Completely torn.

[lady_sensuous]

Thanks for the advice, all.

 

[bobsgirl]

I've been seeing a man on and off for the last two years who I love very much. I have three children, and my 12 yr. old daughter is the only one who says she doesn't want me to be with him. The only reason she gives me is that it upsets her when I leave because she wishes I was with her father, who is very active in her life. The other two children's father isn't apart of their life, and they don't really care about the situation. They just want to see their mother happy, and have said so.

Since I met my S.O., I've occasionally gone over my ex's house for a Sunday night dinner when he has visits with my daughter, and then I bring her home. By doing this, I think its caused more problems. It gives her hope that we could get back together, when in fact, there is none. My ex and I have a good relationship, and it comes natural for us to give each other a hug and kiss goodbye when I leave. It's on the cheek, and there's nothing passionate about it. I don't think things would be the way they are right now if I hadn't done this. I'm not sure.

This past weekend I didn't go over for dinner, but he brought her home, and she later cried her eyes out in my arms. She told me how much it hurt her to see me with my S.O., how she wishes I was with her daddy instead, and it's ripping my heart out. She doesn't even know what I did over the weekend. I'm trying to make everybody happy here, and of course, I can't. It's impossible.

My S.O. is a very good man with a child of his own, and knows what's going on. I wrote him on Monday and said we should end our relationship because of how my daughter feels. He wrote back and was very understanding, and said how much he loved me, and that he respected my decision. I just couldn't do it over the phone.

Which leaves me to today, where I was stuck in bed almost the entire day, and all I could do was cry. I later called him because I was so upset, and told him how torn I felt. I feel like I have to choose, and to even say that, hurts me.

What would you do in a situation like this? I am so messed up. I love them more than words can say, and he makes me happy, but I'm so afraid it's going to destroy my relationship with my daughter. I almost feel like I'm no longer the adult. What in the world should I do? What would you do?

You said you have a good relationship with your daughter's dad. I wonder if there's something he might be able to do to help, if only to reinforce the fact that a reconciliation is not going to happen.

This is a hard one, Lady S. I wish I had some magic words for you. It sounds like both of you are miserable. I admire you for making the decision you did for your daughter's sake, even though it's so painful. Maybe some family counseling?

 

[lady_sensuous]

You said you have a good relationship with your daughter's dad. I wonder if there's something he might be able to do to help, if only to reinforce the fact that a reconciliation is not going to happen.

This is a hard one, Lady S. I wish I had some magic words for you. It sounds like both of you are miserable. I admire you for making the decision you did for your daughter's sake, even though it's so painful. Maybe some family counseling?

Thanks for commenting, bobsgirl. That's an idea.

Even though me and her father have a good relationship, he doesn't know anything about the man I'm seeing. My daughter won't tell him - in fear he'd be hurt, and I can't either. He still loves me, and that's something I forgot to say.

The man I'm seeing is a 40 minute drive, and for the most part, I'm at his place, or a distance from the area of where I live and my ex live. My ex and I are 5 minutes apart.

He knows I've gone out on some dates since we've been apart because I told him, but I can tell how much it pains him to know that. I think another fear of mine is to lose him completely as a friend, even though I don't tell him everything.

I think I'm so completely fucked here.

 

[naamplao]

Thanks for commenting, bobsgirl. That's an idea.

Even though me and her father have a good relationship, he doesn't know anything about the man I'm seeing. My daughter won't tell him - in fear he'd be hurt, and I can't either. He still loves me, and that's something I forgot to say.

The man I'm seeing is a 40 minute drive, and for the most part, I'm at his place, or a distance from the area of where I live and my ex live. My ex and I are 5 minutes apart.

He knows I've gone out on some dates since we've been apart because I told him, but I can tell how much it pains him to know that. I think another fear of mine is to lose him completely as a friend, even though I don't tell him everything.

I think I'm so completely fucked here.

It is just a guess here but I doubt that he is unaware of your new situation. Why?? Because probably your daughter has told him or at least hinted at it.

Not talking about it with your EX is not going to solve your problem. Talking about it with him just might be a starting point for a solution. You say that you have a good relationship with him...why would you lose him as a friend? Except for the fact that he may resent you going out with someone.

