Race Play

[catalina_francisco]

I just came across this great article quite by accident, and given our recent discussion in the Historical D/s thread , thought some others might enjoy it. It is not only good from the POV of discussing racial play, but also looking at theories of why BDSM appeals and various people's thoughts (such as Midori) on elements of humiliation etc. Any thoughts people want to discuss or add are welcome.

Catalina

 

[RJMasters]

I just came across this great article quite by accident, and given our recent discussion in the Historical D/s thread , thought some others might enjoy it. It is not only good from the POV of discussing racial play, but also looking at theories of why BDSM appeals and various people's thoughts (such as Midori) on elements of humiliation etc. Any thoughts people want to discuss or add are welcome.

Catalina

Its about time someone exploited racism for a change.

Great article. Thinks the people who would engage in this would be people who had their shit together upstairs.

This type of play for me would have to be an exception to the rule however. Meaning, with this type of play, certain elements of fantasy and roleplay would have to be a must. Real racism IMO would certainly add realism, however I think it would then fall into the area of real abuse.

I kinda of relate to how two people would approach this kind of play. When I was in the Marines in Okinawa, I shared a room with two friends who were black. After living together for about a month, they were callin me cracker and they were nigga 1 and nigga 2.

When I first moved into the room, the lack of famillarity and knowleedge about each other prevented that type of relaxed exchange, but once we all got to know each other, it was just normal.

I think if two people had this level of trust with one another and were comfortable with each other, then they could engage in this type of play and use it for their own pleasure.

I think people might find this kind of play edgy because it almost seems to encourage racial behaviors. But for two people who are comfortable in their own skin and the skin of the one they are playing with, I'd say cool.

Certainly would encourage talking it out before hand with whom ever first before trying it. Not doing so might find yourself in a world of opps.

 

[FurryFury]

I just came across this great article quite by accident, and given our recent discussion in the Historical D/s thread , thought some others might enjoy it. It is not only good from the POV of discussing racial play, but also looking at theories of why BDSM appeals and various people's thoughts (such as Midori) on elements of humiliation etc. Any thoughts people want to discuss or add are welcome.

Catalina

Interesting article, I confess that being from the South, it's hard for me to imagine doing race play at all. I understand that it can be just play that adds for some but it is deeply ingrained in me that this sort of thing isn't tolerated.
I'm contemplating it now and may come back to add more later.

Fury

 

[graceanne]

I've wondered about this. I know that marquis once mentioned that if he calls C a 'nigger' he gets a reaction, but if he brings up her religion he'll get safe worded. It never occured to me that race play would happen, but it makes sense. If you're going to call someone all sorts of names, why not names that make fun of their color. Beyond that, just cause you call someone a slut or a bitch during sex doesn't mean you think they are. And calling someone a racial name during sex doesn't mean you actually look down on them, you like to call them names.

Their's a story on lit, I think by Dr. Mabeuse (could be wrong) about an Indian woman who gets 'sold' to pay off her brothers debt. The writer puts in the beginning that he wrote it for an Indian friend who wanted a story where the woman gets called racial names.

Like the guy they interviewed said, "“I have been floored when people have criticized me by saying [that] not everyone agrees with my fetish. So what? Not everyone likes cheese.” I wouldn't like it if K made Jewish comments to me, but I wouldn't appreciate most name calling. *shrug* If you like it, then more power to you.

 

[jadefirefly]

Grace basically said exactly what I was thinking -- you might get called slut, whore, or bitch during play, that doesn't mean that you are one. (Well, except a bitch... I work hard for that. )

I don't think that I could get in on it.. but then I am usually not the one calling people names, and you'd have to work pretty hard to find a derogatory racial name to call me, I think. I find most things that would apply to me to just be silly-sounding; the very few that you might find, though, I don't really think I'd get off on it.

Overall, though, I see no major differences between racial names and any sort of derogatory name-calling. You either like it, or don't.

Like cheese. (I like cheese.)

 

[catalina_francisco]

Grace basically said exactly what I was thinking -- you might get called slut, whore, or bitch during play, that doesn't mean that you are one. (Well, except a bitch... I work hard for that. )

I don't think that I could get in on it.. but then I am usually not the one calling people names, and you'd have to work pretty hard to find a derogatory racial name to call me, I think. I find most things that would apply to me to just be silly-sounding; the very few that you might find, though, I don't really think I'd get off on it.

Overall, though, I see no major differences between racial names and any sort of derogatory name-calling. You either like it, or don't.

Like cheese. (I like cheese.)

I agree, Mike Bond's comment about liking cheese was perfect, as was Midori drawing a comparison between racial names in play and ones such as 'slut' etc. being used, and having the same base for where it presses buttons. She also made excellent points on what your Dominant may call you in play as opposed to how you would accept the same name from a stranger...I think this is where a lot of people get confused about how to feel about it...they think in terms of those words being used in amainstream sense, possibly from people you do not know. It is not the same.

