Self Esteem Issues

[SinfulSailor]

I've read some threads here on Lit in which people, mostly submissives, have mentioned having self esteem issues and revealed and discussed how that impacts what they will or will not do, what they will or will not allow and how that impacts their relationships and expectations from their relationships, and so on.

There was also a thread about whether a d/s relationship can or even should be able to create psychological or emotional healing/improvement.

I think its far less talked about but I've long been of the opinion that unreasonable, irrational and/or hurtful PYL's often have some self esteem issues of their own that are at the heart of their overt conduct. They just manifest their issues through cruelty, irrationality, setting their pyl up to fail, etc., instead of through overt self doubt.

And, I am of the opinion that a d/s relationship is in many ways more intense than a 'nilla relationship, sex included but not being the only super-intensity component. In other ways though, a d/s component can simplify a relationship, expectations and life in general and contribute to personal and relationship harmony. (Indeed, that's what I strive for personally.) So maybe that part is a wash?

But anyway, the questions occur to me:

Should people who have a high level of internal self esteem issues (I guess we all have *some* self doubt, right?) first work on those issues and getting their self esteem issues under control before they embark on a d/s relationship?

Is carrying serious self esteem issues into a d/s relationship placing an untenable burden on the relationship? Do those of us who do this set ourselves up for heartache and increase our risk of failure?

 

[catalina_francisco]

I don't think it matters whether it be a D/s or mainstream relationship, both can result in just as much damage and hurt, just as much heartache etc., if there are unresolved issues, or if things go wrong. I also don't think being in a D/s relationship necessarily means it is going to be more intense than a mainstream relationship. I think it is about the people who are in the relationship more so than the flavour of the relationship dynamic. I know I have had intense relationships in the past, mostly because that is how I love, how I do most things. LOL, I am not one of those people who can go through life with a casual approach to most anything...if it holds enough allure for me to be interested, I am going to be likely to be very intense about that interest. It isn't always a recipe for success, but it sure beats living beige any day.

D/s just fills in some of those things which were always leaving me wishing for something I didn't quite know how to define. To answer the questions though, I think everyone has self esteem issues somewhere in their make up, some struggle with it constantly, some only sometimes, and some do not realise it is an issue until something happens to make it apparent it has been shaken up a little or a lot...mainstream can do that as easily as D/s.

Catalina

 

[a_caged_cock]

Here comes an “it depends” answer..but I’ll stick my neck out at the end with an actual yes or no lol.

Someone with a high level of self-esteem issues should look at who they attracted into their life in previous relationships, and if they were damaging, then it would be a huge self-esteem builder to say “I don’t NEED a relationship right now.”

On the other hand, if they look back and say “I don’t deserve a relationship right now” well…the best thing they could do is realize they are worthy of a relationship.

As for putting a burden on a relationship, I assume you mean that the issues coming from the person with low self-esteem are so great the relationship crashes and burns…so what? If we wait until we are perfect, we’ll die first. And even though the person might have “issues” they still have much to give.

 

[FurryFury]

In some ways I've always had some pretty serious lack of self esteem. That didn't prevent into entering into bad relationships or good ones, nilla or D/s.

I don't believe it set me up for heartbreak either.

It did help me have a LOT more sex because when I was most insecure was when I wanted the most sex, at least until I discovered D/s.

I believe everyone has self esteem issues though. A few have too much but most seem to have too little. I'd hate to put my life on hold to "fix" something that I may never figure out how to fix.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

I am a strong believer in the philosophy that change must come from within, when a person has worked through their own issues and reached a place where they can take positive steps. I think that to embark on any kind of relationship when you know you are psychologically unwell is a bad idea, particularly if there were serious self esteem issues in your last relationship. People have a tendency to think that a wonderful new romance will solve all their problems when in fact it just distracts them for a while until old issues resurface.

I am sceptical about the notion of a PYL as a therapist. I think that more often, when a PYL has 'helped' someone through their issues, those issues have been shelved or swept under the carpet. When that relationship fails, the old issues come back to the surface with a vengeance. I know we're quick to beat the therapy drum here on the forum but it's generally for very good reasons.

