gollywog

[pabloback]

after 91 years robertsons have decided to take the golly logo off their products ,they claim to get about 10 complaints a year from people saying that the picture is racist , the debate in this country today has been electrifying, with all opinions for and against from all nationalities

 

[Sensua]

I had a gollywog when I was a kid. It was one of my favorite dolls...and I had a Ragedy Ann.....They were in love, you know.

 

[bluntforcemama]

Good Lord, that thing is scary.

 

[sexy-girl]

of course its racist even the name gollywog is racist its pretty unbelievable that they kept it so long

 

[Angel]

What is a gollywog and why is it racist.


I have no clue what the hell that is.

 

[OUTSIDER]

What is a gollywog and why is it racist.


I have no clue what the hell that is.

The Gollywog or golly as it's now known is supposed to be a black man but like black and white minstral show's it has conotations that make a lot of people uneasy, Robinson Jam's have been using it as their logo for longer than I care to think about but the whole PC thing has knocked it for six so their taking it off their jam's.

BTW, Wog is also a curse word used to describe black people and not a nice thing at all.

On the whole I don't tend to give the golly a second look but it is a shame to see it go, still a new age has new ideas and you have to move with them.

 

[Siren]

it is way overdue

 

[p_p_man]

This is one of those problems...

where the racist aspects of Robertsons Golliwog never occurred to anyone until we were told it was racist by those pressure groups who are meant to promote racial equality but have this knack of cocking everything up because they're too involved in their own political ambition.

As a child (I was one once) the logo used to be a great indicator that what was in the jar was my favourite jam. I couldn't quite get my tongue around the word "Robertsons" so a point with a chubby finger was enough to get what I wanted.

The golliwog was relegated to the back of the jar for a while when those self same pressure groups began their campagn but at least this time old "Golly" has been retired gracefully by Robertsons after years of faithful service rather than being impeached for something he never was!

 

[Angel]

Thanks, Outsider. I didn't know that Wog meant that. Ya learn something new every day.

 

[Siren]

p-p man

 

[p_p_man]

Thanks, Outsider. I didn't know that Wog meant that. Ya learn something new every day.

OUTSIDER was not strictly correct.

In the time between the World Wars when many British colonial administrators were going out to the FAR EAST the term WOG became the euphamism for Western Oriental Gentleman. The term was used to describe Far Eastern and South Eastern citizens in positions of influence and with whom the UK administrators would have to deal. It was a way of differentiating them from the ordinary man in the street.

It had no racial connotations at all.

As a postscript from the same era...

The word POSH (meaning stuck up, a snob) was another euphamism derived from the words Port Out Starboard Home because those were the best sides of the ship on which to have your cabin, on the port side going out and the starboard side on your return.

As they were the best cabins only those with money could afford them, hence the word snob meaning stuck-up.

How wog got into Golli I don't know but as it was the name given to the doll by Robertsons over 90 years ago it was probably a snappy name thought up by someone to sell the jam.

Again no racial connotation.

 

[Angel]

Fuck it, I'll just never cross the damned ocean.

 

[pabloback]

many black people do not see golly as a racist icon [as stated in countless interviews today] , robertsons sell 45,000,000 jars of jam every year and receive on average of 10 complaints , not all of them by ethnic minorities . they have announced in the past thirr to remove golly and have bowed to pressure to reinstate him . this may well be another marketing ploy

 

[p_p_man]

I found this little reference on Google...

"The earliest Golliwog is the hero in books of verse written by Bertha Upton in the 1890's, and illustrated by her daughter Florence. The mother and daughter worked together on twelve illustrated books, all featuring the gallant little character and his adventures traveling to such exotic destinations as Africa and the North Pole, accompanied by his friends, the Dutch Dolls."

The piece goes on to say that later authors made the Golliwog into a rascally character and that together with his dark skin made him politically unacceptable in later years. It doesn't say but by later years I'm assuming from the late 1960s onwards as that is the time of the rise of the various pressure groups.

As pabloback says it does stand to reason that a large number of black families in the UK must buy the product either ignoring any racial meaning the Golly may have or not being aware of it at all.

This is one of those discussions that go around in circles and I'm sure we all think along the same lines. But the only addition I would like to make is that racism and anything portrayed as racial is part and parcel of history and as such should not be swept under the carpet.

Only by discussing and understanding it can we come to terms with it.

 

[OUTSIDER]

OUTSIDER was not strictly correct.

In the time between the World Wars when many British colonial administrators were going out to the FAR EAST the term WOG became the euphamism for Western Oriental Gentleman. The term was used to describe Far Eastern and South Eastern citizens in positions of influence and with whom the UK administrators would have to deal. It was a way of differentiating them from the ordinary man in the street.

It had no racial connotations at all.

As a postscript from the same era...

The word POSH (meaning stuck up, a snob) was another euphamism derived from the words Port Out Starboard Home because those were the best sides of the ship on which to have your cabin, on the port side going out and the starboard side on your return.