Catalina

 

[rosco rathbone]

I have done it.

 

[Netzach]

I've done it. I have to have really clear communication with the bottom beforehand.

 

[Kajira Callista]

Can Rosco and Netzach be my daddy and mommy?

 

[ownedsubgal]

just thought i'd add that for some, the use of derogatory racial slurs in this lifestyle is not a game or roleplay...it is harsh cold honesty and reality. every once in a while my Master will purposely seek out racist white Dominants to use and abuse me. i am not "nigger" to these Dominants simply when their cocks are hard, but always. i am a piece of black meat good only for taking care of their cocks and cleaning their houses. these are men who truly feel they are superior because of their race and sex...it is what has been ingrained in them all their lives. and they are not all from the united states south. having grown up in a small redneck area in virginia, i was used to southern racism. but i was unprepared to face the same treatment from everyone from white south african Dominants to hasidic jewish Dominants to Brits. some would regale me with stories of how their great and great great grandfathers milked and gangraped the female slaves on the plantation for something to do on a dull day...some remarked to me how useful my nappy hair would be to mop bathroom floors...some would gently explain to me that my current fate (slave, slut, white man's whore) had been written in the stars for me...after all, it was what my "grandmammy and great-grandmammy" (his exact words) had been before me...my genetic destiny. and of course they all called me every form of the word "nigger" one can imagine, among other things.

my Master's purpose in exposing me to such Dominants is degradation...a cruel but necessary reminder of just how low my place is and how powerless i truly am. it's a harsh lesson but it's appreciated.

 

[@}-}rebecca----]

Edit

Okay now that I am over my initial shock I thought it best to head back here. A simple shocked emote was all I could muster after reading the post prior to mine . Obviously a bit 'hit and run' so quite unfair.

I am trying soooooo hard to get a headspace around this concept of 'race play', pulling back on all the nerves in me that just shout no this is unacceptable. Though to whom ? Well to some large degree me still, though I am softening around the edges to the concept as a form of 'scene/play'.

Aspects of the post above seem so abusive even if it is consensual. Not as much in the 'tool' of 'race play' but in the outcomes stated . Though its not my life to lead my initial reaction remains the same. While I endeavour to 'grow' here from participating on the Boards by reading the diversity of experiences shared in posts there are some things I sincerely hope never to become complacent about.

Discrimination can be for both postive and negative outcomes. To date I see very little postive here.

End of Edit

 

[boz]

just thought i'd add that for some, the use of derogatory racial slurs in this lifestyle is not a game or roleplay...it is harsh cold honesty and reality.

Good point to keep in mind, ownedsubgal. If someone really believes it, it's not play anymore. It's just racisim.

 

[ownedsubgal]

Good point to keep in mind, ownedsubgal. If someone really believes it, it's not play anymore. It's just racisim.

exactly.

 

[Netzach]

I'd argue that if you're white you are buying some of it. Maybe you don't *want* to be, much to your credit, (let's all pull something patting our own backs, shall we?)

-- but you are still buying some of it.

I may prefer to play with a middle class black guy who went to the same schools I did, and bat some ideas back and forth between each other over a glass of wine before we get down to it, but really the dynamic emerging isn't any better than the one osg describes. All the machinations beforehand serve to make me feel better about the whole thing. It's the moral equivalent of "sure I'll respect you in the morning."

That's where this gets interesting and implicating.

Racism fucks us up. And there is no way to completely un-fuck ourselves. I think that's what engaging on this level admits.

 

[RJMasters]

I'd argue that if you're white you are buying some of it. Maybe you don't *want* to be, much to your credit, (let's all pull something patting our own backs, shall we?)

-- but you are still buying some of it.

That's where this gets interesting and implicating.

Squirms*

I need a shower

 

[Netzach]

Squirms*

I need a shower

It's very ugly, I agree.

But I think anyone who thinks he or she has completely abandoned the continuum of Western thought and all histories, anyone who thinks they got away without any blood on their hands--- yeah. It's a long shower.

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

I remember

discussing something like that here a few years ago and still my outlook hasn't changed. I can not get off on race play, as a top or as a bottom. My headspace completely stops when I hear the word "nigger" or if I have to use the words "cracker/honkey/o-fay". I just can't stomach it, at all.

One would think that racism would be a tad easier to incorporate in play..after all, most everyone has experienced it (either as the receiver or the *giver*) and yet it is still so taboo.

(I need to think on this a bit more and go re-read the articles)

will add further thoughts as they crop up.

 

[RJMasters]

discussing something like that here a few years ago and still my outlook hasn't changed. I can not get off on race play, as a top or as a bottom. My headspace completely stops when I hear the word "nigger" or if I have to use the words "cracker/honkey/o-fay". I just can't stomach it, at all.

