will do life in jail or worst. Violence is only going to bring more violence. And yall saying shit like this, is the reason they shoot and kill us now. When you act like a animal you get treated as such.

Those guys in the barbershop are expressing real frustration. The are angry about this latest victim. Problem is they are riled up and angry because people want them riled up and angry. Not because what happened. If they had been right there watching it in real time, they would have said, "WTF did that guy do that for??", meaning Brown.

If they go out and shoot some cops that is not on you, its likely just talk, it is on those that are stoking this up out of what should have been some open questions, then put to rest by a thorough investigation.

This isn't even Trayvon, where the feds came in after the cops, looked at it and said, ~shrug~..."looks like an ok shooting"

This was investigated hard from day one. The Feds looking over their shoulder. Holder wasn't going to and did not allow a whitewash.

Think about the money that some of these speakers that are saying we need to protest make off of getting in the middle of these things. It doesnt matter to them whether it is real or not. Their face is on TV looking somber and that publicity is worth money to them.

 

[smoothg103rd]

Bitch I call you a bitch because you said you will abandoned your people. I was just keeping it real with them. But best believe if it was a blue vs black war, I'll be shooting my guns with my people.

 

[toubab]

Bitch I call you a bitch because you said you will abandoned your people. I was just keeping it real with them. But best believe if it was a blue vs black war, I'll be shooting my guns with my people.

Smoove, I'm white but I don't consider all white people, or even most white people, to be my people. I don't give a fuck about most white people. Why should I? And why should you give a fuck about black people you don't even know? Sounds like fucked up racist thinking to me.

 

[Que]

Says the guy who calls me a bitch for holding that view? ROFL.



We're not really talking facts however. We're to a large point talking emotions and no matter how many times you say you love me if I don't feel it it doesn't count.

There is controversy onw how he got some portion of his body inside the cop car and honestly a cop grabbing a kid and hauling him into the car to intimidate him sounds WAY more probable than he reached in for a gun that was likely on his right hip. However the cops own story has him outside the car. So I'm curious where you get the no controversy there.

Maybe Wilson just shot him cus he could and we live in a country where you'll defend him. You're more interested in defending one cop who undeniable killed a man than you are in getting roughly 13% of your population to think you GIVE A SINGLE FUCK ABOUT THEIR LIVES. BUT YOU DON'T AND THAT'S THE KICKER.

The whole shot for no reason and scenario should never have happened is entirely within the realm of reality. ::Shrug::

That scenario makes no sense. Cops are taught to keep you at a distance. Wilson sounds like he is my size. No way do I pull a guy that big into my space. The reason I am hard in the paint as Zumi likes to say on this being a righteous shooting is because it is being sold so hard as it is not, with statements that can be shown to be false, and ideas that make no sense.

I get that to you this is "hey coulda been me or mine."

I am saying that this was not even close to what it was portrayed as and still is being portrayed as. My concern here is that if you, a damned reasonable human being, can still see it the way it was sold on day one, I bet every black person in America believes it, and it just didn't happen that way.

It is like some weird Gulf of Tonkin or WMD sales job but for the cause of civil unrest. If there was some evil force that was doing that to incite black against white, I wouldn't like it but it at least makes sense. This wasn't that. It is just a narrative that was politically convenient for a time period and the genie will not go back in the bottle.

I think 911 was something we could of predicted, but we didnt from incompetence, not because we wanted those people to die. Same thing for pearl harbor. I get, though why some people are skeptical, right?

Well other than Lady F, I have heard no black person skeptical about this even after a very open investigation with all the facts on the table. Smooth is (if I understand where he is coming from) doesn't take an opinion on whether the shooting was going to happen because of Brown's actions, just that retaliation is a losing battle.

I have said that cops are jumpy around black suspects and there is a racial component to those fears. If that played a part here, I buy that. What I do not buy is that it was unreasonable in this instance that this officer reasonably feared for his safety.

 

[smoothg103rd]

Smoove, I'm white but I don't consider all white people, or even most white people, to be my people. I don't give a fuck about most white people. Why should I? And why should you give a fuck about black people you don't even know? Sounds like fucked up racist thinking to me.

I see your point. But how I see it is thats why we are in this predicament now. Because we don't give a fuck about each other. ( none bigger than me) because I don't care about shit. My own mother tells me that I'm heartless. But there comes a time when you have to stick together. And that would be one of those times. Kinda like 9/11 how everybody was together. Sometimes it takes tragedy, to bring people closer. But in war you always have to pick a side. And I'm just telling yall what side I would pick. I don't think that is racist.

