"I'll trade votes with you"

[3113]

Who is Chucky???

You is late, Joey-Boy! Go back to da first page. Charley covered that.

 

[Aurora Black]

I don't care how this makes me sound, because I feel the need to say it.

Sure, we're reacting to this topic with outraged gasps and grimaces, but doesn't this sort of thing already happen in the AH at some level?

I addressed this in my thread "What Drives You," (a thread which was ignored by many for the two days it was on the first page. Hmm, maybe everyone was struck blind in a freak accident at the time.) but I'll reinerate my point here.

We already trade votes by voting for our friends while we slight others that don't belong to our circle, and that's unfair. All the rumors about the AH are true: we really are cliquey as hell, and that saddens me. It's been said many times that Internet communities are miniature versions of the real ones, and that's accurate. Like real life, we as people are attracted to those of like mind and interests while closing ourselves to those who deviate from that social pattern.

I don't consider myself to be a part of any circle; I try my damnedest to be open to everyone no matter their background or beliefs, and that's also how I read stories (when I'm not busy writing). I admit that I do place my friends in higher priority, but I also read the works of new members and of those with whom I don't normally have the pleasure of interacting with on the forum.

To make a long story short (too late, I know), reading/voting for the works of only a handful of close people is severely limiting, not just to the person's reading enjoyment and experience (For example, I improve my writing skills with each story I read, and I wouldn't be able to do that if I stuck with just one author or genre) but it also eliminates opportunities to meet new people.

Anyway, that's my opinion on it. As always, it can be either listened to or discarded. Whatever.

 

[joeys-game]

You is late, Joey-Boy! Go back to da first page. Charley covered that.

Goddamn it..she did too..and i know a chuckie..lol

So youse guys need help with dis here job?

 

[cloudy]

I don't care how this makes me sound, because I feel the need to say it.

Sure, we're reacting to this topic with outraged gasps and grimaces, but doesn't this sort of thing already happen in the AH at some level?

I addressed this in my thread "What Drives You," (a thread which was ignored by many for the two days it was on the first page. Hmm, maybe everyone was struck blind in a freak accident at the time.) but I'll reinerate my point here.

We already trade votes by voting for our friends while we slight others that don't belong to our circle, and that's unfair. All the rumors about the AH are true: we really are cliquey as hell, and that saddens me. It's been said many times that Internet communities are miniature versions of the real ones, and that's accurate. Like real life, we as people are attracted to those of like mind and interests while closing ourselves to those who deviate from that social pattern.

I don't consider myself to be a part of any circle; I try my damnedest to be open to everyone no matter their background or beliefs, and that's also how I read stories (when I'm not busy writing). I admit that I do place my friends in higher priority, but I also read the works of new members and of those with whom I don't normally have the pleasure of interacting with on the forum.

To make a long story short (too late, I know), reading/voting for the works of only a handful of close people is severely limiting, not just to the person's reading enjoyment and experience (For example, I improve my writing skills with each story I read, and I wouldn't be able to do that if I stuck with just one author or genre) but it also eliminates opportunities to meet new people.

Anyway, that's my opinion on it. As always, it can be either listened to or discarded. Whatever.

You do have a point. However....Bel said something several months back that has stuck with me, because it's true. Most of us have limited time to be able to read stories here at Lit. There are certain authors that we know will give us a good "return on investment." They are the ones we've read before; that we know we will most likely enjoy what they've written. And, the AH has some incredible talent, so most likely some of those authors that we know we'll enjoy are those that post here.

Do I read every single work by every single author that posts here? Not even close. There's some that I'll read every thing they put out - like Colly, for example. There are others here that I have yet to read a single story.

While I think your criticism is valid, to a point, I also think it's not quite as bad as you make it out to be. I think the outrage was directed at what seemed to be blackmail...."give me a 5 on mine, or I'll go downvote all of yours."

 

[Tom Collins]

I don't care how this makes me sound, because I feel the need to say it.

Sure, we're reacting to this topic with outraged gasps and grimaces, but doesn't this sort of thing already happen in the AH at some level?

