Need Help.

[jezzaz]

So, I've submitted parts 3 and 4 of my first story twice now and had it rejected for somewhat nebulous reasons. I even asked, specifically, for a concrete example of whatever I am doing wrong (taken from the text) that is getting Laurel upset, so I can fix it, but got no response.

I've read the passage I've been quoted in the rejection column, and edited the 3rd and 4th parts accordingly, but I got rejected again. I can't honestly see what it is that she's upset about - I've had two books published and never had to deal with this kind of thing before, but whatever, it's her site.

I don't honestly have all the time in the world to go back and forth with Laurel on this, trying things until I stumble on whatever it is that she doesn't like.

Anyone here want to take a gander at my 3rd and 4th parts (oooh errr missues!) to see if they can spot it? I was just going to say fuck it and move on, but I put the time in on this and I'd rather like to see it published, without my blood pressure going off the charts. I'm totally cool to edit, I'd just rather like to know what, specifically she does not want to see?

Anyone? Pretty please with sugar on top?

 

[Darkniciad]

Step #1, what was the exact text of the rejection?

That's a major help in finding out exactly what Laurel is popping you for. While the notices may seem vague, when you've been here long enough, you can read between the lines and guess what she may be seeing.

 

[slyc_willie]

Step #1, what was the exact text of the rejection?

That's a major help in finding out exactly what Laurel is popping you for. While the notices may seem vague, when you've been here long enough, you can read between the lines and guess what she may be seeing.

Ditto.

Often, when a story is repeatedly rejected, there's usually a question of either underage content, or the allusion to previous underage content. Lit's very careful about not allowing that sort of thing, and any question of it can often make her reject it.

Also, bestiality will have it rejected outright, and possibly things like snuff, scat, and so on.

 

[Darkniciad]

Another common issue is punctuation in dialogue, because it's so hard to catch when you're seeing what you expect, instead of what's there.

For whatever reason, Laurel is a real stickler for this one, and she seems to see that 1 in 100 place where you make a mistake. Speed-reading approval means *pop* and on to the next one when that happens.

 

[slyc_willie]

Another common issue is punctuation in dialogue, because it's so hard to catch when you're seeing what you expect, instead of what's there.

For whatever reason, Laurel is a real stickler for this one, and she seems to see that 1 in 100 place where you make a mistake. Speed-reading approval means *pop* and on to the next one when that happens.

That's a good point. I don't normally assume there's been grammatical or syntax errors when these questions pop up, but they are a relatively common reason for rejection as well.

 

[NaokoSmith]

Wow! Punctuation errors can get you knocked out? Way . I've had stories sent back because there was an accidental formatting instruction in them, and once because the story was too short - although you can put a very short story in if it's audio. The reasons have always been very clearly explained. Do publish the rejection notes, then we can help decipher them.
Also, are you clearly saying in the box for comments, when you re-submit, I've addressed the problem like so? That may help.

 

[sr71plt]

Yes, if it comes to that, someone here will be happy to look at one of your files to see what the issue is. But even then they need to know what the Web site editor said the issue was. No use cleaning up a possible line of mistakes when they weren't what caused the rejection and thus cleaning them up won't prevent another rejection.

There also is a question about where you sent your queries on the rejection. The only connection with the editor that appears to have been functioning for years is a direct private message (PM) through the message system at the top right of this page. You would send the query to Laurel. If you've sent it any other way, despite what the Web site tells you where to send it, it hasn't gone anywhere. Not your fault certainly, but them's the facts.

 

[jezzaz]

Ditto.

Often, when a story is repeatedly rejected, there's usually a question of either underage content, or the allusion to previous underage content. Lit's very careful about not allowing that sort of thing, and any question of it can often make her reject it.

Also, bestiality will have it rejected outright, and possibly things like snuff, scat, and so on.

Yeah, no. This is LW stuff. There's nothing in it that will cause a rejection on that side.

 

[slyc_willie]

Yeah, no. This is LW stuff. There's nothing in it that will cause a rejection on that side.

Then my assumption would be along the lines of Dark's suggestion, in that there were some pretty serious grammatical errors in the piece.

Was it you who posted recently that you had a story rejected because you had the dialogue of two different characters in the same paragraph?

 

[jezzaz]

Another common issue is punctuation in dialogue, because it's so hard to catch when you're seeing what you expect, instead of what's there.

For whatever reason, Laurel is a real stickler for this one, and she seems to see that 1 in 100 place where you make a mistake. Speed-reading approval means *pop* and on to the next one when that happens.

