Do you own your body?

[Sean Renaud]

Why not?

i Assume your position is that choice should be baked in. I don’t disagree. But I don’t understand why you’d damage your position with people that do by ignoring the fact that abortion isn’t just lazy birth control.

I'm not looking up the numbers right now. But Rape and Incest make up something like 2 or 3 percent. Third trimester abortions are similarly rare. Both sides are trying to play your emotions on things that happen so infrequently that a case by case basis would actually work just fine.

The overwhelming majority of abortions happen in the first twelve weeks and if you read the studies they are economic though women find different ways of phrasing it. To me personally 'I want to finish school', 'I want to be farther in my career' and 'I can't afford to care for a child' are all the same statement with slightly different qualifiers.

Passing equal pay for equal work, raising the minimum wage, paid maternal leave, better access to birth control and other women's health, better sex ed (something the Right actively fights against) are all perfectly viable choices. However as is painfully obvious to anybody paying attention preventing abortions isn't REALLY the goal because that would start with preventing unwanted pregnancies. The goal is keeping women in check.

 

[icanhelp1]

Yes, which is the reason it should be codified at the national level

Negative! First off abortion is not a right, secondly, it doesn't fall under the enumerated powers granted by the constitution to the feds under *article I section 8* All powers that fall outside the enumerated powers of the federal government shall be reserved to the states.

 

[_mattycatfish]

Well yeah. Not sure I get your point.

You’d have to be brutally stupid not to

 

[_mattycatfish]

I'm not looking up the numbers right now. But Rape and Incest make up something like 2 or 3 percent. Third trimester abortions are similarly rare. Both sides are trying to play your emotions on things that happen so infrequently that a case by case basis would actually work just fine.

The overwhelming majority of abortions happen in the first twelve weeks and if you read the studies they are economic though women find different ways of phrasing it. To me personally 'I want to finish school', 'I want to be farther in my career' and 'I can't afford to care for a child' are all the same statement with slightly different qualifiers.

Passing equal pay for equal work, raising the minimum wage, paid maternal leave, better access to birth control and other women's health, better sex ed (something the Right actively fights against) are all perfectly viable choices. However as is painfully obvious to anybody paying attention preventing abortions isn't REALLY the goal because that would start with preventing unwanted pregnancies. The goal is keeping women in check.

I’m sure you’re right about the numbers.

I’m sure you’re wrong about your debating skills.

 

[Biggs_Darklighter]

You’d have to be brutally stupid not to

sure

 

[Biggs_Darklighter]

The goal is keeping women in check.

It is so awesome to see people FINALLY coming around to how things should be.

 

[Sean Renaud]

I’m sure you’re right about the numbers.

I’m sure you’re wrong about your debating skills.

If I'm correct about the numbers I'm correct about my debating skills and you are simply resorting to insults.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Negative! First off abortion is not a right, secondly, it doesn't fall under the enumerated powers granted by the constitution to the feds under *article I section 8* All powers that fall outside the enumerated powers of the federal government shall be reserved to the states.

Yeah, I don't give a shit what is granted by the Constitution as far as rights go. That is a foolish argument.

 

[_mattycatfish]

If I'm correct about the numbers I'm correct about my debating skills and you are simply resorting to insults.

Nope.

i don’t think you’re very good at reading or at understanding or at presenting your arguments. Maybe go back and read

 

[Sean Renaud]

I did. I pointed out what the numbers are, what ways could be used to prevent abortions if that was the ultimate goal. The fact that you want things spoonfed isn't my fault.

 

[ll74]

Negative! First off abortion is not a right, secondly, it doesn't fall under the enumerated powers granted by the constitution to the feds under *article I section 8* All powers that fall outside the enumerated powers of the federal government shall be reserved to the states.

A fetus is not a person.

Once you get past that part, you'll do better.

I don't care whether it's a right...it should be a federal law.

 

[icanhelp1]

Yeah, I don't give a shit what is granted by the Constitution as far as rights go. That is a foolish argument.