 

[toubab]

I see your point. But how I see it is thats why we are in this predicament now. Because we don't give a fuck about each other. ( none bigger than me) because I don't care about shit. My own mother tells me that I'm heartless. But there comes a time when you have to stick together. And that would be one of those times. Kinda like 9/11 how everybody was together. Sometimes it takes tragedy, to bring people closer. But in war you always have to pick a side. And I'm just telling yall what side I would pick. I don't think that is racist.

I just wrote this on another thread:

"If some white asshole I never heard of before stole some cigars and got into a confrontation with a cop and got his ass shot and killed, does anybody on this fucking board think I would or should give a crap about it? Anybody think I would or should start a protest about it, or burn down a few buildings because of it? Fuck you, if you do."

 

[smoothg103rd]

I just wrote this on another thread:

"If some white asshole I never heard of before stole some cigars and got into a confrontation with a cop and got his ass shot and killed, does anybody on this fucking board think I would or should give a crap about it? Anybody think I would or should start a protest about it, or burn down a few buildings because of it? Fuck you, if you do."

Me personally I don't give a fuck about the situation. I deal with death everyday. I know situations where someone was charged for murder, but beat the case. And I know for a fact that he killed him. And vice versa. So I really don't care that he is dead or killed him. I never even follow the case. And found his name out here.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Well, you ARE metaphorically off the reservation, so you have no valid point of view on these matters.

Yes, one must obsess on race, even one's own, in 21st Century America.



The people you hate the most are those who have accepted reality and joined the culture they live in in order to enjoy its benefits. That is one problem that has been expressed by successful black people with regard to their conservatism, for lack of a better word, that allowed them to succeed.

 

[toubab]

Me personally I don't give a fuck about the situation. I deal with death everyday. I know situations where someone was charged for murder, but beat the case. And I know for a fact that he killed him. And vice versa. So I really don't care that he is dead or killed him. I never even follow the case. And found his name out here.

I don't give a fuck about Michael Brown, and I wouldn't give a fuck about him if his name was Michael White and he was pale as Casper's ghost. I got better things to concern myself with than some idiot who did things such as what Brown did. One less asshole in the world. And I couldn't care less the color of the asshole.

 

[smoothg103rd]

I don't give a fuck about Michael Brown, and I wouldn't give a fuck about him if his name was Michael White and he was pale as Casper's ghost. I got better things to concern myself with than some idiot who did things such as what Brown did. One less asshole in the world. And I couldn't care less the color of the asshole.

I could dig it.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

It was so peaceful here, hours ago.

A poster has returned from the past and decided to join the ranks of the trolls in order to destroy conversation so that only one viewpoint may prevail.

He has decided to be a woman with big tits.

However, it is clear that he has a history with many established posters and flirts with the new ones until he can decide for sure to add them to the hate list or the high-five list. What us amusing is the way Throb immediately took it under his wing and began spoon-feeding it the lies that he has invented to support that hateful running internal dialog that dominates what he considers to be a thought process.

It will go away once it has made sufficient ignore lists for this iteration.

Summer of 2016, it will reinvent itself and go to war against the Republican Party and everyone it suspects that might be a voice for them or a vote for the Democrats.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

So AJ, why do you believe that black men commit more violent crimes as stated by the OP?

First let me point out that your question is of poor construction. I went the FBI site and looked at some breakdowns and in total number of crimes, it goes back and forth as to who commits the most which gives you an argument against what you think the OP said. However, went you compare numbers as a ratio, crimes over population, the black demographic wins hands down. Now I saw on page one or two the claim that FBI statistics never ever mention race and that was then assumed to be an a prori statement, but it I found it, then it cannot be a true statement or a valid premise for any logical construction, therefore, YOU need to make your case, not I.

Now, a partial answer to the question as I interpreted it, not raw numbers, which are not altogether truthful, but as a ratio which tells a grim and disturbing story.

