Do You Really Listen?

[Bramblethorn]

Of course you omit the context.

Yep. I edited them down to the part that was relevant to discussion, and I linked to the context so that anybody who wants to check it can do so.

Your work seems to be more in the vein of monitoring me than doing much of any writing here. Guess it goes with your thought you've been appointed hall monitor here. Why do I intimidate you and your friends to the extent that you are obsessed with me and pay more attention to my file than I do?

Oh, Keith, you flatter yourself. I don't keep a file on your forum comments; all it takes is a half-decent memory and knowing how to use the forum search function.

In this case, for instance, it was mostly a matter of remembering that "pabulum" is your go-to word when you feel the need to trash other authors whose stories score higher than yours.

(I do keep a copy of the fulsome sock-puppet comments you left on your own stories, back when "KeithD" and "SR71plt" and your other alias were pretending to be three different people, because I knew you'd try to delete the evidence when you were called on it, and they were just too hilarious to lose. But I only bring those out when I see you trashing other authors for "insecurity".)

(It's a rhetorical question, dear. I'm well aware of the amateurs chewing on the professionals games on Internet discussion boards. Or, gasp, is this just a homophobic thing with you and your gang?)

A homophobic thing -

A hom -

A h -

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/583/267/e8a.gif

That certainly will be news to the people who read my stories... and the authors I edit for... and the people I used to pack safe-sex kits with at Mardi Gras time... and my buddies on the marriage equality campaign here... and the office Pride group that I helped found... and my partners of various genders.

I will readily admit that I don't have any collection on you like you so readily whipped out on me. Could you be any more pathetic in your obsessions?

Oh, mate, it's not my fault if you don't know how to use a search engine. I'm honestly surprised you passed spy school without learning even a little bit about how to look things up quickly.

 

[SimonDoom]

Was that the story about the magical shrinking bikini? That was a great little story, but as you say, to jump from it to that comment is bizarre. It really does make you wonder why people like that bother reading at all.

That's the one. There was no cheating. Just exhibitionism -- and most of that was the bikini's fault, not the character's. Even so, that particular reader's thoughts turned to murder.

One just has to remember that the Literotica readership is very, very big, and that every sort of perspective is represented.

 

[8letters]

Here's something to listen to: There's no greater assholery on Literotica than to come to the discussion board and rag on another Literotica author's writing. You can't be more pathetic than that, I opine. It puts you so far below the one you're ragging on that you lose all credence. Just pathetic in the need for your own validation.

I don't see people ragging on your writing. I see people ragging on you as a forum presence. The times I've mentioned your stories, I've done so in the context of you presenting yourself as being a highly-successful commercial writer whereas the rating of your stories say that you're a good-but-not-great writer. So much of what you say about yourself reeks of bullshit.

 

[j267]

Not really. I write my way. If I screw up something and they tell me, then I'll nod and go on. On Lit I write for me.

Ditto

 

[JanusGoneAwry]

I'm still a bit of a nube with only 10 stories to my credit but the 2 genuine comments that were actionable--both were related to my story being posted in the wrong category--I fixed. Personally, I wish I had more comments and I'd gratefully accept advice although like others have said I write for my own pleasure and reserve the right to ignore their input.

 

[KeithD]

I don't see people ragging on your writing. I see people ragging on you as a forum presence. The times I've mentioned your stories, I've done so in the context of you presenting yourself as being a highly-successful commercial writer whereas the rating of your stories say that you're a good-but-not-great writer. So much of what you say about yourself reeks of bullshit.

I'll put you down as an asshole who rags on another Literotica author's writings on the discussion board--the most sleazy thing a Literotica author can do. Cite where I have ever said I'm a "highly successful (modifiers ending in ly don't take hyphens) commercial writer." I post that I write to the marketplace. That's self-evident and easily checked. I have not, that I can remember, ever said I was highly successful at it. I don't need the money required to be high successful at it.

