Mental Illness

[Curious_in_Cali]

E,
It was a beautiful and honest blurt that I am grateful for seeing it before you took it down. I'm not so wise except that I know I'm speaking from my own truth formed from my very real and heart earned experiences. I'm a bit saddened but I understand that you needed to take it down. I'm really good at doing that recoil as well because I get inspired to speak to a post that stirs me, but lose the nerve to hold that honesty so publicly. I hope that you can see in your response ro my post that YOUR story and honesty is valid and valuable when you can share it. This is something I'm still learning as I'm reminded every time I speak honestly and it inspires the honest voice of someone else. It's amazing what we can teach eachother isn't it?
FWIW, I'm still learning and strugging at times to shed the shame and heartaches of a past that still keeps me company at times. It's ok to honor the work and struggles in it because they are real.




That said, CnC, I hope that my intention of saying what I did was to offer the perspective that your self care is ALSO important in these situations came through.

I too have a hard time walking away, or even pulling back some from people when I can see their potential in that idealistic and hopeful way. It pains me to see suffering and the want to help whenever and however I can is true for me. I nearly put my own light out trying to save or help those that were not ready to change. Please know that I'm speaking from a pained and still healing place of needing to learn how to put my own oxygen mask on first. It took a long time to allow the "right" thing to be the most compassionate and loving thing I could do, and then follow through on doing it. So. Hard. The reality that my vigilant assistance was actually part of what was perpetuating the harmful choices he was making was a HARD pill to swallow. It brought the lesson of how helpful NOT helping can be into my life. It's not always true, but sometimes it is.

These are love marathons and the wear and sore muscles are real when we face illness that is mental or physical. The boundaries can sometimes help make the friendship more sustainable because if I'm worn when something of true significance happens that threatens their life or the lives of those around them is when my help is actually needed, I become a liability instead of a help. I just hope that when you weigh what needs to be done and what your friend needs, that you ALSO listen to your own needs. My heart is with you while you sort out the verbs in loving your friend.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[Collar_N_Cuffs]

C_in_C - I understand now. Oh, yes. Yes yes yes, I come first I only extend in help that which I don't need for my core self. I have reserves that are for me and me alone, all extra I gladly spread around as needed. I get this from my grandmother, who raised me. Always be willing to help others, but be a mother bear for yourself and your own family first. Sometimes I have very little to give, but sometimes my reserves are boundless!

And for Elle - thank you for that

 

[Curious_in_Cali]

Cool beans, CnC.

Thank you both, truly. This brought me to a reflective place that was really timely and surprisingly helpful.

 

[BiBunny]

Soooooo...I am annoyed.

I had a doctor's appointment yesterday afternoon. I very specifically requested the doctor I wanted to see (my usual one) when I made the appointment two weeks ago. I was the only one in the waiting room when I arrived, and shortly thereafter, the nurse came out to tell me that the doctor I wanted to see was running behind. She asked if I would like to see someone else so I wouldn't have to wait so long. I knew it was a bad idea when I said it, but I reluctantly said that'd be ok.

I tried to mention something that I'd brought to the attention of my *actual* doctor a couple of years ago. She had told me then that if I noticed it getting worse, I should let her know. It's been getting way worse, so I brought it up to this doctor. I basically got the brush-off, so I kinda kept pursuing it because some of the symptoms are both disabling and alarming.

She more or less told me that since I didn't have insurance, it wouldn't be worth it to try to figure out what was wrong, since I couldn't afford it, anyway, and even if I could afford the tests, I might not be able to afford the treatment.

I kept pushing because I don't think it's a fucking unrealistic expectation to want to know what the hell is wrong with me.

Her next response was "Do you have trouble with anxiety?" No, no, I do not. Congratulations for reading my chart and seeing my legitimate mental issue, but making the leap to "This bitch is clearly a fat, crazy hypochondriac" was kinda uncalled for (especially since almost none of these symptoms are like the symptoms of anxiety).

I finally got her to write me orders to get a full blood panel done, which I got the blood drawn for today at the hospital. It also didn't cost me nearly as much as she was trying to make out like it would. I sincerely hope that something comes back (and that it's both easy and cheap to treat), so that when she calls me to tell me the results, I can say, "Yeah, I knew there had to be *something* wrong."

