New Dom/sub relationship in an established marriage.....

[glockthirty]

I apologize in advance for the length....just a lot of history to cover.

My wife and I have been married for a little over ten years and we struggled with our sex life pretty consistently until the past year or so. Things had steadily been getting better until about October of last year. That's when it really took off.
During a few different conversations starting in late November, she revealed to me her desire to be dominated. This was somewhat of a surprise, but I always knew there was more to her sexuality than she was revealing to me. We had played with some BDSM elements before (bondage, blindfolds, name calling) and non-rough sex has never really done it for either one of us.
She admitted that she had experienced BDSM themed fantasies from an early age and had done some research recently only to find out that her experiences matched those of others who had identified themselves as "natural" submissives and that she wanted to explore this part of her personality.
My side of this is that I had some fantasies involving BDSM, but had not been a recurring theme for me. My initial response to her was that I was willing to try my hand at being a Dom to her sub. Since then I have moved from "willing to try" to "OMG, I love this". The appeal for me is not only the rush that comes from dominating another willing person, but also the pleasure that emanates from her every pore when I am dominating her. I love my side of it, but the pleasure I give her pleases me more.

I will break this up into another post........

 

[glockthirty]

Since we decided to explore this area, we have taken great pains to do it the right way. I bought Us/her "Screw the Roses, Send Me the Thorns" for Christmas and we have both read it. I am starting on my 2nd reading now. We are both in contact with an experienced Dom and have been learning more about this. I have been checking much of his information/instruction against the book and some online resources and so far everything is checking out.

We have been incorporating more BDSM activities in our sex too. Starting mainly with the verbal/mental part before moving on to spankings and using a very mild flogger. There was one *HOT* interlude that involved a belt, but so far I have been hesitant to move it much farther until I get a better feel for the emotional/mental manipulation that is so much a part of this.

I will write more tomorrow. I just realized the time......

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[catalina_francisco]

Try not to get locked too much into feeling you have to read all the well know texts on the lifestyle, and then follow what you are told is right and good. What you will find is right, is what works for both of you in your relationship. You are smart enough to know you need to feel comfortable with each step you take, and not feel it is a sprint with the final destination as the prize. The real prize is the journey, sharing that journey with someone who is willing to take it with you, and being true to yourselves. Communicating with each other throughout is a must. Enjoy the experience for all the ups and downs it may bring you.

Catalina

 

[MasterTennessee]

Well spoken, Catalina.

 

[Daddyslilpet]

Try not to get locked too much into feeling you have to read all the well know texts on the lifestyle, and then follow what you are told is right and good. What you will find is right, is what works for both of you in your relationship. You are smart enough to know you need to feel comfortable with each step you take, and not feel it is a sprint with the final destination as the prize. The real prize is the journey, sharing that journey with someone who is willing to take it with you, and being true to yourselves. Communicating with each other throughout is a must. Enjoy the experience for all the ups and downs it may bring you.

Catalina

Exactly! I just want to re-emphasize the part I bolded above and lend my encouragement as well. Sounds to me like you are already doing just fine so don't sweat it... enjoy your journey together.

 

[RedRose7]

Communication has been a huge part of this from the very beginning. After every session we talk about how it went, good things, bad things and what went well, but could be better. This has led to us exploring areas that each of us individually would not have thought about.

One trend I have noticed is that the more we do this, the more the D/s relationship has started to creep into our life outside of the bedroom. At first we agreed that this would be a bedroom-only but I don't really think that it's going to stay that way. I don't see us ever having a 24/7 type relationship, but we are trying to find a balance that works for us.

Are there any more experienced couples out there who have had to work on this balancing act and are willing to share?

Especially in light of the fact that we have two young children (ages 2 and 4) that we have to work around.

BTW-This is subby wife chiming in here....

 

[bethpage]

Hi, RR7.

I would suggest that you read 'the marks of a slave' thread
http://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=623345

I seem to be suggesting it to everyone. EasternSun may get tired of me pimping her thread.