You are just being a backbiting liar. Probably jealous too. Can't be sure about that as I haven't even bothered to look at your file. I'm not researching you or trying to denigrate your writing or look for any sign of success in your writing.

 

[LAHomedog]

Gosh, as I've posted before I don't seem to get a lot of comments. Maybe it is because I don't have a lot of followers like some of you, or the categories I have a tendency to publish in.

Like everyone, I dismiss or delete the asshole ones. I also tend to ignore the comments that are critiquing me like my 8th grade English teacher.

Compliments are always nice as well as "I look forward to the next one."

Looking back, I think I've had one comment that was truly insightful and the observations were to the gist of the story and helpful to me in my future writings.

 

[8letters]

I'll put you down as an asshole who rags on another Literotica author's writings on the discussion board--the most sleazy thing a Literotica author can do.

In my post, I did not rag on your writings. I stated a fact about the ratings of your stories. I'm glad that you publish as many stories as you do to this site. I want this site to be successfully, and you publishing so many stories on it provides a lot of content to readers who are always looking to read a new story. Keep on publishing.

Cite where I have ever said I'm a "highly successful (modifiers ending in ly don't take hyphens) commercial writer."

You may not have said that, but it's the attitude you have. And if you want to be a jerk...

I don't need the money required to be high successful at it.

What is "high successful"? Is that successful at getting high? I can believe that. You must be high to not get that many people are fed up with your attitude.

You are just being a backbiting liar. Probably jealous too.

I'm not a backbiting liar. I'm not jealous. Bramblethorn is not homophobic. She doesn't have a gang. If it was one person who said something about you, I can see you dismissing it as something about them. But with so many people saying something about you, take the hint that it's you and not them.

 

[Comshaw]

In my post, I did not rag on your writings. I stated a fact about the ratings of your stories. I'm glad that you publish as many stories as you do to this site. I want this site to be successfully, and you publishing so many stories on it provides a lot of content to readers who are always looking to read a new story. Keep on publishing.


You may not have said that, but it's the attitude you have. And if you want to be a jerk...


What is "high successful"? Is that successful at getting high? I can believe that. You must be high to not get that many people are fed up with your attitude.


I'm not a backbiting liar. I'm not jealous. Bramblethorn is not homophobic. She doesn't have a gang. If it was one person who said something about you, I can see you dismissing it as something about them. But with so many people saying something about you, take the hint that it's you and not them.

First off I ain't gettin' into this contest 'cause I ain't got a dog in the fight. And I ain't tryin' to derail the discussion between the two parties, but I wanted to make a comment on the bolded portion above.

This is exactly what I was talking about in my earlier post. If you get one or maybe two comments its worth a consideration but not something to get spun up over. However, if you find you're hearing the same basic problem voiced over and over, even if it's couched in different terms and language, maybe it's time to back up and take a long hard look at what's being criticized. I first heard that little nugget of wisdom from a Creative Writing teacher. I've used it extensively and its helped, not with just my writing but with life in general.

Anyway, sorry guys you can go back to your, aw, "discussion".

Comshaw

 

[gordo12]

First off I ain't gettin' into this contest 'cause I ain't got a dog in the fight. And I ain't tryin' to derail the discussion between the two parties, but I wanted to make a comment on the bolded portion above.

This is exactly what I was talking about in my earlier post. If you get one or maybe two comments its worth a consideration but not something to get spun up over. However, if you find you're hearing the same basic problem voiced over and over, even if it's couched in different terms and language, maybe it's time to back up and take a long hard look at what's being criticized. I first heard that little nugget of wisdom from a Creative Writing teacher. I've used it extensively and its helped, not with just my writing but with life in general.

Anyway, sorry guys you can go back to your, aw, "discussion".

Comshaw

WOOF!

What we're seeing with Keith is the mindset I was referring to when I created this thread. Somebody getting ongoing, consistent comments and ignoring them or unable to incorporate them into their worldview.

This isn't the first public spanking Keith has had over his asshole comments, and it probably won't be the last.