As they were the best cabins only those with money could afford them, hence the word snob meaning stuck-up.

How wog got into Golli I don't know but as it was the name given to the doll by Robertsons over 90 years ago it was probably a snappy name thought up by someone to sell the jam.

Again no racial connotation.

The word WOG may have started off as an innocuous acronym but if you were to refer to a person with that term today you'd be pretty sure to end up with either a law suit or a punch in the nose.

 

[p_p_man]

Copied from OUTSIDER's Post:

"The word WOG may have started off as an innocuous acronym but if you were to refer to a person with that term today you'd be pretty sure to end up with either a law suit or a punch in the nose."


That's for sure. Sorry I thought you were saying that it started out that way...

My mistake...

 

[OUTSIDER]

Actually I'd heard the old "Western Oriental Gentleman" thing years ago but never knew weather to believe it or not.

I also heard that the word "Fuck" was a police acronym used to desribe prostitutes way back, it is supposed to stand for "Fornication Using Carnal Knowledge", I don't know if thats true but I have heard it more than once, anybody know weather thats true or not ?

 

[Darowyn]

Fuck is a real word- it occurs in various spellings in Anglo Saxon and Irish Gaelic.
I often wonder if Golliwog is not by an analogy with Pollywog, an old name for a tadpole- big head and little body!
It cannot have been offensive to all black people. I used to see a black sidecar racer regularly at the bike racing circuits. He had an Afro and a big grin, and on his leathers, front and back, he had the body of the Robertsons Golly stretching from neck to waist, , so his own head made the Golly head.
As far as he was concerned it was a wonderful joke, and he was a great character.
Mind you, there are not many black racers anywhere, are there?
Is it just the economic disadvantage? There are some good Middle Eastern Rally drivers, but they are not making much impression on the world championships yet.

 

[lavender]

 

[Weird Harold]

Speaking of the word fuck, I heard this in a European history class and now am not sure of the accuracy. But I heard that FUCK also stood for fornication under the comman of the king? What the hell is that about?

Actually, the most common story for the origin of the spelling of FUCK is that it is a ploice blotter acronym for "For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge."

The word itself is derived from anglo-saxon or germanic roots. Perhaps one of the German speakers can confirm that?

 

[Myrrdin]

the racist aspects of Robertsons Golliwog never occurred to anyone until we were told it was racist

Likewise,,
There has been a debate concerning the word "spastic". This concerns its appropiation, by those who do not suffer from Cerebral Palsy, as a term of contempt. The British Spastic Society has had to rename itself.

The author Enid Blyton was taken off library shelves because her stories contained Golliwogs. (Written before the word evolved in meaning)
Similarly the 1946 "Rupert Annual" contained a story called "Rupert On Coon Island."

http://www.sterlingtimes.co.uk/POLITICALLY_INCORRECT5.htm

 

[sexy-girl]

wog is differnately a racist term ... i remember a black boy at school being teased and called that ... perhaps it depends on where your from in england or age group if you've heard of it used like that

its probably less well used nowadays but in 80's it was used alot

 

[ranajja]

FYI

Okay, I get it...

So, we not only have the "N" word we're not supposed to use... (which I suspect has its roots in a word meaning "black"--and one must be mindful of using the word "niggardly", which is a legitimate, if a bit old-fashioned, word btw, but one of our southern politicians got in a whole mess o' trouble for using it--but I digress)

...we have a "G" word, too?



far be it from me ever to be politically correct..

 

[p_p_man]

Ranajja...If you ever get the chance...

and if they show it on American TV try watching "Til Death Us Do Part".

Extremely popular in the 60's with audience figures into 10s of millions, (extremely unusual for that period), it was watched and enjoyed by people of all class, religion and race.

The central figure was a bigoted man called "Alf Garnett" and if you want to know what the world was like back then, listen to him.

Niggers and wogs are just the beginning...

Many studies were made of the show by academic bodies and most came to the conclusion that its popularity was due precisely because it brought bigotry out in the open. It also went a long way to breaking down racial barriers as it proved people could laugh at the same thing with no animosity associated with their laughter.

The show had a sequel in the 70s when the gay movement was just taking hold.

Alf Garnet had a field day on that one when his home-help sent by the Social Services to help with his disabled wife, was both gay and black. Funny? You really have to watch it to appreciate it.

 

[sexy-girl]

i agree p_p_man but your description doesnt do it justice i couldnt do better either though ... it has to be one of the smart'ist comedy england has produced ... the idea is the joke is alf garnet because of his bigoted ways he is miserable and afraid all the time


unfortunately not everyone got the joke and thought it was promoting racism infact it was doing the opposite


its a W word not a G word ... wog is a curse word ... if you think its ok to use it when you put golly in front of it then i suppose they should of kept it ... but it was differently a curse word british only maybe though