Masturbation - Ourselves, Our Children

[curiositykitten]

OK, I'm just CURIOUS (it IS part of my name, after all). On the subject of masturbation, I am definitely an activist, but one who didn't begin to enjoy this opportunity until I reached my 40's! As a pre-teen, my mother found me asleep in bed with my underpants down and decided to make a big deal of telling me how OK this was but at the same time showing obvious extreme disapproval. So I soon decided since it felt good (not yet being aware of the years of abuse I had endured) that I would find a guy to do it for me and lost my virginity in the woods at the tender age of 13 (at church camp, no less). I'm wondering what other's experiences with masturbation might be.

Anyway, I have a teenage son and suspect that he has become active in self-induced pleasure and just wondered if any of you think it's a subject that needs to be addressed or just left alone? He talks to me pretty openly, has even asked how to use a condom so I explained it and gave him a few to try as he wished. Of course, we had the whole values & respect discussion as well.

Also, on the reverse, I have a young adult daughter (19) who still lives at home, has never had a relationship and is showing some interest in pornography (I had no idea there was such a thing as Anime porn!) and is questioning her sexual orientation primarily out of a need to feel loved by someone - anyone actually. Her maturity level is a little behind that of her peers and her self-esteem is zero. I have given her a copy of "Our Bodies, Ourselves" which is fairly objective and clear about numerous sexual topics. But in my previous search for "education" for myself, I read a wonderful eye-opening book called "Sex for One" by Betty Dodson. Should I pass it on to her or just leave it alone? I've even considered getting her a vibrator and giving it to her with the book because it's natural for her to have needs and she shouldn't have to live in eternal confusion. But then I think it might be entirely inappropriate. Maybe because of my own history, i assume she has needs which don't exist because she hasn't tried it yet?

I'd appreciate your comments while I consider this...

By the way, I'm a nurse, so I'm pretty open about talking with my kids about anything and everything so hopefully you won't find this quite so shocking.

 

[curiositykitten]

By the way, this is the FIRST thread I ever started, so please be gentle...

And if you don't believe I began this practice so late in life, just read my stories - they are all true (see profile for link.)

 

[Stella_Omega]

I'm right with you here, don't worry!

But I'm just about to turn in for the night... I'll answer more tomorrow...

 

[S-Des]

For me, I'm all for it!

Speaking as a guy (which is pretty much all I'm qualified to do), I'm pretty sure I wouldn't want to discuss this with my mom (actually, strike that . . . I'm REAL sure I wouldn't). Unless you're planning on discussing proper technique (which I'm pretty sure he's figured out already), I'd say leave it alone unless he asks. One thing you can do is buy some good lotion, then pretend not to notice if it goes "missing". You sound like you have a good relationship, so hopefully if he has questions he'll ask (and I'm assuming you talk to him about sex), so the rest should be private (or at least on him to begin any discussions).

BTW, if he's at least 13, then yeah . . . he is DEFINITELY masturbating. I started around 11. Now with the internet and easier access to risque magazines, he has no shortage of material to work off of.

 

[Huckleman2000]

By the way, this is the FIRST thread I ever started, so please be gentle...

It's a wonderful thread to start, I think.
As for your son, I'd reinforce the access to condoms. Maybe set up a drawer where he could pick them up, no questions asked (within reason...). I always tried to emphasize that with my son, but then he went off and lived with his mother since about 16 on, and now his last girlfriend gave him genital warts. As he says, they'd wind up doing it and then not cleaning up afterward, just going to sleep, and that's just all cool but what about "Hey, let's at least be a little bit responsible." For his mother, responsible is mostly about keeping the house spotless. He thinks, and I believe him, that she still thinks he's a virgin.

Yes, he's masturbating. Just don't try to draw too much attention to it, and keep reinforcing the importance of safe sex when he does decide to do it. There's only so much 'sex talk' that you can have with your kids before they get overwhelmed, so draw your line in the sand (so to speak) at safe sex, and hope that they'll talk to you about the rest when they feel they need to talk to someone. If his mother would've taken that stance, instead of directing (and believing) that a teenage boy home alone wasn't sexually active, well....

About your daughter, I'd definitely get her a vibe if I was a mother. Put it all into perspective right away.

 

[curiositykitten]

For me, I'm all for it!

One thing you can do is buy some good lotion, then pretend not to notice if it goes "missing".

BTW, if he's at least 13, then yeah . . . he is DEFINITELY masturbating. I started around 11. Now with the internet and easier access to risque magazines, he has no shortage of material to work off of.