But, interestingly, he's displaying the exact psychological behaviour that I believe leads to the inability to take advice or understand how your behaviour affects people.

While I'm somewhat upset with his derailing my thread, I'm actually glad he's giving us a graphic real-time demonstration of what I was talking about.

 

[LAHomedog]

As other writers have pointed out, probably the vast majority of readers are looking for something to get them off. I'm convinced that "porn talk" is an arousal trigger for a lot of people.

"Porn talk" is a distinct writing style on here. I think for a lot of folks it is just their exuberant, inexperienced way to write. They're reading stories here and whacking off and want to get into the fun.

I have writers who ask me to edit or I am editing who write this way. I call it "writing like a teenager's masturbation fantasy. I use to decline, then I decided to get off my high horse, and if the writer has talent or shows promise, I help him or her.

A frequent note I give is, "You're writing porn. If your reader isn't hard or wet you are not doing your job." Isn't that the purpose of the exercise? I do think that you can write that way and not sound like a porn film.

I wonder what kind of comments a story filled with "Give me that big dick, Harder. Harder. Harder." gets...

 

[8letters]

How many of you really listen? How many of you read them and immediately dismiss them? Do you use them to try to improve? Do you go back at intervals and reread them to see if anything new can be gleaned from them?

I'm talking anon and registered members.

I'm reading a story right now. It's the 3rd chapter. The writer's dialogue has been called many uncomplimentary terms, but over the months the story has taken, he hasn't blinked. He isn't learning. He isn't listening. He keeps plowing on through.

It made me wonder how many of us are guilty of doing just that?

In the Story Feedback forum, I've seen numerous people tell many different authors to keep writing what they want to write and they'll eventually build an audience. I want to tell those authors that if they keep writing like what they've written, they'll continue to get the same minimal response to what they've already written.

If the author you mentioned wants to write that particular dialogue style, who are you to say he's in the wrong? He gets the same amount of pay regardless of his dialogue style. If he likes that style of dialogue, telling him that he should change dialogue style probably just pisses him off.

On the other hand, he'd probably have a more enjoyable experience publishing on Literotica if he did change his dialogue style.

Having been on this website for a while, I've come to the conclusion that it's best to only leave positive comments. If I can't say something nice, I don't say anything at all. I think most authors are not going to be receptive to feedback from negative comments, and leaving a negative comment only demotivates them from writing. If they post a request for feedback in the Story Feedback forum, I'll give them feedback. I try to always leave feedback when requested for a story in my favorite category (I/T).

 

[gordo12]

In the Story Feedback forum, I've seen numerous people tell many different authors to keep writing what they want to write and they'll eventually build an audience. I want to tell those authors that if they keep writing like what they've written, they'll continue to get the same minimal response to what they've already written.

If the author you mentioned wants to write that particular dialogue style, who are you to say he's in the wrong? He gets the same amount of pay regardless of his dialogue style. If he likes that style of dialogue, telling him that he should change dialogue style probably just pisses him off.

On the other hand, he'd probably have a more enjoyable experience publishing on Literotica if he did change his dialogue style.

Having been on this website for a while, I've come to the conclusion that it's best to only leave positive comments. If I can't say something nice, I don't say anything at all. I think most authors are not going to be receptive to feedback from negative comments, and leaving a negative comment only demotivates them from writing. If they post a request for feedback in the Story Feedback forum, I'll give them feedback. I try to always leave feedback when requested for a story in my favorite category (I/T).

The purpose of the Lit comment system is to give feedback. So yes, I'm entitled to say he or she is wrong. It was just that I was reading the third chapter in a series and seeing the same dialogue as the beginning now around 6 months old. There have been multiple comments on each chapter about his dialogue. I only commented on the first chapter. I'm not alone in my criticism.

It made me wonder why someone would ignore something so obvious with all the comments he/she received. Thus this thread.

