Late Night TV and the Quality of Life

[dr_mabeuse]

I was up late last night.

A news show was interviewing people about important issues in the upcoming election: healthcare -- a single mother who ran up almost $100,000 in medical bills for a sick child because she didn't have insurance. She declared bankruptcy.

The sub-prime mortgage meltdown: a middle-aged woman who was forced to live in her SUV for 3 months with her two dogs when she lost her house. Her town has designated a special parking lot for people who have to live in their cars.

On another station, a video of 6 or 8 teen-aged girls beating a 16 year-old because she'd said bad things about them on Facebook. They'd invited her to sleep over, then locked her in the house and took turns beating her all night and videotaped it to put on YouTube. The girl was hysterical. They wouldn't show her face, it was blocked out with a white circle as they beat her. I turned it off.

There was an infomercial for this new stuff called Blox. You put it in the wash and it stain-proofs your clothes so stains run right off. I mean, right off. It like turns your clothes to plastic. Who wants to go around dressed in plastic?

I was sitting there thinking about our soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan, fighting to "preserve our way of life". Giving their lives and limbs for this. Now it's no secret that I suffer from depression, but even so, sometimes I have to wonder. Is this a civilization worth preserving? Is this a way of life worth exporting? Worth bragging about? Is our quality of life all that great, worrying about money all the time, locking girls in houses and beating them, developing idiotic consumer products like Blox? Is this the way people are meant to live?

 

[Katyusha]

I was sitting there thinking about our soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan, fighting to "preserve our way of life". Giving their lives and limbs for this. Now it's no secret that I suffer from depression, but even so, sometimes I have to wonder. Is this a civilization worth preserving? Is this a way of life worth exporting? Worth bragging about? Is our quality of life all that great, worrying about money all the time, locking girls in houses and beating them, developing idiotic consumer products like Blox? Is this the way people are meant to live?

We live in an instant-gratification society here. Products like Blox get developed because people increasingly refuse to learn ways to get stains out of clothing. Life would be so much easier if we didn't have to worry about stains to begin with. All of life would be so much easier if...

Did you ever see Wall*E? It makes a good point; the corporation that built Wall*E as well as the spaceship that's housing humans and all the wonderful technology at their fingertips that's supposed to make life easier just makes them impossibly lazy, fat, and unbelievably weak. We're getting lazier and lazier as a society; we want everything now and we want it done for us. Who wants to go through the hassle of making a paste out of water, Tri-Zyme and Oxy-Clean, spreading it on a stain, letting it sit for an hour, and THEN washing the garment, nevermind all the other stained garments that they have to do this with, when all they have to do is put an additive in with each load of laundry that stain-proofs everything? It's ridiculous.

Sometimes I feel the same way you do. What is it that we're trying to preserve, and why are we trying to preserve it? It's getting worse, not better. Our own lifestyles are killing us, and we're proud of it.

 

[tickledkitty]

Doc, There have been bullies and financial difficulties and political unrest and even stupid inventions forever. We just see it more now. We're always plugged in somewhere. Used to be, people had to wait weeks or even months for news. Now we see it as it's happening.

Maybe there's more of it now because there are more people in the world, but I don't think that makes us unworthy of preservation. You weren't seeing any of the good in the world, and I think there's lots more of that. Let's face it, that sort of stuff doesn't make for good ratings, and late-night TV isn't exactly quality entertainment anyway.

 

[3113]

Maybe there's more of it now because there are more people in the world, but I don't think that makes us unworthy of preservation.

He didn't say that we humans weren't worth preserving, he asked if the American way of life was worth preserving and it is a valid question. If we're trying to forcably spread it, trying to protect it as well then we'd better be able to defend our country and philosophy as a good one.

And that doesn't mean a root philosophy of "Democracy and Freedom" that comes form a time when we were the beacon of good in the world. It means now. What we believe and do right now.

Your point that what he's observing isn't new--to us or to the U.S.A. is a good one. Such is the baser part of human nature. But what's missing is whether there are other ways of life and philosophy in this world that are more worthy of exporting and protecting than this. Ones that do better in creating better people and better lives for those people in general. Ones that reward their better selves rather than encouraging and rewarding their baser natures.

