Imagination vs. ... well ... no imagination

[Chicklet]

Okay so I received some feedback about a story idea and partial I have saying that I need more character description so that the "reader doesn't have to imagine" what the character looks like...

personally, I love using my imagination, and would rather picture the woman/man of my dreams than the stick figure with gigantic boobs that seems to be rather popular.

What do you think? to the point description or vague so that you can use your imagination? which is more fun?

Chicklet

 

[sirhugs]

I think there is an audience for each, but that too the point description will automatically exclude some people, so leaving some things to the imagination might have broader appeal.

Also, excessive details like bra size and penis length get tedious. I start to wonder if these characters carry tape measures in their jockeys. Descriptive terms are a lotter more imaginative, and leave the reader some room to create.

 

[Chicklet]

stole this quote from a thread I started when I first got on lit...I'd forgotten about it until just now, but I thought it would be nice to bring it up again.

Thanks Whispersecret.

I don't think you should be purposely vague in description of character appearance, but neither should you be incredibly detailed. MODERATION IN EVERYTHING.

A rule of thumb I think is worth trying is: when you introduce a character, tell 1-2 physical things about them and 1-2 personality traits.

Here's an example:

When Alice entered the nightclub, more than one male head turned her way. Her burnished copper hair fell to her shoulders like waves of fire. She surveyed the room with a hand on her hip and smiled. No one was wearing anything remotely as sophisticated as her form-fitting black dress and spiked heels. With a slinky, fluid walk that came as naturally to her as breathing, she made her way over to the bar. To her delight, no less than three men approached. There was nothing as satisfying as making a good entrance.

To get the most bang for your buck, try to integrate the personality traits with the physical details. That way you won't end up with a long (boring) description, like:

When Alice entered the nightclub, more than one male head turned her way. She had red hair that fell to her shoulders, big green eyes and full lips. Her breasts were at least a C-cup and almost overflowed the little black dress she was wearing. The thin spaghetti straps had rhinestones on them, sparking even in the dimness of the bar. The material of the dress gathered between her breasts, drawing attention to them. The back of the dress dipped low to the base of her spine and the hem hung unevenly, like scarves. High spiked heels completed her outfit.

Long descriptions can start to sound like grocery lists.

I hope this helps.

 

[quintessential]

Chicklet,

When reading a story there are certain things I like to use my imagination for. It's not necessary for me to know the way a character is built or what size any of their bodily features are.

What I do like to know is background information. I find that shapes a character and it better enables me to understand their demeanor.

I do like to know their hair color and the shade of their eyes. That allows me to form the rest of my imagination around those few descriptions. Also, I like to know if they are short or tall, not necessarily their height written in numbers, but just a description that lets me know their height in general.

In honesty, I truly just enjoy learning about the characters without that getting in the way of the story. It's more important for me to know how they laugh, how they smile, and how they react to situations.

Hopefully, this all made sense.

q

 

[BigTexan]

My opinion, for what it's worth, is that you should have enough description to let the reader paint a picture, but not so much that each reader's picture will be the same.

Leaving out all description leads to bland boring stories. Including so much detail that the reader has no leeway in picturing the character or scene can also be boring.

Drawing the line between the two extremes is the job of the writer.

Trisha glided into the room, her golden hair flowing out behind her like the flames from an old fifties roadster.

This has some description, but each reader will picture it differently. I think that knowing where to draw the line is one of the things that seperates talent from skill.

BigTexan

 

[Chicklet]

Hopefully, this all made sense.

thanks q, it did = ) i try to say if my characters or short or tall, and the hair color a lot because like running hands through dark red hair sounds so good = )

chicklet

 

[Chicklet]

My opinion, for what it's worth, is that you should have enough description to let the reader paint a picture, but not so much that each reader's picture will be the same.

ah, excellent description, there = )

 

[wildsweetone]

as it says in my sig. line

a reader will see what they want to read

personally i prefer using a tiny amount of detail, sometimes i use not enough, it's something i'm still working on and it relates directly to learning how to write the 300 and 500 word count stories.

 

[deliciously_naughty]

I think it depends...when you write in first person, it never sounds natural when you sit and describe yourself unless you have the correct circumstances. I realized that I never gave a physical description of Abigail in Haunted Lover. Fortunately this has given me an opening to write something else that will connect Haunted Lover story with another story (as yet untitled and not fully written).

 

[KillerMuffin]

It's interesting. In over two years of posted stories I've only gotten one piece of feedback requesting more character description. And it was on Sodomizing Hannah of all things.

I'm the absolute worst about describing characters physical appearance. They wanted me to come right out and describe Hannah's chocolatey brown skin instead of just hinting at it.

This is, I think, vastly interesting.

 

[Chicklet]

sometimes i think it's more fun not to hear any description, for first person or the like. makes it more like you're there, seeing through the characters eyes. who cares what the narrator looks like? it's the surrounding's that're important, i think.