 

[Comshaw]

In the Story Feedback forum, I've seen numerous people tell many different authors to keep writing what they want to write and they'll eventually build an audience. I want to tell those authors that if they keep writing like what they've written, they'll continue to get the same minimal response to what they've already written.

If the author you mentioned wants to write that particular dialogue style, who are you to say he's in the wrong? He gets the same amount of pay regardless of his dialogue style. If he likes that style of dialogue, telling him that he should change dialogue style probably just pisses him off.

On the other hand, he'd probably have a more enjoyable experience publishing on Literotica if he did change his dialogue style.

Having been on this website for a while, I've come to the conclusion that it's best to only leave positive comments. If I can't say something nice, I don't say anything at all. I think most authors are not going to be receptive to feedback from negative comments, and leaving a negative comment only demotivates them from writing. If they post a request for feedback in the Story Feedback forum, I'll give them feedback. I try to always leave feedback when requested for a story in my favorite category (I/T).

That is a disservice to the writer you're leaving the comment for. If you find something that needs correction, if you see an area where you think they can improve, you should say so. The mistake that a lot of people make is that to give feedback, to criticize a work, you must be brusque and unyielding. Not true. It can be (and should be) done in a way to inspire rather than chop the legs off a writer. A very long time ago, when I first started doing this, there was a writer on the site I frequented at the time. She wrote a couple of stories, and they were terrible. Thankfully another much better writer took her under their wing and within a year she was turning out stories that were engaging and fabulous, all because someone took the time to work with her and not beat her with her mistakes.

Criticism is an important ingredient for a developing writer. And no matter how long you've been at it, when you stop considering yourself as developing, that's when you stagnate. The stick of criticism is important to keep the pot of inspiration stirred so that fresh ideas float to the surface.

There are many (too many) commentors who feel it's their job to be assholish about criticism. I've developed a thick enough hide I can read what they have to say and pick the important things out of the tripe. But there are some, the ones just starting, the ones who are vulnerable to the assholitis that is spewed who will take it to heart. I hate to lose a writer who may become a good or great one because of something like that.

Oh hell...I've done gone and rambled for far to long.

Comshaw

 

[SimonDoom]

I don't agree that one should only leave positive comments. My attitude toward comments is to apply the Golden Rule: comment to others as I would want them to comment to me. If I've done something wrong in my story, or something that diminishes its quality, I want to know. That's the point of feedback. It's not just to stroke my ego (although I like that, too).

When I comment, I:

1. First, say something positive. Sometimes that's very easy, and sometimes it's harder. But I try. And I almost always begin on a positive note, and save the criticism for later.

2. Try to make any criticism constructive, so the author can use it to improve any problems the author has the next time he/she writes a story. I try to word my criticism so as not to discourage the author from continuing to write.

As long as criticism is constructive -- not just "You suck!" or its equivalent -- I see nothing wrong with it. I want that kind of criticism from my readers, and that's what I try to give when I comment on other stories.

 

[gordo12]

That is a disservice to the writer you're leaving the comment for. If you find something that needs correction, if you see an area where you think they can improve, you should say so. The mistake that a lot of people make is that to give feedback, to criticize a work, you must be brusque and unyielding. Not true. It can be (and should be) done in a way to inspire rather than chop the legs off a writer. A very long time ago, when I first started doing this, there was a writer on the site I frequented at the time. She wrote a couple of stories, and they were terrible. Thankfully another much better writer took her under their wing and within a year she was turning out stories that were engaging and fabulous, all because someone took the time to work with her and not beat her with her mistakes.

Criticism is an important ingredient for a developing writer. And no matter how long you've been at it, when you stop considering yourself as developing, that's when you stagnate. The stick of criticism is important to keep the pot of inspiration stirred so that fresh ideas float to the surface.

There are many (too many) commentors who feel it's their job to be assholish about criticism. I've developed a thick enough hide I can read what they have to say and pick the important things out of the tripe. But there are some, the ones just starting, the ones who are vulnerable to the assholitis that is spewed who will take it to heart. I hate to lose a writer who may become a good or great one because of something like that.