Your daughter may be feeling insecurity in that if your SO is permanent she may feel that she may lose her father somehow. Security for her right now is a happy mom and dad....keeping dad out of the picture does not make him happy, I'd wager.

You will have to address your daughter's security issues. If the EX is ok with your SO then I would venture things will improve as long as acccess to daddy does not change.

Talk to your EX...it is your only way to solve this....you can still be friends and maybe become allies in your daughter's security.

 

[wicked woman]

Íf it was me, I'd call your SO back and tell him you need some time to help your daughter deal with this but I wouldn't break off with him. Why would you break off with someone when your relationship has potential, for your daughter's unhappiness over the normal dreams of a child of divorced parents hoping against hope her parents will get back together?

I don't see why you need to choose. You need to be a Mom and not a best friend to your daughter. Help her realize that it's normal to want her parents to get back together. (I speak from experience as a divorced Mom.) Explain that it's not going to happen...with or without your SO in the picture.

The ideas to have your ex get involved in this are good. I appreciate this may be difficult but he's the adult...your daughter is the child. As her father he needs to, and if it's explained to him, probably wants to help your daughter cope with this.

As for your SO, from what you say he loves you and is very understanding. Talk to him and explain things. He'd probably rather go slow/be patient that lose you.

I'm not sure where you are in your relationship with your SO, but don't rush into a marriage until you've got a better handle on this.

Just remember...you asked.

 

[lady_sensuous]

It is just a guess here but I doubt that he is unaware of your new situation. Why?? Because probably your daughter has told him or at least hinted at it.

Exact words - "I could never tell daddy. It would hurt him."

If he was told about my relationship, I can almost guarantee he wouldn't want anything to do with me. Why? Because he still has hopes for us. I'm not helping by going over for dinner, and I know that. It's time to stop.

Not talking about it with your EX is not going to solve your problem. Talking about it with him just might be a starting point for a solution. You say that you have a good relationship with him...why would you lose him as a friend? Except for the fact that he may resent you going out with someone.

I would lose him as a friend, no doubt. I don't know... maybe it'd be for the best. Maybe it's the only way of being able to truly move on with the man I love. I don't like having this secret, but I also don't wanna lose my ex as a friend either. Like I said, I really feel fucked here.

Your daughter may be feeling insecurity in that if your SO is permanent she may feel that she may lose her father somehow. Security for her right now is a happy mom and dad....keeping dad out of the picture does not make him happy, I'd wager.

I would never do that to her, and I constantly remind her of that. She says she understands, but this could still be a possibility. I always tell her that no one can replace her father, and I don't ask any other man to. Very important for her to know.

 

[lady_sensuous]

Íf it was me, I'd call your SO back and tell him you need some time to help your daughter deal with this but I wouldn't break off with him. Why would you break off with someone when your relationship has potential, for your daughter's unhappiness over the normal dreams of a child of divorced parents hoping against hope her parents will get back together?

I don't see why you need to choose. You need to be a Mom and not a best friend to your daughter. Help her realize that it's normal to want her parents to get back together. (I speak from experience as a divorced Mom.) Explain that it's not going to happen...with or without your SO in the picture.

The ideas to have your ex get involved in this are good. I appreciate this may be difficult but he's the adult...your daughter is the child. As her father he needs to, and if it's explained to him, probably wants to help your daughter cope with this.

As for your SO, from what you say he loves you and is very understanding. Talk to him and explain things. He'd probably rather go slow/be patient that lose you.

I'm not sure where you are in your relationship with your SO, but don't rush into a marriage until you've got a better handle on this.

Just remember...you asked.

Oh my goodness, no. We love each other very much, but marriage or moving in is the farthest thing on my mind right now. If I'm ever going to be asked, he's gonna have to wait for all my kids to graduate. That's 6 more years for my youngest.

Thanks for your advice.

 

[ShinigamiSama]

I really dont see why you have to choose
counseling will fix most of the issues with your daughter's grasp of the situation, though it may take a few months before any progress is seen. I've been a few times and at the time I didn't think it helped, but now that I look back on it the first month was just building a foundation for trusting another person; so even that may help if you can't afford to go every week for a few months


best of luck

 

[Leah57]

I completely agree with WW. I'm a divorced mom, too (OK, so my 'kids' are 29 and 21, but hey, they were children when I was getting divorced!).

