First submission experience...advice? Please?

[eastern sun]

I totally agree that you should listen to your own warning signals. They are your best indicator that something is really wrong, or that you are in danger.

I also agree that checking things out with a group is a valuable way of gaining perspective when you're caught in a whirlwind of contradicting thoughts and emotions. As soon as other people express their perspective, it almost immediately gives you a clearer focus on your own truths.

And I also think you should avoid this person. Specifically, his knowledge that this is your first experience coupled with his insistence that you say you love him within moments of meeting, the discussions about leaving your life within a matter of hours, and his dismissal of your concerns once you raised them, raise a number of warning flags.

The problem is that that kind of manipulation is sometimes what we crave in early submissive relationships. It feels great to release, not only our sexuality, but even our whole identities, into someone else's hands. Like riding the rapids, or free falling, it's just an incredible feeling to let go and feel the strength of this "other" force.

Similarly, I have also found that the clicking of my "danger" buttons can be highly erotic in my BDSM relationships. Linking those spikes of adrenaline with sexual arousal is really intoxicating.

It is also true that the reality of submission does not actually "feel" like the fantasy of submission. Especially when you are faced with moments that challenge your limits. Having doubts and being frightened can be a normal part of a good relationship, especially if you're moving into new territories.

All this means that it can be genuinely difficult in the beginning to sort through the complex feelings and thoughts that are triggered.

Sometimes too we want someone else to take responsibility and care for us better than we do ourselves, but - in the search for that someone - we have to have our best interests in sight at all times.

As you investigate, move slowly enough so that you don't do anything you don't want to do. And never accept the idea that you aren't a "good" submissive if you discover limits you are unwilling to cross. If you find yourself in a situation where you feel uncomfortable, move away and don't doubt yourself. Once you are outside of the situation, you can see it more clearly and determine for yourself whether it is something you want or not. It's only by experiencing yourself in this type of relationship that you discover what you really want.

 

[CutieMouse]

There speaks someone who really doesn't understand what "being submissive" is all about and particularly the issues that Screaminforyou has.

You might consider that a meeting in a public place might pose no danger, but if she was meeting Mr Manipulator Posing As Darling Dom she wouldn't be safe as he could probably persuade her into the back of his van... never to be seen again...

Please think before pontificating next time.......

Actually, I kind of agree with Primalex... If someone answering my personals ad isn't willing to meet within a few weeks (max), I move on. There's no need to chit chat for months and months to ensure ones 'safety'.

Meet in public
Know your boundaries (and how to articulate/enforce them)

The myth that being submissive somehow makes one more vulerable/unable to set boundaries or protect oneself is silly. Submissives don't have to roll over for anyone and everyone; unfortunately many do.

 

[intothewoods]

And I completely disagree with this. If you wait a year before meeting someone, in 99% of the cases you are then 60 years old and alone. There is no danger in real life meeting someone in a public place or CM would have been dead by now. I discard anyone who is unwilling to meet within 4 weeks. 99,99% are fakes who never intend to meet you.

I think this is a really fair point. Meeting in person as soon as possible isn't necessarily a bad thing. You should feel confident enough to turn down a request to jump into the back of his van or whatever. If you aren't, dating anyone is probably a bad idea. Meet for coffee, meet for lunch, etc. Keep it friendly.

 

[intothewoods]

<snip>

The problem is that that kind of manipulation is sometimes what we crave in early submissive relationships. It feels great to release, not only our sexuality, but even our whole identities, into someone else's hands. Like riding the rapids, or free falling, it's just an incredible feeling to let go and feel the strength of this "other" force.

Similarly, I have also found that the clicking of my "danger" buttons can be highly erotic in my BDSM relationships. Linking those spikes of adrenaline with sexual arousal is really intoxicating.

<snip>

I can really relate to this.

 

[Netzach]

And I completely disagree with this. If you wait a year before meeting someone, in 99% of the cases you are then 60 years old and alone. There is no danger in real life meeting someone in a public place or CM would have been dead by now. I discard anyone who is unwilling to meet within 4 weeks. 99,99% are fakes who never intend to meet you.

I absolutely agree with this. Meet as in have coffee, tell yhour friends where you are, public place, don't get in his car the first time normal shit. 4 weeks is a good rule - I also see if they demur when I say "we should have coffee sometime" after the first normal conversation - if they are real life challenged that's more likely than being a serial killer.

