feeling guilty

[twiggy_the_spider]

ok, i wondered if you guys could help me with this. im starting to get into humiliation, scenes such as being put on all fours and made to act like a bitch etc, and, i really enjoy it at the time but afterwards i feel really guilty, i dont know, ashmed maybe for enjoying these things. i've never really felt like this before. i just wondered if anyone else had felt like this, i mean, does it pass. or am i always gonna feel guilty for being as i am?


*aware of the fact that i have "newbie" stamped in big letters across my forehead"

thanks. (sorry if theres already a thread like this in the archive, i always have trouble making my way around it)

 

[AngelicAssassin]

ok, i wondered if you guys could help me with this. im starting to get into humiliation, scenes such as being put on all fours and made to act like a bitch etc, and, i really enjoy it at the time but afterwards i feel really guilty, i dont know, ashmed maybe for enjoying these things. i've never really felt like this before. i just wondered if anyone else had felt like this, i mean, does it pass. or am i always gonna feel guilty for being as i am?


*aware of the fact that i have "newbie" stamped in big letters across my forehead"

thanks. (sorry if theres already a thread like this in the archive, i always have trouble making my way around it)

• Newbie status has nothing to do with your experience.
• The library can be daunting if you're not sure where to start. (Although anelize will probably crucify me for ignoring to mention the presence of a humiliation thread.)
• i always find the last point rather sticky to discuss, but i'll take a whack at it and let the rest chime in with their views.

If you're like most humans, you've had someone, or multiple someones, give you advice/lectures/directives on what constitutes acceptable behavior among "normal" adults. Ok, say you're the humiliator. You just put a woman on all fours and commanded her to bark like a bitch in heat. Let's see ... yep, about a 1,000 women would come out of the woodwork; if they had knowledge of such an act; ready to tar, feather, and perhaps quarter you for stomping all over rights they and others have fought for to give "barking bitch" equal rights under the eyes of the law and society.

Now step back into your roll. Set the same 1,000 women loose and protest you wanted such treatment. You might get a blank stare for a few moments before 50% of them immediately assumed you'd been mentally abused by your "barker" to accept such treatment and say no more. Say another 25% would go so far as to google multiple means of "getting your head straight," and maybe another 15% would actually find a shrink plus take you there. The last 10% might actually pause long enough to listen, realize that's what you wanted, and understand "barker" had not tricked your consent out of you. Of that last 10%, perhaps one, maybe two, would quietly take you to the side and congratulate you on knowing what you wanted, having the courage to go after what you wanted, and maybe help you with your "programmed" guilt for wanting what you want.

In short, you've got a hard road only you can travel. You get to decide if your desires roam outside your acceptable limits. Your fantasy belongs to you, and you decide if they become a reality you can live with afterwards.

In the meantime, peruse this.

 

[twiggy_the_spider]

thanks, lots of helpful points.

oh, and thanks for the link too.

 

[FreeGal]

Hi Twiggy,

AngelicAssassin did make some very good points, and I guess I must be one of those few women who will tell you that you have absolutely nothing to feel guilty about.

I think I can understand where your feelings of guilt must come from, but for whatever reason, I don't share them. I like the same kind of things as you. I am into humiliation. I enjoy serving him, giving him pleasure and him making me do things; things which I would never even consider doing outside of our play.

I've never felt any guilt for anything he's made me do (things which I always do willingly, because I submit my all, my will, to him).

I'm not sure what my point is, but I suppose I just wanted to tell you that, in my eyes and my own personal experiences, you are not alone in what you enjoy - far from it.

As for how to get over any feelings of guilt, I'm not sure. I suggest you just enjoy the humiliation and play for exactly what it is: just that. If you are anything like me, during those moments you feel liberated, you feel yourself, there is no pretence. Just relax and enjoy it. What you do in your own private life is nobody's business, but your own. If you did tell someone about it and they reacted negatively, that's their problem, not yours.

All the very best to you,

FreeGal

 

[catalina_francisco]

From the POV of someone who herself is heavily into humiliation aspects of D/s, I think guilt plays an integral and necessary part. If you are placed in a position where all feelings are bad, then I think that is something which needs to be decided if it is where you are healthiest being....but, if it is play which you enjoy on a certain level, then feel guilty once you are out of scene and able to look at it from a different postion, it is not necessarily something you might find of advantage to move past.

I think once you begin to feel 100% comfortable with something, no longer have any feelings of guilt and/or shame during and/or after, then it loses a lot, if not all of it's power to humiliate and give those necessary and delicious thrills and chills, becoming instead perhaps nothing more than naughty but nice, a different feeling altogether. Humiliation comes from a part of us where we are not entirely comfortable, do feel guilt at what we allow and do, and the knowledge however subconcious it may be, that most people would never relate to our welcoming it. If the guilt is overbearing, perhaps talk to your Dominant and see if there is some way they can help you get to a place where it is manageable without interrupting the good parts of it you both enjoy.

