Should porn stories discuss how sex changes things?

[MrPixel]

... I think stories are better if the characters are putting the sex into some context of their lives while they are having it.

That's my approach. I guess what I've been writing lately are romances with occasional graphic sex. Romance and relationships first, sex scene - sometimes fairly bawdy, followed by more romance. It's easier when you're doing polyamory, the variable character interrelationships can be a lot more interesting.

I did one scene in a bar that was entirely discussing birth control, STDs and emotional aftermath before the event - a planned swinger party involving lifestyle noobs. Probably a boring couple of pages to those interested in something more graphic, but it set the tone and provided a vehicle to just how randy things were going to turn.

My first stories on LitE were somewhat bangety-bangety, but OTOH were mostly about anonymous, opportunistic sex. In that context, there is little to no need to be concerned about the aftermath. The OP's party-out-of-hand scenario and the I/T stuff, it might help to have a closing 'graph or two. For instance, ending the party with a couple of characters expressing regrets to themselves, "Oh, gawd, how am I going to face her tomorrow to explain why that report is late?"

 

[SimonDoom]

I think I misinterpreted your initial post and question, so I have to revise my answer.

Generally speaking, I agree with the concept of your initial post, if I understand it right, that a sex story is better if more than just sex is happening. It's better when you get invested in the character or characters who are having the sexual experience and if the sex is part of a process of change of some sort -- of the character going from point A to point B. Change is a critical element of a good story. A story that merely narrates 2 people having sex, with nothing more, MIGHT be interesting if it's really skillfully done, but it probably won't be. It's usually better if the act of having sex, or whatever the sexual experience is, represents a change or a challenge for a character--crossing a taboo, doing something for the first time, a form of repressed self expression, a new sensation, something.

Where I might possibly disagree with you somewhat--I don't want to assume what your position is--is that I might be more apt to want the sexual experience to be the conclusion of the story, and to leave open what might happen afterward. In my view there are no "endings" in life, until death. Life just keeps going on. I want to give the reader the feeling that the sexual experience, whatever it is, represents some element of change for the characters involved, but as far as what happens after, I'm fine leaving it open.

So, I guess I would say I agree with your statement that an erotic story is generally better when the sex is put into context, but, personally, as a reader, I don't need a whole lot of context. I don't need a lot of before and after. The context can be sketched or alluded to. My ideal is when the climax of the sex corresponds artfully with the climax of whatever the personal change/context is. I don't need much aftermath or discussion of consequences. It can be implied or left to the reader's imagination.

 

[KeithD]

It remains that "better" is in the mind of the individual reader, and the reader's concept of "better" itself is on a sliding scale determined by a whole lot of issues going on with the reader at the time of each separate read.

 

[ChuckWolf]

I do a little of that in many of my stories, like Amy Vs. The Strippers.

 

[yowser]

I think I misinterpreted your initial post and question, so I have to revise my answer.

Generally speaking, I agree with the concept of your initial post, if I understand it right, that a sex story is better if more than just sex is happening. It's better when you get invested in the character or characters who are having the sexual experience and if the sex is part of a process of change of some sort -- of the character going from point A to point B. Change is a critical element of a good story. A story that merely narrates 2 people having sex, with nothing more, MIGHT be interesting if it's really skillfully done, but it probably won't be. It's usually better if the act of having sex, or whatever the sexual experience is, represents a change or a challenge for a character--crossing a taboo, doing something for the first time, a form of repressed self expression, a new sensation, something.

...

I agree with this, particularly the notion that it is always best when there is some evolution in a tale - that a character or two moves somehow cognitively or emotionally from one state to another, learned something, had an adventure that changed them in some fashion.

Stories that reveal characters who rope you into their lives, make you go 'My, what an interesting person, wonder what's up for them? What will they do next?' - as a reader you want to hear more (maybe even another story) - when an author can do that, it is a jewel of a tale.

Creating three-dimensional characters with a range and depth of emotions and reactions in an economy of words remains a huge challenge, always sweet when an author can pull it off.

 

[8letters]

Whatever.

You don't have to let us know that you have nothing to contribute.

 

[KeithD]

You don't have to let us know that you have nothing to contribute.