Because as I have expounded upon many times, white Liberals simply refuse to let them grow up and encourage and foster their anti-social behavior in the guise of tolerance, diversity and understanding and then the offer them the hope of one-size fits all plans to improve their lot, that are variations on Bastiat's Broken Window fallacy that leads them, for appearance sake, to taking one step forward while ignoring the eventual two steps taken backwards once they move on to the next patronizing plan.

~~~~~

But, as I pointed out, you are not engaging in conversation, but the same behavior. You're not offering any thought or idea, what you are doing is eliciting a response in order that you may begin your next attack.

To me, it indicates one of two things: a mind closed or a mind unsure and insecure.

Both states have the same cause - the underdeveloped liberal ideology of moral relativism and the shaky and contradictory compartmentalization of which it is comprised.

http://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=773814

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

When I was at the barbershop them ignorant dummies was talking about shooting cops. Saying shit like we just need to pop about 3 cops, and they will get the message. I didn't want to post this cause I don't want to be a conspiracy to shit. But they were saying shit like something gotta give, shit like this can't be happening, boycott Black Friday. I told them dummies, you are not going to get away with killing a cop. You will do life in jail or worst. Violence is only going to bring more violence. And yall saying shit like this, is the reason they shoot and kill us now. When you act like a animal you get treated as such.

Any chance all that big talk is blowing off steam or maintaining a public show of street credibility which goes away the instant the walk into their home?

 

[Que]

Yes, one must obsess on race, even one's own, in 21st Century America.



The people you hate the most are those who have accepted reality and joined the culture they live in in order to enjoy its benefits. That is one problem that has been expressed by successful black people with regard to their conservatism, for lack of a better word, that allowed them to succeed.

The thread title is sort of misleading. Race relations for most people are fine. Kind of detente. Put any random black guy and a random black guy into a neutral setting and they will get along no different than an two random strangers of the same race.

Put them as cubicle mates, neighbors whatever.

Whites tend to avoid areas prone to violence so they don't see it. They are not specifically target for harm by blacks. They sure don't go into black neighborhoods looking to cause harm to blacks. So like I said, detente.

The place race makes a difference and causes angst is inside the black community. The message that you cannot get ahead, that you will not be accepted or treated fairly if you leave that cocoon. Look at smooth. Bright, capable, I see no problem with him fitting in anywhere I have ever worked. It is hard for him to envision though, because it is foreign to him. Outside of Newark is a foreign country. I am sure the Japanese would be polite to me, but I wouldn't know the first thing about getting a job, a house or whatever there.

Ferguson is in the news so it keeps popping up in this thread. I have said elsewhere my chances of being shot for no reason tomorrow by a random black guy is less than getting hit by lightening. It is even less likely that smooth gets shot tommorow by a random white cop for no reason.

The people selling the narrative fall into two camps. Those the are caught up in the initial reports and so outraged that they have never sat down and reasoned it through, or people that have looked at all of the facts and evidence and are selling it for personal gain whether it be better ratings, higher profile, fame, whatever. Holder and Obama have been fully briefed. They know from either seeing the witness videotapes first hand or having a trusted adviser see it first hand. They know what the grand jury saw and if they sat on the grand jury would have to vote for a no-bill. And they are not saying so for political reasons. Same goes for the usual race hustlers. Sharpton says that all of life is a hustle and this event is no exception for him. He knows what this is, and stills feigns outrage. Its unconscionable.

Those buying the narrative are simply friends, coworkers, neighbors and strangers that have had bad experiences with cops or had a family member have a bad experience and have felt that lump in throat when a cop pulls you over.

I have had bad experiences with cops. I am a frail little old bald white guy. I have had problems with white cops. I have the luxury of knowing for a fact (with two exceptions) that it was not about race. It was about asshole cops. Blacks have no idea that the same crap the cop pulled them over for they do to me. Driving while (looking) poor and uninsured.

I only care about mechanicals and having the vehicle more or less clean. So I get stopped a lot. 59 times since 2008. If I was black I would have a complex about it, and it would make sense to have one.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Left outta the equation is the function of jail in the black niche. Jail is rest & recreation for parasitic black males. Its where they go to hide out and chill out and get the medical services they need. Jail is a pit-stop for thugs. Motel 6 with ESPN. You can get sex from some of the jail counselors.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

We see people here to whom race matters a great deal. Rj is one of those 13% who are outraged over a mascot and a person such as myself who has learned the danger of giving out too much personal information here because of the 'celebrated' race-baiters who use words like gook and invent a history for you based on badly interpreted factoids because, you know, they're like Sherlock-fucking-Holmes.



My race and looks have always seemed to matter more to other people that it has to me and it sure never got in the way of me accomplishing anything I set my mind to including my degrees, my career, my athletic accomplishments and establishing a comfortable retirement nest egg.

While I too have driven crappy cars in the past, I don't now. Plus I drive slow because I have learned that there is no gain in hurry...

 

[smoothg103rd]

Any chance all that big talk is blowing off steam or maintaining a public show of street credibility which goes away the instant the walk into their home?

Some of them was just blowing smoke. But a couple of them I know will do it. I don't think they will just walk outside and shoot a cop though. But in a situation where they are strap and a cop jump out them, on some stop and frisk shit. I think they would open up on them. (Open up means shoot)

 

[smoothg103rd]

Left outta the equation is the function of jail in the black niche. Jail is rest & recreation for parasitic black males. Its where they go to hide out and chill out and get the medical services they need. Jail is a pit-stop for thugs. Motel 6 with ESPN. You can get sex from some of the jail counselors.

All races goes to jail. And jail is none of the above. You are just making assumptions, have you ever been there?