And I think this tool sounds more likely to disappear onto the next "I love you" in two weeks after getting girls seriously wound.

 

[Netzach]

There speaks someone who really doesn't understand what "being submissive" is all about and particularly the issues that Screaminforyou has.

I'm Dominant. I'm queer. I don't get to blame everything on my freak flag - why do submissives get to? There are times when a person says "yes officer" or "I'd be happy to help you" there are times when you wear a sleeve over your labrys and "sister power" tattoo - no matter if you're king of the universe in your mind - the idea that you CANNOT be held to any standards of behavior because of your sexual orientation is horseshit. Sorry, it just is. Boundaries can be very hard work - I know because I had to work at mine. Deal.

I like danger and brutality - it doesn't mean I get to abduct men on the way home from work and put them in my trunk and tie them to my radiator at the loft without taming the situation with negotiation and consent.

Sorry, the fact that something makes you hot and happy doesn't release you from the burden of the shit with which we cope as functional adults.

 

[VelvetSin]

I think this is a really fair point. Meeting in person as soon as possible isn't necessarily a bad thing. You should feel confident enough to turn down a request to jump into the back of his van or whatever. If you aren't, dating anyone is probably a bad idea. Meet for coffee, meet for lunch, etc. Keep it friendly.

I can see the merit in this. I think a long distance sort of thing complicates matters like it sounded like for the OP. If someone lived locally, I don't see any reason why I'd wait more than a few weeks to do a meeting for lunch or coffee in a public setting just to get to know someone - something innocent without expectations. If it required spending money on a plane ticket and hotel for that first meeting, I'd expect more "get to know you" online time before an investment is made. It sounded like the OP and her online Dom lived far apart since going to school near him would put her far away from friends and family.

IMO, meeting for a simple thing like deciding if you'd find someone physically repulsive is perfectly okay and a very good idea before going any further. Someone thinking they have any right to make sweeping life changing decisions for me (like moving colleges, moving cross-country away from support system) within hours of speaking to me without ever having seen me in person would set off huge red flags. And we all have instincts for a reason. If the red flags go off, listen to them. At worst, you're passing up something that might have been fun, and at best, you avoid a dangerous person.

 

[Primalex]

There speaks someone who really doesn't understand what "being submissive" is all about and particularly the issues that Screaminforyou has.

I know exactly what her issue is - her issue is that the online fantasy world tempts her so much that she risks her real life. Her problem is not the real world, her problem is the fantasy world and her hormones. Over phone and net your mind fills in all the missing pieces - with things you like, after all it is your mind. If he rants about raping your ass, you still finger your pussy and cum and then you believe this has something to do with BDSM.

If he would have been a stranger in a Starbucks and said those things to her, she would have laughed and walked away.

So don't come here and tell me real life would be her problem and especially don't tell me I would have no clue. There are some people here where I would accept a rebuke from, but not from a story writer who lives 95% of the time in a fantasy world herself.

You might consider that a meeting in a public place might pose no danger, but if she was meeting Mr Manipulator Posing As Darling Dom she wouldn't be safe as he could probably persuade her into the back of his van... never to be seen again...

Exactly HOW would months of chit chat and sexual roleplay prevent this, except that you will have no warning signs any longer because you got used to it when you meet for real?

And what happens when she walks by some construction workers and someone shouts":Hey baby, suck my cock!"?

Your arguments are shallow. Especially as I have known real women who are what you believe she is, women like osg who really will do whatever the guy says. But the virtual world is no safety net for them either.

Playing WII snowboarding 40 hours per week will not prevent that you break your leg in real life snowboarding, if you are not careful.

Please think before pontificating next time.......

Trust me, my brain works good enough.

 

[Primalex]

I like danger and brutality - it doesn't mean I get to abduct men on the way home from work and put them in my trunk and tie them to my radiator at the loft.

Sigged.

 

[Primalex]

unfortunately many do.

Urban legend.

 

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[Primalex]

you are so cruel! I'm only 45! but the OP is talking like it is a long distance thing and so yes, giving time (in my case it was well over a year to meet) is, I think, sensible

The first question is why you pick a long distance relationship in the first place? I mean, if a guy is two years too old he gets sorted out, but if he can't spend time with you, then it's okay, after all there is the internet to stay in touch. How silly is this?

not paranoid sweets. but my dating pre-internet didn't involve me giving over control and agency to the the other party.

