requirements to submit

[FloggingMolly]

I was wondering if I'm totally odd...

Until lately, I've normally been the Domme. However, I'm finding more and more that my submissive side is controlling my thoughts and fantasies. With the idea of trying that out and seeing how I get along with actually doing it, hubby and I have been in discussion regarding the things I feel I need to get into that frame of mind.

I know that in theory, I shouldn't be making demands of his behaviour, not just in this sense, but across our relationship as a whole. But I don't feel I am able to hand over control unless he is acting in a confident, positive, self-reliant way. I need to not feel 'needed'.

Its hard to explain, I have very little experience on this side of the relationship, and its hard for me to put my feelings out there for fear of being 'wrong' or 'stupid', ya know?

Just wondering if anyone else has these behavioural conditions they feel they need?

 

[JMaxwell69]

I wouldn't worry about being "wrong" or "stupid". Certainly you can't really be "wrong" with respect to how you feel.

Your statement about not feeling the need to be needed is interesting as it is the opposite of what I've heard from several subs in conversation. Though I'm admittedly not the most knowledgeable or experienced in these areas.

 

[FurryFury]

Some people want to be submissive but only to a person who can do x. Now x might be anything from caring for them to not caring for them and anything in between.

It takes the right fit for any relationship BDSM or otherwise.

One of my husband's ideas of bedroom submission is being tied up well enough that he can't escape. It's something I'm not very good at doing.

 

[FloggingMolly]

thanks guys

I dont mind being needed, but cant submit to neediness, childishness, whininess, or bad-temper. Not that hubby often is these things, but I couldnt get into the right head space if this was happening. I need my Dom to be strong and self-assured. Am I asking too much/being too demanding?

 

[JMaxwell69]

thanks guys

I dont mind being needed, but cant submit to neediness, childishness, whininess, or bad-temper. Not that hubby often is these things, but I couldnt get into the right head space if this was happening. I need my Dom to be strong and self-assured. Am I asking too much/being too demanding?

I would say self-assurance is a essential ingredient if he wants to dominate. The dom shouldn't have any reason to be needed, that person should take control. Why whine if you have the power?

 

[subish2009]

thanks guys

I dont mind being needed, but cant submit to neediness, childishness, whininess, or bad-temper. Not that hubby often is these things, but I couldnt get into the right head space if this was happening. I need my Dom to be strong and self-assured. Am I asking too much/being too demanding?

You're never asking too much if you're just stating your fantasies. If you're asking him to do this for you in r/l, then you're still not asking for too much with this as your ideal. You do have to realize, however, that his best effort may still not be quite what you had in mind. Especially if Domming is brand new to him. It may take some practice for you both to find your roles, and it's also possible that he may not have it in him at all. I'd say give it a shot...start small and see how well you both do with working toward making the fantasy a reality.

 

[FloggingMolly]

Thank you, I really appreciate your input

 

[joehmpsd]

I think it depends on whether he is able to be the Dom in the bedroom or the degree of hie submissiveness. Our intimate relationship revolves around D/S with me being Dom the vast majority of the time, however on occasion she wants to be the Dom and I welcome it.

The point I am getting at Molly is that she has to be in the state of mind and want to be in charge, it does not happen much but when it does it is fantastic for both of us. My responsibility is to be open to her desires and not shun her when she is in the right mind set. The bottom line is that you need to have clear lines of communication.

 

[YourCaptor]

Well, you could teach him to do whatever it is you want. Say getting your ass beat.

He'll practice and whine, and moan, and complain, and then hell get good at it, and hell be able to do it while balancing the check book, and he'll have an air of art to his talent, etc, etc.

Build up his comfort with whatever, and hell be confident about it, maybe even cocky.

 

[BehaviorMod]

I would like to add some constructive input to this conversation, though I hope it doesn't come out cross or blunt or rude; this is just me rattling off what's on the brain as it concerns this topic.

First and foremost; is the concern of what we in the BDSM lifestyle call 'switching' . When you switch, or label oneself as a switch; it is essentially saying that you go back and forth from Dom/Domme to sub as needed or desired. While I do not agree with this concept, and believe that everyone has their place as a Dom OR a sub, not as both; I cannot deny that it's possible to do both roles properly. The probability of both roles being continuously switched and done properly though is very low. Reason for that being is that when you are a submissive; there is a bit of ....mental conditioning...that goes into training someone to serve you. Just as well, I'm sure the same thing applies to a Dominant learning His/her trade at being just that.

When you suddenly want to reverse those roles, it can often times cause confusion because A: you are about to undo all that conditioning that made you Dom/sub in the first place for something that's experimental and may not work out how you invisioned it in the first place. B: It might take one of you, or both of you, out of your comfort zone because of the extremes at which the roles are being reversed.