Oh I'm SURE it's this. This is what the rejection notice says. I just don't know what specific issue she is upset about. I think there's literally one comma somewhere that she doesn't like, and BAM, instant rejection. Just saying "Fix your punctuation" is pretty vague bearing in mind I don't see much wrong with what I wrote in the first place. This kind of thing tends to be pretty edge case and instance specific and like I said originally, I just don't have the time to go back and forth on it, trying things until I find what it is that Laurel doesn't like.

All I need is "Here's a line from the text. This comma is out of place. Please fix all occurrences like this." - which is what I asked for in the notes when I resubmitted.

Now, like I said, I've had two books published and never had this degree of concentration on a stray comma, and given the texts are like 20k words each some zeroing in on what the issue was would go a long way for me to seeing exactly what is being complained about and fixing it. I don't doubt there might be a stray comma. Point it out for me? It's not rocket science - just copy and paste the text into the rejection notice - you've already found it since you are complaining about it. Otherwise it's pretty much entirely guess work. Maybe Laurel doesn't like single quotes inside of speech quotes - I dunno.

 

[slyc_willie]

Well, at least we're getting somewhere.

 

[jezzaz]

Then my assumption would be along the lines of Dark's suggestion, in that there were some pretty serious grammatical errors in the piece.

Was it you who posted recently that you had a story rejected because you had the dialogue of two different characters in the same paragraph?

Yes. I fixed all that. Went through and ensured they are now in separate paragraphs. If there are other issues, then all the constant rejection without highlighting the specifics of what she doesn't like is doing is just pissing me off for the sake of it.
I get there might be a grammatical error - SHOW IT TO ME - I'm more than happy to fix it if someone can address specifically what it is. If you are going to reject something like this - and it's totally her choice to do so, no question - at least tell me what it is specifically so I can go fix it.

My feeling here is that there is a foible regarding something specific that I do - a contextual comma in a specific situation, perhaps - that Laurel simply doesn't like, looks for diligently, and if she finds it, it's an instant rejection. I just need to know what that is so I can avoid it in future.

 

[slyc_willie]

Yes. I fixed all that. Went through and ensured they are now in separate paragraphs. If there are other issues, then all the constant rejection without highlighting the specifics of what she doesn't like is doing is just pissing me off for the sake of it.
I get there might be a grammatical error - SHOW IT TO ME - I'm more than happy to fix it if someone can address specifically what it is. If you are going to reject something like this - and it's totally her choice to do so, no question - at least tell me what it is specifically so I can go fix it.

My feeling here is that there is a foible regarding something specific that I do - a contextual comma in a specific situation, perhaps - that Laurel simply doesn't like, looks for diligently, and if she finds it, it's an instant rejection. I just need to know what that is so I can avoid it in future.

Without seeing an actual example of what was rejected, we're back to square one.

 

[jezzaz]

Without seeing an actual example of what was rejected, we're back to square one.

Well, that's exactly my point. There's a hell of a lot of words in this, and I have no real idea of what the specific reason for rejection is, beyond "Fix the punctuation in speech".

Hence me asking for someone else with more experience of what Laurel doesn't like to look the text over.

 

[Handley_Page]

Have you considered asking an Editor first ?

 

[NaokoSmith]

Have you considered asking an Editor first ?

Yup, HP is on the money. You could have a look in the Volunteer Editor list and pick up someone who may be able to point out offending commas. I have had two editors and they have improved my writing IMMEASURABLY. I also edit for some people, which I find great fun (although I am up to my quota at the moment.)

You might do well to look for someone who not only writes in ways you admire but has published a lot on here, so clearly knows how to get work past Laurel's eagle eye. If you ask with sugar on the top, I'm sure someone will be happy to help. People here are very generous.

 

[PennLady]

Yup, HP is on the money. You could have a look in the Volunteer Editor list and pick up someone who may be able to point out offending commas. I have had two editors and they have improved my writing IMMEASURABLY. I also edit for some people, which I find great fun (although I am up to my quota at the moment.)

You might do well to look for someone who not only writes in ways you admire but has published a lot on here, so clearly knows how to get work past Laurel's eagle eye. If you ask with sugar on the top, I'm sure someone will be happy to help. People here are very generous.

I'm all for finding an editor, but I recommend looking on the Editor's forum instead. Check the monthly sticky at the top, or post your request, with the category, length, etc. The VE list is very hit or miss.

 

[Darkniciad]

I'll take a look at it, now that I know what the rejection was for. Send me a PM or drop me a line through "contact" on my bio and I'll let you know where to send it ( can't post emails on the forum )

I can pretty much handle any document format, so whatever you have it in is fine.

 

[sr71plt]

I have no real idea of what the specific reason for rejection is, beyond "Fix the punctuation in speech".