I addressed this in my thread "What Drives You," (a thread which was ignored by many for the two days it was on the first page. Hmm, maybe everyone was struck blind in a freak accident at the time.) but I'll reinerate my point here.

We already trade votes by voting for our friends while we slight others that don't belong to our circle, and that's unfair. All the rumors about the AH are true: we really are cliquey as hell, and that saddens me. It's been said many times that Internet communities are miniature versions of the real ones, and that's accurate. Like real life, we as people are attracted to those of like mind and interests while closing ourselves to those who deviate from that social pattern.

I don't consider myself to be a part of any circle; I try my damnedest to be open to everyone no matter their background or beliefs, and that's also how I read stories (when I'm not busy writing). I admit that I do place my friends in higher priority, but I also read the works of new members and of those with whom I don't normally have the pleasure of interacting with on the forum.

To make a long story short (too late, I know), reading/voting for the works of only a handful of close people is severely limiting, not just to the person's reading enjoyment and experience (For example, I improve my writing skills with each story I read, and I wouldn't be able to do that if I stuck with just one author or genre) but it also eliminates opportunities to meet new people.

Anyway, that's my opinion on it. As always, it can be either listened to or discarded. Whatever.

I don't think it's the vote swapping, per se, that has people riled, Rora. I think it's the fact that the person down voted the stories because they couldn't get a garantee of a 5 vote from Stella.

 

[Aurora Black]

I see.

 

[Roxanne Appleby]

This reminds of a event reported by author Christopher Hitchens on his blog:

I receive lots of threats in one form or another, but the following has a peculiar interest in that it is signed. The website of the Atlantic Monthly received the following posting at 12.44 a.m. on 18 July:

"Christopher Hitchens will be executed at 12.00 noon GMT on 20 July" The communication was followed, perhaps inadvertently, by the name joshjackson2009@yahoo.com I have to say that I admire his punctiliousness in respect of Greenwich time.

I have written to Mr Jackson to say that I shall be unable to keep the appointment and that he will have to reschedule it. I have also advised him that in cases of this kind I like to know details about place of employment, social security number, credit rating, family connections and all the rest of it. He has not thus far responded. If any readers have any light to shed, I would be grateful to hear from them.
Christopher Hitchens

Might your "vote trader" be the same person?

 

[Aurora Black]

This reminds of a event reported by author Christopher Hitchens on his blog

Now that's just sick.

 

[Honey123]

that just sucks Stella....

 

[Selena_Kitt]

And, the AH has some incredible talent, so most likely some of those authors that we know we'll enjoy are those that post here.

I also wonder this... if people who really write because of the LOVE of writing... and who are "serious" (as we can get, on a porn board? ) about writing... will eventually find their way here to the AH?

That's not entirely true of course... there are some amazing authors out there on Lit who don't frequent the boards at all...

but I think a lot of the "really good ones" DO show up here...

which I guess makes this an elitist community, in some ways... as has been said in the past... but it's not an exclusive elitist community, at least as I see it...

I've never seen anyone NOT welcomed here, ever. Even when they were being an ass (myself included ) That doesn't smack of exclusivity to me.

 

[NoJo]

When I started posting here I had a ton of "authorly" questions, and was very keen to learn how to write. Because I got such a friendly and helpful response from people, I've hung out here on and off, ever since.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I also wonder this... if people who really write because of the LOVE of writing... and who are "serious" (as we can get, on a porn board? ) about writing... will eventually find their way here to the AH?

That's not entirely true of course... there are some amazing authors out there on Lit who don't frequent the boards at all...

but I think a lot of the "really good ones" DO show up here...

which I guess makes this an elitist community, in some ways... as has been said in the past... but it's not an exclusive elitist community, at least as I see it...

I've never seen anyone NOT welcomed here, ever. Even when they were being an ass (myself included ) That doesn't smack of exclusivity to me.

I like to think that the authors I know from AH will give me, at least, a better chance of a good read!
And I know for a fact that my time here has made me a better writer, the story in question was vetted by three people that I would never have known otherwise.