Oh hell...I've done gone and rambled for far to long.

Comshaw

I agree. A while back I had a comment on a story about my attribution, dialogue and sentence structure. It came from a registered member so I wrote back and asked what he was talking about. It turned out to be an alternative user name for a major writer here. He showed me what he meant and where I was going wrong. I studied it online too.

The story I was working on got ripped apart and redone. My first comment came from my wife. "Jesus, you've improved a lot!" When the story published I got the same response. Had he not bothered...?

I was happy yesterday to vote for his story of his I really liked in the reader's choice awards.

 

[Emirus]

. Having been on this website for a while, I've come to the conclusion that it's best to only leave positive comments. If I can't say something nice, I don't say anything at all. I think most authors are not going to be receptive to feedback from negative comments, and leaving a negative comment only demotivates them from writing. (I/T).

I don’t read anywhere near as many stories as I used too, very few in fact, but the majority of the time I do leave a comment. It might be fairly short or quite long but it’s always well meant. If I do feel the need to make a negative comment I always counter it with at least one positive comment. Any writer, no matter how bad they may be, has spent their time and imagination on producing a story they hope people will read and enjoy. Derision is not what they want and is not what they should receive.

If I have made a negative comment I always try and explain why and do the same when making a positive comment.

I receive very few comments (perhaps I should write in Loving Wives) and would like more, positive naturally, because I want to improve. No matter how good you may be be as a writer, or how long you’ve been doing it, there’s always room for improvement. I think that’s applicable in any field.

 

[8letters]

That [only leaving positive comments] is a disservice to the writer you're leaving the comment for. If you find something that needs correction, if you see an area where you think they can improve, you should say so. The mistake that a lot of people make is that to give feedback, to criticize a work, you must be brusque and unyielding. Not true. It can be (and should be) done in a way to inspire rather than chop the legs off a writer. A very long time ago, when I first started doing this, there was a writer on the site I frequented at the time. She wrote a couple of stories, and they were terrible. Thankfully another much better writer took her under their wing and within a year she was turning out stories that were engaging and fabulous, all because someone took the time to work with her and not beat her with her mistakes.

As much as I've criticized KeithD, I think he regularly makes two great points:
* There is no typical Literotica reader. Literotica readers are a diverse lot with very diverse tastes
* When an author publishes a story, they don't give you permission to publicly criticize it

Let me say, one of the reasons that I leave only positive comments is that I naturally write comments that are harsh and brutal. It's just the way I am.

Another reason I leave only positive comments is that there are plenty of other people who leave critical comments. I don't feel like I add anything to what others already post when I leave a non-positive comment.

Criticism is an important ingredient for a developing writer. And no matter how long you've been at it, when you stop considering yourself as developing, that's when you stagnate.

To me, the rating of the story, the number and quality of comments, and the other story statistics provide much better feedback than I'm going to be able to give. I've pulled my lowest-rated I/T story from this site, "My Daughter Interrupts My Work". It's rating was much lower than all of my other I/T stories, starting out below 4. The comments never gave me an idea as to why people liked that story so much less than my other stories.

To me, comments that provide critical feedback rarely get their point across. I learn a lot from my beta-readers and editors. But I'm in a relationship with them in which I'm open to their feedback. Some random person leaving a comment - it's tough to get much from that.

An anonymous comment from chapter four of one of my stories:

Exposition
You write HUGE paragraphs of exposition. STOP IT. It's weak writing. It's you not having the confidence in your story telling abilities and it's also a weak plot device because you can't incorporate the threads of your plot into the actual story. All of that shit that Kaitlyn explained on page two should have been woven into the earlier chapters through action & dialogue. Honestly, you're a boring writer, but you don't have to be a bad one too. Stop with the monologuing. Reader 'get it' and the ones who don't: fuck them.

A very detailed comment identifying a problem that I should address, right? Even gives me where in the story is a particular bad example, right?

