Fat Perceptions.

[Lucifer_Carroll]

See all this is why I like the psychological more than the physical for descriptions et al.

Cause what really matters at the end of the day is the person. If someone is a nearly unnatural DDD on Twiggy (something I don't much find attractive personally) but with that snooty "men grovel at my feet, you are a sow" personality, let the Joes of the world fuck 'er.

Besides, they starve the hell out of the middle ground. To have boobs of a goddess, you need the genes, you also need muscle and fat to support your new top heaviness. Good solid bone structure to hold it up without pain and a bunch more. There's no healthy way to strap 'em on an Asian frame then stretch it tall without a sort of masochistic streak.

And on the other end, where they are "svelte", they still get shunned for having small boobs. "Sure, she's thin, but they're no more than cherries" the nitpickity moan.

Not too mention that the fat levels are ridiculous. What's the magic thinness? Cause it seems to me that it's all trained women to see themselves as fat no matter how much their stomach caves in. My best female friend is by no means "svelte", but she's only got one roll. She's by far thinner than all but the beanpole male friends I have and to my eyes she looks right.

Yet even through her independent streak, she still has a touch of that "lose weight" vibe. She resists it, but she talks about it sometimes and it seems stupid.


I think men have got the right beat on this whole fashion thing (which is probably why we're the ones begging for dates most of the time). Right weight? Thin and fat and fit, whatever. Right height? We'll rib anyone. Right clothes? It was the first thing in our closet. Right hair? We just haven't bothered going to the hairdressers. Yeah, it's a stereotype, but considering the whole thing is built on stereotype, it works.


Personally, it'd be best in my mind if we all just let go of all the superficial hangups. A one night fling with a woman who thinks its fun to nearly break her ankles in shoes of death, has an IQ of 3, a personality like sandpaper, but boobs out to here and a stomach you can fit your head in? That should be a slap worthy action by a guy. A life long relationship with a Rubenesque women with an intellect and personality like Gandhi. We should be buying him so many drinks he gets drunk till Doomsday. A girl who drives herself nearly to death for a nearly anatomically impossible body? Slap worthy. A woman who throws her stillettos out the window, didn't bother to brush her hair, is wearing the first shirt from the closet, and is concentrating on her mind? The men should be beating themselves up to ask her out.


Yeah, I know. Get your head out of Fairy Tale Land. Well, you know what I say to that? No. No, damn you. I got pretty pink clouds and you can't make me. No, no, no. Nyah. Now go away or I'll taunt you a second time.

 

[carsonshepherd]

Why d'you think gay men have a reputation of sartorial savvy? It's becuase they can see men (and women) the way women see each other, in terms of how attractive they look.

I think it's because gay men are born with the "show tune gene" that helps them tell the difference between blue and aqua.

Actually, it's because men are shallow. And when they're attracting other men, it's all about the looks, especially for short-term encounters.

 

[domjoe]

Shanglan, that was very interesting. I'm going to have to look out for woodwoes.

 

[domjoe]

I think it's because gay men are born with the "show tune gene" that helps them tell the difference between blue and aqua.

Actually, it's because men are shallow. And when they're attracting other men, it's all about the looks, especially for short-term encounters.

What's the best look for a short-term encounter? Is white polo neck and jeans ok?

 

[Guest]

Shanglan, that was very interesting. I'm going to have to look out for woodwoes.

Crappola, now I haven't a chance with you. P.

 

[Guest]

zoftig.
i am that woman you might never see in a crowd...you might never notice me.
my curves are a part of me and while i bitch about having extra pounds, i would only lose weight if i was told i had to.
i am me, not my weight. as so often iterated in this thread.
it is easy for me to pretend i am that thin woman screaming to get out of my 'fat' shell. but hell, its ever so much more fun to just be who i am.
i am more than what you see. if you dont have the time to get to know me or if youre turned off by my 'zoftig' body... you arent worth my time.

curvy v~

ps, pass the butter.

 

[BlackShanglan]

Thanks awfully, English Lady, Perdita, and DomJoe. I really rather thought I would get "Cheers Shanglan, for that obscure, rambling, and pointless bit of pedantry. Please go sit down and let the grownups talk for a bit."

