Here we go again"Death Panels. Global something & Net Neutrality...

[amicus]

Even with the last Congress adjourned, government regulatory agencies are hard at work before the next Congress is seated in January.

Taken out of the Healthcare bill, 'end of life counselling' is back, by the back door, or course, with primary care physicians being reimbursed by Medicare to provide once a year advice to elders concerning their last days on earth. I think I heard Health and Humans Services slipped it back in as a 'cost saving measure', in that most of medicare funds are expended in the final two to six months of life, and your government would prefer you opt out of that final half year of life to save a buck. Goodbye granny! Now if that ain't a Death Panel, just what the hell would you like to call it? British Pragmatism?

The FCC is trying to implement 'net neutrality', in which the government decides how the internet runs instead of the private market. Critics note that the FCC has absolutely no authority over the internet , but that doesn't seem to be slowing them in the least.

In the 70's, and folks, I ain't shuckin' & 'Jivin' ya, 97% of climate scientists agreed that nasty old man was polluting the atmosphere and was definitely bringing about Global Cooling, The Sky is Falling!

Uhoh, a few short decades later, 97% of all climate scientists agree that nasty old man is polluting the atmosphere and was absolutely responsible for, ready for this...Global Warming! The Sky is Falling!!!

But wait...there's more! Now, you can have both cooling and warming for the price of one! Whoopdefuckin' do! But wait! If you call right now, you can be the first to join with the new age guru's, THE CLIMATE CHANGE EXPERTS! At no extra charge, you get an 8X10 Glossy of Al, the Pal, Gorey!

The planet has been gradually warming since the last Ice Age passed into history, some 14,000 years ago. And ya know what? Mankind had nary a thing to do with it and still does not.

In the meantime, the trillions of dollars invested globally to halt Global Cooling in its' tracks and then in Global Warming, subsidizing 'alternative', more expensive, unreliable wind and solar power, and taxing the energy companies that do work and provide electricity. Curtailing fossil fuel exploration, discovery and exploitation, all your energy bills are going up; gasoline just topped $3.00 a gallon and is predicted to reach $5.00 in the next 18 months and crude oil is on the climb again, topping $91.00 a bbl.

Are you people really that stupid?

Hmmph! Buy you books and buy you books and all you do is lick the covers and eat the pages!

Amicus

 

[sr71plt]

Scared the government is going to ask for renumeration of the health care they've underwritten for you, having found you haven't even paid taxes for 40 years?

 

[DeeZire]

....Taken out of the Healthcare bill, 'end of life counselling' is back, by the back door, or course, with primary care physicians being reimbursed by Medicare to provide once a year advice to elders concerning their last days on earth. I think I heard Health and Humans Services slipped it back in as a 'cost saving measure', in that most of medicare funds are expended in the final two to six months of life, and your government would prefer you opt out of that final half year of life to save a buck. Goodbye granny! Now if that ain't a Death Panel, just what the hell would you like to call it? British Pragmatism?....

It's not a death panel, it's a consultation between patient and care-giver, so the patient can make clear his/her wishes regarding end-of-life care. The death panel is in Arizona, where Gov Jan Brewer, a right wing ideologue, has cut funding for Medicaid-funded organ transplants - the result being the pending death of at least 100 people. So much for the sanctity of human life, eh Ami?

There are also death panels at every private health insurance plan, disallowing life-saving medical procedures based on pre-existing conditions or "inconsistencies" found in the application process - inconsistencies that didn't stop these health insurance companies from collecting premiums for years - until the claimant needed the insurance.

Funny you should mention Medicare. Are you ever going to address your hypocrisy in accepting "socialized medicine" while not paying for it, or are you too much of a coward to explain yourself? Come on, Ami, make something up. Use a lot of big words. Wrap yourself in the flag of freedom. Get all indignant and blustery. You do it so well.

 

[Liar]

The FCC is trying to implement 'net neutrality', in which the government decides how the internet runs instead of the private market. Critics note that the FCC has absolutely no authority over the internet , but that doesn't seem to be slowing them in the least.

It's about truth in advertising. The internet is the internet is the internet. Niether you, me, Verizon or the FCC should get to redefine it. And the FCC is not, but Verizon et al is trying to.

I can't sell you rat piss and call it "milk". The ISPs shouldn't be able to sell tiered access to arbitrary selections of a carrier neutral system of nodes and call it "internet".

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

AMICUS et al

Its 16 degrees here in Schlubville this morning. If you have any global warming to spare, can I borrow a cup of it?

