Just wondering about your opinion

[Tribbin]

Recently, here in FL, they passed an amendment that basically said that people are not allowed to smoke in restaurnats, or anywhere inside public unless it was a smoke shop, or a free standing building. So this means that in a lot of bars and clubs in my area people will not be able to smoke anymore. I personally think that this is outragous. I don't think that the government should be allowed to tell a small business owner what they can or can't do in their store. I can understand it in restaurants and most of the smokers I know don't smoke where they would bother people and if someone askes they always put it out. I was just wondering how everyone else felt about this.

Just to let you know I don't smoke. And I've talked to other people about this and they have said that they agree with it and that they are doing the smokers out there a favor. Trying to "save their lives". I think that is crap. If a person wants to smoke let them. But that is just how I feel.

Trib

 

[I'mVan]

I dunno. On the one hand, an owner of private property ought to be able to dictate the rules for their own establishment. On the other hand, I don't smoke, and loath the effect of smoke after an evening out. No bar will become non-smoking on their own, it's bad for business unless they all do.

 

[millieteases]

A. In the U.S. we are the government. All of us. It is foolish to think that some amorphous being we call "the government" does things to and for us. We're doing it to ourselves.

B. We form governments and make rules because, left on our own, we have this bad habit of killing each other off in our effort to survive.

C. We give up some freedoms so we can be more secure. In this case we choose to limit legal places for smoking, which we know causes disease in the smoker and can cause disease for those who are exposed to the smoke.

Since we all pay for health care, in one way or another, some people in Florida decided to make the financial and health-wise decision to limit exposure to this particular cause of disease.

D. People aren't rational. We pick some things to ban and not others, even if they are equally dangerous. Some societies don't worry so much about sex, others are paranoid about it. As with most things in life, you just have to deal with it.

E. If you live in Florida and don't like the new smoking law, do something about it. Your governor is for sale - I'm sure with the right political donations he'd be happy to work with you on changing the law. (After all, his brother is willing to start a new set of Crusades and possibly World War III so his buddy Cheney and other oil buddies can make some more money off of oil before reality forces them into the renewable energy business - a silly little smoking law shouldn't cost more than, say, the funds for a quick invasion of Cuba.)

Don't you just love politics? And yes, I'm in a mood tonight.

 

[Kitte]

I have no problem with SOME establishments being non smoking, such as hospitals and stores. But I think that a balance can be reached rather then completely banning it. For example in my town they have smoking in some establishments based on ventilation etc. and there is no one under 18 allowed in smoking areas. I think all and all a good compromise.

 

[SINthysist]

Legislate Fate.

We determine who lives and dies, so it is logical to pass laws designed to keep people alive. Bus exhaust is my personal Achilles heel. I want the fawkers banned because they make me cough and each cough takes, minutes, hours, maybe days off of my life...

But then I spent my whole life in a bar, since I was a toddler, so I SHOULD be dead now. Goddamned body, too stupid to know it's been poisoned to death...

Fuck my life. I'm screwed by political incorrectness and I apologize for being alive. It REALLY hurts the cause.

 

[A Desert Rose]

I don't think that the government should be allowed to tell a small business owner what they can or can't do in their store. I can understand it in restaurants and most of the smokers I know don't smoke where they would bother people and if someone askes they always put it out. I was just wondering how everyone else felt about this.
If a person wants to smoke let them. But that is just how I feel.

Trib

Being a previous small business owner, I have very strong feelings about this topic.

The business and the building were owned by myself and my then, husband. It should have been our call, not the government's, what our policy was regarding smoking in our office. Honestly, we broke the "rules" and we smoked there. And we provided a smoking area for those employees who did smoke.

The government regulations regarding this are way out of line. Completely smoke free casinos in my state (Nevada) have failed in that policy and have returned to smoking and smoke-free areas.

Dictating this to business owners will not work and should not be imposed on them. If a bar or restaurant owner wants to have a smoke-free business, more power to them. But it is not the government's business to tell them what they MUST do.

 

[Lancecastor]

Here in Canada we have some cool differences....in Montreal, you can smoke in the grocery store, which is a real hoot!....but in Vancouver, you're not even allowed to smoke outdoors anymore, right, I'm Van?

 

[Chuckus]

IMHO:

The Government has a right to dictate on their OWN premises what is or is not acceptable, but NOT in/for Privately owned/held businesses.

Begin Rant/

I am so tired of everyone discriminating against smokers......it is a form of discrimination just like racism, sexual preference, etc....and it is terrible. I do smoke, though I must say I tend to be very cautious of whom and where I smoke as I am careful and actually don't want to expose others to it UNLESS I am in a designated smoking area or the like.

I tend to find people who "hate" smokers and say they are "saving" us to be pious and "holier than thou" most of the time anyways......and if they consider it wrong to do then it must be, according to them.

/end rant and stepping off my soapbox

 

[SINthysist]

In New Orleans, they have beer coolers in the shoe store...

 

[Chuckus]

Re: Re: Just wondering about your opinion

business and the building were owned by myself and my then, husband. It should have been our call, not the government's, what our policy was regarding smoking in our office. Honestly, we broke the "rules" and we smoked there. And we provided a smoking area for those employees who did smoke.

I smoke in my office and if someone complain about it, I tell them they can wait to see me outside and when I get the chance I'll get to them............if they get really pissy about it.

If I own the building, I will do what I please. The Government is NOT going to dictate to me what I can or cannot do in the building that I own, we keep our employee number low for a reason............the Govt can't dictate as easily to you.

 

[SINthysist]

We here in Waubunsee County think drinking is a SIN. Now those dumbasses in Wyandotte COunty voted for liquor sales on Sunday, but We'll put a stop to that by Gawd...

And then the smokers too!