Thanks - he's 15, which brings me to another question: is it normal that he now seems to enjoy extended hugs, especially when i'm braless (which is almost always at home)? It's completely innocent and a gesture of love 'cause we've always been affectionate, but I seem to notice his hugs getting tighter and longer and someone has put a bug in my ear that it may be something inappropriate. I'm large-busted and now he's 6 feet tall, so it's not like I'm smothering him with them like I did a couple years ago before he hit this growth spurt.

Next - any kind of lotion in particular? Does it need to be a lubricant type or just body lotion?

Finally - I did catch him looking at porn online awhile ago - just women's breasts mostly and we did have a talk about respecting women and internet safety and such. And i'm not crazy about those sights that seem to downoad cookies and things on my computer and mess it up. Hope I didn't screw up his mind with that. We joke around a lot and he's pretty open about things with me, so I don't think it was a problem.

 

[curiositykitten]

It's a wonderful thread to start, I think.

About your daughter, I'd definitely get her a vibe if I was a mother. Put it all into perspective right away.

Thanks for the encouragement. She is still a virgin, so do I explain how this might affect her at first? I'm talking about a simple beginner style that's not realistic in appearance. This one's my toughest case. Her dad would have had a fit! He thought it was horrible that I got toys myself, which is strange 'cause when we were together, he always wanted me to touch myself and I never would because of the history. Probably one of those many control issues.

 

[alyxen]

I would not have wanted to talk about masturbation with either of my parents. My step-mom worked in an OBGYN office, so info about sex in general was not an issue. Personally never did the whole lotion thing, but that is probably a matter of technique more than anything else. I can't speak for the daughter, but I don't think I would have wanted my parents involved in my masturbation in any way, shape, or form. Maybe girls are different (and yes, I KNOW girls are different...bah you know what I mean!)

I think if you ensure they know they can come to you with questions you are doing just fine!

 

[sassypeach]

Thanks for the encouragement. She is still a virgin, so do I explain how this might affect her at first? I'm talking about a simple beginner style that's not realistic in appearance. This one's my toughest case. Her dad would have had a fit! He thought it was horrible that I got toys myself, which is strange 'cause when we were together, he always wanted me to touch myself and I never would because of the history. Probably one of those many control issues.

I'm not sure how a vibrator and a book entitled sex for one, will help with a girl's self esteem issues, do you think her self-esteem is linked directly to her sexual orientation or her being a virgin? Is she feeling pressure? I don't see how your needs translate into her's.
It seems like a overly direct approach to someone who might be exploring their sexuality. Giving her the book and the toy, why?

 

[curiositykitten]

...do you think her self-esteem is linked directly to her sexual orientation or her being a virgin? Is she feeling pressure? ...It seems like a overly direct approach to someone who might be exploring their sexuality.

That's why I decided to post this thread - I'm truly torn. Her self-esteem issues arise from being very overweight, which we are trying to address as well, and from the fact that she's so eager to be in a relationship - had actually set it up with a guy acquaintance (not even a close one) to have sex just to see what it was like and then came to me worrieed about her decision. She does have a lot of peer pressure from girlfriends. She also tells me about a lot of explicit dreams she's having and doesn't understand why. She's never even been on a date but her Anime porn interest has also led to some confusion. She wants so badly to be in a relationship - and wants to get married and have a baby (probably to feel like she has that unconditional love which is the wrong reason entirely.) I want to find some way to help alleviate her confusion and dissatisfaction. Appreciate your input! I want to hear both sides!

 

[whalee]

The issue of hugging with your son brings to mind myself at about 13/14. I found myself pressing my hips to my mom when we'd hug in the morning. Looking back it was just young male curiosity as my sexuality was just awakened at about that time. Never been that close to the opposite sex except for my mother...like most boys. Was not a big thing...went away...nothing happened. Something easily controlled by you. I'm sure you never forget, you're the parent and in control. Don't think attention needs to be drawn to it.

 

[theMaven]

Considering her situation, I'd say the book and a vibrator would be a good idea. It may help boost her confidence level and keep her from venturing into the abusive boyfriend realm. Women with self-esteem issues often attract the wrong type of man, ones whose only interests are using your daughter to satisfy their needs and then tossing her aside when their relationship is no longer convenient/beneficial for him.

And your daughter needs to understand that she's still young, and there's many more productive things she could focus on in her life: getting herself fit (physically, mentally and spiritually) finding a career (be it an actual job, occupational training, or college) getting her own place. These things will help her become self-sufficient, which will add a tremendous boost to her ego. It seems she needs to learn to understand that there's more to life than men and sex, and her value as a human being isn't equated with how much "experience" she has or if she's in a relationship or not.

