Romanticism and BDSM

[jasonlf]

I was just thinking of something....

Is it undomly to be romantic? I'm a really romantic guy, and it just seems to be a weird thought combined with S&M.

 

[Bandit58]

I was just thinking of something....

Is it undomly to be romantic? I'm a really romantic guy, and it just seems to be a weird thought combined with S&M.

Nope, not to me anyway. My Master has bought me flowers on several occasions, taken me to dinner and treats me like a special lady, and I think it's wonderful He had even set up a special proposal for me at the speedway track we are involved in, but He got ill and it had to be cancelled

I love that He is so thoughtful and romantic, it makes our relationship so very special and precious to me

 

[TaintedB]

I think romance is inherent in any sexuality that involves the mind as much as sadomasochism does. Less theoretically, my master was an extremely romantic man. Didn't cramp his sadism one bit. Or vice versa.

 

[DutchDom]

I’m just guessing here… But you seem to be the romantic-domly type?

If you ever have a partner who’d doubt your domlyness because of your romantic side than you could do the following: Grab her by the ponytail and pull her hair back. Then, while pulling her hair, pull her face closer to yours without ever loosing eyecontact (stare her down). With her eyes inches away from yours say something along the lines of: “My romantic side is as much a part of who and what I am, as My domly side. I need both, so you’re just gonna have to take My romantic side up your cute little behind if this is going to work out”. Followed by a firm smacker on the lips and let that melt away into somewhat more tender loving, huggin and gentle kissing.

My 2 cents… the question should not be: “Is it undomly to be romantic?”. But more how does one combine the both. They only seem to contradict each other.

Edited to say: “How can S&M be unromantic if you know that’s what both you and your partner long for/need”.

 

[Killishandra]

I was just thinking of something....

Is it undomly to be romantic? I'm a really romantic guy, and it just seems to be a weird thought combined with S&M.

I think in this case we should make (yet again) the distinction between being a Dom and being a Top. Unsadistic Dominants do exist. Being Dominant oftentimes goes hand-in-hand with being a Top or being sadistic, but not always. It happens that some Dominants are not sadistic at all, and their bedroom play consists of not much more than light bondage or perhaps not even then. I think of "Dom" as being a very controlling role expressed in daily life (S/He controls their sub, the relationship, etc. At least for the most part.) Romanticism and especially chivalry fit in very well in this situation.

However, being a "Top" is more of a sadistic position, and largely confined to the bedroom (although you can be sadistic anywhere, and it doesn't have to be purely physical, you can be sadistic mentally or emotionally against a person.) This is the idea that seems to contridict being a romantic... But I think the posts above me have done a good job of explaining that. Romance is a state of mind... Look through the recent pic thread where tealsphynx used clothespins to make a huge heart on dragon's butt. That was S&M.... but isn't it also kind of romantic?

 

[rosco rathbone]

BDSM/sexual-romantic-love power imbalance is the most romantic thing there is.

 

[AngelicAssassin]

But more how does one combine the both.

Create an emulsion just like one does a vinaigrette, shaken, not stirred. Actually, i don't see the issue. Personalities have multiple facets. Aside from the socio/psychopaths, we all have tenderness in our hearts, and i'm not all that sure the former don't have instances of what passes for kind, gentle, pick your "good" behavior as well.

Things get interesting, however, when two people can mix that magic cocktail just right. It doesn't matter if you end up with an Amaretto Sour, or Long Island Ice Tea. If the buzz gets you where you want to go, and tastes good going down, more power to you.

 

[arctic-stranger]

One of the things I really appreciate about the French Girl is that we can combine BDSM with romance. We both love both parts of the relationship. Sometimes they overlap, and sometimes not. Sometime we focused on just one aspect, and sometimes I tried to incorporate both. Since we are on the front end of the relationship, and just getting to know one another, a lot of what we did (and hope to keep doing) meets both our needs needs for a Maitre/esclave relationship, as well as a romantic relationship.

Biggest example; The French Girl keeps kidding me about hating baseball. So i took her to the Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown. For me it was both romantic, and a kind of punishment--romantic in that i was sharing something i loved with her, and punishment in that she didnt like baseball. Well it did not turn out to be a punishment at all, because she really enjoyed seeing me there, and how excited i was over seeing Babe Ruth's uniform, or telling about Don Larson's perfect World Series game.