Yeah, I know. Get your head out of Fairy Tale Land. Well, you know what I say to that? No. No, damn you. I got pretty pink clouds and you can't make me. No, no, no. Nyah. Now go away or I'll taunt you a second time.

I loved this, Luc. Have you read the Chronicles of Narnia, specifically "The Silver Chair"? I often find myself thinking of the scene where Puddleglum stands up to the wicked enchantress who lives beneath the earth. She has him and his companions all under a spell so that they are gradually forgetting the sun, the sky, Aslan the great lion and protector of Narnia, and all of the good things in life. At last Puddleglum, fighting hard, steps in her fire of magical herbs (releasing the smell of burnt marsh-wiggle, not at all an enchanting scent) and tells her that it may well be that they've made all these things up, and that they are, as the witch says, merely babies playing at inventing worlds. But it's a peculiar thing, that four babies playing together can make a pretend world that licks her real world all hollow. And he's going to stand for Narnia even if there isn't a Narnia, and for Aslan even if there is no Aslan, because he'd rather die believing and defending that than accept that there is nothing more to life than what she says there is.

A beautiful moment.

Shanglan

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

zoftig.
i am that woman you might never see in a crowd...you might never notice me.
my curves are a part of me and while i bitch about having extra pounds, i would only lose weight if i was told i had to.
i am me, not my weight. as so often iterated in this thread.
it is easy for me to pretend i am that thin woman screaming to get out of my 'fat' shell. but hell, its ever so much more fun to just be who i am.
i am more than what you see. if you dont have the time to get to know me or if youre turned off by my 'zoftig' body... you arent worth my time.

curvy v~

ps, pass the butter.

What the hell you talking about?

Damnitt minion, you're naked for inspection all the time. I should know what I'm talking about when I say that if you are fat, I'm Elmer Fudd with a 20ft pecker. And just because I transformed into that once in college on a drunken dare means nothing about the sincerity of that comment.

Sheesh, minions :roll eyes:, even they can't escape the shitbull, poor shitbull-i mean bullshit! Damn story-teller mind wandering.

 

[Guest]

What the hell you talking about?

Damnitt minion, you're naked for inspection all the time. I should know what I'm talking about when I say that if you are fat, I'm Elmer Fudd with a 20ft pecker. And just because I transformed into that once in college on a drunken dare means nothing about the sincerity of that comment.

Sheesh, minions :roll eyes:, even they can't escape the shitbull, poor shitbull-i mean bullshit! Damn story-teller mind wandering.

my dearest Liege
thank you for making me see the light. i swear i wont fall into that fat bullshitshitbull scenario again.
humbly,
your minion
v~

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

my dearest Liege
thank you for making me see the light. i swear i wont fall into that fat bullshitshitbull scenario again.
humbly,
your minion
v~

Damn Straight. Now have another Lucky bar. Soft on the outside, creamy on the inside and completely unrealted to Bad Puns Inc. who are carting me off as I wrinfberkvn. I said fuck off wankers. Damn Pun Police. Catch you lates.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

I agree, but I think that too many women see themselves through male eyes.

Not quite. Women see themselves through their idea of male eyes. I don't think most men care if her shoes are a year out of style or her coat doesn't match her dress. Those are female obsessions.

Besides, if women dressed for men, they'd all wear leather teddies and fishnet stockings and have mattresses strapped to their backs. Men aren't real discerning.

The fact is that the biggest promulgators of the culture's ideas of beauty are the advertisers, and modern advertising has learned to tap into fears of inadequacy and personal discontent. Do you have any doubt that if we all looked like movie stars, the ideal would be changed to something else equally unattainable?

I heard a fashion model toss off a little line on a reality TV show that stuck with me. Someone asked her how she kept her figure, and she just casually said, "Oh, all models have eating disorders." And it struck me: of course she's right. You don't get to the runway by following a course of sensible nutrition and moderate exercise. You have to spend the morning with your head in the toilet throwing up the rye crisp you had for breakfast. You have to look at your 83 pound body in the mirror and see nothing but obesity and start pounding down the laxatives.

These women aren't normal, and that's why they're so rare. And rare = beautiful.

---dr.M.