I'm sure you think that in your lonely delusional world. Perhaps you should test your arguments against six year olds and work your way up.

 

[Btq97]

It is very simple. It is a womans choice.
It's no one else's business.

 

[Sean Renaud]

I'm sure you think that in your lonely delusional world. Perhaps you should test your arguments against six year olds and work your way up.

No need. It works perfectly fine against adults of all education levels.
Do you have a right to wear clothing?

 

[windar]

Negative! First off abortion is not a right, secondly, it doesn't fall under the enumerated powers granted by the constitution to the feds under *article I section 8* All powers that fall outside the enumerated powers of the federal government shall be reserved to the states.

Amendment IX​

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

The Constitution is a floor on rights NOT a ceiling!

 

[LittleDixie]

Ahhh so then under that logic marital rape doesn't exist.

And again, so it's only the fetuses in a uterus that count. Not the IVF throw aways. Wonder why.

So, tell me again how this isn't a moral judgement for having sex.

I think what the problem is is that you can't stick to one issue, because constantly moving the goalposts is how you argue.

No matter how you got fertilized, you now have a fetus inside of you. It may not be fair. It may not be what you want. It may be from the result of a criminal act. It doesn't really matter. You now have a human life inside of you, and that life has rights to bodily autonomy.

You don't get to kill people on your property for trespassing, so why should you have the right to kill a baby that YOUR BODY CREATED for supposedly trespassing?

 

[Btq97]

Wow this will not be popular but.
Till it is viable outside the womb then it is not a separate life. Just like I am able to have this opinion you can have your own But you do not get a say in what another woman chooses to do with her body. Cause if you do where does it stop? Do you send them jail for a miscarriage?

 

[adrina]

I think what the problem is is that you can't stick to one issue, because constantly moving the goalposts is how you argue.

No matter how you got fertilized, you now have a fetus inside of you. It may not be fair. It may not be what you want. It may be from the result of a criminal act. It doesn't really matter. You now have a human life inside of you, and that life has rights to bodily autonomy.

You don't get to kill people on your property for trespassing, so why should you have the right to kill a baby that YOUR BODY CREATED for supposedly trespassing?

You keep making easily disproven illogical (and not factual) statements and I'm the one moving the goal posts?

You say it's nature. It's not.

You say the woman created it. Wow. Over simplistic and irrelevant.

A fetus can't have bodily autonomy because it is fully dependent.

You do get to kill people in self defense. Which abortion is.

You haven't said one thing about what entitles a fetus to rights that no person has.

You just keep hysterically referring to killing babies.

 

[Sean Renaud]

I think what the problem is is that you can't stick to one issue, because constantly moving the goalposts is how you argue.

No matter how you got fertilized, you now have a fetus inside of you. It may not be fair. It may not be what you want. It may be from the result of a criminal act. It doesn't really matter. You now have a human life inside of you, and that life has rights to bodily autonomy.

You don't get to kill people on your property for trespassing, so why should you have the right to kill a baby that YOUR BODY CREATED for supposedly trespassing?

Actually you do get to kill people for trespassing on your property. How generous the law is depends on your race and location but you most definitely DO get to kill people for that.

You keep pretending like the science doesn't show that there is no human life in you at the point that most abortions take place. We don't base our laws on your ancient fairytales for a reason and this is one of them.

 

[butters]

Okay, well, I would point out that the woman's body MADE the fetus.

If you don't give consent to have a fetus in your body, then don't fucking MAKE a fetus in your body.

^^
well, there's a stupid

How fucking quaint, liar.



one hell of an ugly yahoo url link

'no exceptions for rape or incest: Alabama, Arkansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Missouri, Ohio, Oklahoma, Tennessee and Texas.