 

[TheEarl]

I've had a couple of requests for more physical description in my stories, but that's because I don't find it easy to insert description naturally. Making more of an effort.

Description is a tricky thing. I have been slammed in the past for including too little. I find it difficult to wedge it in amongst the story. I have to make a conscious effort to force it in to give the reader some idea what my characters/ my scenes look like.

However there are stories on Lit which go over the top: "She had blonde hair and blue eyes. Her nose was slender and she had a pear shaped face. Her earrings were gold with a blue stone in the middle and caught the light. Her lips were adorned with red lipstick and a little dimple in her chin which appeared when she smiled."

No. Don't do it. Don't make me hurt you. That's not description, that's an instruction manual for a portrait painter. By the second sentence the reader will have fallen asleep. Readers need to know what things look like, but do credit them with a little imagination. Giving them a step-by-step outline gives them no freedom to think.

Picture your character/scene in your mind's eye. What do they look like? Pick out three or four details which are the first things you notice. I once wrote a story in the Buffy the Vampire Slayer universe and needed to describe Dawn. First four details I got were: Mousy brown hair, elfin face, tall, skinny. So I wrote my descriptive paragraph with those details. I could have gone further: small breasts, narrow hips, large eyes, etc, but I don't need to. Those who know what Dawn looks like don't need the description and those who don't can fill in the gaps themselves.

"She had golden hair, tied back in a ponytail. Her eyes were slanted slightly, giving an exotic tint to her face. She was slender and the short, white tennis dress she was wearing showed off her muscled legs to perfection."

Who do you see from that description? I was actually trying to describe Anna Kournikova. It doesn't matter that you didn't see her exactly, you now have a vague idea of who I was trying to show you and your imagination filled in the gaps. I could have described her in a lot more detail, but then you wouldn't have been given any freedom to imagine.

Small addendum to the description section. Never use measurements unless you have a very good reason. Inches, cup sizes, etc are all no-nos. They restrict the reader's imagination. Plus when was the last time you found a man who can tell women's bra sizes from outside her clothing?

Have just C&Ped this from my How To "The Ten Commandments." Hope it's of some kind of help. Thought I'd C&P instead of repeating myself as this is the best advice i have to give.

The Earl

 

[NoJo]

personally, I love using my imagination, and would rather picture the woman/man of my dreams than the stick figure with gigantic boobs that seems to be rather popular.

Chicklet: FYI: Attached is my ideal woman

 

[Chicklet]

now *that* is sexy

 

[lucky lapper]

Fantasy

Fantasy.... That is eacting what is happening while I look at your " Tasty New Thread " and dream about that being mine your your mouth, but I would also like to return the favor to you if I might see your " honey pot ". Please post more, hehe, while I wipe off the keyboard.

 

[Chicklet]

hrm...

seems to be an odd place for that post.

apologies to everyone else.

Chicklet

 

[Pookie]

Me thinks someone's keyboard and/or mouse was already a tad bit sticky before he posted that.

 

[Diane Marie]

Imagination vs. ... well ... no imagination

I do believe in the use of good description. Almost all truly good literary works give a good description of the main characters, although not so good that we can’t use our own imaginations to fill in part of the details. Think of a romance novel, we all want to know what the lead male looks like, but we also want to include details that aren’t part of the novel, details that we find attractive about men. A well written story yields enough to allow us to make him the lover we’d want him to be. Tall, dark and handsome is, of course, not enough but it’s subjective, all three terms being left open to the imagination of the reader.

Really good descriptions, do not come at us all at once, but are spread throughout the story. Introduce your character in a way that show how he/she relates to your story, later a little description, then story, then description. The description has to come within a reasonable time after the introduction.

I’ll state my case:

Introduction, as to who Jack is, how he fits. If it’s a short story, you have to be up front on his importance, if something longer it’s more fun and interesting to build up to his importance or lack thereof. Then

"As Sarah inched herself closer, she again looked at the man on the stage. Jack looked tall and slender, his shoulders strong, his hips narrow. His lean tanned face, expressive, stern, a mix between sober and brooding. His eye shut tightly, as if he was lost in the music he was now playing. His straight, midnight black hair, tumbling down over his forehead, damp and silky under the intense stage lights."

More story then: (Note Sarah was introducing earlier in the story, she’s the lead.)

"As Jack’s eyes fluttered open, his surroundings became clear. His gaze moved from one to the next of the lovely ladies anxious for his attention. Finally being drawn to a pair of huge midnight blue eyes staring up at him. Eyes hidden by lenses of man-sized, thick rimmed glasses. The face of an angle almost hidden from view by those absurd glasses, heart shaped, elegant, with a slim turned up nose, her mouth large, lips succulent. The kind of mouth that begged to be kissed. As she spoke his name, Jack felt his mood being pulled up from the depths that his music always took him to.