 

[English Lady]

rare =percieved beauty.

or it equals something we all think everyone else thinks is Beautiful but I wonder in reality how many men and women really fancy fashion models?

LC...I love your idealistic view. Keep on believeing it!

I was thinking about this some more and I remebered all about the Body Mass index thing (BMI) I worked mine out and I'm something like a 35 which classifies as obese. When I first saw my Nurse about it I was classed as Morbidly obese (6 months or so ago) Now to be seenas being at a healthy"normal" weight by this scale I would have to be about 11 st. I'm 5"10.

My mum is 5"5 and about 10 stone and shes bloody skinny. I'm supposed tobe just a stone heavier than she is now? eh?

I think it's totally of base. Every person is different and everyone has there own ideal healthy weight. The generalisation of that chart which is used as the basis of many diets probably breaks alot of peoples hearts.

I will NEVER be that thin. I don't want to be -I'd look blummin' anorexic! I hope my Nurse doesn't expect me to slimto that -She'll be awfully disappointed *L*

 

[LadyJeanne]

Historically, most metaphors or discussions of masculine sexuality present the male as the active, penetrating partner and the female as the passive, receptive partner. But some images, like that of the wodwoe, express a fear of the female as endlessly and dangerously receptive - a bottomless pit of demand into which male effort is poured without being able to satisfy her. Eventually this leaves the male exhausted and perhaps destroyed. Better a struggling, uninterested but forcibly penetrated partner than an eager but all-consuming one.

Thank you, Shanglan. This is a fascinating topic.

I've noticed over the years that many of my male friends SAY they'd love it if a woman made the first move, asked them out, were more open or assertive about wanting them. Yet when that does happen, and it does, those same friends are quick to run for the hills.

I've always thought it was that the woman removes the thrill of the chase for them by pursuing them herself. Perhaps this fear of the devouring woman plays a part as well.

Yeesh. Something else to fret about! Sexy, but not too sexy...welcoming, but not overwhelming...sexual, but not greedy - what a tightrope!

Does this fear change with age? Is it stronger in older men? Is it univeral or are only some men susceptible?

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

Thank you, Shanglan. This is a fascinating topic.

I've noticed over the years that many of my male friends SAY they'd love it if a woman made the first move, asked them out, were more open or assertive about wanting them. Yet when that does happen, and it does, those same friends are quick to run for the hills.

I've always thought it was that the woman removes the thrill of the chase for them by pursuing them herself. Perhaps this fear of the devouring woman plays a part as well.

Yeesh. Something else to fret about! Sexy, but not too sexy...welcoming, but not overwhelming...sexual, but not greedy - what a tightrope!

Does this fear change with age? Is it stronger in older men? Is it univeral or are only some men susceptible?

Speaking as one male, I'd definitely jump at a woman who asked me out. But then that's probably because I don't really play the pursuit hunting game all the other men are. I'm not out to "bag me a right filly".

Of course, I'd probably shoot myself in the foot by being oblivious and saying incredulously "I'm sorry, are you actually asking me out". (i actually have uttered the phrase "I'm sorry, but are you hitting on me?" before. I wasn't taking offense, I had been shocked out of my gourd)


Then again I do have a big warning sticker with the message "Abnormal Male! techniques used on subject not guaranteed to work on any other male" on my bloody forehead.

 

[LadyJeanne]

Yet even through her independent streak, she still has a touch of that "lose weight" vibe. She resists it, but she talks about it sometimes and it seems stupid.

[snip]

Personally, it'd be best in my mind if we all just let go of all the superficial hangups.

Weight control is bred into us as young girls. At 5' 6" and generally between 125 and 130 pounds, I'm far from heavy and not one single man has ever been anything but complimentary about my size and curves. Yet, yet, I've struggled with poor self-image since my teens. I pretty much hit that weight during high school and was very self-conscious in my 20's about being naked with a man because I was not that cute little size 4.

It wasn't until my sister took me shopping a few years ago thatk I realized what a distorted self-image I had. Invariably, I started out trying on clothes in the wrong sizes; I'd never think to try on the Small blouse or the low-cut one. I was trying to hide my fat under clothes, never getting it that I had nothing to hide. It was triumphantly liberating to see myself as I really am rather than comparing myself to models.