Post-pre-internet dating doesn't involve this either.

if you met me a couple of times and were smitten (which is quite possible), would you allow me complete control of your life?

I don't think that you are real, so it's not very likely. And there is no such thing as complete control. Even he didn't have complete control over her and he tried really hard.

I was considering my answer in terms of it being something that was, or seems to be, long distance. if it is something that is done at a remove, then fine, go with it, if not, then exercise caution.

Why should long distance change the caution you need? Rapists with a van are only 'over there'?

point is, if a person has some kind of safety net in place then it is effective in deterring opportunistic would-be-nutters. it is impossible to guarantee total safety but any precautions are better than nothing, right? or are you in favour of vulnerable people going to meet potential predators with no safety net?

THE VIRTUAL WORLD IS NOT A SAFETY NET.

You do not increase your safety by extending the virtual relationship to a point where you are completely illusional about the other person - you reduce your safety!

A safety net is staying in public. And maybe a friend you take with you. Or pepper spray. Or high heels. Or whatever. But for sure not months of cyber sex.

 

[screaminforyou]

Primalex: I will say you do have some valid points. If I were to meet someone online who lived near me I certainly wouldn’t wait a year to meet them. A month certainly sounds reasonable for an innocent coffee date. However, the man I discussed earlier is across the country. I would HAVE to take a plane to see him. So an innocent coffee date wasn’t possible in this situation.

Having said that : don’t think you me because you read one post. “If he rants about raping your ass, you still finger your pussy and cum and then you believe this has something to do with BDSM.” Wrong. Dead wrong. WHEN he told me to fuck my ass, I fucked my ass. I did almost whatever he asked. If I had met him online and then met him in a Starbucks I would certainly not laugh and walk away. You do not know me I assure you that. I may not have experience but I do know myself.

I’m offended by your judgement.

 

[BiBunny]

Primalex: I will say you do have some valid points. If I were to meet someone online who lived near me I certainly wouldn’t wait a year to meet them. A month certainly sounds reasonable for an innocent coffee date. However, the man I discussed earlier is across the country. I would HAVE to take a plane to see him. So an innocent coffee date wasn’t possible in this situation.

Having said that : don’t think you me because you read one post. “If he rants about raping your ass, you still finger your pussy and cum and then you believe this has something to do with BDSM.” Wrong. Dead wrong. WHEN he told me to fuck my ass, I fucked my ass. I did almost whatever he asked. If I had met him online and then met him in a Starbucks I would certainly not laugh and walk away. You do not know me I assure you that. I may not have experience but I do know myself.

I’m offended by your judgement.

If you ever experience real-life BDSM, you'll understand what he's saying and where he's coming from.

 

[00Syd]

Primalex's tone aside, I acutally totally agree with him. I've met guys online in the past, and if I was interested in them, I didn't see what the sense was in waiting months and months to meet them. Usually I met them for coffee within two weeks. Might as well find out sooner rather than later whether I was into them or not.

And I didn't bother looking for anyone who wasnt in my immediate area. What would be the point? Unless I wanted an online-only fantasy, which I didn't (and don't), I'd keep my searches local.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I am agreeing with Primalex's every post. How weird is that!

 

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[catalina_francisco]

I can appreciate some wanting to wait for quite awhile before meeting an online contact, but reality is most are not going to cool their heels for months on end no matter how good you might appear to be to them. What did you all do before the internet when the only way to meet someone was face to face from the first moment, or through personals in a newspaper? I find many who think nothing of a one night stand with someone they meet in a bar or club, or at least letting them drive them home, and yet cry caution about arranging to meet someone too soon who you have found online. IME, if you play your cards right, you will know far more about your online contact before meeting, than the one you meet at a club, munch etc., and decide to go home with the same night or soon after. It is all about using your head, which I think is a lot of what Primalex is saying.

As to choosing only local, it narrows your choices a lot. If I had taken that approach, no doubt I would still be sitting on the computer chatting with strangers and waiting for the right one. Distance does make it more of a challenge, but not impossible....and gives you a lot more options and choices.

Catalina

 

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[ecstaticsub]

If you ever experience real-life BDSM, you'll understand what he's saying and where he's coming from.