Now dispite all I said, none of my opinions truely matter....we all have them, and all that matters is if you can be happy with it. I only condone switching if you have mastered your current role. If you are truely submissive and know everything there is to know about being submissive; and the Dom knows everything about being Dom and you've been in your roles and comfortable for a time. THEN I feel it's okay to try the other end of the spectrum. I just don't feel it's good for the mindset and mental 'place' for both partners to switch early on in a D/s relationship. It is said that the best Dom/Dommes have been submissives first....and perhaps vice versa. It is a lovely thing to experiment with and if it can be done correctly, will enrich both of your understandings of this wonderful world of BDSM.....I just stress the importance of the mind set involved.

As others above me have mentioned, it might take a while to reset his frame of mind so that he CAN take control and be that fierce, strict, controling Dom you want. After all....you had him taking orders and doing as you commanded prior.....just be patient, and remember that humans can be taught almost anything with enough effort.

Again, I hope my input and viewpoints were helpfull and didn't offend anyone and feel free to send any comments or etc to my PM box.

 

[joehmpsd]

Well put BehaviorMod, switching is very tough to master, however for us we have been in a relationship for fifteen years and are vary comfortable with our roles in and out of the bedroom and we do not live a 24/7 lifestyle.

 

[BehaviorMod]

Ah....well then that should make it all the more easier. I didn't have enough facts to know just what kind of relationship you two had....and I do hate to speculate so I just threw it all out there.

I wish you both luck in figuring this all out....my best advice is just patience and continued work and effort. And communication.....but if you're still going strong after 15 years I think you two have communication down pat.

 

[FloggingMolly]

BehaviourMod: No offense caused at all hon. I'm grateful for your input.

History-wise, Mads (my other half, who is no doubt around the forum somewhere) and I have been together 10 years. When we first developed an interest in BDSM, it was mostly for single scenes here and there... I wasn't really conditioned to being his Domme as any sort of long term arrangement. It worked well for us in the bedroom, but when we werent actively at play, it didnt really factor in for us at all.

This to me feels different, it feels like more than just tying some great knots, and teasing him to begging point. I dont mean to diminish what we did, we both enjoyed it alot, but it was very much a compartmentalised part of our sex life, rather that something deeper.

I don't feel that either of us was truly deep enough in to it to be conditioned to our roles... perhaps 'll get hm to pop n and have a look, he might be able to explain better!

 

[FurryFury]

If you are thinking that a MASTER should be X,Y or Z or project a Dom-ly aura or whatever, you will find that's just so much romantic nonsense, IMO. Therefore "needing it" from your formerly 'nilla lover IS asking a great deal.

Perhaps you should work on being happy that he will try things for you. You might even be awed that he will because man will NOT. We hear it here ALL the time.

Praising him for what he does do and worshiping his flexibility might actually do your more good. At the same time working on your own sub mindset to expect less of a fantasy to happen in RL and appreciate the exploration and mutual love you both share might make you much happier than wishing for the fairy dust and rainbows of a BDSM fantasy world you've made up in your head or read about in fictional tales.

 

[Netzach]

So it sounds like your husband is pretty much a submissive person.

Maybe he's not the right person to explore these needs of yours with, much as you might not want to hear it.

YOU may be a switch, but he might not be. It sounds like you want some of the more passive parts of his personality to change so that you can feel comfortable with your fantasies about Dominant behavior.

If you want to submit to him, then HE should be part of that equation - foibles and all. Just as you'd expect from a submissive, I'm guessing. And frankly as a submissive, he may still not be able to do it.

If my husband had the capability and inclination I'd bend over for him in a heartbeat - he has neither. Really. I switch with another switch with his blessing.

And yes, I've been through this myself and was very frustrated by fantasy expectations of mine being unmet, till I decided it's the person and not the fantasy I wanted to submit to.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I am pretty sure that we are talking about Ds here, right? As opposed to topping?

For me, I need at least one physical scene-- stated goal of a flogging, or rope bondage, or teasing sex-- in order to begin the process of D/s with someone. The physical gives me clues into the mental, and helps me fathom what our dynamic could become.

You might start him off that way. A successful bondage session can really give a guy an idea or two!

 

[FloggingMolly]

I appreciate your inputs, thanks for the replies.

Some of ths expectation comes from the fact that in his professonal, and most of his personal life he is very strong, confident and in control. It also stems from a bad day we had recently that had made me paranoid about the subject.

I have to say, we have been talking about this a great deal, some of which comes down to the replies here, which has been good to help us see how we feel about things. We came down to the sticking point. He isn't reluctant to be my Dom, he was reluctant to be the stereotype persona he felt I was looking for. I don't _want_ him to be someone else, I want him to be him, when he is emotionally stable and happy within himself.

I believe we've come much closer to resolving it

 

[FurryFury]

That sounds good. Great communication has been happening. Keep it up.

BTW, my husband and I are both very take charge and alpha seeming on the job. We are, because we have to be. In the bedroom however, we are both very flexible subs.

 

[joehmpsd]

Great news Molly, sounds like you guys are working it out together.

