How Embarrassing!

[Stella_Omega]

<snip>

1) OP says, very clearly in the very first post that he did not talk to her beforehand:

...Or should I have spoken to her about it before?

2) he does not say that there was any further conversation of any sort after her text.
3) he does NOT seem to feel badly for her-- he is embarrassed for himself.
4) he calls us "female spitting cobras" for not agreeing that she is unreasonable.

 

[DVS]

He says, very clearly in the very first post that he did not talk to her beforehand:

Yes, but later, he says she approached him so they did talk about something, so I wouldn't drag him through the dirt, alone.

I'd give him the benefit of the doubt. Surely they talked a little. I'm guessing she said something about what she wanted to try and he took it from there. Of course, I could be wrong, but I don't think he just roped her and groped her without much more conversation. There just wasn't enough conversation.

 

[neci]

He says, very clearly in the very first post that he did not talk to her beforehand:

by the same token, she did not talk to him.

one night stand
kinky sex

it's the name calling
and the sleaziness
of sir kid
that would make me want to forget the experience.

 

[Stella_Omega]

There's nothing that leads me to believe she was expecting kink in the first place. She was looking for a sexual encounter with a young man.

OP, DID she talk about kinkiness, before she took you home? Did you?

 

[HottieMama]

There's nothing that leads me to believe she was expecting kink in the first place. She was looking for a sexual encounter with a young man.

Right. Consenting to sex and consenting to kink are two entirely different and separate things. (At least in my world...)

 

[BiBunny]

I think we were expected to give an "Of COURSE you were in the right. What kind of prude was she if she wasn't into that?" kind of response. But I could be wrong. It happens once in a blue moon.

LOL. Can I call 'em, or can I call 'em?

 

[Stella_Omega]

Right. Consenting to sex and consenting to kink are two entirely different and separate things. (At least in my world...)

LOL. Can I call 'em, or can I call 'em?

I am amused by the thematic juxtaposition of your respective avatars:

 

[BiBunny]

I am amused by the thematic juxtaposition of your respective avatars:

LOL!

I'm a huge fan of HM's. I love Hello Kitty, and that one's just plain amazing.

 

[YoungMaster87]

Yes, we did chat, however, I cannot recall exactly what was said. I suppose it was the usual flirtatious vibes and hints you release once you've consumed a couple of drinks. It was probably somewhere along the lines of me teaching her a few things, as opposed to her teaching me.
If I can describe it, it was light/mild bdsm, nothing extreme, and this only occurred near the 'end'.
The initial mutual understanding may have been sex, but I assumed she wouldn't have minded if I stepped it up a touch. Who's to know, right?
To me, she appeared to be loving it, nothing, absolutely nothing led me to believe otherwise. Not the expression on her face nor the words from her mouth revealed the slightest bit of discomfort.
But yes, obviously her after-thoughts/shock were different to "reality."
Next time I'll be more straight-forward..

 

[CutieMouse]

Yes, we did chat, however, I cannot recall exactly what was said. I suppose it was the usual flirtatious vibes and hints you release once you've consumed a couple of drinks. It was probably somewhere along the lines of me teaching her a few things, as opposed to her teaching me.
If I can describe it, it was light/mild bdsm, nothing extreme, and this only occurred near the 'end'.
The initial mutual understanding may have been sex, but I assumed she wouldn't have minded if I stepped it up a touch. Who's to know, right?
To me, she appeared to be loving it, nothing, absolutely nothing led me to believe otherwise. Not the expression on her face nor the words from her mouth revealed the slightest bit of discomfort.
But yes, obviously her after-thoughts/shock were different to "reality."
Next time I'll be more straight-forward..

Yep. That has nothing to do with a woman being "reasonable" or not... Y'all hooked up, had a bit of fun in bed, and in the cold light of morning she went 'Ohhhhhh that was not smart" (for whatever reason). As someone teetering towards the edge of "mature", I don't care how hawt the sex was... Realizing I'd bedded someone just a few years older than my son? Ew. Ew ew ew eeeeeeeewwwwwwwwww!

 

[Stella_Omega]

The initial mutual understanding may have been sex, but I assumed she wouldn't have minded if I stepped it up a touch. Who's to know, right?