This is probably reason #1 for rejection here. It usually means that you treated dialogue incorrectly (for the Lit. standard) in punctuation placement. Just what you give on that in this quote breaches the Lit. standard (the period should be in inside the double quotes).

We can probably clear up the reason for the rejection in minutes if you post three or four lines of dialogue from one of your pieces. British style is more complex in the relationship between quotation marks and punctuation than American style is, and, regardless of what would be nice for our British-style writers, the Web site style is based on American style and many treatments that are proper in British style are going to be rejected here. Just the way it is.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I have like zero problems with Laurels scrutiny. She flagged 3 of mine for unorthodox dialogue (it was experimentation) but I never have much cause to gripe about her druthers.

 

[jezzaz]

This is probably reason #1 for rejection here. It usually means that you treated dialogue incorrectly (for the Lit. standard) in punctuation placement. Just what you give on that in this quote breaches the Lit. standard (the period should be in inside the double quotes).

We can probably clear up the reason for the rejection in minutes if you post three or four lines of dialogue from one of your pieces. British style is more complex in the relationship between quotation marks and punctuation than American style is, and, regardless of what would be nice for our British-style writers, the Web site style is based on American style and many treatments that are proper in British style are going to be rejected here. Just the way it is.

Good call. Here we go.

I saw the genuine concern there as she said “Oh my god J. Please, no, not again. You don’t deserve this.”
She was right. I didn’t. A sudden burst of bitterness welled up in me. “It appears I am the problem here. Twice in a year. You do the math.”

...


Amy’s nose wrinkled in disgust. “Oh I’ll be gone. We’ll ‘tidy up’ before we leave, right Wendy? It’ll be something nice for the cheating bitch to come back to.”


...

“Look, I’ll be in touch… Wendy, it was nice to see you.”

I nodded at Wendy and she nodded back and said, “Come see us J. Please. We miss you so much.”

I nodded again, - this time to myself -, looked again at Chloe, who said, “J… talk to me. Don’t be alone. Come find me.”

I nodded at her too and said, “I’ll be back very soon, I promise. I just need to get myself together again.”
I gave them a tight smile and said, “Don’t worry. I won’t vanish again. Not this time. I just need some time…”


Ok, there we go, some examples. What am I doing wrong here?

 

[sr71plt]

The punctuation of these looks fine to me, except for there should be a comma after that first "said" going into the quote (you did it correctly in the examples that followed).

Also, those hyphens used with commas to, I guess, convey em dashes. That one properly should be "I nodded again—this time to myself—and looked again . . .”

The ellipsis you used isn’t a publisher’s ellipsis (“ . . . ” instead of “…”), but I don’t know that the Web site editor cares about that.

Maybe more of it should go to Darkniciad, as offered, for checking.

 

[jezzaz]

The punctuation of these looks fine to me, except for there should be a comma after that first "said" going into the quote (you did it correctly in the examples that followed).

Also, those hyphens used with commas to, I guess, convey em dashes. That one properly should be "I nodded again—this time to myself—and looked again . . .”

The ellipsis you used isn’t a publisher’s ellipsis (“ . . . ” instead of “…”), but I don’t know that the Web site editor cares about that.

Maybe more of it should go to Darkniciad, as offered, for checking.

Yeah, I think you are right. It's something very specific that Laurel doesn't like and I'm unsure of what it expressly is.

I've done exactly as you suggested. Fingers crossed he can pinpoint the issue and I can get these published.

I have quite an elaborate plan of what comes next and am already elbow deep in writing it.

 

[jezzaz]

Just need to say a public Thank You to Darkniciad, who took a look at my stuff, diagnosed it very fast and even did a tiny spot of editing.

In case anyone is interested, there were points where I had written

Person A said "And that's all, Folks", missing the critical comma out after the 'said'. This is, apparently, a massive and huge red flag to Laurel. She'll let a lot of other stuff slide but this she will not.

The man (I'm assuming you are a man?) is a STAR.

Thank you. It's always nice to make new friends.

 

[NaokoSmith]

Just need to say a public Thank You to Darkniciad, who took a look at my stuff, diagnosed it very fast and even did a tiny spot of editing.

In case anyone is interested, there were points where I had written

Person A said "And that's all, Folks", missing the critical comma out after the 'said'. This is, apparently, a massive and huge red flag to Laurel. She'll let a lot of other stuff slide but this she will not.

The man (I'm assuming you are a man?) is a STAR.

Thank you. It's always nice to make new friends.

Thanks for letting us know!

Darkniciad is indeed a star, who comes up with top quality advice modestly and politely put, I have noticed.