Catalina

 

[Pure]

i mean, does it pass.

no, not necessarily


or am i always gonna feel guilty for being as i am?


yes.


Remember, in the realm of fantasy 'I am' is very broad, from boffing Hilary Duff to being pegged by Eva Braun. Isn't there a line in the Bible, "My name is legion." So there [will] always be shameful, even evil things to which you're drawn.

As to Freegals "I've never felt any guilt for anything he's made me do," my entirely personal reaction is: Among women there have always been a number who, on the surface at least, escape sexual guilt by the 'he made me do it' route. But whatever raises her boat...

I believe what Catalina suggests is closer to the point. Even if you could move past shame over doing X, it would be up the the person demeaning you to figure out something new!

An interesting question just occurred to me: Are there self labeled 'subs' and 'slaves' who contract for 'guilt free' sex? (i.e., they enter into an agreement which limits their 'service' to acts which do not cause them guilt?)

 

[Phoenix Stone]

but afterwards i feel really guilty, i dont know, ashmed maybe for enjoying these things. i've never really felt like this before.

Do you mean you've never gotten into this stuff before, or never felt guilt or shame with sex before?

i just wondered if anyone else had felt like this, i mean, does it pass. or am i always gonna feel guilty for being as i am?

One of the things that really struck me about being on this board for a few months is that I really have lost that surface embarrassment, and much of the shame. The part I Wanted to lose, that would have been so Horrified if anyone in rl, besides my spouse, found out or even suspected that I had any interest in 'this sort of thing.' That sneaking suspicion that my interest means there is something wrong with me, or that I'm betraying feminism or whatever. Or even just that 'those people' are Really really weird, and not in a good way, so that I wouldn't want to be associated with them. All of that was floating around somewhere in my brain before I started reading here.

I mean I'd been to the Exotic Erotic Ball in SF before, for G-d's sake, and it just struck me as icky instead of fun and enticing. Reading a bunch and posting and asking all my questions really cured me of all that. It Passed!

My thing may not be your thing, and I may not even be Doing all that much in rl with my mostly vanilla spouse but -- the view is Very different from here. It's a good feeling. I even feel better about myself overall for embracing the dark or shadow side. For some people, it Does pass. Hope that helps.

'Course it probably depends on what exactly you're feeling guilty about and why.

 

[twiggy_the_spider]

Re: Re: feeling guilty

Do you mean you've never gotten into this stuff before, or never felt guilt or shame with sex before?



ive screwd up quoting that somehow. but ive never really felt shame over sexual stuff before, actually that isnt quite true, the first time i slept with a woman felt like that afterwards... hmmm, its not exactly shame, its just, i wouldnt want other people to know i did it. and the thing about betraying feminism, i certianlly get that.

i think it is passing btw.

anyway. thanks.

 

[rosco rathbone]

The guilt and shame are what make it fun. Everything is not right, good and proper; there are some things which should not be done.

Keep sex evil.

I've spoken.

 

[FreeBloke]

Twiggy, the unfortunate answer to all of this is that there is no answer.

You must find the answer as it suits you.

Everyone else who has commented has thought about their comment and spoken, one would hope, from the heart.

The fact is, they all come at it from their own personal perspective of the subject.

If everybody on the boards were to comment, you would get an array of answers as diverse as all those people.

The only answer Twiggy, is that it is up to you to find, within your own comfort zone.

If the answer is outside your comfort zone, then you have a choice. Either stay within and never savour the experience again, or attempt to enlarge, and I suspect you will find, enrich your comfort zone.

I wish you well in your search, for it is simply that: Your search.

 

[Netzach]

my entirely personal reaction is: Among women there have always been a number who, on the surface at least, escape sexual guilt by the 'he made me do it' route.

Pure meet mr. forced-bi fetishist number 20,0043


mr. force me please, say hi to Pure. No, just shake hands.

~N.

 

[Justina123]

I've been a submissive for some time now and lots of the things we do in a scene are things which, if I think about them afterwards, I feel extremely embarrassed and, yes, a little guilty about. I would never want anyone (other than other Doms & subs) to see some of things I've done, and had done to me, and if I "think" too much about it, it ruins it for me. When I am "in the thick of it", I go by feel, both physical and emotional, I guess you'd call it, but afterwards.... (Even in scene, if I allow myself to slip into thoughts about "this is embarrassing, I must look like an idiot" etc. etc. ) it ruins it.

