REDWAVE: Jack Wheeler proves America worse than Saddam Hussein!

SINthysist

Rural Racist Homophobe
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An excerpt:

“In March of 1993, I was the keynote speaker at a conference of business and civic leaders held in Indianapolis. One of those attending was a federal judge named Joe (it's best not to mention his last name). He seemed a nice, decent fellow who not once hinted that (as I had been informed by the organizer of the conference) he was on the short list of candidates to be the new director of the FBI. The current FBI director, William Sessions, had announced his attention to resign as soon as the recently inaugurated Bill Clinton found a replacement.

Joe and I sat together at lunch and the conversation was pleasant – until someone at the table brought up Waco.

The ATF had assaulted the Davidian church complex a month earlier and the standoff was ensuing, with the final holocaust a month away. When I asked Joe what he thought of what was going on at Waco, his entire demeanor and body language changed, his face turned purple with rage, and he announced: "I'll tell you what the FBI should do. Those people [the Davidians] killed federal agents. We should go in there and kill every last one of them."

Someone responded, "There are children in there, Joe." Joe brushed the comment aside with a wave of his hand. "You don't understand. No one can get away with killing federal agents. They all deserve to be killed in return."

Joe was passed over in favor of Louis Freeh, but he exemplified the mindset not just of the FBI but also of so many in law enforcement in general. As anyone who has made the mistake of arguing with a police officer giving them a traffic ticket understands, the most heinous crime anyone can commit, more evil and depraved than child molestation, is Contempt of Cop.

You know the joke: A conservative is a liberal who's been mugged; a liberal is a conservative who's been arrested. Smart-mouth a cop and you're asking for a world of grief. Fight back and defend yourself from police action, no matter what the action is, and your life is in danger.

This is what happened at Waco. The Davidians tried to defend themselves from an armed ATF raid, set up as a pure publicity stunt to better argue for increased funding. That the raid had a flimsy pretext and was botched was irrelevant to the federal law enforcement community, however. No matter how and why, federal agents were killed and revenge had to be taken. The FBI man in charge of the siege and final death raid of April 19, Richard Rogers, thought exactly like Joe.

It is important to grasp that what happened in Waco was no accident, that the Davidians were killed on purpose in an act of revenge by the American government. And it is important to know just how they were killed, that the method of their killing was as grisly and evil as anything perpetrated by Saddam Hussein.”

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/9/18/181852.shtml
 
hmmm and Janet Reno wants to be Florida's governor, didn't she approve of this "mass murder", or defend the actions of it.
 
Thanks SIN, I have long held the belief that the assholes the authorized Waco should have been thrown under a jail and left to rot. This viewpoint is not based on whom was President at the time, so to anyone that thinks its just another Clinton bashing party on my part, get a freakin clue (I voted for him two times). The viewpoint is based watching our government in action in my nearly 36 yrs on this rotating rock. I was pissed then, I was pissed at Ruby Ridge, I am pissed yet today when the other criminal party in power today allows the continued perversion of our Constitution in the detention of "possible terror suspects". Bullshit I say, plain and utter bullshit.
 
Can anyone tell me more about ''that'' family whose members were killed (kids included) by FBI.

The incident was so fucked up that it turned a Gulf war vet Tim into Oklahoma bomber?

What desciplinary actions are taken to those Feds who murdered kids except some light BDSM spanking?
 
HeavyStick said:
hmmm and Janet Reno wants to be Florida's governor, didn't she approve of this "mass murder", or defend the actions of it.

She gave the order.
 
LovetoGiveRoses said:


She gave the order.
she also gave the order to quell several investigations of administration corruption and to storm the house Ellian Gonzales was staying in but that is not the topic.

Am I wrong, or was she not about to be fired by Clinton during the Waco time frame or was that later on? Hmmm, sometimes ones actions give pause for thinking WTF are they really up to.
 