Ugh. This is why I wanted to see my regular doctor. She never acts like whatever is wrong with me is because of my brain cooties.

I will not make that mistake again, I assure you.

/rant

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[BiBunny]

Oh bibunny. That sucks.

You know, I do regular full bloods for some of the critters here, and so it all ways strikes me as odd when people don't want to do it for them selves ( and pay lab fees I'd pay here too, though weirdly its way more expensive here privately for lab fees than for the same tests for a critter...weird, huh?)

I always think its good to know what our own norms are anyway. I do that, for say, my horses In serious Work, why would I not do it for a person in work?

Agreed!

The bit about the horses made me think of something, too.

We (my parents and I) tried and tried for a long time to figure out what was wrong with one of our horses several years ago and had all kinds blood tests--the regular yearly ones, Lyme, EPM, etc.--and such run. Nothing ever came back, so by process of elimination, we (correctly) guessed that she had EPSM. All we had to do then was change her diet, and in a couple of months, she was fine and hasn't had any problems since.

We knew when we were getting all this done that it was possible that nothing would show up on the tests. But we also knew that every negative we got meant one more thing we could mark off the list of possibilities.

So to me, it's kinda like, if three hicks and a vet can figure that out amongst themselves, then you'd think a doctor wouldn't have a problem making that leap, too.

(For the record, the hospital that I'm having the tests done at gives a 60% discount to those of us who don't have insurance. That's why I drive all the way to the backwoods where I used to live to go the doctor and hospital, rather than doing it where I actually live now. I paid roughly $125 for a ton of tests. I'm aware that that's a good bit of money, but nothing like what I *could* have had to pay or what that doctor tried to make me believe I'd have to pay. Stupid woman. )

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[Collar_N_Cuffs]

The relationship between therapist and patient is so intimate, in a private sort of way. There is no knowing what the patient is relating. If the therapist cannot see through delusions, or has a treatment agenda of their own that is somewhat rigid, this can be a problem for sure. Is a second opinion worth pursuing? Would anyone be open to that?

Sounds like a difficult situation, I'm sorry.
Hang in there and try and let your frustration go. Whatever will happen, will happen. Stressing over it won't help! I know you know this, but hoping it will help to hear it from someone else

 

[gypsy*seer]

One of the most important (and most grounding) things that I've learned lately, is that you just can't fix everything.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[BiBunny]

No, no second opinion, no answering questions, any concern expressed results in meltdown.....that's my really part of the huge concern....I don't think its ANY of our business what goes on in therapy. I do think its our concern ( different word intentionally, different meaning meant) that things go worse in life.

I think you're right to be concerned.

As many Lit people know, I, ironically enough, got my bachelor's degree in psychology. Despite the fact that I went to a medium-sized, mostly unimpressive state school, we had (and I assume still have) one of the best behavioral analysis programs in the state.

All these years later, I still distinctly remember one thing that one of my professors--who was actually the head of the department at that time--told us. He said that if a therapist or psychologist couldn't help a patient within six weeks (assuming at least weekly visits, of course), then they wouldn't be able to help the patient at all.

He went on to clarify that he didn't mean "completely fix everything wrong with them." He didn't even necessarily mean "make a huge amount of progress in six weeks." He just meant that, if within six weeks, the psych professional couldn't make even the slightest bit of (positive!) progress, they'd never be able to help the patient in any meaningful way.

For some reason, that little tidbit's always stuck with me. A lot of times, I think that people believe that just talking about their problems makes them better. But if they were bad enough to drive you to see a therapist to start with, they're probably not going to go away just because you have a conversation about them once a week.

In order to improve, people have to actually do something, not just talk and ruminate. The therapist's job is to act as the catalyst, to provide the patient with the tools and motivation to take that leap into action. And, like Dr. P. said, if they're not able to do that in six weeks, it's probably not going to happen. And it doesn't necessarily even mean that the therapist is bad at what they do, just that their approach doesn't mesh well with what the patient needs. That kinda thing happens.

So, yeah, that was a really long-winded way of saying that just because a person can convince themselves that a therapist/psychologist is working out for them, it doesn't mean they actually are. People--me included--tend to confuse talking or thinking about something with actually doing it.