Why do you even care if your EX is your 'friend' or not? You can be friendLY and amicable, and parent as a team without being 'friends'! Having dinner with daddy and daughter only gives false hope to a girl who is wishing for what will never happen. Your EX is a big boy, and if he's hoping that you and he will get back together, you need to set him straight, too.

When my boys were old enough to understand, I told them (and still do!), that there is a part of me that will always love their father. One reason is that my sons would not be the men they are if it weren't for their dad's part in their genes, upbringing, etc. To not love their dad would diminish in some way the love I have for my sons. We get along well in family situations (son's wedding, grandson's birth and christening, etc). My EX, on the other hand, is a complete asshole, and even being on the same continent with him is too damn close in my book! and yes, my ex and my sons' father are one in the same person.....

 

[naamplao]

Exact words - "I could never tell daddy. It would hurt him."

If he was told about my relationship, I can almost guarantee he wouldn't want anything to do with me. Why? Because he still has hopes for us. I'm not helping by going over for dinner, and I know that. It's time to stop.

How long have you been divorced? How long have you been involved with your SO? Did you wait a long time before introducing him to your daughter?

I have a feeling you introduced them to eachother far too soon.

Burdening your daughter with secret is not helping. You have to remove the secret then by explaining the situation with your EX. Sounds to me like you left him for some reason...you had the courage to do that...now you must take the next step and make it final if this new SO is worth it.

I would lose him as a friend, no doubt. I don't know... maybe it'd be for the best. Maybe it's the only way of being able to truly move on with the man I love. I don't like having this secret, but I also don't wanna lose my ex as a friend either. Like I said, I really feel fucked here.

Hmmmmm.....you don't need the EX as a friend...you need him to still be the father to your children. If you told him about your situation it would stop the hugs and kisses on the cheek on the doorstep but would it stop the visits of father/daughter?

I divorced my EX 2 years ago myself. I don't interfere with her and my son's relationship. We are on good enough terms that I know we can sit side-by-side when he marries or has a significant event in his life...but I've seen her maybe 4 times since our divorce.

It sounds to me like you still have issues with your divorce.

 

[wicked woman]

I completely agree with WW. I'm a divorced mom, too (OK, so my 'kids' are 29 and 21, but hey, they were children when I was getting divorced!).

Why do you even care if your EX is your 'friend' or not? You can be friendLY and amicable, and parent as a team without being 'friends'! Having dinner with daddy and daughter only gives false hope to a girl who is wishing for what will never happen. Your EX is a big boy, and if he's hoping that you and he will get back together, you need to set him straight, too.

When my boys were old enough to understand, I told them (and still do!), that there is a part of me that will always love their father. One reason is that my sons would not be the men they are if it weren't for their dad's part in their genes, upbringing, etc. To not love their dad would diminish in some way the love I have for my sons. We get along well in family situations (son's wedding, grandson's birth and christening, etc). My EX, on the other hand, is a complete asshole, and even being on the same continent with him is too damn close in my book! and yes, my ex and my sons' father are one in the same person.....

Don't mind me while I snicker here...agreeing with the dichotomy of the ex husband and the father of my sons.

I'm reminded of being at my younger son's wedding, which my ex husband and his current wife attended (with their mixed family). My ex and I have always been friendly towards each other. I don't wish him ill, still loved him when we divorced...but have absolutely no wish to be friends, let alone anything more.

I had the joy of listening to his wife explain to her children how unusual it was...and yet a good thing...that her husband and I could come to our son's wedding and not only be civil but friendly towards each other. Hey the children from his second marriage treat me like an aunt!

So I agree...help your ex realize the truth too. With a little bit of work you may be able to have your cake and eat it too.

 

[lady_sensuous]

How long have you been divorced? How long have you been involved with your SO? Did you wait a long time before introducing him to your daughter?

I have a feeling you introduced them to eachother far too soon.

I was never married to him, and we were together for 5 years. My S.O. (now) and I have been together for two years. It was on and off in the beginning because I wanted to take things slowly. So, no, I didn't introduce him to my children too soon. I consider myself to be a smart and loving parent, and do think before I act. Please don't assume.

