Pitfalls of editing

[CiaoSteve]

I like to edit the odd story when time allows, but recently I found myself wondering if it was worth it. I've found myself in this situation a couple of times, and then picked up the wrath of comments (by association) on somebody else's tale. What happens, and it is the author's prerogative, is that the you spend considerable time fixing grammatical errors, send it back to the author, but the author chooses to publish a version still containing the grammatical errors. No problem, I guess... except that the author adds their thanks to the editor (which is usually a real nice touch) ... and then you pick up the wrath of comments pointing out how bad the editor must have been. I should turn a blind eye, but actually these comments seem to hit harder than ones on my own stories, as at least I am in control of my own destiny.

So now I wonder... to edit or not to edit... that is the question.

Sorry, I'm just sounding off... not looking for sympathy... or even responses... unless you want to share your own pitfalls of being an editor.

 

[Euphony]

No problem, I guess

Except it is a problem. Your work product (which, I'm assuming you gave for free) is dismissed, disrespected and, thusly, so too your time.

Certainly you can be the bigger person but there is a point where you are not honoring yourself by continuing be used in only a sycophantic role.

The other authors/editors bit surprises me as I would think if you do much of any of this work, on either side, you're bound to run into this "tell me what I want to hear and ONLY what I want to hear" behavior. If it's social faux pas to recognize that reality, have the butler escort me out.

Editors have saved some of the greatest works and greatest authors from themselves.

Free editing is laudable especially when many needing help here are hobbyist at best.

Honor your contributions.

 

[Voboy]

Nothing much to add, except that this just confirms a long-held belief of mine: I never want to edit anybody, and I never want anybody to edit me.

I want stories with my name on them to owe nothing to anyone else, for precisely this reason. Any slings and arrows are the writer's responsibility, solely... but editors dilute that responsibility. That's never sat well with me.

 

[KeithD]

When I've edited for someone here, I specify that they not mention that I have--for the reason spelled out here. The author is the last one who had it and who is the one who submits it at Literotica. That's who is responsible for what is published.

 

[alohadave]

Nothing much to add, except that this just confirms a long-held belief of mine: I never want to edit anybody, and I never want anybody to edit me.

I want stories with my name on them to owe nothing to anyone else, for precisely this reason. Any slings and arrows are the writer's responsibility, solely... but editors dilute that responsibility. That's never sat well with me.

It's really not that big of a problem. Most people are gracious and thankful for the efforts of editors.

A good editor is not diluting your voice and for me, I try to preserve the author's voice whenever possible. A good pair will elevate your story without taking away from you as the author.

The authors who do this are likely inexperienced and don't realize that they are dragging the editor, or they are jerks who do this kind of thing to everyone.

 

[gunhilltrain]

Except it is a problem. Your work product (which, I'm assuming you gave for free) is dismissed, disrespected and, thusly, so too your time.

Certainly you can be the bigger person but there is a point where you are not honoring yourself by continuing be used in only a sycophantic role.

The other authors/editors bit surprises me as I would think if you do much of any of this work, on either side, you're bound to run into this "tell me what I want to hear and ONLY what I want to hear" behavior. If it's social faux pas to recognize that reality, have the butler escort me out.

Editors have saved some of the greatest works and greatest authors from themselves.

Free editing is laudable especially when many needing help here are hobbyist at best.

Honor your contributions.

I'm not sure exactly what either of you means, but I think he's saying that readers don't have the right to demand that the author return a published work to Lit? I don't think anyone's ever asked that of me, although a long time ago one person left a comment that I had made some unspecified errors. Actually, there was one other such person, and I did decide to send it back for corrections, which took the usual week or more to complete. Also, we are all hobbyists here, although there are a few who indeed use publishing services for pay.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

I like to edit the odd story when time allows, but recently I found myself wondering if it was worth it. I've found myself in this situation a couple of times, and then picked up the wrath of comments (by association) on somebody else's tale. What happens, and it is the author's prerogative, is that the you spend considerable time fixing grammatical errors, send it back to the author, but the author chooses to publish a version still containing the grammatical errors. No problem, I guess... except that the author adds their thanks to the editor (which is usually a real nice touch) ... and then you pick up the wrath of comments pointing out how bad the editor must have been. I should turn a blind eye, but actually these comments seem to hit harder than ones on my own stories, as at least I am in control of my own destiny.