I wish I had some actual advice, instead of this kind of random tangent I just went off on, but the discussion just made me think of the six weeks business. I hope you can work something out, though.

 

[NOIRTRASH]

Absurd.

My MD collects her facts, I express my symptoms, and she prescribes treatment. If I cooperate I get better, if I sit on my ass little happens. Your perfesser acts like a psycho-magician not a professional. Unless its all a big mystery patients need to cooperate, and most don't.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[IrisAlthea]

You have helped bi bunny, you have helped me. Because I feel less bizarre in my instinct.

Ultimately......there is nothing I can do. GYpsy seer is wise: its maybe not my job. Besides.....I have a big business to attend to with the beam in my own eye, right? but, if I don't say it.......no one else will. Is it therefore my job as a good friend/ relative to show concern in my support? Its what friendship and love means to me I think. Support and sometimes supporting the unreasonable to the outside world, but not 'bullshitting' in private. Not giving bullshit, but cutting the crap while giving a cuddle.

Yes, I think it is better to be honest about being concerned, even if it might come with a cost.
In the end it will still be up to them what they do about it.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[FurryFury]

Gianbattista great job posting and leaving what you needed to get out there and work around. *HUGS*

 

[Collar_N_Cuffs]

My friend is in crisis, and she called me for help. If anyone can offer words of wisdom, they will be appreciated.

She went off her meds about a month ago, in an up swing and once again convinced that she didn't need them. She crashed and burned pretty quickly. They pulled her aside at work today and said they realize she is having problems, it's evident to everyone, and they are willing to work with her - half days, or whatever she needs.

She called me and said she thinks she should call her psychiatrist, because she feels like her brain doesn't have any electricity, and she is confused. But she doesn't want to go in the "loony bin", because she is afraid she will be labled as completely crazy and she will lose her job.

I did this;
Offered to go get her if she needed to be driven anywhere.
Encouraged her to call her psychiatrist if that's what she felt she needed to do.
Explained that the "loony bin" isn't necessarily a place where they tie you down and force medicate you any longer, and that, in fact, it was the best thing that ever happened to one of her family members if she would just think about it.
Asked her if she could get time off so she could deal with this away from the scrutiny of those at her work, and asked if she felt comfortable talking to her supervisor about the probability of keeping or losing her job.

I don't know what else to say to her. Anyone her e who can offer some advice to me, or for her?

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[IrisGardens]

I dated someone with mental illness and he had been seeing a therapist of some sort weekly since he was in first grade-- he was close to 50. I was pretty young and naive at the time and I decided that I'd not blame any issues on his condition since it would be (in my mind) too easy to manipulate him with it.

It turned out to be a disaster. He blamed everything that he did on his lack of medication or his condition. He had been married four times, and I found out that each wife had left him by basically coming up with a reason to be gone, then letting him know and deal with the fall out away from him. At first I thought that they were mean, then a friend said to me, "So many women cannot be wrong: he is rich. He wants you to call before work, at lunch, and after work and before bed. This is not healthy. See what happens if you don't want to spend your lunch hour talking to him." He panicked. I induced an anxiety attack for him. It was my fault, all my fault, how dare I.

I started to wonder how he could be seeing a therapist since he was 6-- almost 44 years when we met-- and he was still a basket of nerves. When we slept together he held on to me for dear life even in his sleep, his body molded to mine, down to his feet being under mine which kind of grossed me out. (I would later marry someone else have a baby do that with me, a preemie, but even after six months, that baby needed space!) I, too, had to do a disappearing act on him and my dad told me that he thought I was lucky that I didn't end up entombed in a glass case in his house.

At the time, my biggest reason for leaving was that I didn't want our marriage to be me, him, and his team of mental healthy professionals. Once I got away, I realized that I could breathe again. My posture changed.

I don't have a problem with people with mental health issues, but we need to be aware when we are dating them what our own boundaries are.

ETA: We need to have our own healthy boundaries no matter who we are dating, are friends with, or just interacting with people on any basis!

 

[MrHappy212]

First, listen to your friend and by that I mean really listen to her. So many people crash because they feel as if they have no one to talk to. Everyone needs to rant and rave once in a while.

Second, she would not be on medication if it was not needed. If they work for her then she should continue taking them. If not then she should see a doctor and get something that does.

Third, have a girls night out.