She talks about the little things, both in her head and in and out the bedroom, and how it affects her children. I love reading her writing.

 

[glockthirty]

I have read thru the first few pages of EasternSun's thread and her writing is wonderful. It shows the mindset and thought process of someone who is devoted to pleasing another.

Things have been working right along here. Had a great night on Tuesday, although it did not end well due to an upsetting phone call. She had been very disrespectful(her personality is naturally outspoken and sassy) toward the other Dom that is helping us along.

This was the first time I initiated punishment activities and it went very well. I still have visions of her laying prostrate over our bed, sides heaving, reddened ass exposed to me.....hmmmm, sorry got distracted there for a minute.

It seems that the longer/more we do this, the more I find myself moving away from playing the role of a Dom and toward being a Dom. Not sure of another way to explain it than that. My personality is very easy going, and not very likely to make demands on others. Not a wuss by any stretch, just not the kind of person you think of when you think of a Dom.

Anyone else noticed this as well?

30

 

[Homburg]

It seems that the longer/more we do this, the more I find myself moving away from playing the role of a Dom and toward being a Dom.

That was basically how it worked for me early on. I just stopped playing at it and started being it.

 

[Daddyslilpet]

I have read thru the first few pages of EasternSun's thread and her writing is wonderful. It shows the mindset and thought process of someone who is devoted to pleasing another.

Things have been working right along here. Had a great night on Tuesday, although it did not end well due to an upsetting phone call. She had been very disrespectful(her personality is naturally outspoken and sassy) toward the other Dom that is helping us along.

This was the first time I initiated punishment activities and it went very well. I still have visions of her laying prostrate over our bed, sides heaving, reddened ass exposed to me.....hmmmm, sorry got distracted there for a minute.

It seems that the longer/more we do this, the more I find myself moving away from playing the role of a Dom and toward being a Dom. Not sure of another way to explain it than that. My personality is very easy going, and not very likely to make demands on others. Not a wuss by any stretch, just not the kind of person you think of when you think of a Dom.

Anyone else noticed this as well?

30

I'm not going to be very popular with what I'm about to say here, but the day I get in trouble because some Dom "tattles" on me to Daddy will be a cold day in hell. I am not expected to mind anyone but Daddy per His rules. He owns me, not every Tom, Dick and Harry out there that calls themselves Dominant.

A mentor is one thing but have you considered how fuckin confusing it is to your sub to have to obey two Masters? Did she know ahead of time that she was expected to treat this other Dom a certain way or she would be punished for not doing so? If not exactly how fair was it to change the rules mid stream on her? Especially when the two of you were having such a nice evening up to that point.

Look my views on this aren't very popular around here, even though I live this 24/7 in real life with my husband of almost 21 years... so do with my advice as you will.

 

[glockthirty]

Daddyslilpet....

1. I did not change the rules midstream. She initiated him serving as a guide and mentor to the both of us and all three of us are clear on our respective roles.

2. She knows that it is expected by both he and I that she show a reasonable amount of respect to him in their interactions, this does not equal blind obedience. She also understands that refusal by her to do so will result in negative consequences for her whether initiated by him or by me

3. Tuesday night was going well because of my decision to let her know how unhappy I was. Not in spite of it.

4. He did not "tattle" on her. I have access to all of their online chats and emails. This was a condition on my part as her husband, not as her Dom. I have read the chats and seen her words, I have also seen her be disrespectful toward him.

5. I consider their online chats the same as a R/L meeting. In R/L I would expected her to show respect for other Doms because of their position. I would also expect another Dom to show respect to me and my sub by asking permission from me before interacting with her in any way.

30

 

[sadangel]

Try not to get locked too much into feeling you have to read all the well know texts on the lifestyle, and then follow what you are told is right and good. What you will find is right, is what works for both of you in your relationship. You are smart enough to know you need to feel comfortable with each step you take, and not feel it is a sprint with the final destination as the prize. The real prize is the journey, sharing that journey with someone who is willing to take it with you, and being true to yourselves. Communicating with each other throughout is a must. Enjoy the experience for all the ups and downs it may bring you.