This angel, whom pressed herself so closely to the stage wasn’t the type of woman who routinely tried to capture Jack’s attention. The first indication being the lack of her showing any cleavage. For that matter it was difficult to even see if she was capable of showing any cleavage at all. The blue cotton sundress she wore hung on her like a sack. But there were hints, Jack’s imagination was soon filling in every detail. When it came to women one thing Jack did not lack was imagination, scruples, surely, morals, yes. Imagination never, an uncannily accurate imagination, which he quickly used to build a picture of the woman now standing before him. Petite, slim, small firm breast, cat like in her elegance. Not Jack’s type of woman at all, not enough curves, less abundant in the bosom department then was his preference, and definitely to much fire in those eyes. Those angry eyes spelled trouble, a complication he just didn’t need, nor want, in his life."

More story then:

"He moved closer, invading the space she considered her own, apprehension gripped her, it was almost impossible not to jump back. Forcing her fear back down, she looked up at him defiantly, determined to stay her ground. As he moved closer, Sarah instinctively wanted flight but she was determined not to let him bully her, even as his arm slipped around to nestle in the small of her back. Leaning back on her heals trying to force Jack to break his hold only caused him to draw her even closer, her body feeling the heat of his as they touched. Sarah’s gaze moved down and away from his eyes, her mind reeled, "this can’t be happening, I don’t want these feelings, oh god please, I’m not ready to feel again."

With his free hand Jack reached up and slid her gasses off, putting his thump and forefinger on each side of her chin he raised her head. Sarah had no choice but to look at him as he studied her in the pale white light. Her bone structure was lovely, delicate, feminine, her features equally so, her skin as flawless as fresh cream. But she wore no makeup, no jewelry, nothing to enhance or draw the eye. Her thick, dark hair had been shorn just above her shoulders and looked as though she gave no thought to it at all, tucking it behind her ears, sweeping it carelessly back from her face."

Does this not beg for more? It could end here, your imagination could fill in the rest. My personal preference is I want more. One more point, not only are these paragraphs descriptions of features, each moves the story alone, each say something about the character’s nature. Who they are or who they want others to perceive them to be.

Do not down play the art of writing descriptively. That is all we really do, we describe people, places, time, and events. Yes, we can even describe the autumn leaves, if in that description we discover something essential about one of our characters, that description become fundamental to our story.

I do think that for short stories, the kind I write here, that kind of description is to lengthy, if I want my readers to visualize my characters, as I see them, then it’s short and sweet, done in a paragraph or two. But that is the voice I have chosen for erotic literature, some of you have chosen other voices. I don’t have the time to waste on descriptive prose, I’d much rather just get to the meat. In a way, I think my choosing that voice has, alone with some other choices I’ve made, detracted from the quality of my erotic writing. Something erotic, written in beautifully flowing descriptive pose should always be the idea.

About the size thing, Sirhugs, we really do have to know the size of our breast, we buy bras. Can you please tell me why most men know the same about their cocks. Is there a sock that’s sized for that little thinky? Come on Sirhugs, you know, you’ve used that tape measure yourself. I’ve even measured some of my men, in most cases I could have cared less, but they wanted me to, and I’m positively sure they had already done so. Average, big or little you men surely know the size of your penises. Which brings me to another point I’d like to make, I’ll do so in a new thread.

 

[Just_John1]

According to Big Texan

Big Texan, as he is giving you here again, gave me some great feedback on a story that I wrote that really stuck with me. In this story, I left the description of the characters somewhat remote, perhaps a little obfuscatory, and got a great response from him. He told me that I gave enough description to create a category but not a specific image, it left some interpretation to the reader. Good on one hand bad on the other.

Some readers don't want the detailed description because it doesn't fit into the fantasy they want to read into any story. Some readers, on the other hand, maybe due to laziness, don't want to have to think, and a less than detailed description forces them to think on their own. I personally have taken Big Tex's advice to heart and try to create a descritpion that will force the image into a general category but which will allow the reader to "see" a unique image. I have found it very challenging to give enough but not too much. I guess its kind of like alcohol, there is never enough, it goes straight from not enough to too much.
JJ1

 

[Chicklet]

is it wrong to try to cater to the readers who want the vague descriptions?

 

[BigTexan]

is it wrong to try to cater to the readers who want the vague descriptions?

I don't think so. In fact, too much description or bad description is, in my opinion, much worse than vague description. However, toeing that invisible line marking "just enough" description will probably satisfy more readers.

And thanks, JJ, for mentioning me

BigTexan

 

[Alex De Kok]

I just re-read a couple of my stories, and I find I'm using less description now than I used to, and definitely no measurements, although I plead guilty to doing that when I started.

I like to use my imagination and I like my readers to do the same, so I guess I'll continue with a minimum. I do like to give a clue or two, for example in Tell me I can hope the only description I gave of Alison was -

"She turned and walked away and I watched the long red hair swing and that tight round swimmer's ass of hers rolling in her snug denim skirt. The waitress had to speak three times before she caught my attention, but she was smiling."

- I think that was just enough to help visulalise, but not so much that I imposed my own vision on the reader, and that's the sort of description I like to read, too, as we all have our own mental pictures.

Alex