Insanity at the UN

[Boxlicker101]

This is something that just happened. Can anybody think of a place worse than Iran for this position? There may be some places, such as Saudi Arabia, that are as bad, but none worse.

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2010...ted-nations-commission-status-women-congress/

This is from Fox News. Apparently, no other news organization took note of the ridiculousness of the situation.

 

[amicus]

Other than Blogs, you are right, only Fox seems to be aware; I did find this:

Iran's election comes just a week after one of its senior clerics declared that women who wear revealing clothing are to blame for earthquakes, a statement that created an international uproar — but little affected their bid to become an international arbiter of women's rights.

"Many women who do not dress modestly ... lead young men astray, corrupt their chastity and spread adultery in society, which (consequently) increases earthquakes," said the respected cleric, Hojatoleslam Kazem Sedighi.

Curiously insane, eh?

Amicus

 

[Loring2]

Great Choice

Magnificent, just what the world needs. Enough of these shapely ankles and sensitive lips. Down with women's rights ... no Zivi ... no please don't .. please don't . ...................................................................................................

Mr. Loring will be back in a few days to take his place among the lesser eunochs ... the scar tissue on what was once his testicular apparatus will have begun to heal.

Это будет учить его

Zivi

 

[TE999]

This travesty only serves to illustrate the absolute worthlessness of the Hudson River Debating Society. It's down the UN rabbit hole again where nothing makes sense. For the US to both host and bankroll this abomination is ridiculous as many of the countries in the UN hate America and all it stands for...beginning with Iran.

 

[sr71plt]

The UN looks like a travesty to shallow thinkers who don't understand what's really going on there--who only look on the surface and don't understand that the assembly sessions and speechafying are mainly a cover for having a place where senior and closely briefed diplomats of even highly belligerent nations can meet and talk and negotiate behind the scenes.

For the public show venues, the UN operates much like our own Congress does--on the seniority system (indeed, its mechanisms were set up by folks who knew our congressional structures and mechanisms well).

I don't know when/how long Iran would be given the gavel on a committee like this--but as a member of the committee, they either have to be there in the room (or noticeably absent), in the spotlight, where they have to face up to the pressure from other delegates as they never would have to without this venue or system.

Putting them on the committe has nothing to do with approval of behavior. Only the shallow thinkers would think that.

 

[Boxlicker101]

It will be interesting to see what the Iranian delegates have to say while on this commission, and how they will respond to challenges to their country's record.

It is also interesting that anybody can actually defend this asinine appointment or find it to be anything but a travesty.

 

[sr71plt]

It is also interesting that anybody can actually defend this asinine appointment or find it to be anything but a travesty.

Yeah, that probably has something to do with what you did in life rather than work in government and international affairs.

There's no particular need for the bus to wait until you figure it out--it certainly doesn't need your approval.

 

[al_Ussa]

There may be some places, such as Saudi Arabia, that are as bad, but none worse.

You're kidding, right? Saudi Arabia is FAAAAR worse than Iran when it comes to women's rights... hell when it comes to human rights in general.

In Saudi Arabia, women can't even go out in public without a male relative. Women have to fully veil themselves. Women can't drive, testify in court...

In Iran, not only can women drive and hold jobs. In Iran, women have always held the right to vote. Saudi Arabia doesn't even have the pretense of voting. Hell, Saudi Arabia effectively has SLAVERY in the form of Asian and Arab expatriates. And, unlike Iran, Saudi Arabia suppresses religious diversity (including within the Muslim community; do you know what Saudi textbooks say about us Shi'ites?)

I'm not saying that Iran is a paradise, but Iran is certainly more progressive than Saudi Arabia and many of the Gulf states. But then, those states are "allies" of the US and entirely propped up by it.

 

[sr71plt]

al-Ussa is quite right about Saudi Arabia following a much more fundamentalist and women-oppressive pathway than Iran. The United States gives them a pass (on this and a lot of other things) just because we need them much more than we need Iran.

It's a complex world out there, and the United States, just like everyone else, makes compromises and wears blinders--and rails on the surface against such institutions as the UN to keep their less-bright constituents happy and under control--as they need to do to maneuver through the obstacles.