On the other hand, when i have a hunk of her hair in my hand, or have her tied, and am telling her how she is mine, every part of her, and proving it by taking every part, that is also romantic, in a weird sense to both of us.

I guess, in the end, we have to say that romance is a hell of a lot deeper than Ricky and Lucy. More like Benedick and Beatrice. Or Viola and Orsino. Or Petruchio and Katherina.

 

[Guest]

I was just thinking of something....

Is it undomly to be romantic? I'm a really romantic guy, and it just seems to be a weird thought combined with S&M.

Nope.

 

[arctic-stranger]

Nope.

Word...

 

[catalina_francisco]

Romance and D/s can be the perfect dichotomy providing an amazing tingle from combining both light and dark, with no set guidelines for when one or the other will play seperately or together. Add a sadistic Dominant and it is near perfect.

Catalina

 

[jasonlf]

Romance and D/s can be the perfect dichotomy providing an amazing tingle from combining both light and dark, with no set guidelines for when one or the other will play seperately or together. Add a sadistic Dominant and it is near perfect.

Catalina

If all the posts (which have all been good to a certain degree)... this one was the most revelatory...

The black/white contrast -- you tell her you love her, give her roses, and treat her like a lady before tying her up and treating her like a ... um... lady? Heh. It's almost like the romanticism pulls her up to a pedistal, and the S&M knocks it out from under her, kinda increasing the intensity of the S&M experience.

 

[naughtygirl69s]

If all the posts (which have all been good to a certain degree)... this one was the most revelatory...

The black/white contrast -- you tell her you love her, give her roses, and treat her like a lady before tying her up and treating her like a ... um... lady? Heh. It's almost like the romanticism pulls her up to a pedistal, and the S&M knocks it out from under her, kinda increasing the intensity of the S&M experience.

good points.

I like the thought of this......I'm new to bdsm and this is the way I picture it, being sweet but dominant, calling me dirty names, pulling my hair but, being passionate and loving at the same time

Now, where can I find a man like that?

 

[Marquis]

Most experienced people are probably thinking... uhhhh BDSM is romance.

I think I can answer this question well for you Jason because I do believe I understand where you're coming from. If I'm totally wrong please correct me, but what you have to realize is that, even as a Dom, BDSM is not totally about your desires.

As crazy as it may still sound to you, there are women out there who get genuine pleasure out of fulfilling your desires. They often expect to be recognized and appreciated, but the goal is to give as much if not more than you get, even if you never think of it that way.

Let's say my sub does something to upset me. I am now walking around with this sharp twinge in my brow and the stiffness of annoyance in my neck. I could probably wait it out and eventually I will get over it and we'll talk and I'll see she is sorry and it'll be all good. Or I could just put her over my knee and spank her while I remind her of the day's lesson. It makes me feel better because I get it out, and because I feel pain makes my point more accurately than ignoring her or walking around pissed off. To me, ignoring her says "I can't deal with you" and walking around pissed off says "this isn't about you". If neither is the case, why treat it differently? Besides, people say things they don't mean when they are hurt or angry, and words can be more painful than anything physical.

On the other side of the coin, my sub is relieved to take her lumps and have it over with. She'd rather deal with the physical ramifications of her mistake than be treated like I love her less over something that probably isn't that big of a deal. She feels comforted that I am not content to ignore our problems and she relishes the opportunity to surrender to my dark desire, to show me that she really is sorry and willing to deal with the repurcussions of her mistake.

Now it get's more complicated if she doesn't think she made a mistake. I think a good sub will recognize the importance of not upsetting her Dominant regardless, even if he "shouldn't" have been upset by her action. D/s is a constantly growing and changing relationship and I think the best Doms and subs are those that become the Doms and subs that their partners need, and not just generic Doms and subs with a preset guideline of what is fair or right. Even (maybe especially) the subbiest sub has the right not to be abused however, and thus it is EXTREMELY important to check yourself as a Dominant, because your sub may not do it for you. If you are anything like me, you won't want her to, even when you know you're wrong. However, she will have all the more respect for you and be all the more willing to follow you if you apologize when you realize you are wrong whether you think you can get away with it or not. If you want to be the one handling the relationship, you better handle it.