When she's ready, the right man (or woman) will come along. And to attract the best possible mate, she should be at her own personal best. Mutual love, respect and understanding is the only way a relationship will survive, and in her current state, I'm not sure she thinks she's worth it.

I know that's the way I felt at her age . . .

But, you're obviously a good parent who only wants to do what's best for her kids, and I'm sure with your guidance and support, they'll both be fine

 

[Guest]

Two Christmases ago, my wife and I suprised the hell out of her then-19-year-old daughter (who still lives with us, dammit) by giving her a vibrator and lube as a present.

Why? She too was suffering from self-esteem issues and shacking up with some fairly predatory and low-level scum just to avoid being alone. My thinking (I confess, it was my idea) was that a better means of relieving her sexual tension would allow her to think more clearly about who she hooked up with, and why.

Long story short, it seems to have helped, aided by a few faltering signs of maturity. She's been far more selective in her relationships and generally more stable emotionally. She's actually in a job now that she enjoys and seems to take some pride in.

How well this anecdote will apply to your situation I can't judge, but perhaps your daughter will have similar results.

 

[curiositykitten]

Considering her situation, I'd say the book and a vibrator would be a good idea. It may help boost her confidence level and keep her from venturing into the abusive boyfriend realm. ......
.....there's many more productive things she could focus on in her life: getting herself fit (physically, mentally and spiritually) finding a career (be it an actual job, occupational training, or college) getting her own place. ......
.....When she's ready, the right man (or woman) will come along. And to attract the best possible mate, she should be at her own personal best. Mutual love, respect and understanding is the only way a relationship will survive, and in her current state, I'm not sure she thinks she's worth it.

THANKS for your thoughts! You're exactly right about the abusive thing. The one "boyfriend" she had early in high school was abusive and then another friend from school that she liked only kept putting her down all the time. I'll use your comment about her being ready. She actually has flunked out of college this year, more from lack of maturaity and ability to handle it on her own yet than anything. So she's starting a tech school course in the fall to learn a good trade. And she's not had a job, so will be working for the summer at a children's camp. You have a very keen sense of awareness and understanding - I appreciate your input!

 

[curiositykitten]

Two Christmases ago, my wife and I suprised the hell out of her then-19-year-old daughter (who still lives with us, dammit) by giving her a vibrator and lube as a present.

Long story short, it seems to have helped, aided by a few faltering signs of maturity. She's been far more selective in her relationships and generally more stable emotionally.

How well this anecdote will apply to your situation I can't judge, but perhaps your daughter will have similar results.

Sounds right on target - nice to hear an actual similar situation. Thanks for sharing this with me - I knew I was asking this question in the right place!

 

[curiositykitten]

The issue of hugging ..... Don't think attention needs to be drawn to it.

That's how I felt, but my friend had kinda made me concerned. I know it's all completely innocent and maybe he is experienceing some normal feelings, but as long as that's as far as it goes, I see no sense in changing. After all, we all still need hugs, touch and signs of affection! Thanks for your reply!

 

[NoJo]

I have to say curiositykitten, that you have a whole BUNCH of issues yourself. Did I read your first post right about having been abused? It was not very clear to me.

I rarely give advice to people I don't know, but I'd suggest

1. BACK OFF from both your kids, esp. the 15 Y/O, while you

2. REALLY GET TO GRIPS with how you feel about

Parental abuse
Abusive Boyfreinds
Lesbianism
Masturbation
Your own feelings towards your son

 

[NoJo]

Note: When I say "back off" -- I DON'T mean to stop hugging and kissing, and generally being a Mom. I mean, back off trying to get involved in their sexual issues. Maybe they need to be resolved by other people than you -- or rather, with help from outside of the family.

I CANNOT believe that your daughter is the way she is without good reason. Try to understand that reason.

 

[logophile]

This is a great thread, Curious. Thank you for starting it.

OK, your son first. I agree with others that at 15, it's likely he's already masturbating. I think Des's idea of getting him some good lotion is brilliant. I would suggest getting him a few personal care things and putting that in there. Does he shave yet? You could try a new toothbrush, maybe some shaving creme and some lotion. If there are things he likes, throw one or two things in with the package. Make it no big deal and just give him the bag from Target. I had a friend once who found her son's porn collection and replaced it with several magazines featuring natural (no-implants, no shaved pubis) women. That seemed like it took things a step too far. But how many young men masturbated to pictures in National Geographic because it was already in the house. I don't know your current living situation, but there's always the possibility of "hiding" some movies, magazines or books around where he can find them. Might protect your computer a little at least.