It's a very seductive notion for some submissives to believe that they can abdicate responsibility for their own psychological welfare and let their PYL tell them what they should be thinking and feeling. It can create a dangerous emotional dependency on the PYL which in turn can cause huge psychological fallout if and when the relationship ends. Even if the relationship doesn't end, events can trigger a 'relapse' that then calls into question all the PYL's efforts and the pyl's progress thus far. There is also the belief that any progress made is because of the PYL so the pyl never really has any true faith in themselves as they give the PYL complete credit for everything.

If a therapist is doing more harm than good, you get another therapist. When it's your significant other doing more harm than good, albiet with fine intentions, where does that leave the relationship?

Um... hope that makes sense. It did when I typed it.

 

[myinnerslut]

i have come to the conclusion that it is a rare person who does not have any form of self esteem problem. it seems people have them to some degree everywhere you turn. myself included. that being said, the cuase and depth an way these issues manifest are different. some, and id go as fara s to say most, are capable of having a relationship. often the love that you find in a relationship, D/s or otherwise, works wonders towards healing self esteem issues. im not saying the lover heals things, but the love itself experienced in the relationship is a healer.

though i do believe in fair warning. if you keep your issues hidden till they errupt, your SO will probably thing youve just gone crazy. talk to them. dont catch them off guard. that seems like its asking for trouble.

 

[EmpressFi]

I've had self esteem issues for centuries.. ok.. so I havent been alive that long, but it FEELS that long. But between Malin's love for me and Keeper of Fi's love for me and showing me that if Master says I'm beautiful, who am I to argue... it's been getting better. Not saying I'm "cured", goddess no, but I'm getting better, it's not something I wallow in... my clothing styles have changed, I've been wearing shorter sleeved shirts and shorter skirts, etc. I couldnt have done it without their love

 

[SubKekiLee]

I've had self esteem issues as well for a long time due to a childhood filled with doubt and abuse... It has taken me years to overcome that doubt and self realization that I am beautiful and that I have a good heart... Sir brought that out in me and with his love and his respect and his encouragement I have been able to see that my inner beauty matches my outer beauty I truly belive a "nilla" relationship wouldnt have done this for me.. YMMV....

 

[BlondeRose]

I am a strong believer in the philosophy that change must come from within, when a person has worked through their own issues and reached a place where they can take positive steps. I think that to embark on any kind of relationship when you know you are psychologically unwell is a bad idea, particularly if there were serious self esteem issues in your last relationship. People have a tendency to think that a wonderful new romance will solve all their problems when in fact it just distracts them for a while until old issues resurface.

I am sceptical about the notion of a PYL as a therapist. I think that more often, when a PYL has 'helped' someone through their issues, those issues have been shelved or swept under the carpet. When that relationship fails, the old issues come back to the surface with a vengeance. I know we're quick to beat the therapy drum here on the forum but it's generally for very good reasons.

It's a very seductive notion for some submissives to believe that they can abdicate responsibility for their own psychological welfare and let their PYL tell them what they should be thinking and feeling. It can create a dangerous emotional dependency on the PYL which in turn can cause huge psychological fallout if and when the relationship ends. Even if the relationship doesn't end, events can trigger a 'relapse' that then calls into question all the PYL's efforts and the pyl's progress thus far. There is also the belief that any progress made is because of the PYL so the pyl never really has any true faith in themselves as they give the PYL complete credit for everything.

If a therapist is doing more harm than good, you get another therapist. When it's your significant other doing more harm than good, albiet with fine intentions, where does that leave the relationship?

Um... hope that makes sense. It did when I typed it.

Great post and yes it makes sense... I have very low self esteem and do know I need to work on it myself instead of relying on others for it. Will I ever be able to over come it .. idk .. I need a lot of work in that area.

 

[Homburg]

I can't think of a single person that I know that does not have self esteem issues. I'm pretty much the picture of self esteem (at l4east to most people that know me), yet I have self-doubt, image issues, etc. And in the areas where my self-esteem actually is monolithic and massive, it occludes my ability to understand and empathise with others in various ways.

We're all damaged. We just have different cracks and bruises, and react differently. So, no, I don' tthink it is some kind of failing to enter into a relationship when you are imperfect.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

I can't think of a single person that I know that does not have self esteem issues. I'm pretty much the picture of self esteem (at l4east to most people that know me), yet I have self-doubt, image issues, etc. And in the areas where my self-esteem actually is monolithic and massive, it occludes my ability to understand and empathise with others in various ways.

