History became myth, myth became legend...

[Frimost]

That line from Lord of The Rings, and the whole premisis of a magical ring found after thousands of years, throught to be a fairy tale, a myth, there are MANY similiar "magical" items in the annals of history of mankind which became myths and legends.

makes you wonder dosn't it? The other line as well, about how The World has changed, and how much that once was is lost for none now live who remember it...

Part of Asian thinking, and of Robert E. Howards and HP Lovecrafts thinking was that mankinds history is cyctrical and acheology bears that out as truth to some point.

Have you ever wondered if sometime back in history, perhaps even before written history there was really a time when REAL magic REALLY did exist instead of the smoke and mirrors BULLSHIT of Copperfirld and his cohorts.

Maybe somewhere, sometime an acheolgist will uncover some ancient palace or stronghold with some kind of item similiar to Master Ring of the Lord of The Rings trilogy, unleashing some kind of destructive power or army upon us...

Now that I think of it sounds similiar to many of the Indiana Jones storylines as well.

But have you ever thought "what if" about that kind of stuff? Maybe much of what we think of reality and unreality is dependant upon the times we live in and much of what we take for granted is shaped by the times and age we live in.

Sauron reminds me of Satan, and what they go through kind of reminds me of some of the preditions of Armageddon (which I am sure was itentional when JRR Tolkein was writting it).

I don't know, I WANT to believe in real magic but I also have a scientific mind to some extant that requires some proof for a real validation of its existance. However, as much as most of what people believed back in Mideval times were silly supersticians I cannot discount ALL legends and myths unless I was THERE to disprove them myself and there are LOTS of them from antiquity in many cultures.

 

[phrodeau]

You have a scientific mind because you have a larger knowledge base than any ancestor. Our ancestors may have been our equals in intelligence, but without the knowledge base imagination takes over.

It's easy to believe in magic if you don't have a basic knowledge of how things work.

 

[Lasz]

When I hear that line I think of Camelot.

Do we know it exisisted? It is a legend yet it could be true.

 

[Frimost]

Yes and no, much was superstition, supposition, and raw ignorance. But, like for a myth-if a wizard can shoot fire from his hands, or turn stuff to gold with but a touch, or be immortal and not age-THEN that is either magic (if there’s any truth to it) or utilizing a force or technology beyond OUR comprehension today.

 

[Frimost]

There are lots of other legendary lands as well, Shangri-La, Atlantis...I found that many of the lands of Conan's world-the coutries in the book where are real legendary lands as well (Hyperborea, Vanaheim, Aquilonia, ect.).

 

[Weevil]

Part of Asian thinking, and of Robert E. Howards and HP Lovecrafts thinking was that mankinds history is cyctrical and acheology bears that out as truth to some point.

Your pseudo-intellectual Dungeons and Dragons post aside what the hell does this sentence mean? What the hell is cyctrical?

 

[Frimost]

Cyctrical, as in cycles, the rise and fall of mankind's civilizations. How advancements are inevitably lost to war-how at times we take steps backwards, regress in knowledge, lose methods, technology, and philosophy to decadence and ignorance. How The Great Roman civilizations soon became feudal primitive constituent kingdoms and many things, once known were forgotten or destroyed. The Burning of the Great Library of Alexandria, the sacking of Carthage, Rome, ect. Things, great things that we could once accomplish we can no longer, or lack the vision, determination, and grandiose ideals to even try to compete with. The Great Lighthouse, the Colossus of Rhodes, the pyramids of Giza, the hanging gardens of Babylon…Those feats, accomplished with less-less people, less money, less technology…Why do we settle for mediocrity? Why do we shake our heads at such feats of labor and dedication but not even consider rivaling them? Ever since the 70’s, with the technology of reinforced steel rods imbedded in concrete we have had the CAPABILITY to build a tower higher than a mile high, but have not DONE so because they (architects) figured it would take the elevator too long to make it to the top floor. Do you think the Chinese procrastinated over such trivial problems before building the wall?

 

[Weevil]

Ah, you meant cyclical.

English Language Buddy says take remedial classes.

 

[Ms_Lilith]

Ah, you meant cyclical.

English Language Buddy says take remedial classes.

Thank you, that was going to be my correction.


Now then, I do believe that there was a time when magic.. real magic... existed. I believe in spells and power, and healing stones, and all kinds of things. I do believe some of it still exists today, but it's lost its followers to cynicism. And when i speak of magic, I don't mean modern wicca, or something like that. I mean real, deep in the blood magic. I think you just need to search deep into people to find it.

 

[Frimost]

Thank you, that was going to be my correction.


Now then, I do believe that there was a time when magic.. real magic... existed. I believe in spells and power, and healing stones, and all kinds of things. I do believe some of it still exists today, but it's lost its followers to cynicism. And when i speak of magic, I don't mean modern wicca, or something like that. I mean real, deep in the blood magic. I think you just need to search deep into people to find it.

Well in that case I think we should go on a date, or have a good chat at a local bar-we would have allot to talk about.

 

[Weird Harold]

I don't know, I WANT to believe in real magic but I also have a scientific mind to some extant that requires some proof for a real validation of its existance. However, as much as most of what people believed back in Mideval times were silly supersticians I cannot discount ALL legends and myths unless I was THERE to disprove them myself and there are LOTS of them from antiquity in many cultures.

I don't recall Arthur C Clarke's Exact words, but he said something like, "Any science that is sufficiently advanced is indistinguishable from magic."

It's entirely possible that at some time in the past humanity had science "sufficiently advanced" that later, degenerate, societies remembered as "Magic." Eric Von Daniken is conviced that legends of "Magic" are the result of primitive human's contact with advanced alien travelers.

The cyclic nature of the universe is a common premise in Science Fiction/Fantasy literature -- Tolkien, Howard, Robert Jordan, Moorcock, and many, many others have based their writings on such a premise -- I seriously doubt any of them actually belive it to be true, but it does provide a universe where "magic" works.

One interesting viewpoint -- agin often used as a premise in Science Fiction/Fantasy -- is that the laws of nature work according to our understanding of them: Once, there were only the four elements -- Earth, Air, Fire and Water -- but acceptance of new theories changed the universe to fit the concept of the periodic table; Once the Earth really was flat but enough people began to believe that it was not flat that it became a sphere; etc. By that theory, Magic once worked, but when people began to believe it was only trickery, it actually became trickery and sleight-of-hand. Perhaps the explanation that there is too much iron in our modern world for Magic and Magical Creatures to exist any longer is actual fact instead of a literary device?

 

[scylis]

alchemists once saught to turn lead into gold. in our advanced state of technology, we can now turn gold into lead.

when i think of this, my sleeping body smiles.

 

[phrodeau]

Consider the biblical account of Moses and the liberation of the Hebrew slaves from Egypt. There's quite a lot of magic there. Is it to be believed?

Is the ancient kingdom of Israel part of history, myth or legend? How about Eden?