dealing with dishonesty

[carsonshepherd]

Just strange to find out the person you trust most has lied to you and kept secrets.

Keep in mind, though, that not everyone has the same standards of honesty as you do. Some people do not feel they owe you the same honesty you give them. Some people have secrets they feel they cannot tell anyone. Like others have said, you must accept what people are capable of giving. And if you can't accept their limitations, then maybe they are not the friend for you.

As for cyber/online relationships.... I have found it best and easiest not to trust anyone. At least not at first. As Elizabeth said, you cannot look into someone's eyes online and see those verbal and voice cues about their intentions that we can have in person. I know not everyone is out to hurt or take advantage of you, but neither is everyone completely generous and unselfish. Those people are out there - I have been lucky to meet some - but I always assume the worst until proven wrong. Maybe I'm just a cynical bastard though...

 

[sophia jane]

As for cyber/online relationships.... I have found it best and easiest not to trust anyone. At least not at first. As Elizabeth said, you cannot look into someone's eyes online and see those verbal and voice cues about their intentions that we can have in person. I know not everyone is out to hurt or take advantage of you, but neither is everyone completely generous and unselfish. Those people are out there - I have been lucky to meet some - but I always assume the worst until proven wrong. Maybe I'm just a cynical bastard though...

I am one of those poor souls who trusts everyone unless given reason not to. But I am quickly learning this- that online I shouldn't give out my trust to anyone. You are right, it is impossible to really know who someone is online, at least not for a long time. This is a difficult transition for someone like me, but probably the best thing I can do to protect myself.

SJ

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

I don't have many friends. I have a lot of colleauges, a lot of associates, a lot of people I hang with, a lot of friends of friends. But only four or five actual true friends. I find the defining trait of a friend as them being a person you trust to make decisions about you or your life that you would otherwise be too close or ill-equipped to decide.

If one of my friends kept a secret from me? Lied about it? I'd have to trust that they were doing right by me, in doing it. That maybe I want honesty, but they knew best. Its not about how much they trust me, it's about how much I trust them.

I trust my friends completely, if they feel its for the best to keep something from me (and they have, at times), I cannot begrudge them that unless I'm trying to make myself a victim so I can get righteous.

 

[BigAndTall]

About cyber relationships.

I wouldn't say you can't trust people, but you need to be smart about it.

I am normally very very cusious at first, and than after a while, see just how much my RL i can talk about.

 

[Guest]

<threadjack>

Big, I just noticed your title. LOL! Care to show me your sprinkles?

</threadjack>

 

[sophia jane]

If one of my friends kept a secret from me? Lied about it? I'd have to trust that they were doing right by me, in doing it. That maybe I want honesty, but they knew best. Its not about how much they trust me, it's about how much I trust them.

I trust my friends completely, if they feel its for the best to keep something from me (and they have, at times), I cannot begrudge them that unless I'm trying to make myself a victim so I can get righteous.

I think this is an interesting point. And possibly a very valid one, at least as applies to my situation. Thanks for that.

SJ

 

[Softouch911]

I don't have many friends. I have a lot of colleauges, a lot of associates, a lot of people I hang with, a lot of friends of friends. But only four or five actual true friends. I find the defining trait of a friend as them being a person you trust to make decisions about you or your life that you would otherwise be too close or ill-equipped to decide.

If one of my friends kept a secret from me? Lied about it? I'd have to trust that they were doing right by me, in doing it. That maybe I want honesty, but they knew best. Its not about how much they trust me, it's about how much I trust them.

I trust my friends completely, if they feel its for the best to keep something from me (and they have, at times), I cannot begrudge them that unless I'm trying to make myself a victim so I can get righteous.

Joe, this is great!

But I gotta say you're a better man than I! (At least in this.... )

SJ is hurt by being lied to. When it happens to me, especially from a friend, I get mad, angry that they didn't let me make my own decisions (if they said it was for my own good), or angry at the betrayal of the friendship (if they were being selfish).

And after I'm angry I want to get back at them ... usually by trying to do the same thing to them.

Not very noble. And maybe not very smart, and I rarely have gone so far as to try to do it, but ....

I agree with you, like I said. I wish I could do it: kudos to you!

Softie -- romancing the venom

 

[Wildcard Ky]

It's definitely a touchy situation when you know the friend is doing it with good intentions. It's just something you'll have to weigh for yourself. One thing you need to reconcile is why were they lying instead of simply not saying anything. Being silent doesn't equate to a lie.

Myself, I can't stand liars/lying. I am honest with people, and I expect the same in return. If my kids get into trouble for something and lie about it, they get in more trouble for the lying than the act that got them into trouble. At the same time, I can remain silent about something, and I don't consider it that I've lied to the other person.

 

[LadyJeanne]

It's definitely a touchy situation when you know the friend is doing it with good intentions. It's just something you'll have to weigh for yourself. One thing you need to reconcile is why were they lying instead of simply not saying anything. Being silent doesn't equate to a lie.