Have fun play safe

 

[eastern sun]

We came down to the sticking point. He isn't reluctant to be my Dom, he was reluctant to be the stereotype persona he felt I was looking for. I don't _want_ him to be someone else, I want him to be him, when he is emotionally stable and happy within himself.

I believe we've come much closer to resolving it

This is such an interesting moment. (and I applaud the communication that you're engaged in with your husband so take what I'm going to say with heavy doses of salt)

My husband and I had a similar moment or two, during which one or the other of us took on a stereotyped persona in our relationship. It was not what either of us wanted, on either the giving or receiving end.

But we both were doing what we thought would make ourselves and/or the other person happy. And making ourselves and/or the other unhappy in the process.

There is nothing more frustrating and misery-making than an emotionally unstable, sad, or disappointed-with-life/his family/himself spouse.

But isn't it an interesting moment when you realize that his emotionally stability and happiness within himself will be the source of your own happiness (and satisfaction) as well?

As you proceed down this path, recognize that he may not always be emotionally stable or happy with himself. If you are committed to this aspect of your relationship, do whatever you can to support your side of the D/s dynamic - with honesty and integrity and patience.

If your happiness is going to depend on his happiness, you might be bitterly disappointed one day, for reasons over which you have no control. On the other hand, if you do what you can to develop your own emotional stability and happiness within yourself and then offer support to him to develop his, you have an opportunity for genuine happiness within this relationship.

 

[Netzach]

This is such an interesting moment. (and I applaud the communication that you're engaged in with your husband so take what I'm going to say with heavy doses of salt)

My husband and I had a similar moment or two, during which one or the other of us took on a stereotyped persona in our relationship. It was not what either of us wanted, on either the giving or receiving end.

But we both were doing what we thought would make ourselves and/or the other person happy. And making ourselves and/or the other unhappy in the process.

There is nothing more frustrating and misery-making than an emotionally unstable, sad, or disappointed-with-life/his family/himself spouse.

But isn't it an interesting moment when you realize that his emotionally stability and happiness within himself will be the source of your own happiness (and satisfaction) as well?

As you proceed down this path, recognize that he may not always be emotionally stable or happy with himself. If you are committed to this aspect of your relationship, do whatever you can to support your side of the D/s dynamic - with honesty and integrity and patience.

If your happiness is going to depend on his happiness, you might be bitterly disappointed one day, for reasons over which you have no control. On the other hand, if you do what you can to develop your own emotional stability and happiness within yourself and then offer support to him to develop his, you have an opportunity for genuine happiness within this relationship.

OK, it's interesting - I hear so many iterations of this and experienced it myself - where DO these stereotypes come from and why do we think we want them so much?

 

[eastern sun]

OK, it's interesting - I hear so many iterations of this and experienced it myself - where DO these stereotypes come from and why do we think we want them so much?

They come from cultural images, pornography, erotica, dream-images, and the collective unconscious, don't you think? (I'm sure you and I have had a hand in creating them ourselves in some miniscule way with our postings on this board.)

This raw energy that we all experience in one form or another needs "a container" - and it finds its home in the images we come across. But it isn't "the container" we're interested in experiencing, it's the energy itself.

It's a function of our human nature, I think - where instinctual drives for sex, power, and security meet our language/symbol-making abilities. We create concepts that capture the raw stuff of life in a symbolic medium, and then (sometimes) lose contact with the raw stuff by fixating on the concept.

At least, that's my take on it, what do you think?

 

[Netzach]

They come from cultural images, pornography, erotica, dream-images, and the collective unconscious, don't you think? (I'm sure you and I have had a hand in creating them ourselves in some miniscule way with our postings on this board.)

This raw energy that we all experience in one form or another needs "a container" - and it finds its home in the images we come across. But it isn't "the container" we're interested in experiencing, it's the energy itself.

It's a function of our human nature, I think - where instinctual drives for sex, power, and security meet our language/symbol-making abilities. We create concepts that capture the raw stuff of life in a symbolic medium, and then (sometimes) lose contact with the raw stuff by fixating on the concept.

At least, that's my take on it, what do you think?

Well, MY complaint with "the casual community" hahaha is that it does tend to serve up a pretty small buffet of options and expects everyone to appreciate them recognize them and stick to them.

It's easy enough to ignore that and do what you want when you're jaded and 35 but really hard to avoid wanting to find yourself inside the paradigm when you're new to it.

 

[eastern sun]

Well, MY complaint with "the casual community" hahaha is that it does tend to serve up a pretty small buffet of options and expects everyone to appreciate them recognize them and stick to them.

It's easy enough to ignore that and do what you want when you're jaded and 35 but really hard to avoid wanting to find yourself inside the paradigm when you're new to it.

I agree that the buffet table can get pretty disappointing when you've seen the same dishes served over and over and over again. Especially when the dishes aren't meeting your nutritional requirements.

But don't you think most human beings enter into the paradigms of their culture (or rebel against them) as children or teens or "novices" because our brains are wired to do so? As a species, we use language-learning to survive.