And, once in a rare while, I've been able to browse, and sometimes I've found a writer that should be here, and I've sent feedback inviting them. I don't know if any one has come at my invite, though..

As far as voting policy, mine is always the same- I vote a minimum of 4.5, and I only vote if the story merits it- I admit it, I've given ones when the story is THAT bad- when there is no skill, no imagination, no hot sex. No skill but intent and desire- that's okay with me, yanno? It doesn't get me off, but I wouldn't vote down- or at all- on a story like that.

Most of my votes do go to AH-ers, because those are the people who have links in their siggies, and I'm lazy that way Sometimes someone will say something that intrigues me and I go check out their work.

 

[duddle146]

Voting solution...

How wonderful to read everyone's entries on this thread.

Because I have been helped and encouraged by so many writers and yes, readers; I have adopted an imperfect solution to a less-than-perfect situation. First, if I can find any spare time during most days, I try to read several stories. Because of the frustration at the ruthlessness of having One-Bombers knock out my first story, I decided I wasn't going to do that to anyone.

If I finish a story - it gets a 5. If I don't finish the story - I don't vote. If they have problems such as grammer and spelling, I will write them a note in the Miscellaneous Feedback Box. This is so I won't embarrass them. After all, who the hell am I to embarrass anyone. When I first started, and sometimes no doubt even yet, I make plenty of mistakes of all sorts.

The simple truth is I like writers of all genre and feel honored to be a part of the Literotica Group. It's sounds silly, but I really take such great pleasure when I can vote and perhaps leave a personal comment.

While my approach is an imperfect one, perhaps in some way it can make up for the attack of the trolls, on writers who have spent hours writing a story for all of us to read. Their time spent has to mean something.

 

[Aurora Black]

Interesting system, but...

What if you finish a story and you don't feel that it's 5 material, Bill? What then?

 

[Stella_Omega]

and NOW I know why I started this thread!
I've gotten some thoughtful and real feedback, and two offers for editing, and if these kind people come through- a couple of my stories will be that much closer to perfection.

 

[kendo1]

I tend not to vote at all.
If someone asks me to read a story, I will. And I'll give an honest vote.
It doesn't depend on who the authour is.

If I have helped with proofing/editing I will not vote on the story.
I don't think that is ethical.

Ken

 

[minsue]

Stella, if you haven't already, you can also use the "report this story" feature and explain what happened in the box there. It's the easiest way for them to sweep a specific story for invalid/illegal votes.

I don't care how this makes me sound, because I feel the need to say it.

Sure, we're reacting to this topic with outraged gasps and grimaces, but doesn't this sort of thing already happen in the AH at some level?

I addressed this in my thread "What Drives You," (a thread which was ignored by many for the two days it was on the first page. Hmm, maybe everyone was struck blind in a freak accident at the time.) but I'll reinerate my point here.

We already trade votes by voting for our friends while we slight others that don't belong to our circle, and that's unfair. All the rumors about the AH are true: we really are cliquey as hell, and that saddens me. It's been said many times that Internet communities are miniature versions of the real ones, and that's accurate. Like real life, we as people are attracted to those of like mind and interests while closing ourselves to those who deviate from that social pattern.

I don't consider myself to be a part of any circle; I try my damnedest to be open to everyone no matter their background or beliefs, and that's also how I read stories (when I'm not busy writing). I admit that I do place my friends in higher priority, but I also read the works of new members and of those with whom I don't normally have the pleasure of interacting with on the forum.

To make a long story short (too late, I know), reading/voting for the works of only a handful of close people is severely limiting, not just to the person's reading enjoyment and experience (For example, I improve my writing skills with each story I read, and I wouldn't be able to do that if I stuck with just one author or genre) but it also eliminates opportunities to meet new people.

Anyway, that's my opinion on it. As always, it can be either listened to or discarded. Whatever.

I quite agree about the unspoken vote trading here on the AH. I think in most cases it's subconscious, but it most certainly exists. I'm not sure what can be done about it other than try to be as honest as possible with the voting. I know there have been times when I voted on a friend's story when I had to stop and ask myself, "Would I be giving this a 5 (or 4, or 3, etc) if it had been written by a complete stranger?"

