Need help/advice/criticism.

[Sai_dias_29]

This has been nipping at me since the day I posted the story, and I can't seem to get my way around it. At all. It's been nearly two years since the story has been posted and I still want to redeem it. Somehow. So, could someone take a look at the story and point out all that's wrong with, what works, what doesn't, and any advice to make it better.

https://literotica.com/s/family-secrets-nights

I know that I should post this on story feedback, but I'm looking for advice from other authors. From their own perspective.

 

[EmilyMiller]

Taken from the preamble to your story:

A thank you goes out to EditorsApprentice, who did the editing for the first half, but due reasons, he wasn't was able to finish the full editing. Thankfully, Fantasy Gorilla was able to finish the editing.

So you got not one but two people to edit it for you. But I guess you weren’t happy with their input. So you want some more input. How many edits do you have in mind?

Incest is not my thing, so I’m not going to be providing such input. But I’d suggest something a bit more targeted than “point out all that's wrong with, what works, what doesn't, and any advice to make it better”.

What are you unhappy about? Why are you seeking more input? Any particular areas you feel are in more need of attention?

A blanket request like yours is likely to garner the non-existent response it has had so far.

Em

 

[Sai_dias_29]

So you got not one but two people to edit it for you. But I guess you weren’t happy with their input. So you want some more input. How many edits do you have in mind?

One of them is my editor and the other is a beta-reader, they're both great. But I want a reaction from someone isn't involved in the story as much as them. They both got the revised stories sent to them, but both of them are weren't very happy with them. And neither was I. So now I'm looking for a blind reaction from someone who doesn't know what my thinking for the story is. If that makes sense.

What are you unhappy about? Why are you seeking more input? Any particular areas you feel are in more need of attention?

It feels unsatisfying. Something about the story feels incomplete. (Mind you the story IS incomplete, it was suppose to be a two-part story.) But everything after the opening scene feels mangled to me. There's nothing there holding on, or pushing the story forward. And I don't know how to fix it. A lot of people liked the story (there's also a lot of people who HATED the story with a passion) and is waiting for part-2, but I can't find any sensible way to continue the story.

Initially I thought that it was because it was my first story. But when I tried to rewrite the story, I keep hitting some roadblock along the way. Either the story feels too stupid, childish, or just plain lazy.

Now I'm looking for a blind input on the story, so that I can figure out what is going wrong with the story so that I save it.

Hope that makes some sense.

 

[EmilyMiller]

Not my thing, but I wish you luck. Hopefully someone will read the above and be inspired to help.

Em

 

[Sai_dias_29]

Not my thing, but I wish you luck. Hopefully someone will read the above and be inspired to help.

Em

Thank you!

 

[Djmac1031]

I'll read it over and get back to you.

 

[Euphony]

First and foremost, I would post/ask to have this moved to the Feedback forum. That gives you more exposure to those in the headspace to deconstruct/guide you along in what you are seeking.

Second, you remind me of when I am really wound up and I'm usually not in a state to take criticism in its proper measure. It's possible to overcorrect and drive your writing off the road just across the yellow line this time. This makes me hesitant to drop my quick thoughts but I will do so with the ask you are careful not to overcorrect.

The early exposition is very A to B and overexplained. There are plenty of details which trip our reader expectation meter for something to be relevant when it never really is. If you make us wade through thick mud, there needs to be a very specific goal/payoff on the other side of that river. Pretty much every detail needs to have a reason for being there and push the narrative forward.

Also key, who are these people? It felt more like a description of paper dolls with bolt on characteristics rather than living, breathing individuals with understandable motivations. They are so down to fuck without token or no resistance to pretty much all of it. Where are the stakes? What is risked and why is it worth what will be gained? Characterization is near non-existant.

Some will argue "it's stroke fiction, those things don't matter." Disagree. There are plenty of AH stalwarts who write plausibility stretching fiction on the regular but they are always sure to have a grounding even if the readers don't notice it (they do care about it subconsciously, and vote on it knowingly or not) Even hunting for it, I found no grounding.

Sex happens on the assumption "of course, this is porn fiction" and for very little other reasons. Some authors count on some unique puzzle piecing of participants to carry a story but the incest category is more discerning than many give them credit.

"My relative is hot so why not" is rarely enough for the regulars in the category and incest is a very loyal category.

If you don't want to write the complexities, that's fine. But at least minimal motivations and some layers beyond "we're are physically able to fuck so of course we will" are needed and cut the detailing to the bone (those readers aren't fussed with them. They want their expectations met and an understanding you are moving straight-line towards them. You have to balance what they *think* they want with what they really want, teasing but a bare minimum of it and a zero'ed in narrative on the taboo sex happening.

 

[Djmac1031]

Okay, gave it a quick read.

Here's my thoughts.

It's a perfectly acceptable Spank Story if that's what you were aiming for.

It reads like one of those porn videos where an oblivious family member is doing stuff around the house totally unaware there's people fucking right next to them.

The problem is: there's absolutely no character development.

We meet characters, they fuck. We meet new characters. They fuck too.

Why are they fucking? Because they're horny.

Why is the one son Sai the only one not involved? So he can be the Oblivious Character / Voyeur.

You mentioned them all supposedly being "good Christians" to try to add some shock value, like they're acting outside of their normal behavior.

But we never see any "normal" behavior. They're even grab assing during breakfast.

You introduce two new female characters two pages in only to have more sex scenes. We know next to nothing about them except names and what they look like.

Speaking of; there are literally several paragraphs in a row of nothing but character descriptions.

I get you said you were planning a part 2, but four pages without giving us a clue who these people are and why they're all happily fucking their own family members left me confused and ultimately disinterested.

 

[Sai_dias_29]

This makes me hesitant to drop my quick thoughts but I will do so with the ask you are careful not to overcorrect.

Don't worry I won't. The story is currently shelved and I want to redeem it. That's why I'm asking for others take on the story.

Also, thank you for the feedback!

 

[Euphony]

Don't worry I won't. The story is currently shelved and I want to redeem it. That's why I'm asking for others take on the story.

Also, thank you for the feedback!

It may be a me thing but I wouldn't frame it as "redemption" fixing or similar. It's a counter productive headspace.

Streamline your details, omit what is not absolutely necessary, and give your character's a reason for engaging in psychologically weighty sex and you are well on your way to the clarity in writing you are working towards.

You are on the right path but the overcorrections you made also happen to be big time issues for the category's readership so you were outsized punished for minor common transgressions.

Readers want some stakes and a reason for sex other than because they can.

 

[Djmac1031]

You said you wanted, not just a critique, but advice on how to make it better, so:

Sai - make a choice on his purpose. Is he the Voyeur Character, spying on all the sex, or the Oblivious Character, the one unaware of everything going on around him? You made him both, and it doesn't work.

Physical description dumps: don't do them. Instead of three or four paragraphs describing each character in excruciating physical detail, sprinkle details in during the sex scenes.

WHO - Who are these people, beyond their physical appearance? Because other than that, we know next to nothing about them.

WHY. - This is a very important question. WHY is ANY of this even happening?

Conflict / resolution - important for any story. What's the conflict here? Other than Sai being the only family member not fucking?

And what's this building to, other than more sex? Is there any POINT to it?