Kurdistan

Lasher

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Joined
Dec 18, 1999
Posts
26,825
I've been wondering why it's such a bad idea for the Kurds to have a homeland?

I mean... I know the basic issues. The Turks would have a shit fit and most likely oppose it militarily - they'd likely lose a big chunk of territority sooner or later and they wouldn't just sit back and let that happen. The Iranians I'm sure would do the same.

But is there something wrong with the Kurds that they're not allowed to have their own nation?

Much of the '90s was spent with the bizarre nation-making of the post World War I era finally collapsing. Much of what happened was in places created out of the remnants of the Ottoman Empire - Czechoslovakia splitting into the Czech Republic and Slovakia, Yugoslavia splitting along various ethnic lines, former Soviet Republics gaining independence, etc - and it seems to me that allowing the Kurds to do the same would be a completion of that process.

Anyone who knows the History of Iraq understands it was a nation made up by the British as a reward to someone who helped them in the dissolution of the Ottoman Empire. Its borders were arbitrarily drawn and include 3 groups of people who really don't want to be a nation together.

There are no Iraqi people. The Kurds, Sunni Moslems and Shia Moslems who make up the people of Iraq are lumped under that term solely on the basis of being part of an artificially created nation.

To me it would make more sense to allow this nation to dissolve and allow the 3 states that should exist to come into being.

Obviously it should be up to the people who occupy that land to decide. But I think given the History, the Kurds and Shia would be all for it.

I almost expect the Kurds, unless bullied into doing otherwise, to make an attempt at some point of declaring independence...

Should this be opposed?
 
The Kurds are the second largest group of people with out a nation to call their own. We have already said over and over that the territorial intgerity of Iraq will be maintained so I doubt any new state is going to come out of this.
 
I've heard it repeated over and over that we won't being doing this.

The Kurdish north ahs been operating autonomously for quite some time. What do we do if they just say fuck it and some Kurdish Thomas Jefferson decides to write a declaration of independence? Then what?
 
To do it right the world would have to agree to disassemble most of the middle east and much of Eurasia and then rebuild as several hundred small countries. "Kurdistan" should rightly also include some of the land currently possessed by Turkey as well as Iran. If Iraq was just split into 3 nations each of them would be quickly over-run by neighbors.

The whole thing is a mess with no easy solutions and I'm afraid I don't have the time to do this important subject justice with a more extensive commentary right now. Basically, I agree with you though. If these peoples want to have independent nations they should be allowed to. The practical aspects of doing that are very complex though.
 
The problem is that the maps weren't drawn correctly 85 years ago and to this day we still pay for it.

I don't understand why the Kurds can't get any love.
 
The reason why the Kurds don't get their land back is because the countries who have occupated it don't want to give up on the oil and other riches that this land has.

And I would be very surprised if USA would ever actively help the Kurds to get their freedom, because then there's the risk of oil prices going up.

Which is one of the reasons why non-Americans always smile when we hear Americans talking about going into war to protect freedom and democracy.
 
I'm not even considering America actively helping the Kurds. Like I said, the Turks would go ape shit and we need the Turks, right? Plus all those Nato issues...

But what if? What if the Kurds decide to give it a shot? That really puts a everyone in a pickle, doesn't it?
 
My guess is that the world wouldn't help the Kurds for fear of annoying the Turks and the Iranians, but if the Kurds would somehow manage to break free on their own, then every country in the world would come crawling, eager to lick their behinds while they're in praying position, pleading for cheap oil...
 
The Turks can fuck up NATO just fine on their own. They don't need the Kurds as an excuse. :rolleyes:

Turkey is playing a passive-aggressive game right now. Fuck 'em.
 
The only hope for Turkey is that they will have to straighten up if they want to join the EU.

"It's all about the money."
 
Lasher said:
I'm not even considering America actively helping the Kurds. Like I said, the Turks would go ape shit and we need the Turks, right? Plus all those Nato issues...

But what if? What if the Kurds decide to give it a shot? That really puts a everyone in a pickle, doesn't it?

We did sell them out the last time they tried. I think they deserve a homeland.

I assume if Iraq were dissolved, the Shiites would join Iran.

I don't know what the Sunnis would do.
 
patient1 said:
We did sell them out the last time they tried. I think they deserve a homeland.

I assume if Iraq were dissolved, the Shiites would join Iran.

I don't know what the Sunnis would do.

Not give a shiit?:eek:
 
No one "deserves" a homeland. Any unified group can "earn" a homeland. It's called revolution and the price is blood.

Ishmael
 
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