Myself, I can't stand liars/lying. I am honest with people, and I expect the same in return. If my kids get into trouble for something and lie about it, they get in more trouble for the lying than the act that got them into trouble. At the same time, I can remain silent about something, and I don't consider it that I've lied to the other person.

I appreciate your honesty...

My ex has the same policy on lying. He won't lie to me in answer to a direct question, but he omits truth because he doesn't see it as lying. So, unless I asked, "Gee, sexy lover, did you cheat on me today?" I wouldn't know. Big Liar.

And, wouldn't you know, I beat myself up for not asking the right questions, as though I should be expected to know what questions to ask.

 

[carsonshepherd]

I appreciate your honesty...

My ex has the same policy on lying. He won't lie to me in answer to a direct question, but he omits truth because he doesn't see it as lying. So, unless I asked, "Gee, sexy lover, did you cheat on me today?" I wouldn't know. Big Liar.

Yeah, withholding the truth is nothing but a big fat lie. My policy: don't do anything I have to lie about, including just not mentioning it. LJ

 

[sophia jane]

I appreciate your honesty...

My ex has the same policy on lying. He won't lie to me in answer to a direct question, but he omits truth because he doesn't see it as lying. So, unless I asked, "Gee, sexy lover, did you cheat on me today?" I wouldn't know. Big Liar.

LMAO! Yeah, I'm with ya.
In my situation, it was a bit of both since I asked him quesitons on several occasions that would have been the perfect time for him to tell me, but instead he lied.

SJ

 

[LadyJeanne]

Yeah, withholding the truth is nothing but a big fat lie. My policy: don't do anything I have to lie about, including just not mentioning it. LJ

That's how non-fucked up people do it.

Thank you, sweets.

 

[Wildcard Ky]

I didn't mean to imply answering a question with silence. I meant not mentioning something at all isn't lying.

 

[carsonshepherd]

I didn't mean to imply answering a question with silence. I meant not mentioning something at all isn't lying.

Not lying is still dishonesty though... (not that I have never done this, or justified it by saying it isn't lying.)

 

[Wildcard Ky]

If you and I were friends in real life, and I saw your boyfriend out with someone else and didn't tell you about it, would it be dishonest on my part? You never asked any questions or anything like that. It's just a matter of I didn't tell you something.

That's what I'm referring to in being silent.

 

[LadyJeanne]

If you and I were friends in real life, and I saw your boyfriend out with someone else and didn't tell you about it, would it be dishonest on my part? You never asked any questions or anything like that. It's just a matter of I didn't tell you something.

That's what I'm referring to in being silent.

If I were telling you, as my friend, how much I love the boyfriend and how close we were and how happy I was and maybe this guy was the 'one' for me, would you keep silent? If so, yes, that's dishonest when you know something crucial and significant and don't tell to spare yourself from being the bearer of bad news.

 

[ElizabethWest]

A sin of omission... You can't hold back on a friend even if you think it's in their best interest. If you do, what kind of friend are you? Carson would be better off without the cheating bum even if it hurt his feelings to find out the truth.

 

[carsonshepherd]

If you and I were friends in real life, and I saw your boyfriend out with someone else and didn't tell you about it, would it be dishonest on my part? You never asked any questions or anything like that. It's just a matter of I didn't tell you something.

That's what I'm referring to in being silent.

I understand you. I'm not disagreeing. I've done about every kind of lie and dishonesty and sin of omission there is so I don't get judgemental about other people. And I definitely don't squeal on friends, that's just a matter of loyalty. To know something is a lie or dishonest is one thing. Then you choose whether or not you can live with that.

 

[Wildcard Ky]

If I were telling you, as my friend, how much I love the boyfriend and how close we were and how happy I was and maybe this guy was the 'one' for me, would you keep silent? If so, yes, that's dishonest when you know something crucial and significant and don't tell to spare yourself from being the bearer of bad news.

Yes. I probably would keep silent. It's not a matter of sparing myself from being the bearer of bad news, it's more a matter of that's something between them.

 

[carsonshepherd]

Oh - and by squealing on a friend...

If you were MY friend you should tell me. (I wouldn't care but that is beside the point.)

If you were HIS friend... well... then your loyalty would be to him. I'd find out anyway.

I don't squeal on friends. Loyalty between friends is one thing I don't compromise on. And my friends don't either.

 

[ElizabethWest]

I don't squeal on friends. Loyalty between friends is one thing I don't compromise on. And my friends don't either.

*sigh of relief*

You know all my secrets...

 

[carsonshepherd]

*sigh of relief*

You know all my secrets...

See... that is why I don't squeal. You know some of mine too, no? Fair is fair.

 

[ElizabethWest]

See... that is why I don't squeal. You know some of mine too, no? Fair is fair.

My lips are sealed, gorgeous. Especially after last night...

 

[Wildcard Ky]

Hope you didn't take it personally that I used you as an example Carson. I didn't mean anything personal by it.

 

[carsonshepherd]

Hope you didn't take it personally that I used you as an example Carson. I didn't mean anything personal by it.

Oh, heavens no. Nothing offends me. No worries.