So now I wonder... to edit or not to edit... that is the question.

Sorry, I'm just sounding off... not looking for sympathy... or even responses... unless you want to share your own pitfalls of being an editor.

That is why a few times when I helped out an author asking for editing help, I have given him thorough feedback about what he needs to fix and how, instead of doing it myself. Editing is a tedious, boring work, and I hate doing it for my own stories, let alone other people's work... On top of that, I would rather teach a man to fish than give him a fish, even if it takes much longer.

 

[PastMaster]

When I've edited for someone here, I specify that they not mention that I have--for the reason spelled out here. The author is the last one who had it and who is the one who submits it at Literotica. That's who is responsible for what is published.

Wheneve i have a story of mine edited - i always add a forward, crediting the editor (I personally think they are due the credit since its a lot of work) but also making it clear that I have tampered with the story since it came back from the editor - so any issues remaining - are down to me.

I have had a couple of amazing editors. I can't self edit (or self moderate as I'm sure some will agree) it just doesnt work for me, so either i post stories complete with errors that i am just blind to - or i rely on someone else to find them for me. (i do use grammerly but its not perfect either)

 

[gunhilltrain]

Oh, I get it. He's talking about editing for someone else and they decide not to do as he recommends. And then comments come in from readers about how he is a poor editor.

 

[Voboy]

Oh, I get it. He's talking about editing for someone else and they decide not to do as he recommends. And then comments come in from readers about how he is a poor editor.

...you're saying his post needed editing for clarity and flow?

Oh, the irony...

 

[KeithD]

Oh, I get it. He's talking about editing for someone else and they decide not to do as he recommends. And then comments come in from readers about how he is a poor editor.

Yep, that's a genuine pitfall here.

 

[Euphony]

Oh, I get it. He's talking about editing for someone else and they decide not to do as he recommends. And then comments come in from readers about how he is a poor editor.

Yeah.

Editor got it coming and going. Gave of his time to do the edits, which went unused. Had other authors question his ability to edit when other editors believed this was his shoddy work posted due to the thanks.

I'm not wanting to ascribe malice on author's part but at the very least it's very bad form.

 

[Rustyoznail]

I've edited for a few authors stories, and the discussion goes back and forth about specific issues. If the writer ignores my recommendations, I would wish them well and walk away. Thankfully I've never been put in that situation.

I'm happy to continue editing, but when I feel I have the time. I don't put my name up as "available to edit".

 

[KeithD]

I've edited for a few authors stories, and the discussion goes back and forth about specific issues. If the writer ignores my recommendations, I would wish them well and walk away. Thankfully I've never been put in that situation.

I'm happy to continue editing, but when I feel I have the time. I don't put my name up as "available to edit".

An editor here often won't know whatever the author did with the edit until the work posted on the Web site.

This contrasts with publishing houses. Authors review edits and there's a sliding scale in how much they have to say on whether in-house edits are accepted or not, but the final copy is last handled by a publishing house editor, not the author.

 

[Rustyoznail]

True - if they submit an unedited version, so be it. That's why I have a conversation upfront to make sure we're comfortable working together. I'm providing a service, and I don't want to waste my time.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I've edited for a few authors stories, and the discussion goes back and forth about specific issues. If the writer ignores my recommendations, I would wish them well and walk away. Thankfully I've never been put in that situation.

For me it depends very much on what kind of recommendations.

If it's something where there's objectively a right and a wrong choice, "that's not what that word means" kind of thing, I would be reluctant to work with an author who made a habit of ignoring recommendations - that just leaves me wondering "why did you ask me to edit if you're going to ignore this?"

