Natural Slave?

[Penalt]

Okay, a little background first. Today, Mamid is feeling a little under the weather today so I have put her collar on her to enforce that for today she is under my direction to take it easy and heal. While puttering about and cleaning I have been noticing how natural her collar looks on her and how it actually enhances her beauty. The wide black band with its silver highlights looks great when combined with her long black hair hanging down to her lower back.

So, as I began to dwell on how natural she looked in a collar I began to wonder the following: If some people naturally appear to look good and at ease in bondage, to one degree or another, are there people who naturally are slaves? Or for that matter people who naturally are Master/Mistresses?

Now the automatic referal to this are the books of the Gor series where it tries to make a case for all women being natural slaves and all men being natural masters. I reject that concept as I would any statement that goes "all x people are y". Although from a strictly evil, male-centric view I wouldn't terribly mind if all women naturally were slaves, but I digress.

I am wondering if some people are naturally slaves or masters? What do the rest of you think on this?

 

[Chicklet]

i don't think so.

i think it's just the same as some people who look better in pink than others.

when people tell me they're 'natural masters' i tend to laugh at them to their face.

 

[@}-}rebecca----]

oh my......................smiles

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c224/rebecca000/canofworms.jpg

The Devil made me do it .

 

[Penalt]

Nice pic!

Chicklet, would you perhaps think then that certain people have built-in or genetic tendancies to aspects of BDSM? It is interesting to note that Mamid's mother was involved in BDSM as well. No idea if she still is or not. Mamid is very estranged from her, with good cause. But it does tend to add to the hypothesis of it being a natural tendancy.

Although, I will say, you make a good point as well. Especially as when you think about it BDSM gear tends to be made of high quality material and is usually well taken care of so it naturally will tend to enhance the appearance of someone wearing it.

Have you noticed I seem to be on both sides of this?

 

[Chicklet]

Chicklet, would you perhaps think then that certain people have built-in or genetic tendancies to aspects of BDSM?

No.

If you want to pull it from that line, I don't think it's genetic, but it could possibly be something built in by how you're raised. My roommate and I were discussing this last night, because I, for instance, was only spanked ONCE as a child. And I don't think that I would or could possibly like it in adult life if it'd ever happened in childhood. My roommate, on the other hand, was spanked OFTEN, and thinks that she associates her spankings in adult life as proof of love, like her parents gave her.

An example of what I'm talking about could be, I have been medicated for depression in the past. My mother also has depression. It can be caused by a shortage of enzymes in your brain or whatnot, and I thought for a long time that this was proof that it was a genetic disorder. HOWEVER, now I think that I had depression because my mother raised me to look at everything negatively. Negative thinking is something you learn from your parents, and it's very hard to break.

So, I used to think the depression I had was genetic, and now I think it was a learned behavior.

I don't think it's genetically built in to any of us to be any more submissive than any other animal might be.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Nah, I don't buy the appearance of certain items on people making it seem they are naturally in that role. It would be the same as saying someone who looks good in a nurses uniform must be a natural nurse etc....doesn't seem to have a solid basis.

I have no idea why Mamid is estranged from her mother, but I do hope she reaches a place where she can talk with her mother and either have closure or reconciliation on whatever terms they agree to before it is too late. Too many people wish they had done something about it while they had the chance when it is far too late to do so, and that can eat away at a person. I have to say for myself, it has made a huge difference in my life to be able to do that, and has actually been a positive thing.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/169/382933528_acc85890f0_t.jpg Catalina

 

[Penalt]

So, I used to think the depression I had was genetic, and now I think it was a learned behavior.

I don't think it's genetically built in to any of us to be any more submissive than any other animal might be.

Learned behaviour, eh? That is an interesting concept, and probably more likely than a genetic tendancy I must say.

 

[Chicklet]

Learned behaviour, eh? That is an interesting concept, and probably more likely than a genetic tendancy I must say.

my opinion of this was formed because i can see myself reacting to things EXACTLY the way my mother reacts to them. The same panicky reaction, the same words coming out of my mouth, the same behaviors, and I think to myself "do i really feel this way?" and the answer ends up being no, but I still act that way.