AND DON'T GET ME STARTED ON EVIL MARYJANE!

Now, if you are in front of your computer and not wearing your safety harness, you're pissing me off too and just axing for it...

 

[Mellon Collie]

Has anyone seen my civil rights?

 

[The Heretic]

A. In the U.S. we are the government. All of us. It is foolish to think that some amorphous being we call "the government" does things to and for us. We're doing it to ourselves.

Agreed. However, this is not a democracy. The majority does not rule so far as to be able to create laws that infringe on the rights of the minority. For example, if the majority of caucasians enacts a law that says non-causcasians must be segregated, the judiciary will find this law unconstitutional.

C. We give up some freedoms so we can be more secure. In this case we choose to limit legal places for smoking, which we know causes disease in the smoker and can cause disease for those who are exposed to the smoke.

We should not give up freedom for anything. We can agree that we all have certain unalienable rights that we should not give up for security, but we can also agree that these rights only extend so far as to not infringe on the same rights that others have.

You have the right to smoke anywhere as long as I do not have to breathe the pollution from your smoking. As such when you are in a public place where other's have to breathe the same air, we can say that you cannot smoke there without infringing on your rights or asking you to give up anything, because such rights do not exist.

Since we all pay for health care, in one way or another, some people in Florida decided to make the financial and health-wise decision to limit exposure to this particular cause of disease.

We all pay for health care because some people came up with the mistaken idea that this was something the government should do, and because other people realized they could use this as argument to control the populace. They say that since society has the responsibility to pay for health care, then society also has the right to make demands that infringe on our rights. You don't want to wear a helmet while riding your motorcycle? We as society can force you to wear the helmet because if you hurt yourself we have to pay for your health care. You must wear your seat belts for the same reason. And so on - it is the same argument our parents used when we were kids; "as long as you live under my roof, and I pay the bills, you will follow my rules!"

The problem with that assumption is that government is not our mommy and daddy - at least it shouldn't be. On the whole, we as individuals can make our own decisions better than anybody else can make them for us. We know our needs, our desires, our capabilities, our resources/skills and our objectives better than most other people, especially some bureaucrat or social reformer.

 

[SINthysist]

You own nothing. Even if you pay for it, it is not your castle.

As an experimant throw a wild, loud party. You cannot do what you want.

Property Tax is a permanent lein held by the government so they can take "YOUR" property if you do not behave in a proscribed manner...

 

[Chuckus]

You own nothing. Even if you pay for it, it is not your castle.

As an experimant throw a wild, loud party. You cannot do what you want.

Property Tax is a permanent lein held by the government so they can take "YOUR" property if you do not behave in a proscribed manner...

Actually I have been known to throw some loud and wild parties in my day on farmland...............in the middle of nowhere with all pertinent neighbors there, we did what we wanted to.

But I know what your saying SIN..................

 

[The Heretic]

I dunno. On the one hand, an owner of private property ought to be able to dictate the rules for their own establishment. On the other hand, I don't smoke, and loath the effect of smoke after an evening out. No bar will become non-smoking on their own, it's bad for business unless they all do.

Such rules do not prohibit what a person can and can't do on their own private property - what the rules do say is that in a confined yet public space, you (not you specifically) do not have the right to pollute the air I breathe. I have the right to breathe relatively unpolluted air wherever I go, and I have the right to say you cannot pollute it any more than it already is.

If someone wants to have a public place on private property where people can smoke, then they can open a private club or have a section just for smokers with a separate ventilation system/etc. so I don't have to breathe the polluted air. It is really that simple. It is not about private vs. public property, it is about private vs. public places.

 

[Pamela]

Here in Canada we have some cool differences....in Montreal, you can smoke in the grocery store, which is a real hoot!....but in Vancouver, you're not even allowed to smoke outdoors anymore, right, I'm Van?

In Calgary it varies. I can't smoke in almost all restaurants, but I can in a bar.

You can smoke in Safeway in Montreal???

 

[Chuckus]

Such rules do not prohibit what a person can and can't do on their own private property - what the rules do say is that in a confined yet public space, you (not you specifically) do not have the right to pollute the air I breathe. I have the right to breathe relatively unpolluted air wherever I go, and I have the right to say you cannot pollute it any more than it already is.

If someone wants to have a public place on private property where people can smoke, then they can open a private club or have a section just for smokers with a separate ventilation system/etc. so I don't have to breathe the polluted air. It is really that simple. It is not about private vs. public property, it is about private vs. public places.

More or less correct, my personal office is a confined space and it is NOT a public place therefore...............

 

[Guest]

 

[SINthysist]

Chuckus, the neighbor bitches and moans about bruised beef and the quality of milk when I party !

 

[Chuckus]

Chuckus, the neighbor bitches and moans about bruised beef and the quality of milk when I party !

LOL. The corn tastes a bit funny from the farm we party on, I wonder why?

 

[SINthysist]

But then he thinks my crop circles and the dissappearance of his veal, er, calves are linked to UFO's !

 

[Chuckus]

But then he thinks my crop circles and the dissappearance of his veal, er, calves are linked to UFO's !

Is your neighbor REDripple per chance?

 

[Texan]

E. If you live in Florida and don't like the new smoking law, do something about it. Your governor is for sale - I'm sure with the right political donations he'd be happy to work with you on changing the law. (After all, his brother is willing to start a new set of Crusades and possibly World War III so his buddy Cheney and other oil buddies can make some more money off of oil before reality forces them into the renewable energy business - a silly little smoking law shouldn't cost more than, say, the funds for a quick invasion of Cuba.)

Don't you just love politics? And yes, I'm in a mood tonight.

Wow, somebody woke up on the wrong side of the election.

 

[SINthysist]

The Azalias don't bloom as full any more either.