I think most subs will give their men some leeway to be themselves. A lot of men unfamiliar with the ways of the sub will use this freedom to abuse the subs' kindness and many others will never accept the gift the sub is offering. Use that leeway properly however, and she will give you her universe. Use that leeway to build her trust, slowly, to make her realize that she can be your slut and she will still be your love, that she can be your slave and still be your princess.

She will let you tear her down if she knows you will put her back together. All most subs want is to please you as best as they possibly can anyway. Show them you won't take it for granted, and they just might.

 

[caela]

Marquis, all I can say is Wow...very deep and very very well thought out.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Most experienced people are probably thinking... uhhhh BDSM is romance.

I think I can answer this question well for you Jason because I do believe I understand where you're coming from. If I'm totally wrong please correct me, but what you have to realize is that, even as a Dom, BDSM is not totally about your desires.

As crazy as it may still sound to you, there are women out there who get genuine pleasure out of fulfilling your desires. They often expect to be recognized and appreciated, but the goal is to give as much if not more than you get, even if you never think of it that way.

Let's say my sub does something to upset me. I am now walking around with this sharp twinge in my brow and the stiffness of annoyance in my neck. I could probably wait it out and eventually I will get over it and we'll talk and I'll see she is sorry and it'll be all good. Or I could just put her over my knee and spank her while I remind her of the day's lesson. It makes me feel better because I get it out, and because I feel pain makes my point more accurately than ignoring her or walking around pissed off. To me, ignoring her says "I can't deal with you" and walking around pissed off says "this isn't about you". If neither is the case, why treat it differently? Besides, people say things they don't mean when they are hurt or angry, and words can be more painful than anything physical.

On the other side of the coin, my sub is relieved to take her lumps and have it over with. She'd rather deal with the physical ramifications of her mistake than be treated like I love her less over something that probably isn't that big of a deal. She feels comforted that I am not content to ignore our problems and she relishes the opportunity to surrender to my dark desire, to show me that she really is sorry and willing to deal with the repurcussions of her mistake.

Now it get's more complicated if she doesn't think she made a mistake. I think a good sub will recognize the importance of not upsetting her Dominant regardless, even if he "shouldn't" have been upset by her action. D/s is a constantly growing and changing relationship and I think the best Doms and subs are those that become the Doms and subs that their partners need, and not just generic Doms and subs with a preset guideline of what is fair or right. Even (maybe especially) the subbiest sub has the right not to be abused however, and thus it is EXTREMELY important to check yourself as a Dominant, because your sub may not do it for you. If you are anything like me, you won't want her to, even when you know you're wrong. However, she will have all the more respect for you and be all the more willing to follow you if you apologize when you realize you are wrong whether you think you can get away with it or not. If you want to be the one handling the relationship, you better handle it.

I think most subs will give their men some leeway to be themselves. A lot of men unfamiliar with the ways of the sub will use this freedom to abuse the subs' kindness and many others will never accept the gift the sub is offering. Use that leeway properly however, and she will give you her universe. Use that leeway to build her trust, slowly, to make her realize that she can be your slut and she will still be your love, that she can be your slave and still be your princess.

She will let you tear her down if she knows you will put her back together. All most subs want is to please you as best as they possibly can anyway. Show them you won't take it for granted, and they just might.

Excellent post Marquis.

Catalina

 

[YinandYang]

I think it goes hand in hand....he gets pleasure out of making me hurt physically, and I get pleasure from being hurt. When the scene is over, and I am at the stage where everything is miles away, in my own little world, and unable to think or speak coherently....he pulls me towards him and holds me whilst muttering words of endearments. Its very intense, spiritual and romantic.....couldn't live without this side of BDSM

 

[Netzach]

I think I view this a little differently than a lot of people.

Sadism to me, IS Romantic. Highly romantic. Nothing says "I *am* you" like having a twitching, vulnerable pink bit of human in my hands and squeezing till the tears well. Nothing connects me to my lover quite the same way as when he or she is wincing and still letting me do whatever it is I'm doing. That's so much more profound to me than most of human experience, and it certainly ranks the memorable sits on park benches and makeout sessions in cars that I've had as well.

 

[laurel-marie]

I was just thinking of something....

Is it undomly to be romantic? I'm a really romantic guy, and it just seems to be a weird thought combined with S&M.