We're all damaged. We just have different cracks and bruises, and react differently. So, no, I don' tthink it is some kind of failing to enter into a relationship when you are imperfect.

Oh I know we're all imperfect, I'm as psychologically dented as anyone else. I think though that when self esteem issues are significant and emotionally debilitating, a new relationship isn't always a good idea. People project the issues they had in a previous relationship onto any new one without even realising it and that's how negative patterns emerge. If someone has self esteem issues to the point where therapy is needed, it should be left in the hands of a professional that they can connect with and trust, rather than a swank new PYL with big ideas about 'saving' their new pyl.

I think these 'save me' subs are the ones who get us all painted as emotional doormats who are seeking 'abuse' as a backhanded form of 'self harm.' Dangerous label indeed and the main reason BDSM can attract predatory abusers.

 

[Homburg]

Sure, self esteem issues so potent that they need therapy aren't good baggage to bring into a new relationship, but the nature of self-esteem issues is that they often make you feel like you have less worth than you do. Telling someone with self-esteem issues that they shouldn't enter into a new relationship isn't exactly a great thing. Really poisonous self-esteem problems, sure, but the normal low self-esteem?

My point was that everyone has problems. Saying that those problems are a barrier to relationships strikes me as self-defeating. Then again, this is one of the areas where the monolith of esteem blocks out the sun, so I have trouble putting myself in the shoes of someone with low self-esteem. My POV might not be all that worthwhile here =P

 

[Netzach]

I can't think of a single person that I know that does not have self esteem issues. I'm pretty much the picture of self esteem (at l4east to most people that know me), yet I have self-doubt, image issues, etc. And in the areas where my self-esteem actually is monolithic and massive, it occludes my ability to understand and empathise with others in various ways.

We're all damaged. We just have different cracks and bruises, and react differently. So, no, I don' tthink it is some kind of failing to enter into a relationship when you are imperfect.

Yes, that. I basically have learned to widen the gaps between haunting periods of paralyzing self-doubt as my art form.

 

[ataxia.girl]

I think these 'save me' subs are the ones who get us all painted as emotional doormats who are seeking 'abuse' as a backhanded form of 'self harm.' Dangerous label indeed and the main reason BDSM can attract predatory abusers.

Excellent point. There's a reason why an interest in Sado\masochism is often listed as a symptom or indication of possible Borderline Personality Disorder. The site i linked is newer and does not list BDSM as a symptom but the sites that do are generally pretty old and outdated. The "From the Inside" section is also very good.

Thought i would go ahead and link some info since, well, people who have this disorder are often attracted to this lifestyle, have huge self esteem issues, and if they are your sub you might want to understand it. You may want to understand it so you can avoid them. The book "Stop Walking on Eggshells" is also extremely good for understanding and dealing with borderlines constructively.

If i sew a warning label on myself can i stay?

 

[VelvetDarkness]

If i sew a warning label on myself can i stay?

Oh sure, pull up a chair. Think we all need government health warnings of one kind or another. Any group of people that defines itself by how fucked up they are is going to attract more than a few crackpots.

"Mad is a useless word, a non-term, there are only varying degrees of sanity.

Sane is a useless word, a non-term, there are only varying degrees of madness."

Forget who I'm quoting but I think it's an interesting concept.

ETA: If you do manage to successfully sew a label onto your ass then you are officially hardcore. That'll be some hawt needleplay.

 

[Sexualinnocent]

I can't think of a single person that I know that does not have self esteem issues. I'm pretty much the picture of self esteem (at l4east to most people that know me), yet I have self-doubt, image issues, etc. And in the areas where my self-esteem actually is monolithic and massive, it occludes my ability to understand and empathise with others in various ways.

We're all damaged. We just have different cracks and bruises, and react differently. So, no, I don' tthink it is some kind of failing to enter into a relationship when you are imperfect.

When I read this...I thought...Homburg, you are a really cool dude.

We all have issues, yes...it's how we deal with them that is the mark of our character. I wish I didn't have the issues that surfaced this weekend with my relatives, but oh well...I still am learning to deal, and it may take my lifetime. It's not just me, but my weird relatives...