This was a succinct contribution, I thought, to your apparent need for everyone to write to your specifications. Post #29 is also a "don't let anyone else tell you how you 'should' write" contribution to the discussion. The "whatever" was meant to convey that a story could, or could not, follow up with what the consequences were of a sex act. It all depends on how the author wanted to do it, and I think it's silly to waste time discussimg "shoulds" of how someone should write their story in this regard. That is direct contribution to this discussion, I think. Tough if it doesn't agree with you. I think pushing writers on such issues is antithetical to the creative writing process.

Didn't have to let us know you'd be snarky about my giving my opinion to you giving your opinion either--and stewing about it for over a day before deciding it was necessary for you to attack.

 

[8letters]

Generally speaking, I agree with the concept of your initial post, if I understand it right, that a sex story is better if more than just sex is happening. It's better when you get invested in the character or characters who are having the sexual experience and if the sex is part of a process of change of some sort -- of the character going from point A to point B. Change is a critical element of a good story. A story that merely narrates 2 people having sex, with nothing more, MIGHT be interesting if it's really skillfully done, but it probably won't be. It's usually better if the act of having sex, or whatever the sexual experience is, represents a change or a challenge for a character--crossing a taboo, doing something for the first time, a form of repressed self expression, a new sensation, something.

I think what I'm saying is that sex in a story should have an emotional stake, the higher the better. Sex that doesn't have an emotional stake is boring to me. Sex that doesn't change tomorrow doesn't have an emotional stake. To me, a way to build emotional stake is for characters to think about "What happens tomorrow?" as they consider whether to have sex or not.

To come at from another angle, I believe that most of the change that you discussed happens when the character decides to have sex. That decision should be a thoughtful one. The character should make that decision because they think they'll be in a better place once they've had sex. And that implies that the character is imagining that future better place, or what will happen tomorrow.

Standard boiler plate - write what you want, there's an audience for every type of story, these stories are fantasies, etc.

 

[KeithD]

I think what I'm saying is that sex in a story should have an emotional stake, the higher the better. Sex that doesn't have an emotional stake is boring to me.

That's OK for you personally, if you wish to limit yourself that way. It would be arrogant and literary immaturity to assert that it should be a limitation accepted by everyone else too.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Simple example story:
An office of six guys and a female admin decide to have a Super Bowl party at one of the guys' home. There's plenty of alcohol, one thing leads to another, and eventually they have a gangbang with all six guys fucking the admin.

Should the story discuss how things are going to change at the office?

I read I/T stories, and a lot of them don't have the characters wondering "What happens tomorrow?" as the story progresses. It's almost like the characters are sex machines who have had their "fuck like bunnies" switch turned on, and no corresponding emotional switch is thrown. I find those stories lacking.

What do you think?

It can be done either way, but I generally find the "what changes after?" stories more interesting. My first story here started out as a one-night stand but the consequences gave me fodder for a much longer story.

 

[lovecraft68]

It can be done either way, but I generally find the "what changes after?" stories more interesting. My first story here started out as a one-night stand but the consequences gave me fodder for a much longer story.

For me, I could get behind what comes after if the concept is between two people. Whether it be a taboo story, a romance, age gap, maybe a woman being seduced by another woman the first time, and if its done in a way that takes itself seriously.

But absurd things like what happens the day after a woman let's six guys gang bang her? There is nothing there other than it happening again which is where a premise that sex crazed and out there will go anyway.

Unless its the guys telling everyone in the world and slut shaming her, there is no other realistic end.

Maybe the OP's question is a good one, but to me, a bad example in premise.

 

[8letters]

Maybe the OP's question is a good one, but to me, a bad example in premise.

That's a fair criticism. I was trying to avoid an I/T story idea and came up with something that I thought everyone could discuss.

 

[yukonnights]

Hey, it's just a fuck story. Nobody gives a shit about the next day. This site is about hot sex. Don't overthink it.

I disagree. Very few, if any, of my stories are just about hot sex and there is certainly a large audience for stories with a plot and a message. That said, I assume you're probably just joking

 

[SimonDoom]

To come at from another angle, I believe that most of the change that you discussed happens when the character decides to have sex. That decision should be a thoughtful one. The character should make that decision because they think they'll be in a better place once they've had sex. And that implies that the character is imagining that future better place, or what will happen tomorrow.
.