I've worked for liberal administrations and conservative ones (missed the recent dopey one, though), and they all said something different for public consumption, but they all did more or less the same thing behind closed doors to keep the ship afloat. And they all were grateful there was a place to go to contact someone with a direct line home within ten minutes if it was needed. We call that the United Nations.

So, take the shallow, critical approach as you like. It will be comforting for you to have a bully scapegoat--and mostly it don't matter much what you think and rant about anyway.

 

[ishtat]

This is something that just happened. Can anybody think of a place worse than Iran for this position? There may be some places, such as Saudi Arabia, that are as bad, but none worse.

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2010...ted-nations-commission-status-women-congress/

This is from Fox News. Apparently, no other news organization took note of the ridiculousness of the situation.

Yes Box, more or less every country in Africa, half of Latin America, Myanmar, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq virtually all the central Asian 'stans anywhere in rural India.

Incidentally check the biography of the author of that article and realise that you have bveen sucked in.

 

[sr71plt]

Incidentally check the biography of the author of that article and realise that you have bveen sucked in.

Box "realize" when he's being sucked into something? That's asking the impossible, isn't it?

 

[Boxlicker101]

Yes Box, more or less every country in Africa, half of Latin America, Myanmar, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq virtually all the central Asian 'stans anywhere in rural India.

Incidentally check the biography of the author of that article and realise that you have bveen sucked in.

Whatever the biography of the author, the fact that Iran has been named to this commission is what counts. Unless you are claiming the story is a total lie, or that Iran does not practice the oppression described. What is relevant is the message, not the messenger.

I do not believe all the places you have listed are specifically more oppressive to women than Iran. Some places in Africa might be comparable, but most are not. I don't know that any nations in Latin Ameerica are. Have you ever seen photos of women on the beaches in Brazil or Argentina? Some parts of India might still be pretty bad, but not the nation as a whole, which is what I refer to. Those parts of Afghanistan controlled by the Taliban may be even worse, but that is not a whole nation either.

 

[sr71plt]

Whatever the biography of the author, the fact that Iran has been named to this commission is what counts. Unless you are claiming the story is a total lie, or that Iran does not practice the oppression described. What is relevant is the message, not the messenger.

I do not believe all the places you have listed are specifically more oppressive to women than Iran. Some places in Africa might be comparable, but most are not. I don't know that any nations in Latin Ameerica are. Have you ever seen photos of women on the beaches in Brazil or Argentina? Some parts of India might still be pretty bad, but not the nation as a whole, which is what I refer to. Those parts of Afghanistan controlled by the Taliban may be even worse, but that is not a whole nation either.

No, your interpretation of the effect of it is what really counts in your assertion. And you just don't get it, so you've misinterpreted.

You also are misinformed on Iran being one of the most oppressive countries to women.

So, basically, it doesn't really matter what you think about it, because you are off in lala land (as usual) on the whole topic.

Rant as you wish--it does a whole lot of good on a porn discussion board, where most of the posters have dismissed you as a crack pot on non-porn issues anyway.

 

[MzDeviancy]

You're kidding, right? Saudi Arabia is FAAAAR worse than Iran when it comes to women's rights... hell when it comes to human rights in general.

In Saudi Arabia, women can't even go out in public without a male relative. Women have to fully veil themselves. Women can't drive, testify in court...

In Iran, not only can women drive and hold jobs. In Iran, women have always held the right to vote. Saudi Arabia doesn't even have the pretense of voting. Hell, Saudi Arabia effectively has SLAVERY in the form of Asian and Arab expatriates. And, unlike Iran, Saudi Arabia suppresses religious diversity (including within the Muslim community; do you know what Saudi textbooks say about us Shi'ites?)

I'm not saying that Iran is a paradise, but Iran is certainly more progressive than Saudi Arabia and many of the Gulf states. But then, those states are "allies" of the US and entirely propped up by it.

Very well said.