Fourth, offer to accompany her to the therapist.

Sometimes just being a friend is enough to help someone in need.


All of this depends on what kind of problem your friend has, some are easier to treat at home than they are at the doctor's office.

 

[BiBunny]

My friend is in crisis, and she called me for help. If anyone can offer words of wisdom, they will be appreciated.

She went off her meds about a month ago, in an up swing and once again convinced that she didn't need them. She crashed and burned pretty quickly. They pulled her aside at work today and said they realize she is having problems, it's evident to everyone, and they are willing to work with her - half days, or whatever she needs.

She called me and said she thinks she should call her psychiatrist, because she feels like her brain doesn't have any electricity, and she is confused. But she doesn't want to go in the "loony bin", because she is afraid she will be labled as completely crazy and she will lose her job.

I did this;
Offered to go get her if she needed to be driven anywhere.
Encouraged her to call her psychiatrist if that's what she felt she needed to do.
Explained that the "loony bin" isn't necessarily a place where they tie you down and force medicate you any longer, and that, in fact, it was the best thing that ever happened to one of her family members if she would just think about it.
Asked her if she could get time off so she could deal with this away from the scrutiny of those at her work, and asked if she felt comfortable talking to her supervisor about the probability of keeping or losing her job.

I don't know what else to say to her. Anyone her e who can offer some advice to me, or for her?

I have precisely zero useful advice because I'm pretty sure "knock her out with a heavy object and drag her unconscious ass to the doctor, whether she wants to go or not" is probably impractical and possibly illegal. But I'll be thinking of you, and I hope everything works out ok for both of you.


As for me, I'm in the middle of a massive house-cleaning spree. I have too much junk in too small a place, for one, and for another, I really haven't been doing much in the way of trying to keep things clean for quite some time. First, it was for mental reasons, then for physical ones, and then for just being overwhelmed by it all.

I have several things that I'm going to have the maintenance people come and fix while I'm out of town next week, and once that's done, I'm going to start dragging stuff out of closets and drawers and cabinets to get rid of some of it and reorganize the rest.

It's a monumental task for anyone, and it's even more monumental with this mystery illness I seem to have. But I'm just doing a little at a time, and I seem to be making slow progress.

So why am I posting this here? Partly because it just feels better not to have to trip over things every time I turn around and partly because I feel like, in some ways, that it's a symbolic throwing out of everything that once weighed me down. Like, there are lots of things I rarely think about anymore and that don't bother me (mentally and stuff-wise), but it's nice getting it physically out of my sight, too.

 

[Collar_N_Cuffs]

Ok, so I ended up asking her if she wanted to go be evaluated at a psychiatric facility, and she said yes. I took her, and they admitted her. I really, really hope she gets the help she needs there. I'm glad she has care and support for now. I hate to say it, but I'm not overly optimistic for the long run. I can admit that here. She is insisting she probably has a thyroid problem or has had a stroke. She is in total denial about being bipolar. I hope they help her accept her condition, if that will help her move on. She always insists she isn't "crazy", so she stops taking her meds, and then is shocked when she bottoms out. Grrrrrrrr! I want to see her get some insight into her own condition, but only if it helps bring her peace.

Elle - I hear what you are saying about her job situation. Unfortunately, it's almost a damned if you do, damned if you don't kind of thing It's highly dependent upon the higher ups at work.

 

[MrHappy212]

Being Bi polar does not make a person crazy, though it does mess with their heads a lot. Does her work have vacation days? And if so does she have any available?


Also check this out

http://www.webmd.com/bipolar-disorder/guide/what-is-bipolar-disorder


I'm not bi polar but I do suffer from mood swings and chronic sever depression. I'm not crazy either The key to dealing with episodes is having good friends who don't mind you crying on their shoulder when you need to, or a good sparing match when your upset and need to kick the crap out of something.

The reason so many people with bi polar disorder have trouble is because they are (or feel that they are) alone and unwanted. The best thing you can do for her is not to give up, check in on her and let her know you are there...even when she doesn't want you to be. Let her yell and rant, bitch and moan, hold her when she cries, push back when she pushes you away. I know that its asking a lot and most people wouldn't even bother...but just asking for help tells me that you have what it takes.

As for long term... that just depends on how much torture you can take.