Mind if I roll my eyes? A WHOLE FUCKING LOT?

take it from this old butch dyke who has fucked -- and topped-- more women than you ever will:
Always assume you don't know.

Asking is kinda hot, actually, women like hearing questions. We hardly ever hear men asking questions.

"Baby, I really want to spank your sweet ass. Have you ever wanted that? It will feel sooo good... Just exactly as much as you want, and if you tell me to stop, I will. Guarantee."


And stay away from insults with older, recently divorced women on the first date. Even if she claims she wants them. Let her tell you she wants more, rather than that she never wants to see you again.

Next time I'll be more straight-forward..

Good move.

Go, read some books, do some homework on this thing called kink. Don't be reinventing the wheel.

 

[Skytripper]

"Baby, I really want to spank your sweet ass. Have you ever wanted that? It will feel sooo good... Just exactly as much as you want, and if you tell me to stop, I will. Guarantee."

So hot!

 

[bhndblueyes88]

The initial mutual understanding may have been sex, but I assumed she wouldn't have minded if I stepped it up a touch. Who's to know, right?

That's kind of our point dude. Who's to know? How are you to know she wouldn't go running to the cops afterwards? Or that you wouldn't awaken some forcibly-forgotten bout of child or spouse abuse? Or that you'd just plain upset her? Particularly if alcohol is involved, you just can't trust that someone's physical response is equivalent to their emotional/mental response.

 

[DVS]

There's nothing that leads me to believe she was expecting kink in the first place. She was looking for a sexual encounter with a young man.

OP, DID she talk about kinkiness, before she took you home? Did you?

No no no... You people are completely straying away from the point.
Let's get one thing straight - SHE approached me, became interested, and then we ended up back at HER place. It was only later during our 'romantic session' that I took things to the next level. It was 100% consensual, trust me.
She then told me, via text message, that she was unhappy of what had happened.
However, I still feel she is an adult, and should have acted like one.
I enjoyed myself, but it was probably all a bit too much for her, just that one step too far...
And btw Stella, the name is Sir, not kid...;-P

From the tone of his posts, I assume she brought the topic of kink up, but after reading this post again, I'm wondering if that was what he meant when he said he took things to the next level.

But, I think we've hashed and rehashed this. The point is, no matter who instigated and who consented...the point is made that he overstepped his position without communicating with her, and she allowed him to, without saying "no". We don't know whether she enjoyed it at the time and only until later, did she have second thoughts. That does happen. I believe that he understood the situation to be 100% consensual. I also think he thought this, because 1)she didn't stop his advances and 2)her body enjoyed it, to use his words.

Yes, we all know that a body can lie and only someone saying "no" or "yes" does someone know they want it. But that goes back to the original point of communication. Everything would have turned out better, if they would have communicated more. It takes two to communicate so she could have brought up what she liked and didn't like, too.

I'd say he was about 60% at fault, being the male and more dominant of the two, and she was approximately 40% at fault. In my experiences, most mature women (while some can be kinky) won't show their kinky side during the first encounter. They are too reserved for that. Divorcees, especially. The more they get to know you, they open up to um...stimuli. But, she can't read his mind to know what he intended to try with her (when he took it to the next level) and he couldn't have known if she would have enjoyed that or not, because he didn't know if she was a reasonable woman.

YoungMaster, feel free to correct any of this that I have wrong. I'm not trying to railroad you. I think you know by now that your biggest error was not communicating. But, you are not the first. It happens a lot. And because you didn't communicate, YOU could have been seen by authorities as the bad guy, if she had been so inclined. Domestic cases tend to go that way. Charges probably wouldn't have stuck, but you'd at least have the hassle of "going downtown" with the guys in blue and spending some time in a holding cell with a guy named Bubba.

So, what's the moral to this story? COMMUNICATE, PEOPLE! DUH!

Kinky fun can be amazing, when you both know you enjoy the same things.

 

[HottieMama]

Asking is kinda hot, actually, women like hearing questions. We hardly ever hear men asking questions.

"Baby, I really want to spank your sweet ass. Have you ever wanted that? It will feel sooo good... Just exactly as much as you want, and if you tell me to stop, I will. Guarantee."