 

[al_Ussa]

Yes Box, more or less every country in Africa,

Speaking as an African (or rather an American of African descent) I'm not sure if you even realize how big Africa is. Most of Africa isn't especially bad when it comes to women's rights.... Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, Morocco, South Africa, Nigeria, Kenya, Ethiopia, Mali, Tanzania and the like are pretty standard for "third wolrd" coutnries though some (like Tunisia and Morocco) are notably more progressive and South Africa is practically part of "the west" anyway.

That said I could think of some offenders. Somalia I would say constitutes a failed state at the moment and Algeria has been locked in a bloody civil war for the past couple decades. Sudan... unfortunately is a dictatorship as well. And several East African countries - even ones like Kenya, Ethiopia and Egypt - continue to practice of female circumcision. And Zimbabwe is a dictatoship anyway.

But the worst offenders here would have to be countries like Democratic Republic of Congo, Chad, Guinea and Sierra Leone, where the governments were/still are using mass RAPE as a weapon. THAT is something that has never happened in Iran or any countries in the Middle East.

half of Latin America,

Not really. My experiences with one of my girlfriends from Bogota didn't suggest anything of the sort. In fact Colombia seems pretty laid back about most things. I've heard that the curfew in Bogota was even lifted since the last time I was there.

Myanmar,

No. Burmese women have traditionally enjoyed a high level of status, and like most of Southeast Asia run most of the daily businesses. The only thing women are excluded from are religious institutions and they can never hold the same power or influence as a Buddhist monk. That said Burma is certainly a dictatorship with few freedoms; but those restrictions are for everyone.

Pakistan,

Depends what part of the country you are talking about. Panjab and in particular Lahore is pretty egalitarian. Most of the big cities are in fact. Its only really in the NWFP that you have any real problems. Pakistan is still far ahead of Saudi Arabia.

Afghanistan,

Again though its a failed state.

Syria,

Not even close. Syria may be a dictatorship but it is pretty modern. Syrian Lingerie.

Iraq

Only after the US invasion. I would point out that women had it much better under Saddam in some ways.

virtually all the central Asian 'stans

Again complete bollocks. Uzbekistan for example is pretty modern. None of the Central Asian countries require women to be completely covered (as Saudi Arabia does) or bar women from office or voting (as Saudi Arabia does).

anywhere in rural India.

Maybe parts but certainly not all of India. I am not justifying practices such as suttee but you do have to admit that India has been moving ahead in the last few decadaes.

 

[Jagged]

Once again I see another justification for why the UN is a waste of time. Every scum bag and despot against their turn to speak. Regardless of what they might be currently doing they can scream about the United State. Only difference now is we have a President more than willing to say sorry for just about everything.

Honestly if the United States pulled out and let them keep their building to meet do you thing anything would happen? If we cut off foreign aid for just one year things would be amazing. Now that would be wrong, because innocents would suffer, well theoretically they would, because I doubt much of the supplies and fund actually make it to those who are suffering.

Let them squabble why we build the United States into a great nation and help our real friends around the world.

 

[al_Ussa]

Let them squabble why we build the United States into a great nation and help our real friends around the world.

Honestly, statements like that tend to stink too much of "US should kiss ass to Europe and maybe Israel and screw everyone with dark skin."

Yeah, I like the US, but that doesn't mean that I like everything the US (or rather, US POLITICIANS) have done, nor do I support all of the big business elites. And if you saw half of what they did to the world you wouldn't either.

You know what the REAL problem with the UN is? It supports member states only. And more often than not it means countries like the US, UK, Russia, Israel, China, the EU states and so forth get to impose their will on the rest of the world. Everyone else kind of gets screwed over.

What did the UN do to help East Timor? What did the US do? You can talk about freedom and democracy all you want, but the fact is that only Australia got involved, and even then only because it was in their backyard.

Yet when the dust settled the US was quick to want an embassy there and want to influence politics.

What did the UN or western nations do about Bhopal. More people died there than in 9-11, and yet Union-Carbine never paid for it. In fact, the US refused to extradite Anderson to India.

What did they do about the civil war in Sierra Leone, or in Congo, or in Sudan? What did they do when rebel troops and government goons were both using RAPE as a fucking weapon.