Cliques exist, as well, of course. It's human nature. I'm sure I can validly be accused of being clique-ish, but it's never intentional. People simply connect with some more than they do with others. Anyone who spends enough time with a given group of people is going to find that there are some that they are closer to than others whether they try to or not.

 

[Aurora Black]

Stella, if you haven't already, you can also use the "report this story" feature and explain what happened in the box there. It's the easiest way for them to sweep a specific story for invalid/illegal votes.


I quite agree about the unspoken vote trading here on the AH. I think in most cases it's subconscious, but it most certainly exists. I'm not sure what can be done about it other than try to be as honest as possible with the voting. I know there have been times when I voted on a friend's story when I had to stop and ask myself, "Would I be giving this a 5 (or 4, or 3, etc) if it had been written by a complete stranger?"

Cliques exist, as well, of course. It's human nature. I'm sure I can validly be accused of being clique-ish, but it's never intentional. People simply connect with some more than they do with others. Anyone who spends enough time with a given group of people is going to find that there are some that they are closer to than others whether they try to or not.

I use the "Report" function rather often, I'm sorry to say.

It's rare for me to vote below 5 on stories these days, but when I do, I always explain why.

Yes, I agree that cliques are inevitable, and I never thought of you that way, sweetie.

 

[artisticbiguy]

I got feedback from someone;
They loved my story, and offered to give me a five vote, if I, in return, would give them five votes on some stories that needed them.
I replied that I would gladly read the stories and vote fives if I thought they deserved them, and would not vote at all if I thought not.

The reply came back "have a good life" and my story's rating dropped.

I think the advise "just don't respond to that" is the best option. I admit I've never had someone ask me such a perposterous thing. I don't think I've ever asked someone to vote for any of my stories. I've asked a few authors to read my stories (usually not on lit as I'm not wanting them to vote for me) for the feedback, but I think vote swapping is a bit capitalistic.

 

[artisticbiguy]

Cliques exist, as well, of course. It's human nature. I'm sure I can validly be accused of being clique-ish, but it's never intentional. People simply connect with some more than they do with others. Anyone who spends enough time with a given group of people is going to find that there are some that they are closer to than others whether they try to or not.

I am the same way... though with a friend, if I've been asked to read their work, if I can't give them a 4 or 5, I won't vote at all. I've never voted a 1 on anything as if it was that bad I never got past the 1st paragraph and I won't give a vote on something I didn't read completely. As you can tell, I don't vote often... especially here on lit, as the majority of the stories I start reading never get finished (aka, I don't get to the end)

 

[duddle146]

What if you finish a story and you don't feel that it's 5 material, Bill? What then?

Everyone has their own idea what '5 material' is. If I finish a story it's because I enjoyed it. I fully acknowledge the rating system I've adopted has its imperfections; however, my interest is to encourage not discourage other writer's work.

I must admit I derive a certain amount of pleasure in supporting other writers. If I have constructive suggestions - well, that's where the Miscellaneous Feedback feature can be utilized. After all, other writers have helped me so it's good to give something back.

Where possible, though, I prefer to use the public comment feature.

 

[arienette]

I gave ya a 5 just for putting up with the bullshit, deary.

 

[JRaven]

There is a lot of good advice, many good comments in this thread. Sorry about your delema, Stella. But I'm glad you started this.

My voting system is actually very much like Duddle's. If I don't finish a story because it's that bad, I don't vote at all. If I do finish a story, I'll either 4 vote or 5 vote it. Sometimes, I vote a 5 because of my arousal state. Sometimes I vote a 4 because I had to read a badly typo'd sentence three times to figure out what the author meant. I like to leave positive reinforcement in Public Comments. But I will also sometimes send negative feedback via a signed private feedback.

I belong to a fraternal organization where often times members complain about the cliques within the organization. Aurora's and minsue's comments make me realize that yes, they are inevitable. Thanks ladies.

Jenny

 

[NoJo]

I only vote 5 for stories, and do so with wild abandon