I've read enough of your stories that I can see this perspective in your stories. Your stories tend to be romantic. It's forbidden romance, because it's usually brother-sister, but it's romance. The trick in your stories is plausibly to explain how two people who shouldn't be romantically entangled get entangled anyway and to make it plausible and satisfying for the characters involved and for the reader.

But romance isn't necessary for erotica. Erotica can be tragic, or absurd, or horrific, or comic, or epic. It can just be an impulsive encounter. An indulgence of an erotic whim. An inhibited housewife one day breaks free and does something sexually crazy with a neighbor. A man who's always thought of himself as straight decides to have an encounter with another man. I don't think stories about those kinds of experiences are necessarily any less deep or significant than stories about romantic experiences. It's all a matter of how you pull it off.

The nice thing about it for an author is that the options are nearly infinite.

The thing I get from these threads and from the stories I've read is that what is "erotic" is deeply personal, and often weird, and peculiar to the reader and author, and the word "should" applies to a significant degree only to one's own tastes, and no more broadly than that. Which is fine.

 

[yukonnights]

I've read enough of your stories that I can see this perspective in your stories. Your stories tend to be romantic. It's forbidden romance, because it's usually brother-sister, but it's romance. The trick in your stories is plausibly to explain how two people who shouldn't be romantically entangled get entangled anyway and to make it plausible and satisfying for the characters involved and for the reader....

This is something I was thinking about too. The question in my mind is; What kind of reader am I aiming at? Is this story that those who follow and get notified of my new stories is going to like? It's not that an author has to satisfy a fan base — more the question of; does he/she want to?

While I'm here, the thought also came to me; To delve into the afterthoughts of the entire cast of characters is too much. But, what will the woman feel / think the next day? That in itself would provide ample content for some resolution / ending to the story.

 

[SimonDoom]

The question in my mind is; What kind of reader am I aiming at? .

Strive to write for yourself as the best reader possible. That's the reader I write for. I have yet fully to satisfy that reader, but I'm going to keep trying.

 

[Bramblethorn]

For me, I could get behind what comes after if the concept is between two people. Whether it be a taboo story, a romance, age gap, maybe a woman being seduced by another woman the first time, and if its done in a way that takes itself seriously.

But absurd things like what happens the day after a woman let's six guys gang bang her? There is nothing there other than it happening again which is where a premise that sex crazed and out there will go anyway.

Unless its the guys telling everyone in the world and slut shaming her, there is no other realistic end.

Maybe the OP's question is a good one, but to me, a bad example in premise.

Yeah, there are some stories where people want to explore the kind of fantasy that's easier to pull off when nobody's thinking about the day after. It's harder to write a "what comes after" for that sort of story and make it work.

I played with this a bit in The Floggings Will Continue: the main body of the story is the kind of scenario that would normally be suspension-of-disbelief fantasy fodder (mundane workplace to BDSM-ish orgy in the space of a few hours) but there is a morning after and it's very uncomfortable indeed.

 

[nonverbalcommunication]

“If I am not for myself, who will be for me? If I am only for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?” -- Hillel

In my highly biased opinion, the connections that people make with one another are really all that matters in life. I grew up in a small tightly-knit community where I knew everybody and they all knew me. The boy who lived next door, whom I knew from when we were 4 and 5 years old might as well have been my brother. The girl I've known from church since we were 3 might as well be my sister. So they and others were used as templates.

Should... Who knows... Prolly not in a 750 word "stroker."

Could? In a story of at least a page in length. Sure...

I like going into the character's motivation. The why and wherefores. How a little D-and-s opens doors to bliss. How many different things are sensual. Why we should never say "no" to a lover. How sex is really just communication. A true way of expressing our feelings for one another.

I am not a doll made of bisque china. I've pushed entire fully formed-- albeit small-- human beings out of my body, then I made a nutritious food to nourish them. But "Anon E. Mouse" tells me that I must be a guy or crazy. "Women don't like that." One told me that women don't have "spongy bodies that fill with blood, expand, tingle, and get hard."