Yesterday I read an article by an MD and healthinsurance executive about death panels. His wife has terminal cancer, and he praises the professional advice she got to stop expensive interventions. We wont call such advice DEATH PANEL, but we'll require MDs to restrict expensive interventions by refusing to pay for them. And MDs wont order anything they dont get paid for. The money is the death panel.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

It's about truth in advertising. The internet is the internet is the internet. Niether you, me, Verizon or the FCC should get to redefine it. And the FCC is not, but Verizon et al is trying to.

I can't sell you rat piss and call it "milk". The ISPs shouldn't be able to sell tiered access to arbitrary selections of a carrier neutral system of nodes and call it "internet".

Youre correct.

The internet is designed for use by virtually any and all operating systems. Regardless of what system I use, my ISP must accommodate me for accessing the web. But some ISPs wanna restrict access to competitors, and Verizon is their king. MSN and AOL tried the same crap back in the early 90s with the instant messaging.

 

[oggbashan]

My youngest daughter works as a doctor in two hospices.

She does "end of life counselling" every week. It is never about assisted suicide but about how to make the end of life as comfortable as is feasible, and how to make the most of the remaining days/weeks of life.

The patients know they are in the hospice, or visiting the hospice, because they are terminally ill. The staff can help to make the last days/weeks as comfortable as possible, using medication that would not be possible for someone expected to survive (This drug can cause addiction for life/damages organs/has long-term side-effects - who cares if life is measured in days!) and help the patient and their loved ones come to terms with the impending event.

We all have to die. Discussing the options about how we die can be helpful, not just for the person who is ill, but for the family.

Og

 

[amicus]

Damnit, Liar, Christ, the Internet ain't broke, don't try to fix it!

A free market means just that, free, free to compete and hell yes competing entrepreneurs will try any ploy to 'one-up' the competition.

You fucking Euro's just don't get freedom, do you?

You don't understand the magnificence of the 'invisible hand' that guides human affairs and you are so fucking sure, that if only you controlled everything, everything would be so much better. How fucking stupid can you be?

How many examples of failed, controlled societies and economies do you need before you finally get it?

Kiss my bony butt!

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

AMICUS

You come across as a yahoo cuz you aint yet learned that business is in bed with government. The real model is more along the lines of prohibition where booze competition was reduced to a few suppliers with most of government on their payroll.

 

[amicus]

My youngest daughter works as a doctor in two hospices.

She does "end of life counselling" every week. It is never about assisted suicide but about how to make the end of life as comfortable as is feasible, and how to make the most of the remaining days/weeks of life.

The patients know they are in the hospice, or visiting the hospice, because they are terminally ill. The staff can help to make the last days/weeks as comfortable as possible, using medication that would not be possible for someone expected to survive (This drug can cause addiction for life/damages organs/has long-term side-effects - who cares if life is measured in days!) and help the patient and their loved ones come to terms with the impending event.

We all have to die. Discussing the options about how we die can be helpful, not just for the person who is ill, but for the family.
Og

~~~

Not a simple issue, Oggbashan, in our modern era where we actually have choices which we did not have before.

My mother had a disabling heart attack and the 'family' insisted she be put in a 'nursing home'...she begged me, the oldest of her children, to not do that.

And so, I cared for her..for five years and 59 visits to the emergency room until she no longer wanted to live. A family member called your, "Hospice". and you gloss over the true nature of the organization.

If you don't really know the procedure...well, that is one thing...if you do know, as I do, and evade it....well...

Hospice is a morphine induced coma which starves the patient to death without intravenous feeding or hydration.

I left. I could not bear to witness the inevitable.

I do not have answers, but I do have values, ethics and morals. I do not know how the final days, weeks and months of life should be managed, but I do know, it should not be a governmental cost/benefit equation applied on a general basis without invidividual consideration.

I know you don't 'get it', Ogg, nor do many here, but the individual, or the family, should be the ultimate arbiter of the end of life; not the fucking government.

As I stated earlier, the last two to six months of life are the most expensive for socialized medicine to fund and cope with. And surely, as the 'final solution' of the Nazi's and the Jews, was no doubt a 'cost effective' solution; what of the humanity? Or has the Great British Empire, upon which the sun never set, lost its' moral and ethical foundation?

For those of you who did not know what the "Hospice" program is all about, do your own search; don't take my word, learn it for yourself.

Amicus

 

[amicus]

AMICUS

You come across as a yahoo cuz you aint yet learned that business is in bed with government. The real model is more along the lines of prohibition where booze competition was reduced to a few suppliers with most of government on their payroll.[/QUOTE]

~~~

And you come across as an embittered old cynic who fails to see the innate goodness of the individual.

The struggle between good and evil is never-ending, and the burden always falls on the present.