Burdening your daughter with secret is not helping. You have to remove the secret then by explaining the situation with your EX. Sounds to me like you left him for some reason...you had the courage to do that...now you must take the next step and make it final if this new SO is worth it.

If my daughter wants to keep it a secret to him, who am I to stop her? She has feelings, and doesn't want to hurt her father. Are you assuming I put this into her head? Absolutely not.

I hate the secret, and I hate feeling that I have to sneak around because I worry about his feelings like my daughter, but in a different way. I wouldn't know where to begin to tell him, and it didn't come easy for me to leave him either.

Hmmmmm.....you don't need the EX as a friend...you need him to still be the father to your children. If you told him about your situation it would stop the hugs and kisses on the cheek on the doorstep but would it stop the visits of father/daughter?

You are getting confused.

I said in my beginning post that I have one child with him. The other two children's father is not active in their life. And I already said that I'm stopping the Sunday night dinners because it gives him hope when there is none. Obviously this would stop the hugs and kisses goodbye, right?

I divorced my EX 2 years ago myself. I don't interfere with her and my son's relationship. We are on good enough terms that I know we can sit side-by-side when he marries or has a significant event in his life...but I've seen her maybe 4 times since our divorce.

It sounds to me like you still have issues with your divorce.

Again, not divorce. It's a past relationship that's now a friendship. Not wanting to hurt someone's feelings makes me have issues? I call it having a heart.

 

[bobsgirl]

Lady S, I'm not sure if it's been mentioned, but if your ex holds out hope that the two of you might reconcile, he could be unconsciously or even consciously fueling your daughter's hopes.

I know it's hard. It would be hard for me too, but I hope you'll consider having a serious conversation about this with your ex.

 

[Lolaleigh]

My 2 cents on the situation.

First your daughter will grow up sooner than you think and have her own life. As you have already said marriage will happen when your kids are older so I would not end your relationship because of your daughter. Your happiness is important too and you cannot live your life entirely for your kids. I know that sounds harsh but in 2 -4 years your daughter will probably not give you the time of day as she will be out with friends, working at a part-time job and going through her firsts of many broken hearts from boys.

I don't say this to be heartless or mean but you still have to remember you are a woman and not just a mom. If this is a man you think you can grow old with and you enjoy your free time with, don't give it up.

There has to be a way for you to tell your daughter that you are going to continue to see your SO and in time she will understand. If you end this relationship you are giving too much control to a young girl that should not have it. If she gets you to end a relationship with a man she doesn't like... she will think that she can get you to start one with her father.

Again,... just my 2 cents from a different angle. Hope I didn't offend.

 

[M's girl]

I think that children who are 12 years old understand a lot more than we (adults) give them credit for sometimes. Could it be that she is playing out her wish for you and your ex to be together while displaying her grief? I hate to say this but children can be terrible egoistic and manipulative when they want something.

I also think that you are turning yourself inside out and upside down to make her happy, hell, keep everybody happy (including your ex) and you forget about yourself in the process! And you are not being truthful. I'm not saying this to tell you you're wrong because I can see and understand what you are doing.... but it's not working. Your daughter needs to know. Your ex needs to know. It's over. As long as you are not clear and outspoken about that I can totally understand how your daughter (and maybe also your ex) still think things could work out again. Why is it you are not telling your ex you have a new relationship? You don't have to explain or justify your new relationship to him. If he still loves you and you are not being truthful about this new relationship you are only going to hurt him more in the end.

Your children should come first, always, but as long as your new partner is treating you and your children well there is no way your 12 year old daughter is to say who you can date. You should not have to choose! I think she is mainly confused and the only one who can put a stop to her confusion is you! With the help of your ex.... I think it's a very good idea, as someone else suggested already, to talk to your ex and have him also talk to his daughter!

 

[liberatedslave]

Hi Lady S

I've thought about this and it seems to me that you have given your daughter the upper hand here. She knows that your ex still wants you and she knows you have a new guy. She also knows that you have put it into her power whether to tell her father this or not. She probably daydreams about manipulating this leverage somehow and bringing her parents together. This is a potentially dangerous dream because it's what she wants most in the world right now with all her heart and if you don't take control back into your own hands it'll backfire spectacularly.