One would think that racism would be a tad easier to incorporate in play..after all, most everyone has experienced it (either as the receiver or the *giver*) and yet it is still so taboo.

(I need to think on this a bit more and go re-read the articles)

will add further thoughts as they crop up.

I'm looking forward to that.

 

[Netzach]

discussing something like that here a few years ago and still my outlook hasn't changed. I can not get off on race play, as a top or as a bottom. My headspace completely stops when I hear the word "nigger" or if I have to use the words "cracker/honkey/o-fay". I just can't stomach it, at all.

One would think that racism would be a tad easier to incorporate in play..after all, most everyone has experienced it (either as the receiver or the *giver*) and yet it is still so taboo.

(I need to think on this a bit more and go re-read the articles)

will add further thoughts as they crop up.

Hi gorgeous.

Has anyone here seen "the aristocrats?" One of the more interesting things in that movie was when someone, I forget who, drew the conclusion that race had replaced sex and sexual perversity as the ultimate taboo in the US. I think it was a fair assessment - as I watched the film and catalogued my reactions to Whoopie Goldberg and Sarah Silverman's versions of the joke versus most other comics, it was interesting and seemed true in relation to my own grossout and discomfort meter.

That's only partly relevant to your post, Luna, but your question about why it's so beyond most people's pale in spite of the fact that it happens all the time made me think of that.

 

[RJMasters]

Admittedly this causes alot of anxiety inside me. Which is why I would have to some roleplay here to even consider it. I know ownedsubgal would just winkle her nose at me as it would smell of cheap beef. But that's ok as I don't see us ever facing this situation. I don't respect the level of realness she owns up to in this, yet I find at the same time a deep respect for the level of submission.

I think after taking part in something like this, I would need to be alone for a while. It would take everything out of me to cross the line and do it with any believability.

Scary stuff.

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

Further thoughts:

When I spoke of race play before (a few years ago), I hadn't tried it. Wasn't something I wanted to do and just the thought of it made me feel dirty. Not long ago (a bit over a year but seems more recent), I played a bit with it a discovered 2 things about myself I had never really known before:

1) I am a bit racist.
2) I don't like it.

One would assume that race play would kind of make it easier to face these things about one's self, but in reality it doesn't. It's the same thing (for me) as female supremacy..I deep down believe that I am better than just about any man I have ever come across..nilla or otherwise. So playing at it feels inherently unreal.
Basically, it follows for me as a black female supremcist that any white man I Top is beneath me..always.

Funnily enough, these thoughts never come into play with women of any shade or hue, but guys of any race usually start out as beneath my notice...but moreso if they are white.

It's the main reason why I don't indulge in race play or female power trips...I scare myself when I do.

seriously.

 

[MechaBlade]

I just came across this great article quite by accident, and given our recent discussion in the Historical D/s thread , thought some others might enjoy it. It is not only good from the POV of discussing racial play, but also looking at theories of why BDSM appeals and various people's thoughts (such as Midori) on elements of humiliation etc. Any thoughts people want to discuss or add are welcome.

Catalina

Even though I occasionally obsess over someone partially because of their race, there is much more to the person than that. And I just cannot get off to any race play.

 

[RJMasters]

Further thoughts:

When I spoke of race play before (a few years ago), I hadn't tried it. Wasn't something I wanted to do and just the thought of it made me feel dirty. Not long ago (a bit over a year but seems more recent), I played a bit with it a discovered 2 things about myself I had never really known before:

1) I am a bit racist.
2) I don't like it.

One would assume that race play would kind of make it easier to face these things about one's self, but in reality it doesn't. It's the same thing (for me) as female supremacy..I deep down believe that I am better than just about any man I have ever come across..nilla or otherwise. So playing at it feels inherently unreal.
Basically, it follows for me as a black female supremcist that any white man I Top is beneath me..always.

Funnily enough, these thoughts never come into play with women of any shade or hue, but guys of any race usually start out as beneath my notice...but moreso if they are white.

It's the main reason why I don't indulge in race play or female power trips...I scare myself when I do.

seriously.

There are times when someone says something or does something that effects you in ways you just can't express. Such a moment just happened for me. Ty Luna

 

[John Doe]

This reminds me of a dream I had recently about an Asian girl I sort of know (she's technically Australian, but of Vietnamese decent) and I find her in this little village in the jungle, I think somewhere near Ple Ku. I point my M-60 at her but she's pleading "don't huht me G.I., don't huht me!" She looks real cute in her little bamboo hat and grey pajamas, so I decide not to murder her.

Ayway, I give her a chocolate bar and she's so grateful she takes me into her little hut and I fuck her.

I guess that sort of ties in to the historical aspect you mentioned.

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

There are times when someone says something or does something that effects you in ways you just can't express. Such a moment just happened for me. Ty Luna

*blushing profusely*

thanks RJ...I was worried that I didn't word my response correctly or that I would offend...I am glad you seemed to get it.