If good men do nothing; evil wins.

You need to take sides, you old shit, not just stand on the sidelines and root for the loser.

Amicus

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

AMICUS

You come across as a yahoo cuz you aint yet learned that business is in bed with government. The real model is more along the lines of prohibition where booze competition was reduced to a few suppliers with most of government on their payroll.[/QUOTE]

~~~

And you come across as an embittered old cynic who fails to see the innate goodness of the individual.

The struggle between good and evil is never-ending, and the burden always falls on the present.

If good men do nothing; evil wins.

You need to take sides, you old shit, not just stand on the sidelines and root for the loser.

Amicus

Spare me the cliches from your new 2011 Disiderata calendar. YOU ARE A CHILD OF THE UNIVERSE.....zzzzzzzzz.

I do take sides...my side.

 

[amicus]

Ya Know, James; Cliche's, Anachronisms and Colloquialisms all have their place, otherwise, they wouldn't have a name.

You may not understand or confess...but others do...heh...

 

[oggbashan]

~~~

Hospice is a morphine induced coma which starves the patient to death without intravenous feeding or hydration.

...For those of you who did not know what the "Hospice" program is all about, do your own search; don't take my word, learn it for yourself.

Amicus

That is not a Hospice that anyone in the UK would recognise.

UK Hospices are charitable organisations, supported by the community, that provide pallative care for terminal patients. If they behaved as you suggest, their charitable status would be withdrawn.

Og

 

[amicus]

I cannot speak for the Uk, nor can I confirm that 'Hospice' is an international entity with identical procedures...but I can speak for what I know, and I did.

Amicus

 

[sr71plt]

I cannot speak for the Uk, nor can I confirm that 'Hospice' is an international entity with identical procedures...but I can speak for what I know, and I did.

Amicus

You can't speak for much of anything, Ami. Certainly not how Hospice works in the States.

Why do you care what health care costs?--you're getting for free even without paying your taxes.

 

[cloudy]

That is not a Hospice that anyone in the UK would recognise.

UK Hospices are charitable organisations, supported by the community, that provide pallative care for terminal patients. If they behaved as you suggest, their charitable status would be withdrawn.

Og

Its also not any Hospice here in the U.S. Its a figment of ami's imagination, as most things he rants about are.

 

[DeeZire]

...As I stated earlier, the last two to six months of life are the most expensive for socialized medicine to fund and cope with. And surely, as the 'final solution' of the Nazi's and the Jews, was no doubt a 'cost effective' solution; what of the humanity? Or has the Great British Empire, upon which the sun never set, lost its' moral and ethical foundation?....

Funny you should mention socialized medicine, Ami. You'd be in a hospice right now if it wasn't for the socialized medicine that saved your life - socialized medicine you didn't contribute to. Have you lost your moral and ethical foundation? Why do you get free medical care when you refuse to pay taxes so that others can get free medical care? What of the humanity? If everyone did as you did and didn't pay their taxes, the result would be the same as the "final solution" of the Nazis and Jews, because there would be no money to pay for end of life care.

Amicus, my friend, you are truly lucky to be on so many ignore lists, because you are really looking like a fool at the moment. I mean, you always look like a fool, but today you've topped yourself. Congratulations.

 

[amicus]

Well, hell, they say Death and Taxes are the only certainties in this world; got rid of one, workin' on the other.

Liberal Progressives never bitch about their taxes, they even volunteer to pay more, as long as their tax payer paid salaries rise a corresponding amount.

Such a deal!



amicus...that be me!

 

[Liar]

Damnit, Liar, Christ, the Internet ain't broke, don't try to fix it!

A free market means just that, free, free to compete and hell yes competing entrepreneurs will try any ploy to 'one-up' the competition.

You fucking Euro's just don't get freedom, do you?

You don't understand the magnificence of the 'invisible hand' that guides human affairs and you are so fucking sure, that if only you controlled everything, everything would be so much better. How fucking stupid can you be?

How many examples of failed, controlled societies and economies do you need before you finally get it?

Kiss my bony butt!

So you have no problem with me selling rat piss and calling it milk? Or sugar pills and calling it Aspirin?

Just checking.

I'm all for free competition. Compete with pricing, quality and services. But I draw the line at competing with lies. I prefer a market where the consumer have the opportunity to make informed choices. You obviously don't. And mask it in hyperbolic f-bomb rants about "freedom" and petty ad homimen instead of having a substantial conversation based on facts. Once again you show your charachter.

 

[sr71plt]

Liberal Progressives never bitch about their taxes, they even volunteer to pay more, as long as their tax payer paid salaries rise a corresponding amount.