 

[tickledkitty]

I knew what he meant. The "us" I was referring to was Americans.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I'm an amateur historian. I collect books and articles from the 19th Century. Plus I'm old enough to have heard tales from people who lived in the 19th Century, and I have my own memories of the 50s.

In 1850 it was quite possible to be murdered by religious zealots, bandits, wild animals, Indians, and escaped slaves. Ordinary people were walking ATM's for the destitute.

 

[3113]

I knew what he meant. The "us" I was referring to was Americans.

Again, granted, but it's more American philosophy than Americans as a people. You're very right that there are always heroes and villains in any given culture and always have been--those who will give up their seat on a bus to the old woman and those who won't--but are the values of that culture, in general, worth exporting and maintaining? We have to grant that American cultural values, at present, do reward those who have the most and scream the loudest, and tend to ignore or look down on those who don't have much or can't shout over others.

 

[Corylea]

Yesterday, six billion people went about their business, and nothing interesting happened to them. They went to work, did their jobs, came home, ate dinner, hung out with their families, and went to bed. They watched TV or danced or played cards or told stories. They went on dates with exciting new people or hung out with well-loved old people. They threw parties, went to parties, made movies, went to movies. They mowed the lawn, went to church/temple/mosque/whatever, learned something new, taught something new, painted pictures, went shopping, cleaned their houses, washed their clothes, walked the dog, petted the cat, combed the llama.

And you won't see any of it on the news, because normal people going about their normal lives isn't considered news.

Today I had a normal life, and nothing bad happened.

Maybe we should start a thread where we can each say that.

 

[cantdog]

Again, granted, but it's more American philosophy than Americans as a people. You're very right that there are always heroes and villains in any given culture and always have been--those who will give up their seat on a bus to the old woman and those who won't--but are the values of that culture, in general, worth exporting and maintaining? We have to grant that American cultural values, at present, do reward those who have the most and scream the loudest, and tend to ignore or look down on those who don't have much or can't shout over others.

To act morally is not to bargain. You do a good thing without asking for reciprocity, and you do it because you are keeping an oath to yourself.

You do it one by one. Hungry people? Feed one. Vulnerable people? Shelter one.

One by one. You won't be alone long.

A country can do the same. It won't, much, for a time, because we don't run this place, the owners do. We have to deal with the current owners, the ones making the decisions, if we want to make a good way to live.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

3113's right. When we talk about our "way of life", just what are we talking about that's so fucking great? Where I live, the traffic's just awful, TV sucks, we've got this economic meltdown, people working two dead-end jobs to try and make ends meet, the two political parties at each other's throats, more people in jail than any other nation on earth, more stress than any other culture in the world, anorexic kids cutting themselves with razor blades, an impossible health care system, degraded environment, the middle class losing ground while the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and things generally going from bad to worse.

And yet this is the way of life we want to defend to the death and export to the rest of the world? We hold ourselves up as an example of the way people should want to live?

Hey, you know, in some cultures people still live in big, extended families and sit around and eat together and have time for each other. They have time to screw around and be kind and sleep late and plant gardens and do things like that. And yet we're going to tell them how they should live? Where do we get off?

 

[Corylea]

Hey, you know, in some cultures people still live in big, extended families and sit around and eat together and have time for each other. They have time to screw around and be kind and sleep late and plant gardens and do things like that. And yet we're going to tell them how they should live? Where do we get off?

I think it's precisely because so many of us have a crisis of confidence in the American way of doing things that the idiots who run the government are trying to spread our way around the world. If you're the best and everybody knows it, you don't have to proselytize -- people will come to you and ask to be included. If you're not the best, you want to bolster your confidence that you're doing the right thing by recruiting everybody else to do it, too.

I've seen this happen a lot on the individual level, and I see no reason why it can't happen on a national level, as well.

Yes, it sucks.

 

[cantdog]

Minding your own business isn't much help, a lot of the time, unless you're really radical about it, because the money tells you what your business is. That's what power consists of. The more people who get up in the morning and go do something because you tell them to, the more you may say you have power.