Why would it be undomly to be romantic?
I don't see how it 'lowers' his status because he might wash her hair or give her a flower.

<snip>
I think most subs will give their men some leeway to be themselves. A lot of men unfamiliar with the ways of the sub will use this freedom to abuse the subs' kindness and many others will never accept the gift the sub is offering. Use that leeway properly however, and she will give you her universe. Use that leeway to build her trust, slowly, to make her realize that she can be your slut and she will still be your love, that she can be your slave and still be your princess.

She will let you tear her down if she knows you will put her back together. All most subs want is to please you as best as they possibly can anyway. Show them you won't take it for granted, and they just might.

Exactly how I feel about it. It gives me a feeling that i am cherished, important, loved....which creates in me a deeper need of wanting to please.

Being romantic has different meanings to different people....maybe that's different levels...the point is, a simple heart drawing all the way to a candlelight dinner while violin music playing or him using a paddle with a heart cut out, if the act makes you feel loved and cared for then to me it is romance and does not lower the status of the one giving it.

(Hope this had some sense in it. Made sense in my head)

 

[YinandYang]

I think I view this a little differently than a lot of people.

Sadism to me, IS Romantic. Highly romantic. Nothing says "I *am* you" like having a twitching, vulnerable pink bit of human in my hands and squeezing till the tears well. Nothing connects me to my lover quite the same way as when he or she is wincing and still letting me do whatever it is I'm doing. That's so much more profound to me than most of human experience, and it certainly ranks the memorable sits on park benches and makeout sessions in cars that I've had as well.

All that you have said there is what I find in my belief of 'he hurts me so he must love me'....you explained it better than I ever could

 

[SueJ]

Marquis, that was so well said....

 

[Kajira Callista]

I think I view this a little differently than a lot of people.

Sadism to me, IS Romantic. Highly romantic. Nothing says "I *am* you" like having a twitching, vulnerable pink bit of human in my hands and squeezing till the tears well. Nothing connects me to my lover quite the same way as when he or she is wincing and still letting me do whatever it is I'm doing. That's so much more profound to me than most of human experience, and it certainly ranks the memorable sits on park benches and makeout sessions in cars that I've had as well.

That is exactly how i feel. The thought of someone hurting me lots makes me feel like a starry eyed in love giggling teenager.

 

[Hell Cat]

If you ever have a partner who’d doubt your domlyness because of your romantic side than you could do the following: Grab her by the ponytail and pull her hair back. Then, while pulling her hair, pull her face closer to yours without ever loosing eyecontact (stare her down). With her eyes inches away from yours say something along the lines of: “My romantic side is as much a part of who and what I am, as My domly side. I need both, so you’re just gonna have to take My romantic side up your cute little behind if this is going to work out”. Followed by a firm smacker on the lips and let that melt away into somewhat more tender loving, huggin and gentle kissing.

I am soooooooo wet right now.

 

[shy slave]

Marquis post described many of the subs who post here including myself.

Laurel-Marie has said it makes her feel cherished, important and loved.

Without the romance of BDSM what would we feel: abused, uncared for, unloved, a waste of a life.

Most subs (male and female) have experience of PYL's who have not appreciated what was been given freely and willingly.

There are real Doms/Tops who are very experienced in the way to flog/cane/administer pain but do not begin to understand how to maintain the psychological safety of a submissive. Nor do they want to, it does not make them 'wannabes' it makes them PYL's who do not deliver romance and sadism in equal amounts.

Look around the threads and read between the lines of every successful relationship, the romance is there as a necessary and integral part.

For myself how much easier to take the pain and the punishment if you know he will always deal with issues in a way that makes you feel more loved and more secure.

Quote by Dutch Dom

If you ever have a partner who’d doubt your domlyness because of your romantic side than you could do the following: Grab her by the ponytail and pull her hair back. Then, while pulling her hair, pull her face closer to yours without ever loosing eyecontact (stare her down). With her eyes inches away from yours say something along the lines of: “My romantic side is as much a part of who and what I am, as My domly side. I need both,

This would work everytime for me, how could you doubt the need in him to be romantic or the need of the submissive to hear him say it.

 

[DutchDom]

I am soooooooo wet right now.

Glad I could be of service.