But for deeper edits I'll often give more subjective feedback: "I don't think a character with this background would talk that way", "this scene hasn't acknowledged that she's cheating on her fiancé and that probably needs to be addressed", etc. etc. The author may not agree with my judgement on those issues, and as long as they've considered my advice I'm not bothered if they choose differently. (And on the professional side, even if they're making a decision that I consider bad, I comfort myself with the knowledge that I get paid whether or not they take the advice.)

 

[RelentlessOnanism]

Nothing much to add, except that this just confirms a long-held belief of mine: I never want to edit anybody, and I never want anybody to edit me.

I want stories with my name on them to owe nothing to anyone else, for precisely this reason. Any slings and arrows are the writer's responsibility, solely... but editors dilute that responsibility. That's never sat well with me.

I think that's pretty much my view on it too. I'm sure there are some very good editors here, but presumably every single one of them is an amateur. They're simply offering an opinion that may or may not be right or wrong. The one time I had someone look at my work, I disagreed with every suggestion they had. Maybe they were right and I was too arrogant to realise it, but I just decided to go ahead with the story I wanted to publish. Maybe, if I found the right editor, I would be a much better writer, but it's not like I’m expecting to become a proper novelist. It's just a bit of fun.

 

[KeithD]

but presumably every single one of them is an amateur.

Probably close, but a false presumption. I know a few professional ones helping here and I'm a professional book editor. And any second set of eyes is better than no one else reviewing it at all. No need to go overboard on this.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I think that's pretty much my view on it too. I'm sure there are some very good editors here, but presumably every single one of them is an amateur.

*waves hand*

It's not my main job, but I actually do have a sideline as a professional editor. The paid stuff is non-fiction so it's a different focus from editing erotica, but a fair bit of what I'm paid for is stuff like flow, structure, and readability that's at least partly transferable to fiction.

They're simply offering an opinion that may or may not be right or wrong. The one time I had someone look at my work, I disagreed with every suggestion they had. Maybe they were right and I was too arrogant to realise it, but I just decided to go ahead with the story I wanted to publish. Maybe, if I found the right editor, I would be a much better writer, but it's not like I’m expecting to become a proper novelist. It's just a bit of fun.

As with many things in life, if you go with somebody who's not the right fit your first time may not be all that you'd hoped for. But an editor who understands what you're trying to do with a story, and helps it get there - instead of trying to write their own story inside yours - is a huge asset.

 

[Bazzle]

I help an author who writes for a different place.
I edit the story, send it back (i am better at spotting other peoples errors than my own).
I may edit the story a dozen times, changing the same error.
Does it remain in their published draft. Yes.

 

[CiaoSteve]

I used to get somebody to edit mine and they picked up the same issues time after time...

discreet v. discrete
throws v. throes

Now I don't bother. There's always something which slips through and I shrug my shoulders and as long as it isn't totally laughable I get on with it. I know I once quoted a song, crediting it to the wrong artist, but hey ho... that's life I guess... there's always the edited version (oh the irony!)

 

[KeithD]

discreet v. discrete

Yep, I have to separately check the definitions on that one, each and every time.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Whoever claims that a writer who needs an editor should not write, is not only a ridiculous snob but also an abominable creature. The notion of writing without editing is absurd.

Where has anyone in this thread said this? I don't see a post that makes such a statement.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Glasses?

The hump I guess...

That post says nothing close to what you said. I don't see arrogance, I just see a guy saying he wants his work to be his own, warts and all, and willing to take the slings and arrows that come with that choice. That's his call to make, surely? Why the hostility?

 

[Voboy]

That post says nothing close to what you said. I don't see arrogance, I just see a guy saying he wants his work to be his own, warts and all, and willing to take the slings and arrows that come with that choice. That's his call to make, surely? Why the hostility?

This.

If you wish to use an editor, or be an editor, that's entirely your business. I simply don't, and concerns such as the OP's are part of the reason why. I'm not all that sure why you'd conclude that indicates sociopathy, @willtolive, but that's your hangup and not mine. I stand by my words, not yours.

If editor/writer relationships were all hearts and flowers, this thread would not exist.