I have no idea what the person is talking about. I don't think I write huge paragraphs of exposition. I don't see huge paragraphs of exposition in that story. There was a reason Kaitlyn explained so much on page two - this chapter was the surprise twist chapter, and Kaitlyn was explaining everything the MMC had missed in the prior chapters. I felt the amount of explanation was fine.

Which brings me to main point - I don't think there are many times that an author is open to the feedback people leave and by providing negative feedback all you're doing is angering and demotivating them. In the above example, I'm not open to criticism about exposition. Done. The person wasted their time.

And I consider myself a person who is very open to feedback! When I've posted about how many people I have look at my stories as I write them, the almost universal response is that I'm crazy. So many writers don't use an editor or beta-readers. If they aren't willing to post a story in the Story Feedback forum or seek out an editor or a beta-reader, why do you think they'll be open to learning from a short comment you've left on their story?

 

[SimonDoom]

* When an author publishes a story, they don't give you permission to publicly criticize it

KeithD has been very consistent about this point for as long I have been participating in these forums (four and a half years). He makes a good case for his position. I respect this viewpoint. I also disagree with it.

I think when you publish a story at Literotica you implicitly consent to the use of all of its features. That includes reader voting, comments, and favorites. I personally want to get meaningful comments in response to my stories, and that includes criticism as well as praise. We all benefit if we exchange that criticism. If you don't want to get such comments, you can turn them off, or you can delete those you don't like. This system gives something to everyone. A system where there's no criticism is a system where you have a feedback feature but it's not being used meaningfully. Under my system, you and Keith always have the option of deleting unwelcome criticism. But under your system, I have no options -- I will never see the criticism I want to see.

That said, I think criticism ought to be constructive. When I give criticism, I try to give it in a way that, in my view, helps the author write a better version of the story the author wants to write. To that end, I try hard to avoid doing the following:

1. Trashing the story as a whole as a bad story.
2. Shaming or criticizing the author for writing the story based on its subject matter.
3. Telling the author that the author should rewrite the story in a way that makes it a completely different story, one that I would like.

There have been times where I've probably violated rule number 3, but sometimes it's hard to give an author advice without making the author feel you want him or her to write a different story.

 

[Comshaw]

Originally Posted by 8letters View Post
* When an author publishes a story, they don't give you permission to publicly criticize it

When you publish a story and leave the little slider for the comments in the "ON" position, you have just given permission for anyone commenting to criticize your story. It doesn't matter whether we like the comments or not, those commenting have the right to do so as they please, within the rules of the website of course. And I have never seen a rule that says "no criticism of written works". Repeating it, no matter how many times, doesn't make it so.

Besides, if we don't like what was said we can always delete the comment and ignore it...if we can that is.


Comshaw

 

[8letters]

When you publish a story and leave the little slider for the comments in the "ON" position, you have just given permission for anyone commenting to criticize your story. It doesn't matter whether we like the comments or not, those commenting have the right to do so as they please, within the rules of the website of course. And I have never seen a rule that says "no criticism of written works". Repeating it, no matter how many times, doesn't make it so.

Agreed. If you publish a story on Literotica, you should expect comments that criticize your story. Life in the big city, etc. I enjoy critical comments. But at best, they give me a vague feeling of where I can improve.

What I'm arguing is that people who leave a comment that tells an author an area they can improve on are very unlikely to help the author become a better writer. They are much more likely to anger the author or demotivate them. People don't like unsolicited advice.

If you want to help an author get better, I suggest sending them a PM asking them if they'd like advice and on what. I'd think they'd be much more open to feedback that came that way. And if the feedback wasn't clear, then they could ask for clarification. And if you send such a PM, expect many authors to not respond or to turn you down.

 

[KeithD]

Misrepresentation of my consistently held position. Folks here do so love to make up positions for me and then attack them.