'The majority of these measures were passed by Republican-controlled state legislatures, suggesting that the issue may become an albatross for the party. When Mississippi Gov. Tate Reeves, a Republican, appeared on NBC’s “Meet the Press” on Sunday, he falsely asserted that his state’s abortion ban has an exception for rape and incest. When host Chuck Todd noted that it doesn’t, Reeves avoided taking a position on whether such an exception should be added to the law." '

just looking at those names, one wonders how they all rate on a chart of rates of incest and rape


View attachment 2148701
^^
worth reposting

Interesting how many of the states that are putting in restrictive abortion laws have the highest infant mortality rates https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/infant_mortality_rates/infant_mortality.htm

It seems that "pro-life" ends at birth...

uhuh

Amendment IX​

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

The Constitution is a floor on rights NOT a ceiling!

A-fuckin'-men!

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

The laws against abortion originated as a movement by male doctors to ostracize and displace midwives. It was not about safety or life. Just like it isn't now.

They are guided by hysteria and lies. That's all. Don't lie more.

You are a liar. If you don't want to be called a liar, then quit lying. If you don't like being called a liar, too bad.

Anti abortion fanatics are liars. Always have been, always will be.

Again, you will support a national ban. Don't fucking lie.

Everything thing I’ve told you can easily be verified. Our Constitution, our system of government, abortion legislation, judicial precedent, the moral and ethical divide over abortion, etc. I don’t mind being called a liar for pointing out these realities.

You are obviously unhappy and extremely emotional over the fact that abortion laws exist. It’s clouding your ability to have a rational discussion.

You started this thread seeking affirmation and to a large extent, you received that. Take the win, be happy, accept that different points of view exist, move to an abortion-friendly state if you don’t already live in one, practice birth control if you need to, and don’t live in fear of a national ban on abortion. The Congressional math, Senate rules, and national sentiment makes that about as likely as a federal ban on beer and wine. And keep spewing hate my way if it relieves the anger you harbor toward those who have different perspectives than you.

 

[AlexBailey]

The shithead liberals will never understand this. If a woman is pregnant it’s only because she wanted to get pregnant. If she didn’t want to be pregnant she would have shut her reproductive system off.

You're obviously a sick-fuck conservative troll. So next time you rape someone and get her pregnant it's her fault because she didn't "shut off her reproductive system?"

 

[adrina]

Everything thing I’ve told you can easily be verified. Our Constitution, our system of government, abortion legislation, judicial precedent, the moral and ethical divide over abortion, etc. I don’t mind being called a liar for pointing out these realities.

You are obviously unhappy and extremely emotional over the fact that abortion laws exist. It’s clouding your ability to have a rational discussion.

You started this thread seeking affirmation and to a large extent, you received that. Take the win, be happy, accept that different points of view exist, move to an abortion-friendly state if you don’t already live in one, practice birth control if you need to, and don’t live in fear of a national ban on abortion. The Congressional math, Senate rules, and national sentiment makes that about as likely as a federal ban on beer and wine. And keep spewing hate my way if it relieves the anger you harbor toward those who have different perspectives than you.

I can't imagine why anyone would be happy with being lied to by dishonest fanatics like yourself. It completely eludes me.

Your warped interpretation of the constitution - originalism, another lie - is just another chink in the armor of this so called pro life movement.

You are a liar because you lie. You go along with liars and you allow them to lie. You carry their lies forward.

Win? Hardly. By mid summer women will be subcitizens and a slave to any fetus in her uterus.

Fuck off. I have no nice words or patience for civility to fanatical liars who only want to control everyone else regardless of the harm it will cause.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

“I think what the problem is is that you can't stick to one issue, because constantly moving the goalposts is how you argue.”

Yes.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

I can't imagine why anyone would be happy with being lied to by dishonest fanatics like yourself. It completely eludes me.

Your warped interpretation of the constitution - originalism, another lie - is just another chink in the armor of this so called pro life movement.

You are a liar because you lie. You go along with liars and you allow them to lie. You carry their lies forward.

Win? Hardly. By mid summer women will be subcitizens and a slave to any fetus in her uterus.

Fuck off. I have no nice words or patience for civility to fanatical liars who only want to control everyone else regardless of the harm it will cause.

Belated Happy Mother’s Day