Catalina

This is true. My first experience with BDSM was with someone I trusted and loved. It started slowly with communication. She told me she had experimented with spanking herself and enjoyed the sensation. She wanted me to try with her. We did. It was an erotic experience. It was when I learned I enjoyed it. We experiemented slowly with other things. Taking our time. The only real thing we read up on was Vaginal and Anal fisting to be cerian we did things safely. We knew nothing about safe-words, but we actually had them!

Share the journey with your wife. Enjoy it. Dont get caught up in the "right" way. Practice the safe, sane conseual ascpet and COMMUNICATE! That's the key.

 

[Homburg]

5. I consider their online chats the same as a R/L meeting. In R/L I would expected her to show respect for other Doms because of their position. I would also expect another Dom to show respect to me and my sub by asking permission from me before interacting with her in any way.

30

Why? Would would you expect her to show respect to anyone because they decided to call themselves some arbitrary title? I can understand wanting her to show respect to other people in general, but it is not like there is a Dominant's Guild with a Licensing Board. No one is due special respect simply because of their sexual orientation.

I also have concerns about the "in any way" part. I am totally with you on other Doms showing proper respect for me and mine by asking me permission before they make any sort of meaningful contact, but "in any way" includes such things as talking to her in public spaces, random chats at a munch, etc. By doing that, you are not asserting your dominance over your property, you are asserting dominance over the social interactions of everyone in the local vicinity. Sure, expect them to ask permission before touching her, or offering to scene (assuming the other dom knows) but deciding that it is disrespectful to even talk to her? Little bit excessive, and I say that in a friendly advice sort of way.

 

[Daddyslilpet]

Daddyslilpet....

1. I did not change the rules midstream. She initiated him serving as a guide and mentor to the both of us and all three of us are clear on our respective roles.

2. She knows that it is expected by both he and I that she show a reasonable amount of respect to him in their interactions, this does not equal blind obedience. She also understands that refusal by her to do so will result in negative consequences for her whether initiated by him or by me

3. Tuesday night was going well because of my decision to let her know how unhappy I was. Not in spite of it.

4. He did not "tattle" on her. I have access to all of their online chats and emails. This was a condition on my part as her husband, not as her Dom. I have read the chats and seen her words, I have also seen her be disrespectful toward him.

5. I consider their online chats the same as a R/L meeting. In R/L I would expected her to show respect for other Doms because of their position. I would also expect another Dom to show respect to me and my sub by asking permission from me before interacting with her in any way.

30

That's not what your post said that I was responding to, but ok. Like I said I have some years of experience in this... take my advice or not.

 

[myinnerslut]

In R/L I would expected her to show respect for other Doms because of their position.

i respect other doms because they are people. i respect subs or slaves the same ways for the same reasons. if they do something to destroy that respect then i cease to respect them anymore. the only one i respect for his position is my Master. he is the one that owns me, not anybody who claims to be dominant.

 

[sadangel]

Why? Would would you expect her to show respect to anyone because they decided to call themselves some arbitrary title? I can understand wanting her to show respect to other people in general, but it is not like there is a Dominant's Guild with a Licensing Board. No one is due special respect simply because of their sexual orientation.

I also have concerns about the "in any way" part. I am totally with you on other Doms showing proper respect for me and mine by asking me permission before they make any sort of meaningful contact, but "in any way" includes such things as talking to her in public spaces, random chats at a munch, etc. By doing that, you are not asserting your dominance over your property, you are asserting dominance over the social interactions of everyone in the local vicinity. Sure, expect them to ask permission before touching her, or offering to scene (assuming the other dom knows) but deciding that it is disrespectful to even talk to her? Little bit excessive, and I say that in a friendly advice sort of way.

i respect other doms because they are people. i respect subs or slaves the same ways for the same reasons. if they do something to destroy that respect then i cease to respect them anymore. the only one i respect for his position is my Master. he is the one that owns me, not anybody who claims to be dominant.