Just going about your business gives them all the leeway they need. You are supposed to be in charge; if you abdicate, you can't wonder that others, more motivated, have taken the reins you let drop.

 

[voluptuary_manque]

Yesterday, six billion people went about their business, and nothing interesting happened to them. They went to work, did their jobs, came home, ate dinner, hung out with their families, and went to bed. They watched TV or danced or played cards or told stories. They went on dates with exciting new people or hung out with well-loved old people. They threw parties, went to parties, made movies, went to movies. They mowed the lawn, went to church/temple/mosque/whatever, learned something new, taught something new, painted pictures, went shopping, cleaned their houses, washed their clothes, walked the dog, petted the cat, combed the llama.

And you won't see any of it on the news, because normal people going about their normal lives isn't considered news.

Today I had a normal life, and nothing bad happened.

Maybe we should start a thread where we can each say that.

I'll join.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

...

And yet this is the way of life we want to defend to the death and export to the rest of the world? We hold ourselves up as an example of the way people should want to live?

...

Today I lived free. I was free to do as I please. I didn't not have to worship a god if I did not want too. I didn't not have to show anyone papers to go somewhere. Today I didn't have to go anywhere I didn't want too. I did not have to watch what I said to friends. Today I could bitch about the government, the state of the union, the state of affairs of this country of ours without worry about persecution. Today I lived free.

 

[rgraham666]

Hey, you know, in some cultures people still live in big, extended families and sit around and eat together and have time for each other. They have time to screw around and be kind and sleep late and plant gardens and do things like that. And yet we're going to tell them how they should live? Where do we get off?

Misery loves company.

 

[voluptuary_manque]

Hey, you know, in some cultures people still live in big, extended families and sit around and eat together and have time for each other. They have time to screw around and be kind and sleep late and plant gardens and do things like that. And yet we're going to tell them how they should live? Where do we get off?

Gosh, I really hate to break into all this Modernist Angst, (it's all so touching, yanno) but those of us who have chosen to do so still do. And, yes, I live here.

 

[trysail]

Doc,
Every time I start to think humanity hasn't made any progress, I re-read William Manchester's A World Lit Only By Fire: The Medieval Mind and The Renaissance.

It's not only curative, it's also prophylactic.

P.S., don't watch television— it's bad for you.

 

[voluptuary_manque]

Doc,
Every time I start to think humanity hasn't made any progress, I re-read William Manchester's A World Lit Only By Fire: The Medieval Mind and The Renaissance.

It's not only curative, it's also prophylactic.

P.S., don't watch television— it's bad for you.

Amen. Is a fact. People who watch more that six hours of commercial television a week think the world is a far more dangerous and miserable place than can be supported by objective evidence.

 

[SeaCat]

3113's right. When we talk about our "way of life", just what are we talking about that's so fucking great? Where I live, the traffic's just awful, TV sucks, we've got this economic meltdown, people working two dead-end jobs to try and make ends meet, the two political parties at each other's throats, more people in jail than any other nation on earth, more stress than any other culture in the world, anorexic kids cutting themselves with razor blades, an impossible health care system, degraded environment, the middle class losing ground while the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and things generally going from bad to worse.

And yet this is the way of life we want to defend to the death and export to the rest of the world? We hold ourselves up as an example of the way people should want to live?

Hey, you know, in some cultures people still live in big, extended families and sit around and eat together and have time for each other. They have time to screw around and be kind and sleep late and plant gardens and do things like that. And yet we're going to tell them how they should live? Where do we get off?

Doc,

When we talk about our way of life we aren't talking about what you are seeing. Yes these things do happen, but life isn't all Jerry Springer or Maury.

The news reports that which sells. What sells isn't the good, it's the bad. (I have my own theory about this by the way.)

That which is good about our country is rarely reported because no-one wants to hear about it. They live it on a daily basis.

Cat

 

[3113]

Gosh, I really hate to break into all this Modernist Angst, (it's all so touching, yanno) but those of us who have chosen to do so still do.