 

[agibean]

.
Too many people wish they had done something about it while they had the chance when it is far too late to do so, and that can eat away at a person. I have to say for myself, it has made a huge difference in my life to be able to do that, and has actually been a positive thing.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/169/382933528_acc85890f0_t.jpg Catalina

I have three siblings currently not speaking to each other for various reasons. I'll be visiting all of them in a week and hope to impress upon them exactly what you said above. As the oldest, I appear to have been cast as the peacemaker by the rest. I hope I am successful-I'm glad you were able to reach closure in your life.

 

[Cheshire D]

Learned behaviour, eh? That is an interesting concept, and probably more likely than a genetic tendancy I must say.

I dunno, I'm personally of the opinion that it's a combination of both. You may have a genetic tendancy towards depression but that only activates if your environment (social, familial) and your thinking (postive v. negative) triggers it. Or maybe I"m just sucking up my professors' opinions cuz they're completely different to what I was taught (that mental disorders were completely biologically based and you can't help when you have them) and I'm going through a serious rejection of my earliest teachings.

Anywho, I think submission or domination could be construed the same way. Perhaps there's a genetic tendancy towards being a submissive or dominant person, but it only comes out when a certain combination of factors (again, familial/ social, psychological, biological) are met.

I'd love to do a sociological/psychological study on this topic...

 

[Mamid]

have no idea why Mamid is estranged from her mother, but I do hope she reaches a place where she can talk with her mother and either have closure or reconciliation on whatever terms they agree to before it is too late.

The only closure I need with my mother is the one where the closing of the casket occurs.

I have tried reconciliation with her. Several times. The latest stunt she pulled was not even bothering to tell me my grandmother was sick and dying, or for that matter dead. Oh no. She decided to call up here and yell at Penalt because other relatives were feeding me the information. I was informed that I was not welcome at her funeral nor wanted even though I carry that woman's name in mine.

That was my last try at reconciliation. Now drop the subject.

 

[subtleone]

Ohhh The Nature/Nurture Debate

I think that it has to be a bit of both. You will obviously pick things up from your parents/significant people in your life, you will also sometimes rebel against those same people; if this rebellion has a positive effect and enhances your life you most probably will continue in your 'rebellious' ways and conversely if your rebellion turns sour you may conclude that 'mother knows best' and follow her every word for evermore.
We all lead different lives and have sometimes vastly different life experiences and these experiences also go in some part to make us what we are eg: some of us travel the world and experience different cultures others never leave our birth county.
BUT we all seem to have natural tendencies, how often have people said on these boards "I just knew something was missing until I found I was..." I know I have! Watching my own children one is desperate to please everyone while another is out to get everything her way, yet to look at them they are identical and they are treated identically.
....and so the debate continues ad infinitum!!

 

[catalina_francisco]

The only closure I need with my mother is the one where the closing of the casket occurs.

I have tried reconciliation with her. Several times. The latest stunt she pulled was not even bothering to tell me my grandmother was sick and dying, or for that matter dead. Oh no. She decided to call up here and yell at Penalt because other relatives were feeding me the information. I was informed that I was not welcome at her funeral nor wanted even though I carry that woman's name in mine.

That was my last try at reconciliation. Now drop the subject.

Sorry you have had such negativity and seem offended.

Catalina

 

[catalina_francisco]

I have three siblings currently not speaking to each other for various reasons. I'll be visiting all of them in a week and hope to impress upon them exactly what you said above. As the oldest, I appear to have been cast as the peacemaker by the rest. I hope I am successful-I'm glad you were able to reach closure in your life.