My answer kinda lies within the two posts I quoted.

I respect that Homburg is "A Master" a Dom. He however is not my Master or Dom. Therefore, FOR ME, I do not address him as Sir. For me, that is a very personal title and is reserved for only one. I will respect who he is.....but I continue to call him and others that are Dom's or Masters (Mistress/Domme also included) by their Username unless told otherwise. I don't address them with Sir or Master, because they are not MY Sir or Master.

Homburg has earned my respect as have others by the way they respond and treat me and others. That is how ALL people earn my respect. They respect my boundaries and I respect theirs.

If I am asked by the one that I call Sir to address another Dom/Master as Sir...I will do so, to please Him. I will do it to respect Him and those he asks me to. I will do it willingly.


By the same token, when dealing with another sub, I will ask their Master, if it's known to me, if I may have permission to speak privately with them, with the understanding that they (The master) will be included in the messages if that's their choice. I only ask if I have something I would like answered that just doesn't feel as safe to me on the boards. I have only done this once. I do not abuse the trust that either the sub or Master has given me.

Yes, if you and your wife have contacted someone to mentor you, then she and you need to respect the rules, the boundaries agreed upon by all. That includes how and when to address the other person. If she fails to act respectfully, then discipline that has been agreed upon should be taken.

Like mis said. I respect people because they are people, not because they are a Dom or a Master.

 

[RedRose7]

ok, subby wife again. maybe i am just not as understanding of the life-style as some, maybe it has to do with the fact that i am a southern girl and respecting others is just a fact of life. the Dom that W/we have been working with was actually floored when i told him that calling people sir and mam are just part of my daily routine. it has nothing to do with D/s it has to do with respecting people as people. that is how i was raised and i see nothing wrong with it. HOWEVER...it is my understanding in this arena, respect is taken to a new height. if W/we were to ever go to a party (again live in the bible belt so i dont ever see this happening) would i expect a Dom to ask my husband permission to greet me...yes, i would. that is part of the allure of this for me.

so i ask the more experienced (some from the south would be nice)...why is this a problem if it is what i want?

 

[Homburg]

I've spent most of my life in the South, and have lived in Virginia for twenty years now. I grew up on army bases, as my dad was a soldier, so I definitely grew up saying sir and ma'am, and still do. It's just manners. Manners has nothing whatsoever to do with top, bottom, dom, sub, master, or slave. It is just how you were raised. Sir and ma'am, without the weight lifestylers frequently apply, are just words.

I remember being at my first actual BDSM social and the kitchen was tiny. There was a male submissive in the kitchen, and I wanted some ice, so I asked him nicely if he could grab me some ice. "Hey, soandso, could you grab me some ice, please?" It's just polite address. He paused less than a half-beat and then did it. When I was handed the cup, I said, sans any emotional weight at all, "Thank you, sah," and moved on. He stopped dead in his tracks as I'd said "sir" even in passing. Whatever. 36 years I've been on this planet, and the first half of those were on military bases around people that say sir and ma'am with every other sentence in their working life, and keep the same habits oftentimes at home. It meant nothing to me, but surprised him. Since then, they've gotten used to me, and heard the explanation once or twice.

As to asking permission to greet, no. I would consider that rude. Plain and simple, you are a person, I am a person. Our respective sexual orientations and interpersonal BDSM relationships are utterly meaningless when it comes to basic social greeting. If I pass you in the hall on the way to the bathroom at a munch and say hi, and you tell me to talk to your dom before I do that, you and your dom both are going to go right on my "Not worth talking to" list.

See, I require your permission to touch you. If you say I require his permission as well, that's cool. But to open my mouth and speak in your direction? That means you are telling me what to do. Nope, doesn't work that way. I don't get to take liberties with your person, sure, but you don't get to tell me what to do in any way outside of taking physical liberties with your specific person. And, last time I checked, saying "Hi there" in passing is not taking physical liberties with your person.