I hope he is a virgin. If he has a partner, I feel sorry for her.

Anymore it seems that everyone is so easily offended. I don't have sex with people whom I don't trust-- whom I wouldn't trust with my life. I enjoy lovers who are predictable while they incrementally push boundaries. I enjoy giving them control (what is derided as CNC) and enjoying the outcome.

To me sex is a part of life-- at least part of a happy life-- it shouln't be divorced from everything else in life.

Just the opinion of SGOTI.

 

[NotWise]

While I'm here, the thought also came to me; To delve into the afterthoughts of the entire cast of characters is too much. But, what will the woman feel / think the next day? That in itself would provide ample content for some resolution / ending to the story.

That would be a reasonable way to handle the example in the OP.

I look at the question a little more broadly, in a way that 8letters already mentioned. The question for me is more, "should the next day make a difference?" For me, the answer is clearly "yes," but some readers would never knowingly read a word in my stories.

A denouement that addresses the consequences of sex is an awkward device. I used something similar in my last story (Candy Shops), but I don't think that it's generally a good idea. I've also made the "what's next" conversation the climax of a story (Finding the Fourth Girl). What seems more natural to me is that the story is written so that the consequences are known before the end of the story.

For instance, in the story I'm working on now, the final scene ends in bed when the woman asks if her lover's offer to teach her to ride horseback is still good. Everything has been set up so the reader knows the question means she's agreeing to a longer, larger relationship. At least, that's how I think it'll work.

But then, that's a romance. In Romance stories the consequences of sex always make a difference.

 

[Voboy]

Strive to write for yourself as the best reader possible. That's the reader I write for.

Hear, hear.

I often arouse myself while writing, and occasionally even when skimming for continuity once I'm done. The reception my stories have received make me feel very comfortable that there are many, many readers who are more or less just like me, and if that's my audience? I'm all for it.

Sometimes I feel like a short, simple story; by my standards, that's usually about three Lit pages. MUCH more often, I feel like getting immersed. As I said earlier, I often want to read about people who give a shit about the consequences of their sexual choices.

I like characters that feel real. That's all part of that.

 

[MelissaBaby]

I disagree. Very few, if any, of my stories are just about hot sex and there is certainly a large audience for stories with a plot and a message. That said, I assume you're probably just joking

I doubt it. Comments like that are made here on a regular basis.

 

[yukonnights]

Strive to write for yourself as the best reader possible. That's the reader I write for. I have yet fully to satisfy that reader, but I'm going to keep trying.

Yes, I do write for myself as a hobby to pass time. I've satisfied "fan #1" to a large degree and haven't sold my soul to some 'popularity devil'. That said, common sense tells me that I also need to satisfy my audience — otherwise, why publish/post the stories at all? In a broader sense; what artist of any creative product ignores the likes and artistic tastes of the ones who the artist hopes to entertain?

I'm a pretty simple guy, my stories seem to always veer in the direction of love and romance. Thankfully, there's a lot of romantics in the world and they come in all shades, circumstances and sexual orientations. But yes, in order to create the best art one has to love what is being created. Like you, I've not yet fully satisfied myself — but my fans have propped me up enough to keep trying.

Good point and I'm glad you mentioned it.

 

[yukonnights]

Originally Posted by yukonnights View Post
I disagree. Very few, if any, of my stories are just about hot sex and there is certainly a large audience for stories with a plot and a message. That said, I assume you're probably just joking

I doubt it. Comments like that are made here on a regular basis.

I don't doubt that there is a large audience for stories that are actually just scenes — much like the online porn clips without the visuals – no real story, no message, no emotions, etc. I don't quite understand why anyone would opt to read such content rather than watch it — but it's a big world. That such content is the majority of what's published on LitE is doubtful IMO. It's not really that important to me, I don't read that kind of content — but to each their own, etc.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Hey, it's just a fuck story. Nobody gives a shit about the next day.

Speak for yourself.

 

[Lifestyle66]

If your story is about a gangbang, then that's all there is to it. The office relationship just sets the scenario for how they came together.

If your story is about office relationships, then there's a longer story, and you need some concluding scenario with their final resolutions.