I think that's because they are able to figure out the benefits of economies of scale in combining to provide services that the individual couldn't possibly have the time or money or expertise to cover for him/herself.

That you are taking advantage of this without doing anything close to your share just points to your selfishness and lack of respect for others. But then, as you post, you are a follower of Ayn Rand.

That doesn't make you any less of a parasitic drone jerk.

 

[amicus]

So you have no problem with me selling rat piss and calling it milk? Or sugar pills and calling it Aspirin?

Just checking.

I'm all for free competition. Compete with pricing, quality and services. But I draw the line at competing with lies. I prefer a market where the consumer have the opportunity to make informed choices. You obviously don't. And mask it in hyperbolic f-bomb rants about "freedom" and petty ad homimen instead of having a substantial conversation based on facts. Once again you show your charachter.[/QUOTE]

Liar, I have no problem with you trying to sell anything you want to; but I do want a video of you milking the rat!

I don't think you are for free competition at all. I think you have a Godlke faith in the ability of the collective, government, to protect you in the market place.

I think you deeply and truly believe that if there were no government regulations, your fellow man might well indeed sellyou rat piss if he could make a profit.

I think you have a poor regard for your fellow man because you have low confidence in your own ability to be free and remain ethically and morally proper.

I don't necessarily fault those who depend on faith for their moral leanings, but I have discovered not to argue with them as reason and rationality are not included in any faith.

I have travelled all over this country, eaten at hundreds of little family owned restaurants in isolated places where the individual, home cooked meal is more safe than all the government regulations concerning food preparation could ever be.

You see, I trust my fellow man to labor in his own rational self interest which includes treating me as he would himself because we mutually depend upon each other NOT to sell rat piss and call it milk.

Your concept or faith in government rules and regulations, creates an atmosphere of distrust where people do cut corners and sell rat piss just to make the quota for the day.

The strange anomaly in your belief that I see, is that the same individual, either making decisions on his own or directed by rules and regulations, is the same human being in both cases.

If you believe that people will only act with integrity when the threat of retaliation enforces the rules and regulations, then I can understand your mindset.

I have worked in a lot of places in many different jobs with many different people. There are always the 'slackers', they usually don't last long, but the very last thing one should do would be to enshrine them in a public union where their lax attitude is rewarded with tenure.

Amicus

 

[DeeZire]

....You see, I trust my fellow man to labor in his own rational self interest which includes treating me as he would himself because we mutually depend upon each other NOT to sell rat piss and call it milk.....

Tell that to my GF's kid, who has leukemia because his mom was working in an unregulated workplace and was exposed to toxic chemicals while she was pregnant. In her case, the self interest of the owner of the company resulted in lax safety procedures for the workers, all for the sake of increased production. The owner of the company profited from the increased production while the workers suffered the consequences. Where is the integrity in that? Come on, Amicus, explain it.

You, my friend, are so full of shit, I'm surprised your forum postings don't show up colored brown.

 

[sr71plt]

You, my friend, are so full of shit, I'm surprised your forum postings don't show up colored brown.

What a good idea to do to his words when you quote him.

 

[amicus]

Where is the integrity in that? Come on, Amicus, explain it.

~~~

Gladly.

But in my own way, if you don't mind.

Growing up in the 1950's and even later, I found it difficult to comprehend how any human being could do what the Nazi's did to other human beings; men, women, old and young, children, infants, all because they were Semites.

Do you know that the pollution of the Love Canal, way back when, was done under government license and inspection?

I would bet that the company you denigrate, was licensed by a government agency, inspected regularly by inspectors, paid City, County, State and Federal Taxes just for the right to 'do business'. I would win that bet, would I not?

The worst and most atrocious violations of human rights is always, always under the aegis of government, that self same government you want to protect you.

It is and always has been and always will be, in the best interest of the Company or the Corporation to provide a safe working environment and to produce safe quality goods. It is not government rules and regulations that protect you in the market place, as I told Liar in another Post, it is your fellow man you must depend on as he must depend on you.

Are their crooks in the world who have no ethical or moral foundations and may well, as Liar put it, 'sell you rat piss and call it milk', yeah, of course there are and all the rules and regulations in the world will not change that, but one honest man can.

The psychological premise here is that when you delegate the authority to function in a moral manner to the collective, then no one has the responsibility to perform in that manner.

Public parks and Public beaches are trashed daily because no individual has the responsibility to keep them clean. But a private beach, a private park, will always be tidy because their is ownership and personal responsibility.

I do not expect you to respond in a civil manner, but I do hope as others browse, that they may be tempted to consider that individual choice leads to humane responsibility while collective enforcement is without honor.

Amicus