And then your son. I don't think there's any problem whatsoever with buying a wonderful book like Sex For One and a starter vibe for a 19 year old. I think it's an especially good idea in a situation like your daughter's. Not only would it relieve her sexual energy, it might give her a beginning in true "self love" that will extend beyond loving her physical self into truly loving her whole self. I think it's great that you're working with her to improve her total image of herself and this is one way to do that. Being sex-positive in front of her (which it sounds like you're doing) is an excellent way to help her become sex-positive and learn what that there's nothing to be ashamed of, even if a person is overweight or feels otherwise unattractive.

Good on you, Curious!

 

[NoJo]

All the advice I've seen smacks of the well-meaning but inept Dad in American Pie. Adolescence is a time to let the kids know you're there for them, and to prevent them going off the rails, but basically parents need to let them do the figgerin' themselves.

Single parents (of both sexes) find that hard sometimes.

 

[logophile]

All the advice I've seen smacks of the well-meaning but inept Dad in American Pie. Adolescence is a time to let the kids know you're there for them, and to prevent them going off the rails, but basically parents need to let them do the figgerin' themselves.

Single parents (of both sexes) find that hard sometimes.

I don't agree with you on this, Joe. I don't think we stop being parents when our kids reach a magical age (13, 15, 17). If all the stars align, they need us less and less and we back off as they pull away. But Curious's kids haven't pulled away. They are both discussing their sexuality with her, meaning that they want (on some level) to have their mother's guidance.

With her son, she could probably safely let him go for now because he's simply looking at some internet porn and masturbating. But it doesn't hurt to help him be sex-positive, either. If you want your kids to grow up never doubting that masturbation is good and healthy and positive, you can't not do anything! Society will fuck their heads up about it and it can take years to shed the shame (OMG - I'm such a pervert - I masturbate several times a day) and move through it. Why let those layers of crap build up on your kid when it doesn't have to.

And with the daughter - well, if you've ever stood at the precipice with a daughter who might well fall in, you must understand that this is a moment which can't be gotten back. The way Curious has described her daughter tells us that she's almost to make-it or break-it time. She's already had one abusive boyfriend and is desperate for intimate attention from someone, anyone. Teaching her how to love and respect herself is crucial, right now.

That's part of our jobs as parents and you don't just get to shrug it off because you think it would have been uncomfortable for you to talk to your parents or because you know it would have been unpleasant to talk to your own kids about it. Parenting teens is about 60% uncomfortable/unpleasant. It doesn't mean it doesn't have to be done. Letting kids find their own way means raising another generation of people with sexual hang-ups and low self-esteem which perpetuates the cycle of a civilization of people who are making bad relationship decisions and trying to fill the void in their lives with more items, more things while not connecting with the people around them. I look at the very big picture in my parenting, and it's working for me so far.

YMMV.

 

[jomar]

I would not have wanted my parents involved in any way in my self-sex life. It could easily be mortifying to a teen, though it also depends on how open about everything the family is.

With your son I think it's enough to just allow it to happen and if the subject comes up, endorse it. Otherwise, look the other way.

With your daughter...the things you have said suggest to me she could benefit from counseling.

Best wishes to you all.

 

[Pure]

curiosity, [slightly revised]

i think you're somewhat on track in your intent, but some means you're thinking of, and some suggestions by others sound to me intrusive, such as supplying lotion for jack off. surely your son will figure his favorite lube.

i think the books for daughter are fine, including dodgson. but i'd leave vibrator purchase, the details and implementation to her.

both kids are hardly repressed. they do need info and understanding, but also privacy.

i'm not sure that porn material is that useful or informative (it's fantasy), though it may be exciting.

 

[OhMissScarlett]

That's why I decided to post this thread - I'm truly torn. Her self-esteem issues arise from being very overweight, which we are trying to address as well, and from the fact that she's so eager to be in a relationship - had actually set it up with a guy acquaintance (not even a close one) to have sex just to see what it was like and then came to me worrieed about her decision. She does have a lot of peer pressure from girlfriends. She also tells me about a lot of explicit dreams she's having and doesn't understand why. She's never even been on a date but her Anime porn interest has also led to some confusion. She wants so badly to be in a relationship - and wants to get married and have a baby (probably to feel like she has that unconditional love which is the wrong reason entirely.) I want to find some way to help alleviate her confusion and dissatisfaction. Appreciate your input! I want to hear both sides!

Actually, speaking from experience, I think your idea about the book and the vibrator is a good idea. At the same age, I was very confused about my body and very shameful about the idea of masturbation, even though my parents were very open with me. Not finding out how to please myself first, led to years of bad sex, failed relationships, and promiscuity. I was always looking for the perfect lover who was going to satisfy my every need. Well, that was me, but it took me a long time to figure it out.

 

[mismused]

delete