What have they done about the "sex tourism" in the Philippines, Thailand and other parts of SE Asia, where wealthy WHITE Euro-Americans go to have sex with children.

What did they do when Colombia was dealing with drug lords... drug lords who were getting MONEY from US and European elites.... and who turned Bogota into the freaking murder capital of the world.

Remember, the US didn't care about the Taleban until it needed a scapegoat after 9-11... That the US did nothing to protect the people of Iraq or the museums after the war, but immediately went to work gaurding the oil (and in fact renegotiating contracts in favor of US corps). And remember that the US gave mercenaries blanket immunity from ANY charges.

Remember that the US government has targetted Arab journalists in Iraq and in fact has tried to suppress Arab news media in the US, despite the claims of "fredom of speech" and "freedom of the press".

And remember that the US still supports the Saudi royal family and their Wahhabi fundamentalism.

If you wonder why people might be a little pissed off, there are no shortage of reasons to dislike the governmnet and their supporters.

 

[Jagged]

Honestly, statements like that tend to stink too much of "US should kiss ass to Europe and maybe Israel and screw everyone with dark skin."



Wow....Ah you're far off the mark as you can get, and once again there is the popular trend. Don't agree with someone call them a racist.

There are close to 200 countries around the globe, and all of them including the ones run by non-Caucasians are out for their own nation interests. Just seems when the United States does it that we're committing crimes against humanity. By having a high standard of living we're doing something wrong?

As to the history you bring up I've never said we're completely free from guilt, and we've done exploitative things, but history is just that, the past. You can't change it, but you can work for a better tomorrow.

Sexual slavery the United States has done plenty, and it is a crime to travel to those nations for that purpose. Do we need to do more of course, but it could be greatly limited if those nations took initiative.

As to Africa well we've tried to help many times, but I think it is time to let people sort out their own internal matters. After all you don't want evil westerners interfering do you?

We could do more with places like Columbia if we actually tried the war on drugs as a war, but that won't happen. So, education and programs to reduce the demand is a good idea.



The world critics complain that we're not the world's policeman, and many nations say we don't do enough. I just want to see what would happen if we just sat out of the game for 4 years. Just guarded after own interests for once. Those who have been real friends deserve our friendship in return, and those who do nothing but take and call us enemy well your on your own. Let's face it there are no friends or enemies, but rather demands for resources, and those control what we all do.

 

[sr71plt]

It's OK if you don't understand what's really going on at the UN for it to be beneficial to a whole range of U.S. administrations, Jagged. It's OK, really, life will go on without your awareness of how the world functions--especially if all you're doing about it is ranting on a porn writers discussion board.

 

[cloudy]

I just want to see what would happen if we just sat out of the game for 4 years. Just guarded after own interests for once.

Wow. You don't get it at all, do you? The economy is a global thing now, and we can't just "sit out of the game for four years." It's impossible.

It's 2010. Catch up.

 

[glynndah]

Perhaps having a country whose viewpoint is not consistent with Western Philosophy might be in keeping with the mandate of the United Nations.

 

[rgraham666]

"This organization is created to keep you from going to hell. It isn't created to take you to heaven." - Henry Cabot Lodge, Jr.

 

[Jagged]

Wow. You don't get it at all, do you? The economy is a global thing now, and we can't just "sit out of the game for four years." It's impossible.

It's 2010. Catch up.

I wasn't talking about trade, I'm talking about foreign aid. You know the programs where we even give enemy nations money with the hope they'll spend it on food for their people.

Follow the conversation please. I'm not into isolationism.

 

[Jagged]

al-Ussa is quite right about Saudi Arabia following a much more fundamentalist and women-oppressive pathway than Iran. The United States gives them a pass (on this and a lot of other things) just because we need them much more than we need Iran.

Oh I agree when we need someone as an ally or their resources we'll pretty much over look anything. Like when we needed the South Africans to fight communists we never commented about their internal policies and even violated the UN arms embargo to make sure they had the weapons they needed.

 

[sr71plt]

Henry Cabot Lodge Jr. Wasn't he that ultraconservative Brahmin Republican vice presidential candidate in Nixon's 1960 election campaign.