So I've long since learned to not try to over-rationalize or self-justify things. I enjoy my life and my Dominant thoroughly. Period.

-justina

 

[s'lara]

Hello and welcome twiggy.

Our Library touches on a number BDSM related subjects and you'll find the humiliation section informative.

The guilt really is part of the cycle isn't it? i think the guilt and shame is a necessary aspect of humiliation. Without the after affects of a rather intense, humiliating act, we'd have cereal without the milk. Cat is right in that boredom and desensitization would quickly set in if we were unable to complete the cycle of enduring humiliation, enjoying it and guiltily/shamefully facing this particular need once said act is over.

Dark thrill seems to be a good description for this kind of play.

Personally, i'd rather not win the inner struggle regarding humiliation as the complexity of my feelings seem to act as a support system for this particular need.

Good luck to you twiggy. i hope your explorations are enjoyable and safe.

lara

 

[Pure]

Hi N,

On your bi-fetichist.

Point taken.

But I'd say that 'forced gay' of 'forced female clothing' thing is the *main and one of the few areas that males deke(sp?) out of responsibility. These are areas that 'unman' the fellow.

I believe for women, in general, the whole 'sex' package, quite vanilla and straight, is often fraught with guilt, so there is a very broad range of acts that they wish to be 'forced' to do, sometimes something simple as a b.j.

 

[Netzach]

I'm also going to throw out that if the guilt shame and gross feelings outweigh the fun had, you may find that submitting and bottoming are not your cuppa tea. It should be evil and slippery but still gratifying on some level, I think.


But I'd venture you are having a hell of a good time, while feeling dirty and bad.

 

[Pure]

life springs from dirt

 

[twiggy_the_spider]

I'm also going to throw out that if the guilt shame and gross feelings outweigh the fun had, you may find that submitting and bottoming are not your cuppa tea. It should be evil and slippery but still gratifying on some level, I think.


But I'd venture you are having a hell of a good time, while feeling dirty and bad.

yeah, hell of a good time.

i have the opposite situation to the "he made me do it" thing, im always having to convice people (well, just my sister knows) that i do these things of my own free will and that im not being abused or something.

 

[FreeGal]

As to Freegals "I've never felt any guilt for anything he's made me do," my entirely personal reaction is: Among women there have always been a number who, on the surface at least, escape sexual guilt by the 'he made me do it' route. But whatever raises her boat...

There you go again, misquoting me. Or, maybe not misquoting me, but not quite giving the entire truth of what I said.

I said, "I've never felt any guilt for anything he's made me do (things which I always do willingly, because I submit my all, my will, to him)."

Which is a far cry from what you implied. I would NEVER go down the route of admonishing myself from any feelings of guilt by laying the blame at his door - which is how you were implying my thinking is. Far from it.

I submit to him because I want to. I do as he asks and tells me because I want to. Maybe my choice of words was wrong, he doesn't "make" me do anything - but I like to feel that way. He "tells" me and gets me to do things - things which I always do, because I want to please him.

I have no feelings of guilt, purely because I don't think we are doing anything wrong. It's all private, between us: two consenting adults. I would do anything for him.

FreeGal

 

[Phoenix Stone]

Interesting viewpoints, all. I'm still not sure if I understand how twiggy's guilt manifests itself and what she's really feeling guilty about, but she did say it was passing, which is nice.

We also seem to be interchanging terms such as guilt, shame and embarrassment which have different meanings. I've never felt guilty for any of this or for any sex I've had, that didn't involve (very long ago, before my present partner) cheating, or flirting that got dicey. The acts themselves? No. Otoh, I felt deep shame for having the fantasies I have, and had a lot of embarrassment around the thought of anyone besides my husband knowing about my interest in D/s. The shame is less deep and the embarrassment is almost gone, just from reading on Literotica (and one other forum.) Thank you for that. Especially those who've run the library here, moderated, and all the fascinating thinking posters.



(It's a relief and a release.)

 

[FreeGal]

Pheonix Stone, you make a lot of sense to me and stated all of that very well.

Guilt, shame and embarrassment, I believe, are sometimes confused.

I, also, used to feel a little inner shame for some of the somewhat dark and twisted fantasies I had. I don't any longer, partly because I have found someone who shares those fantasies, but mostly because he has already turned two of my strongest (and some might think depraved) fantasies into reallity. The best bit? The reallities were even better than the fantasies.

I feel no guilt or shame for anything we have done. However, embarrassment is another issue entirely. To me, embarrassment is closely linked to humiliation, and that is a big part of our play. He enjoys humiliating me and I love to be humiliated. I think the day I stop feeling embarrassed, or self-concious even, is the day the "edge" would go from a lot of our experiences.

FreeGal

 

[AngelicAssassin]

Bump