Lion or Pussycat?

[YinandYang]

I would like to know your views on the different personalities of people who put themselves into a category (ie Dom/me/ Sub) and how it affects a relationship.

For example, is a sub who is wilful, strong minded, any different to a Sub who is Meek, or not strong willed. Is there a challenge there, or on the opposite side is there no challenge? Which one is more exciting? Or does it not make a difference? Would it affect the way the Sub was treated? And what would happen when total submission is found, after months of 'training'? Is the training more important than the result?

I realise this is an individual thing, but would be interested to read how people feel about the Lion or the Pussycat?

 

[Kajira Callista]

hmmmm I kinda see it this way.
submissive= lion (or insert your fav here)
Dominant= lion tamer

that applies to me at least, i dont know if it does for everyone. I am not the easiest person to handle, i have a wicked temper and i tend to be unfocused very often. When a Dominant steps into my life, in any way those things change for me somehow.

 

[catalina_francisco]

hmmmm I kinda see it this way.
submissive= lion (or insert your fav here)
Dominant= lion tamer

LOL, perfect analogy KC. Of course it takes a brave and strong Dominant to step into the lion's cage, but we wouldn't have it any other way.

Catalina

 

[shy slave]

hmmmm I kinda see it this way.
submissive= lion (or insert your fav here)
Dominant= lion tamer

that applies to me at least, i dont know if it does for everyone. I am not the easiest person to handle, i have a wicked temper and i tend to be unfocused very often. When a Dominant steps into my life, in any way those things change for me somehow.

For me, KC response sums it up well.

Not sure if I am more of less of a lion than KC, I like to anaylse and this leads to more and more damn questions. Making me only focus on topics that have seized my interest .
Having a Dom gives a balance to work/play aspects, broadening my interest base.
That said, I too have a difficult temper at times, and have been told many, many times I am not a Sub *sigh*
What they mean is I am not the sub for them .
If a Dom can capture my mind then I will follow.
I have yet to be put in a position whereby the demand froma Dom is not a hard limit but equally not on my mental list of things i am willing to do.
That will test my submission in terms of training.
Yinandyang~your question 'is the training more important then the result' is and interesting one. Looking forward to hearing PYL views on that.

 

[catalina_francisco]

And what would happen when total submission is found, after months of 'training'? Is the training more important than the result?

I realise this is an individual thing, but would be interested to read how people feel about the Lion or the Pussycat?

I think from my experience, many Dominants do not specifically want to reach a point of total submission as in no more training. Seems it is the challenge of training and challenging the submission which makes it interesting for both sides, so much so that once a lesson has been learned, it can be altered down the track to bring about a need to relearn. Perfection is a fantasy, doubly so for a D/s union where challenges are welcomed to focus heavily on that submission and challenge it's foundation. It is not so much about creating a SAM but in demonstrating that submission means adhering to that which the Dominant wants and needs in any given moment, even if that is just to keep you on your toes and thinking.

Catalina

 

[schmerzgarten]

In contrast....

A good dog is inherently submissive to his/her owner and well trained. However, as the story of a wonderful ole seeing eye dog exemplifies...180 lbs of solid German Shepard named Jack...threaten the owner and the best behaved of puppies might give you to know a nice job, a cool wardrobe, and a volvo won't help you when nature comes a callin'. Submission does not necessitate weakness, only a desired relationship.

 

[sunfox]

A good dog is inherently submissive to his/her owner and well trained. However, as the story of a wonderful ole seeing eye dog exemplifies...180 lbs of solid German Shepard named Jack...threaten the owner and the best behaved of puppies might give you to know a nice job, a cool wardrobe, and a volvo won't help you when nature comes a callin'. Submission does not necessitate weakness, only a desired relationship.

*slinks in to hijack briefly*

A good dog is rarely submissive.. just obedient. My best working dogs are the ones that are highly independently thinking partners, not subservient, attention seeking omega personalities. I could get a lab if I wanted that. But I won't get started on my lab-dislike.

*hijack over* *slinks back out all sneaky-like*

 

[schmerzgarten]

how dare you!!!!! *L*

I love German Shepard’s but I'll not be a party to the disparaging of labs. They come in two flavors, adorable and smart and handicapped. *L* And yes, I believe submissives come in the same two flavors, unfortunately I've been both. *kicks self*

 

[jdmct]

yinandyang

You did start a "challenge sub" thread after all,you naughty girl.