I lived in Arlington when Waco became prominent. There had been reports to the Texas department that works with children and families to the effect that there was sexual and child abuse taking place at the Koresh compound. State representatives had visited there and children were not allowed to be openly interviewed. It was known that Koresh had separated husbands from wives and required the wives to be "his" wife. That was the adult’s choice, but the rumors involving children should NOT have been overlooked. The investigations did make Koresh a little nervous and paranoid, however.

His reaction was to begin an arming of his people with illegal weapons. There were reports that he had been "trading" in those weapons for some time. He also began a program of preaching a "Doomsday" scenario to his followers a la Jim Jones. "We must all die together to attain the Holy Land". That was quite effective with most of the followers but a few resisted and got out. When a few more tried to leave the family they would have left behind was used as a threat.

State and Federal representatives tried to negotiate with Koresh, just as we do today with Sadam. The results were just about identical.

I will not say the Feds used good judgment in the tactics used to serve the warrant on Koresh, but like many things in life hindsight is 20/20. The truth is, when authorities show up to serve a lawful warrant it is probably best not to welcome them with an ambush firing automatic weapons through walls and ceilings.

I was watching live TV the final morning and saw the insertion of teargas six or seven times before the vehicle approached that final corner of the building. I was shocked to see smoke coming out of that corner because no where else had anything been visible. The cameras pulled back slightly at that point and I was even more shocked to see smoke coming from several places in the building and realized at THAT INSTANT that the fires were set INSIDE. David Koresh got just what he desired, a martyrs death, and he took all those followers with him as his victims of murder by his hands and plans.

Rhumb:(
 
Rhumb, the allegation of sexual abuse never were proven. Also in the event of a sexual abuse case, why were ATF agents used and not social services or the local yocals? Either way it was a tragedy and innocent people on both sides perished do to an over zealous pursuit.
 
One has to ask oneself what the Branch Davidians did in the first place to raise the ire of the federal government.


Nevertheless, I'm very glad "Joe" didn't get the job. We don't need another a-hole in the government. There's enough as is.
 
I concur with brokenbrainwave's bipartisan Prez bashing. I did not support Clinton, and I don't support Bush either. Waco was an outrage, a clear case of the U.S. government committing mass murder against its own people.
 
islandman said:



Yep, that would be a no-no. Did they shoot a cop or something when a few of them got pulled over?
nope, if memory serves me correct, someone correct me if I am wrong please, they found a loop hole that allowed them to sell you the parts to the rifle, not the whole. You get it, put it together and boom boom, you have a rifle. This is not the first group to get the hammer dropped on them for this.
 
islandman said:



Yep, that would be a no-no. Did they shoot a cop or something when a few of them got pulled over?

As I remember the investigation and news of the time, ATF was there because the Davidians had been running automatic weapons and explosives (hand grenades). They had been very peaceful until the day the ATF showed up to issue a search warrant and search the compound. Three or four agents were killed in a fusillade when the Davidians opened fire from inside the building.

I am also very sorry that any person died at Waco whether it be ATF agent, Davidian or child. I am no fan of Clinton nor Reno, but neither of them and no one among the federal agencies is responsible for a single death at Waco. As I said before, David Koresh got what he wanted and if there was a "mass murder" it was done by him alone.

Rhumb
 
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So what ??

Why do we have to have a contest about who is the biggest asshole?? Do any of you really think the us is the land of the holy, of the kind, of the just? Or anywhere else for that matter? No matter where you are don't spit in the eye of the Tiger 'cause he will *EAT* you. While telling you what a nice guy he is and why you deserve to be eaten.
 
brokenbrainwave said:
why do I have the sudden urge to walk into traffic slowly?

:D I'm not sure.......but your Opus AV fits the feeling of that post to PERFECTION!!!;)

Rhumb
 
RhumbRunner13 said:


:D I'm not sure.......but your Opus AV fits the feeling of that post to PERFECTION!!!;)

Rhumb
lol, never thought of that. Hey, have any Prozac or horse tranquilizers? The poster above you might need some.
 
How very quickly on some issue both sides can come to a consensus on certain issues.

Dr. Wheeler always provokes some thoughts when I read him. Can't always say I go along with him on everything though...

He may be a tad farther to the right than I!
 
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