And, in that case, I really don't care if it is part of the allure. I am not in your fantasy world. We share the real world. I'm going to do my thing and you are going to do yours, and you are not going to modify my behavior any more than I am going to modify yours. The rules we follow at a munch/social are the rules of said munch/social group.

You have already said that you don't have much experience in this lifestyle. That's cool. I'm not going to claim to have twenty years experience in social BDSM, but I will tell you right now - behaviour like that will NOT earn you friends in any munch group or social that I have been associated with or hung out with. It's just not how those groups operate, and not how any group I've personally heard of operate either.

 

[BiBunny]

I don't see what being in the South has to do with anything, but if my Master required everyone who talked to me to have his permission first, he'd never have time to do ANYTHING else. I'm here to make his life easier, not harder.

 

[CutieMouse]

ok, subby wife again. maybe i am just not as understanding of the life-style as some, maybe it has to do with the fact that i am a southern girl and respecting others is just a fact of life. the Dom that W/we have been working with was actually floored when i told him that calling people sir and mam are just part of my daily routine. it has nothing to do with D/s it has to do with respecting people as people. that is how i was raised and i see nothing wrong with it. HOWEVER...it is my understanding in this arena, respect is taken to a new height. if W/we were to ever go to a party (again live in the bible belt so i dont ever see this happening) would i expect a Dom to ask my husband permission to greet me...yes, i would. that is part of the allure of this for me.

so i ask the more experienced (some from the south would be nice)...why is this a problem if it is what i want?

I did not chime in the other day because I am dealing with some things IRL and was worried it would spill over as grumpiness... but a few others said what I was going to say.

A) the "W/we" stuff works in Gorean novellas, but not in real life [nor message boards]. Hell one of the most dominant PYLs* on the board refuses to capitalize "I" when referring to himself. It's "i" every.damn.time.

B) I am Southern [Texas to be specific], although I've lived in Mississippi and Tennessee as well. I also joke that Emily Post is my Domme [because she is]. I am polite equals with everyone I meet. Period. Elders are called Sir/M'am - a habit I grew into as I aged; one I rarely require of my children.

C) Respect is taken to a new height? In erotica, maybe; IRL, nope.

D) Expecting negotiations between PYL types to simply say hello to a pyl strikes me as a recipe for a social meltdown -

Local munch, PYL #1 walks up to a group of people, but can't easily identify who the respective PYLs of the group are. Does he [rudely] refuse to greet anyone out of respect for not knowing who's permission to ask? If a pyl says hello first, does he [rudely] refuse to answer before finding a PYL to request permission to speak to her?

*PYL = Pick Your Label [Dominant/Top/Master/Domme/High Inquisitor]
*pyl = pick your label [submissive/slave/bottom/groveler]

 

[RedRose7]

Homburg...
i was raised in alabama so yes, your description of the sir,mam, fits right into what i was saying.

and let me clarify...when i say permission to greet, i mean that if i am standing by My Dom, and you greet me before Him, would that not be considered rude? again, i am very new(as in this is about week 6) to this and have two young children at home so i learn when and where i can. i did not mean to imply that you or anyone else would have to have His permission to say hi or chat. although re reading my post i suppose i said just that...sorry...

let me also go a little farther and explain that in our vanilla life, i have all the power. i do the bills, take care of the house, kids, etc etc. he works outside the home (let me say until 6 weeks ago so did i and did everything else). i am always the first to greet someone. i am the loud outspoken one. some might even call me a control freak. i have never disrespected him in his position as my husband, but some feel that i wear the pants. facts are, i am just more at ease in day to day control. he is MUCH more laid back. so when i say that him taking the lead is the allure for me, i mean just that. I dont have to. I can be introduced. I can be guided, etc. as he has said before, this is spilling into our vanilla lives and after 10 years of marriage, i am very ok with that.