Regardless of how she feels, your daughter should not have the right to tell or not tell your ex about your new guy. This is something he has a right to know. This guy is becoming a part of his daughter's life and a part of your life. It is your place to tell him this and I would strongly suggest you do this without your daughter present. This is between you two, a totally separate issue from his fatherhood and you should make that clear. I can't believe you have let this continue for two years, whatever happens your ex is going to be upset and not wholly without reason.

If your daughter is 12 and you were with her father for 5 years I'm guessing that it must be at least 7 years since you split as a couple? If I've got that right then at this stage he has no business thinking that you will get back together and in telling your daughter he wants this he's using her as a pawn and being unfair to her. HE is doing that, not you. You must have a face to face talk with him and explain that to him so he understands that, whatever his own feelings, he is not the issue here - your daughter is.

As others have said, you have a right to a loving relationship and the fact your ex hasn't sought one is not your responsibility. Your SO has been incredibly patient to put up with this iMO.

It'll cause trouble and people will get upset but these things almost always settle down. You've been so afraid of confrontation that you've let your ex and daughter live in a dreamworld for two years. This is as unfair to them as it is to you and initially your ex will be hurt and jealous and your daughter will feel betrayed.

She will feel betrayed because you have let her think that she's the absolute centre of your world to the exclusion of all else and that what she wants is more important than your happiness. She'll think you've betrayed her father by having a relationship. ALL HELL WILL BREAK LOOSE!

BUT

What is really the ABSOLUTE worst that could realistically happen?

Your daughter might want to spend more time with Dad but that's ok. She may decide she wants to live with him but he probably doesn't want that and as long as you see her regularly and she has space to adjust and she knows your house is always home you really won't alienate her in the long term.

Your ex will have a tantrum, become difficult, you might argue, no more sunday lunches. Would he really risk his relationship with his daughter? He might be disappointed but it has been years since you were a couple. He'll be upset it took you so long to tell him and use it as an excuse to play the injured party but so what? How much time do YOU have to spend with him so long as he sees his daughter?

Now think... after two years of this fiasco. What's the absolute BEST that could happen. How long have you been waiting to begin your life with your new man? What will the calm be like after the storm?

I bet it's more than worth it.

I'm sorry to be so direct and I hope I haven't offended you but to me the basic choice is simple. Either your ex's hurt feelings and your daughter's temporary (and it will be) disappointment are more important than a man you say you truly love.

I do hope that whatever you decide you end the stalemate, the situation you're in now is simply untenable and none of it is the fault of your poor, jilted SO.

Best wishes

 

[liberatedslave]

Oh my goodness, no. We love each other very much, but marriage or moving in is the farthest thing on my mind right now. If I'm ever going to be asked, he's gonna have to wait for all my kids to graduate. That's 6 more years for my youngest.

Lady S, I just spotted this post and it really shocked me. Why on Earth do you think that progressing with your relationship as any consenting adult has a right to is going to damage your children somehow? You have said that your other two kids approve of your guy. What are you so afraid of that you could imagine living apart from the man you love for six years could ever be necessary?

I think you really need some perspective here. Relationships break up, millions of kids have step-famillies, things go wrong and you pick yourself up and you rebuild your life. These are valuable lessons for any kid, they're a lot more resilient than they look when they're crying and stamping in their rooms.

If your daughter, who you love so much, was in your shoes right now - what would you be telling her to do? Could you watch her live the way that you're living now? You deserve no less than what you would wish for her.

 

[lady_sensuous]

 

[Darkknight2010]

What would you do in a situation like this? I am so messed up. I love them more than words can say, and he makes me happy, but I'm so afraid it's going to destroy my relationship with my daughter. I almost feel like I'm no longer the adult. What in the world should I do? What would you do?

OH dear... my two cents; see a concelor or some semblance there of, asap.

You obviously don't want your daughter upset, but you being miserable isn't gonna help things either.

Why a conselor when you've got a lot of helpful people here? Because we're not there, we don't have constant updates on what's going on, and frankly we're not professionals... although if someone IS then bless you for a free consult.