Whether I am with my Dominant in "real life" or on the phone the amount of control he has over me, and my degree of obedience is the same.

Well I have, and his points still are beside the point in relation to the OP


like I said, it doesn;t weed out anything but the compulsive psychos, but what it does do is allow trust to be built and allow you to get a handle on someone. unless a person is actually a very sophisticated liar/fantasist/whatever, they will, over time, leak enough shit to give warning signals. If a person takes no heed of inconsistencies or warning signs, then that is down to them. But high heels, pepper spray etc will not deter the determined attacker.

It isn't a perfect system and obviously it won't stop people who want to just abduct, but bringing in the Kampusch story is a red herring, because we don't know what happened to her and again, it's beside the fucking point, isn't it?

safety nets about staying in public are meaningless as well, (see http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/7279420.stm). Like I say, nothing deters the determined attacker, but very basic shit WILL.

I'm prepared to accept that I'm cautious in wanting some kind of assurance that my potential sexual partners are who they say they are and that having safety systems are not foolproof, but that does not mean to say that they are worthless over all. If someone I am meeting is unwilling to give some kind of proof of who they say they are, even after a series of emails/texts or whatnot, then it's not someone I would want to meet.

I agree with this completely.

 

[Netzach]

Primalex: I will say you do have some valid points. If I were to meet someone online who lived near me I certainly wouldn’t wait a year to meet them. A month certainly sounds reasonable for an innocent coffee date. However, the man I discussed earlier is across the country. I would HAVE to take a plane to see him. So an innocent coffee date wasn’t possible in this situation.

Having said that : don’t think you me because you read one post. “If he rants about raping your ass, you still finger your pussy and cum and then you believe this has something to do with BDSM.” Wrong. Dead wrong. WHEN he told me to fuck my ass, I fucked my ass. I did almost whatever he asked. If I had met him online and then met him in a Starbucks I would certainly not laugh and walk away. You do not know me I assure you that. I may not have experience but I do know myself.

I’m offended by your judgement.

If I met a girl on tuesday who tapped me on the shoulder and told me to start masturbating then and there in the starbucks line on wednesday and I decided I HAD TO DO IT I would seriously consider professional help.

Being submissive isn't kooked, being completely unwilling to take responsibility for life and safety is. You need to develop some boundaries or sort VERY carefully through people for someone paternalistic enough to really buffer your existence in the strictest M/s. Which is not a one week affair. One cannot have it both ways.

 

[Netzach]

What did you all do before the internet when the only way to meet someone was face to face from the first moment, or through personals in a newspaper?

Fuck yes. I think I was the last person on earth whose first BDSM contact was an appalingly bad blind date from the back pages of the newspaper.

I went home alone, didn't give a phone number, and didn't get knifed 30 times either, it was appallingly normal.

Seriously the double standards are amazing - if a newb Dom came around talking about how he spit on a waitress because he can't help it he's just wired that way sooooo much we'd be collectively berating him to no end.

 

[DVS]

I think there are a lot of extremes in this thread and in my opinion, finding the middle is the best advice to take. And I think the OP's original question has been sufficiently answered. The guy was a manipulating creepoid to even suggest she move across the country and sever ties with college, family and friends.

On-line BDSM is full of creeps, as well as a few in real life. And while it's probably not likely, it isn't impossible for an over her head, heavily in lust newbie submissive to wind up in the back of a van, never to be seen again.

No, I don't own a van.

 

[screaminforyou]

I never decided that I "had to do" anything. He just had a way of explaining things that made it seem like it was something that I wanted.

If I met a girl on tuesday who tapped me on the shoulder and told me to start masturbating then and there in the starbucks line on wednesday and I decided I HAD TO DO IT I would seriously consider professional help.

Being submissive isn't kooked, being completely unwilling to take responsibility for life and safety is. You need to develop some boundaries or sort VERY carefully through people for someone paternalistic enough to really buffer your existence in the strictest M/s. Which is not a one week affair. One cannot have it both ways.

And I would just like to say that I realize now I was being an idiot. Definitely not disputing that.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I never decided that I "had to do" anything. He just had a way of explaining things that made it seem like it was something that I wanted.





And I would just like to say that I realize now I was being an idiot. Definitely not disputing that.

Sex can do that to you.