My position is that you cannot assume that someone is asking for negative ("developing" in your mind's view--often without sufficient knowledge to make it) critique simply by posting stories to this site or leaving comments open here. This is not a critique site. It puts itself forward as a share site. That's evident by it allowing authors to turn off comments and voting and erase comments. I believe that most people who post stories here are doing so to share and with the hope of praise. I don't think you have to give them praise and I agree you have the right to provide negative (or your view of "developing" comment) if you wish, but you don't have the right to assume that they are asking for negative (or "developing") comment simply because they posted stories to Literotica and left comments on. If they want critique or your idea of what will develop their writing better, they'll ask for it--either in notes on the story or by asking on the Feedback threads.

It's not an issue of whether you have the right to provide critique comment. It's an issue of whether you have the right to assume that the writer either wants or must accept negative critique--that this is the reason they post stories here. I hold that it is NOT the reason most post stories here.

And I guess in addition to that, I hold that most of you don't have the chops to be telling anyone else how to write better (beyond mastering the technicals better) and that most of you do so to puff yourself up rather than any interest or concern for the one you are lording it over with your version of a "developing" critique. Most of the advice I see given on this board is unnecessarily limiting to creative writing and often just plain wrong.

 

[8letters]

And I guess in addition to that, I hold that most of you don't have the chops to be telling anyone else how to write better (beyond mastering the technicals better) and that most of you do so to puff yourself up rather than any interest or concern for the one you are lording it over with your version of a "developing" critique. Most of the advice I see given on this board is unnecessarily limiting to creative writing and often just plain wrong.

All bow before the Writing God!

In my post upstream, I was going to write "Writing God" at first, but changed it to "highly successful commercial writer". I should have stayed with "Writing God".

All bow before the Writing God!

 

[TxRad]

All bow before the Writing God!

In my post upstream, I was going to write "Writing God" at first, but changed it to "highly successful commercial writer". I should have stayed with "Writing God".

All bow before the Writing God!

You have no idea what you are talking about. KD is a trained editor with more years of experience than most of you have been writing. Yeah, he's harsh and opinionated but in a lot of ways, he has put in his time and a lot of the time, he's right but a lot of people don't want to hear it.

This gangbang has gotten way out of hand.

 

[XerXesXu]

My position is that you cannot assume that someone is asking for negative ("developing" in your mind's view--often without sufficient knowledge to make it) critique simply by posting stories to this site or leaving comments open here. This is not a critique site. It puts itself forward as a share site. That's evident by it allowing authors to turn off comments and voting and erase comments. I believe that most people who post stories here are doing so to share and with the hope of praise. I don't think you have to give them praise and I agree you have the right to provide negative (or your view of "developing" comment) if you wish, but you don't have the right to assume that they are asking for negative (or "developing") comment simply because they posted stories to Literotica and left comments on. If they want critique or your idea of what will develop their writing better, they'll ask for it--either in notes on the story or by asking on the Feedback threads.

I agree.

I’ve always thought of Lit as a place where anyone, of whatever writing ability, could share their masturbation fantasies, especially the more bizarre ones. The more I read and see here, the more I’m convinced of that. Some may never have had to write anything beyond a letter to their relatives. Some are young (yes, young people are not as good at anything as older people, experience makes you better at everything, even sex and writing). I see some threads with people outlining a fantasy and asking others to write the story, I assume because they believe they don’t have the writing ability do it themselves.

At the other end there are other people who aspire to be good writers, maybe who work, or have worked, in the literary or journalistic fields, or want to. They take pride in their writing and want to improve. Often, dare I say it, they have fragile egos. They, of course, are welcome to use Lit for that purpose, to enter competitions, to write in categories that have no appeal to them to see if they can do it convincingly. I also expect that these people can readily identify each other.

As for readers, they don’t distinguish. I imagine they vastly outnumber the writers, and are mostly here for the masturbation fantasies. They won’t distinguish between people who are invested in their writing and those who aren’t. If they think you’ve wasted their time you may find their comments negative. For most writers and readers Lit isn’t a creative writing school, it's a 21st C wank sheet.