It took a long time, and a lot of pain and patience, but it is something I am glad I did. Now if my sisters (I'm the baby of the family by 9 years) could do the same, and even manage to talk to each other, it would make me feel better, but it is something they have to feel in the right place to do and unfotunately time is running out. I think it was my father's death which made me feel it important to speed up my own process with my mother...it just seemed it needed to be done, no matter how painful, or I would carry the wounds forever. It also helped I had been able to have some time and distance to look at things more objectively, and acknowledge the reality and learn to live with it.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/186/376675788_f2e2be5814_t.jpg Catalina

 

[MasterPhoenix]

I think that maybe there is some hard wiring that goes into a desire for a Ds relationship, but I also that is not the defining factor.

My baby looks awesome in her collar too... it makes her whole face light up.

 

[Netzach]

I think everyone looks good with stripes on their ass and a smile. Everyone.

 

[ownedsubgal]

I think everyone looks good with stripes on their ass and a smile. Everyone.

is the smile really necessary tho?

 

[Netzach]

is the smile really necessary tho?

It's a good accoutrement.

Tears and snot running are really good on about a third of the people out there.

 

[agibean]

I think it was my father's death which made me feel it important to speed up my own process with my mother...it just seemed it needed to be done, no matter how painful, or I would carry the wounds forever. It also helped I had been able to have some time and distance to look at things more objectively, and acknowledge the reality and learn to live with it.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/186/376675788_f2e2be5814_t.jpg Catalina

In our case, everyone managed to work things out while my parents were living, despite the occasional serious disagreement. It was only after my mother's death that little things became bigger things that went on to seem insurmountable. We're all getting older-all past 40, and you'd think that would lead to MORE working things out, but nooooo.

I really don't want to be having a conversation with one of them years from now as they tell me how they wished they'd sat down with whichever one leaves us first.

 

[amadaun]

I don't know about genetically hardwired to be submissive, but hardwired to like pain, maybe. The two tendencies seem to come together in a lot of people, though... maybe submissiveness is a learned response that people who like pain tend to acquire because of their interactions with people who cause them pain in their formative years, or culture or summat. Who knows, I sure don't.

 

[graceanne]

Here's another idea - maybe she looks so good in a collar, (a) because you're a dom and find that kind of thing attractive, and (b) cause you love her. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, after all. I bet if you asked a majority of people (like off the street) what they think of Mamid's collar, natural slave isn't what would come to their minds.

 

[Kailey_86]

i think that a collar might look better on some people more than others. i agree with what gracie said on this though.

As for being a natural slave, i would say i am naturally submissive. This submissiveness might also be described as being a people-pleaser and maybe introverted in the vanilla world. i think it's just part of my personality. i noticed that the nature vs nurture arguement was brought up. i would say it's both.

 

[MasterPhoenix]

is the smile really necessary tho?

I think that a smile is a key thing to get though life.

Anyway, I like that spaced out look My rose has after a good beating.

 

[MasterPhoenix]

In our case, everyone managed to work things out while my parents were living, despite the occasional serious disagreement. It was only after my mother's death that little things became bigger things that went on to seem insurmountable. We're all getting older-all past 40, and you'd think that would lead to MORE working things out, but nooooo.

I really don't want to be having a conversation with one of them years from now as they tell me how they wished they'd sat down with whichever one leaves us first.

I was basically estranged from My father from the time I was in My late teens due to a whole lot of issues, not the least of it was a lot of bs that My stepmom started. Yeah we saw each other once in a while, but there were a lot of resentments and such, and no real closeness. Its only in the last six months or so that we have started to come close again.

I am very grateful that we could do it, because I would hate to have to live with not doing My part before he passes. Its like that song from Mike and the Mechanics "The Living Years."

 

[Mamid]

on one hand, being estranged from my mother hurts - I want her to know the kids and vice versa.

On the other hand, with what she had pulled before, keeping the kids safe is more important than her "grandparental rights."

She has proven to us that she refuses to grow up or even learn to forgive or accept the forgiveness I have given previously. We recently found a letter she wrote years ago to me (I was 21) and the language she uses would have made just about anyone cringe. It was as if she was trying to feed me candy with one hand and beat me with the other at the same time.

Yes, I found out that she was into the scene - when her boyfriend walked into a play party I was attending. Can we say "squick"? I knew we could.

That was the end of my play party days.