And, last time I checked, saying "Hi there" in passing is not taking physical liberties with your person. Yes i agree. i just did not say it well. i will have to be honest, we have been focusing on more of the dynamics between the two of us more than if we were to ever be around others. like i said before, resources here are limited. we will more than likely have to travel to play and, well, lets just say i dont want to be embarrassed or embarrass him by not being able to socialize correctly, so thank you for your honesty.

 

[BiBunny]

I was raised in Alabama, too. So was my Master.

I really, really, REALLY think you're taking this way too seriously. Honestly, it's not that complicated. Things don't work in real life the way they do in porn and/or erotica.

Kinky people are just that...people. I don't often socialize in munch groups or whatever because that's not my thing. But I've never treated anyone differently because they're pervs. I've never been treated differently because I'm a switch in social situations with people who knew about my kinks, either.

Real life and chatrooms or real life and porn diverge very, very sharply from one another. Just treat folks in the same way you'd anyone else you've just met, and you'll be fine. There is no "kink etiquette" outside of regular old social niceties and "Ask before you touch," which, really, if you think about it, is a social nicety as well. It's not rocket science. Don't over-think it.

 

[RedRose7]

i am sorry if you think that i am too serious about this, and yes i do tend to over think. again, why being a sub appeals to me. please understand that this has been something that i personally have been afraid to share with ANYONE in my life until now. this is a big deal to me. i know most of you have done this a lot longer, may or may not be in 24/7 relationships, etc, we are all different. i just want to understand this more. want to understand how this will fit into my life more.

 

[Homburg]

It's a big deal for most of us too, and this is why we're telling you that it's cool, relax. BDSM'ers, by and large, are mellow at events. They may be stone cold bastards about protocol in their own private relationships, but they tend to be laid back with people outside those relationships. So don't worry about embarrassing your dom and just be a normal, sociable person. You'll be fine.

As to the question on someone greeting you before your dom or vice versa, it depends. How obvious is your power dynamic? If he is dressed as leatherman toppy and you're naked with a collar, sure. If you're both in jeans and t-shirts, not so much. Don't expect others to know your dynamic automatically. Heck, maybe not in your region, but I was taught to greet the woman first. I sometimes change this if the power dynamic is obvious, but not always.

And therein comes the big lesson. Even if the dynamic is obvious, even if you are wearing signs that say your roles, don't expect others to follow some protocol of yours. Expect them to be polite, sre, but don't be insulted if they talk to you first. It is very, very rarely meant as an insult.

Now, if you get that creepy single dom that walks up, never acknowledges your dom and chats you up, sure, that is something that one might just need to get insulted over.

 

[CutieMouse]

It's a big deal for most of us too, and this is why we're telling you that it's cool, relax. BDSM'ers, by and large, are mellow at events. They may be stone cold bastards about protocol in their own private relationships, but they tend to be laid back with people outside those relationships. So don't worry about embarrassing your dom and just be a normal, sociable person. You'll be fine.

As to the question on someone greeting you before your dom or vice versa, it depends. How obvious is your power dynamic? If he is dressed as leatherman toppy and you're naked with a collar, sure. If you're both in jeans and t-shirts, not so much. Don't expect others to know your dynamic automatically. Heck, maybe not in your region, but I was taught to greet the woman first. I sometimes change this if the power dynamic is obvious, but not always.

And therein comes the big lesson. Even if the dynamic is obvious, even if you are wearing signs that say your roles, don't expect others to follow some protocol of yours. Expect them to be polite, sre, but don't be insulted if they talk to you first. It is very, very rarely meant as an insult.

Now, if you get that creepy single dom that walks up, never acknowledges your dom and chats you up, sure, that is something that one might just need to get insulted over.

The few munches I've attended, I've initially been assumed a Domme. I've decided I don't fit the stereotypical submissive "look" (demure petite little thang) - apparently tall, thin, serious looking redhead, usually in black, lover of the stiletto = PYL.