Still do what? Tell people in other countries how to live?

I'm glad to hear you don't suffer from depression and can easily dismiss those who do as going through "modern angst." Which is to say, I know you're aspie, VM; so am I, so I feel it all right to remind you that, now and then, we must try not to be lazy and make use of those lessons we've been taking in how to pass as human beings rather than jerks.

 

[3113]

Today I lived free. I was free to do as I please. I didn't not have to worship a god if I did not want too. I didn't not have to show anyone papers to go somewhere. Today I didn't have to go anywhere I didn't want too. I did not have to watch what I said to friends. Today I could bitch about the government, the state of the union, the state of affairs of this country of ours without worry about persecution. Today I lived free.

That's very nice, Zeb. Unfortunately, when we export our values, meaning take down governments and replace them with our hand picked leaders, we most often do not put in leaders who are going to allow their people to live free. History shows that, again and again, we pick leaders who are in agreement with what is best for the U.S. economy, not what is best for the people of that nation, even given that what is best is living free.

We cannot argue, for example, for free elections and then help overthrow freely elected leaders because their politics don't favor U.S. interests.

So it's very nice to know that you're living free, or think you are, but there are some of us who aren't living so free in this country, and even if we were, "Freedom" is not one of the American values that Dr. M. feels we're exporting to other countries, nor one that we, ourselves, value near enough in this current day and age. If we did, why would so many want to make laws restricting homosexuals from marrying each other?

 

[voluptuary_manque]

Still do what? Tell people in other countries how to live?

I'm glad to hear you don't suffer from depression and can easily dismiss those who do as going through "modern angst." Which is to say, I know you're aspie, VM; so am I, so I feel it all right to remind you that, now and then, we must try not to be lazy and make use of those lessons we've been taking in how to pass as human beings rather than jerks.

What I meant was that some of us still live in extended families, plant gardens, and such like.

I do not believe that we can export what we are. It would take a very long history lesson to explain why and for many it would seem to be unholy politically incorrect so I will forbear. Okay?

 

[jomar]

3113's right. When we talk about our "way of life", just what are we talking about that's so fucking great? Where I live, the traffic's just awful, TV sucks, we've got this economic meltdown, people working two dead-end jobs to try and make ends meet, the two political parties at each other's throats, more people in jail than any other nation on earth, more stress than any other culture in the world, anorexic kids cutting themselves with razor blades, an impossible health care system, degraded environment, the middle class losing ground while the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and things generally going from bad to worse.

And yet this is the way of life we want to defend to the death and export to the rest of the world? We hold ourselves up as an example of the way people should want to live?

Hey, you know, in some cultures people still live in big, extended families and sit around and eat together and have time for each other. They have time to screw around and be kind and sleep late and plant gardens and do things like that. And yet we're going to tell them how they should live? Where do we get off?

Doc, where I live all this is going on. But we've also go kids playing sports and parents working hard but watching and cheering them on and keeping their mouths shut about the refs, kids interested in school and getting good grades, people volunteering for a wide variety of causes, neighbors helping each other out without thought or need, a community pitching in and mowing city parks because the gas budget is going to fire and police, a city trying to do the best for its citizens.

What I see,Doc, is the glass not only half full, but, on the local level, people trying to fill it as fast as they can because they're happy to do so.

I see people fucking off on weekends and not being engaged in a frenzy of activity (unless their kid is on a travel soccer team). I see people valuing eating together as a family and attending family get togethers. I see people smiling and laughing and connecting and it sure seems genuine to me. That's what I see in my community and I am far more average than I really care to admit. So...

ETA: Sorry if I missed the direction of the thread before I posted.

 

[voluptuary_manque]

Is it possible that those of us who pay a lot of attention to what is passed off for news have a jaundiced view of life? We cannot have it both ways, people. Either we are being propagandized by bad news or despite clear evidence to the contrary, the End is Near. Which way to you want it?

 

[rengadeirishman]

I have my own beliefs on what i think is wrong with our way of life, but this is not the time, and i've had a few drinks.

But though i do not agree with everything going on, it could be far worse.