Really hot, actually...

And stay away from insults with older, recently divorced women on the first date. Even if she claims she wants them. Let her tell you she wants more, rather than that she never wants to see you again.

As someone who is "older," and very recently divorced, I can say that you NEVER fully know what she went through in her marriage, because chances are on a first date she's NOT talking about the down and dirty details of it or of her divorce. Better to not say anything at all, than to ruin some potential fun by saying the wrong thing at the wrong time. I really, really, REALLY like verbal humiliation. However, if it occurred out of the blue, it would leave me cold and ruin my "fun" and therefore yours as well.

 

[FurryFury]

I'll just throw this out there too. There are certain people that only have sex when they are "impaired" so they can regret it and not really have consented (which in the bible belt is evil, btw), to it. They "always" regret it the next day and rarely will see you again when this happens. Society often encourages this crap and there was a time when I was prone to that sort of thing though I never actually had PIV sex back then, myself.

 

[Stella_Omega]

From the tone of his posts, I assume she brought the topic of kink up, but after reading this post again, I'm wondering if that was what he meant when he said he took things to the next level.

See, that's so funny because I didn't see one single clue that she said one single word about kink.

In fact, he says:

Yes, we did chat, however, I cannot recall exactly what was said. I suppose it was the usual flirtatious vibes and hints you release once you've consumed a couple of drinks. It was probably somewhere along the lines of me teaching her a few things, as opposed to her teaching me.

BDSM is not something you do with a casual bar encounter. In fact I have turned down women who came and squirmed in my face trying to goad me into slapping them. And been glad I did it, too. If she can't TELL me that she wants a little bit of my kind of abuse, I will not assume she does. I won't do her work for her.

 

[Chiara_searches]

The initial mutual understanding may have been sex, but I assumed she wouldn't have minded if I stepped it up a touch. Who's to know, right?

I can't find the exact quote but it goes something like this: "Don't assume. You make an ass out of u and me."

 

[koalakutie]

.....

 

[Stella_Omega]

I dunno, koalakutie, that's a whole lot of "probably" and supposition.

And you know-- the odds of some dame in a bar having read this forum when she isn't even thinking about kink in the first place? Astronomical.

We will hope the kid is better than that. I kinda think he is, actually.

 

[koalakutie]

.....

 

[Curious_in_Cali]

We will hope the kid is better than that. I kinda think he is, actually.

Yes. Beautiful.

~~


SO many great points made, this thread has been interesting to read.

That said, all I want to add is that I am left a bit unsettled as I am not sure that I agree that divorcees of any age need more consideration or neatly fit a stereotype than any other random person. The quote "Be kinder than necessary as everyone is waging some kind of war" comes to mind. Yes, everyone. You have no idea the true path someone has walked to meet you in that raw and naked moment that falls somewhere on the spectrum of sex and fucking, regardless of whether it has been seasoned with BDSM or not.

Many if not most of us have wounds and scars of varying degrees that impact all different aspects of ourselves, including our sexuality, which is why compassion is so critical in relating to one another. I think these can be more visible in these sexually charged interactions, but not any more common than say, in the abstinent population. That said, I am not an advocate of approaching life from the mindset of a victim and defining yourself as an exception, but truth be told pain is pain and healing is a choice and a process that happens at different times and different ways for different people. Yes, divorce can be horrid, but so can so many other things that people have walked through.

That and what is up with this "older" label... what does that even mean? *ducks her head for using the "L" word again* hehe

 

[Stella_Omega]

The quote "Be kinder than necessary as everyone is waging some kind of war" comes to mind.

And that is a very good point.

 

[bhndblueyes88]

We will hope the kid is better than that. I kinda think he is, actually.

I was rather inclined to be on his side at first, and assume this was just the usual "beginner's miscommunication"...but I couldn't abide by the attitude he displayed as people discussed the issues he raised. If he was just getting his feathers ruffled and turns out to be a decent fellow, that's fair enough. However, that's not how he came off. He came off like BiBunny called it. He seems to be being a bit more reasonable now. So hey, if he shows himself to be better than this impression, I'm willing to let him change my mind!