Well done,

James

 

[DarkLadyOfDeath]

KC put it about perfect in my mind. What good is a master if they don't have to do anything? If the sub just "rolls over and takes it" .. and what good does that make you a sub? I for one believe nothing worth haveing is freely or easily given/taken. as for "training" one compleately.. It's a nice idea or concept but the reality of it is slim to none.. at least in my own views and outlooks. I'm sure as always their are exceptions to this rule but people themselves are constantly changeing in the world around them even as the world itself changes. Total submission is nice idea but I think a far fetched concept if one applied it to reality. Because no matter what is said,postures used,feelings expressed you can never know truely whats in anothers soul/heart/mind.

The lion or the pussycat?

I am both yet neither.

Oh and the result is always more important then the training. The "training" differes little.. the results, Well they could be anything. To use teh dog reference. You could train 6 dogs with the same technique, And you will get 6 different dogs of varying degrees of "obediance" ... Thus it is the dogs not the training method that make the entire experiance unique and therefore more fulfilling in my own mind.

 

[YinandYang]

You did start a "challenge sub" thread after all,you naughty girl.

Well done,

James

Well, it was on my mind...and kind of confused me a bit

 

[YinandYang]

Total submission is nice idea but I think a far fetched concept if one applied it to reality. Because no matter what is said,postures used,feelings expressed you can never know truely whats in anothers
soul/heart/mind.

Thankyou, I was hoping to hear something like that! It makes sense that people are different it would be wrong to set guidlines and then expect the general consensus be that the rules never change. Give and take on both parts then. I suppose I questioned it because I can be a fiery person, although my SO says he likes to see that contempt in my eyes sometimes, makes him work harder (his words not mine lol)

 

[YinandYang]

When a Dominant steps into my life, in any way those things change for me somehow.

KC Thats what I am starting to see in me, and thats why I questioned it, Thankyou

 

[YinandYang]

Of course it takes a brave and strong Dominant to step into the lion's cage, but we wouldn't have it any other way. Catalina

And that kind of adds fuel to their own power doesn't it?

 

[YinandYang]

And yes, I believe submissives come in the same two flavors, unfortunately I've been both. *kicks self*

And its good to test the waters so to speak

 

[sunfox]

I love German Shepard’s but I'll not be a party to the disparaging of labs. They come in two flavors, adorable and smart and handicapped. *L* And yes, I believe submissives come in the same two flavors, unfortunately I've been both. *kicks self*

Pfft.. labs are either handicapped, or less handicapped. *grins*

I only have one german shepherd currently, but they're a favorite.

I think submissives come in about a hundred flavors... personally, I'm of the 'poisonous lionfish' flavor.

 

[catalina_francisco]

And that kind of adds fuel to their own power doesn't it?

Often yes, as long as they are aware of how to handle it.

Catalina

 

[YinandYang]

My apologies for posting the info above on seperate posts...but I havent worked out how to do multiple quotes yet

 

[TaintedB]

For example, is a sub who is wilful, strong minded, any different to a Sub who is Meek, or not strong willed. Is there a challenge there, or on the opposite side is there no challenge? Which one is more exciting? Or does it not make a difference? Would it affect the way the Sub was treated? And what would happen when total submission is found, after months of 'training'? Is the training more important than the result?

I think most of us (submissives) are both. Somtimes feeling and acting one way, sometimes the other. Submissives can _appear_ to have comparatively strong wills, I think, because we are seen in the contexts of our relationships. What would be perfectly normal attitudes and behavior in a vanilla or dominant woman is often naughty or willful when indugled in by a submissive in a control relationship. We're held to a different standard in that regard. Plus, it's good not to forget that submitting isn't easy. We aren't brought up to do it, and being that way 100% of the time doesn't come naturally for most of us. It has to be learned and also adjusted to.

With that said, I've had the pleasure of knowing a number of submissives who are both strong-willed and very obedient at the same time. I know, it sounds like a contradiction. What I mean is that their willfulness (not sure if that is the right word--maybe liveliness or verve) makes them question things a lot and challenge their dominants in interesting ways, but when it comes to the bottom line, they knuckle down and obey. I say it's been a pleasure to know them because I think they are the most interesting type of submissive.