My best advise is to deal with this NOW. If she's that upset waiting it out is gonna make it worse.

Good luck milady.

 

[Lolaleigh]

Your past abuse comes across loud and clear. I agree with DarkNight and you need to see a therapist, not only you, but the entire family. My best friend is in the field and I would not have gotten through an abusive ralationship without her and her advice.
You need to take back charge of your life and make sure your kids know that you are in charge otherwise your girls are going to think that this is what being a grown up is all about and they will not have hapy productive lives themselves. You have proven that in the end you are strong as you left the abusive relationship. Keep going.

You are trying so hard not to rock the boat and in the process you are drifting with no real direction. If you love your SO and not your EX then you need to tell your family and the EX. You ARE worthy of love of a good man and I think by the way your SO is hanging in there that you have found one. Don't give this up. Especially if he is good to your kids and wants to be part of their lives.

Living for your kids is great but not at the sacrifice of yourself. Children are selfish by nature and want whatever is good for them, not anyone else. They do not have the maturity to look past their own face at this point and see you as a woman and not just mom. With age comes understanding and in time they will be happy for you and proud of you for making a life for yourself. It may take years. But do you really want to be a marter?

 

[tanyachrs]

You need to tell her that she doesn't have any say in your romantic life and to get over it. It sounds harsh but it'll be doing her a kindness. You're giving her the idea that if she says or does the right thing she can affect a reconciliation and that's not true. You need to make it really clear that it's not true so she can stop feeling responsible.

 

[liberatedslave]

Wow Lady S, you have a lot on your plate. I can understand you carry guilt for moving your kids around & being indecisive about leaving your marriage. You need to sit down & decide where you want your life to be heading. Then you can tell others with certainty & move in that direction at your own pace. For now, your SO deserves to be either a partner you're proud of or a free agent. Be firm with both you ex & daughter & in time they'll respect you. Take small steps toward what you want & they'll adjust.

 

[naamplao]

If my daughter wants to keep it a secret to him, who am I to stop her? She has feelings, and doesn't want to hurt her father. Are you assuming I put this into her head? Absolutely not.

I hate the secret, and I hate feeling that I have to sneak around because I worry about his feelings like my daughter, but in a different way. I wouldn't know where to begin to tell him, and it didn't come easy for me to leave him either.

If you took the initiative and talked it out with the EX them the issue with your secret would disappear. It may bring other issues to the table but then you would be moving forward instead of walking in circles.

The point to begin with the EX is that this secret is affecting your daughter and you are looking for his help in making your daughter understand that you are moving on with your life. If he is any kind of a father he will understand and it would probably help him understand some aspects of his daughter's behavior that he probably has been confused about in the past.

Again, not divorce. It's a past relationship that's now a friendship. Not wanting to hurt someone's feelings makes me have issues? I call it having a heart.

I am sorry for the mis-intreptation but usually an EX is a product of a divorce, it was a natural assumption. It is moot anyway since a 5 year live-in relationship and a child as a result is a marriage without the paperwork.

I can see you are a caring person but keeping such a secret from someone who still has feelings for you is not going to dull the pain with time...the longer you wait to tell him the worse it gets IMHO

 

[lady_sensuous]

Well, I guess it's over. He won't return my calls anymore. He's probably doing this for my daughter's sake.

I'll get over it. I'll move on like I've done before with everybody else I've lost in my life. Maybe it's for the best. I don't know.

I thank everyone for your advice, the understanding and thoughtful pm's, and taking time to help me out here. It was appreciated.

l_s

 

[M's girl]

Well, I guess it's over. He won't return my calls anymore. He's probably doing this for my daughter's sake.

I'll get over it. I'll move on like I've done before with everybody else I've lost in my life. Maybe it's for the best. I don't know.

I thank everyone for your advice, the understanding and thoughtful pm's, and taking time to help me out here. It was appreciated.

l_s

Give it (him) some time. He is doing what you asked him to. He probably is confused and angry. Wait a week or so. Then send him flowers or whatever (yes, women can do that too) with a note saying you made a huge mistake and although you still want to do right by your daughter, the two of you is something that she will have to accept. This gives you some time to talk to your ex and your daughter first, to set the record straight....