Co-Authoring, How To?

[SamScribble]

Many years ago, I co-authored a comic novel.

My co-author wrote the first chapter and left it with the central character facing a major and potentially embarrassing challenge. I then had to write him out of that situation - but I couldn't resist writing him in to another before I handed it back. She - my co-author - returned serve. And so we went on for another 20-something chapters.

In the end, our agent (we shared the same one) suggested that it would make a better radio play than a novel, and so my co-author recast it as a radio play and we sold it to the Beeb.

I'm not sure that I would recommend our modus operandi, but it was a lot of fun.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Thank you, I'll need some, no doubt. You have piqued my curiosity with your icon; is that a Rottweiler/Burnese Mt. Dog mix? Handsome whatever it is.

He, Rudy, was...he past away a couple of years ago, was a Rottweiler/Pit Bull mix.

Most people were afraid of him, until they saw the grandchildren tugging on his ears, his tail and trying to climb on his back for a horsieback ride. He actually wouldn't hurt a fly...not really true, him and his aunt killed the Easter Bunny two years in a row. They caught a rabbit in the backyard.

But try and approach the grandkids and he was a different dog, unless he knew you.

You can see pics of him and his aunt Sunshine here.

 

[PreOwned]

Many years ago, I co-authored a comic novel.

My co-author wrote the first chapter and left it with the central character facing a major and potentially embarrassing challenge. I then had to write him out of that situation - but I couldn't resist writing him in to another before I handed it back. She - my co-author - returned serve. And so we went on for another 20-something chapters.

In the end, our agent (we shared the same one) suggested that it would make a better radio play than a novel, and so my co-author recast it as a radio play and we sold it to the Beeb.

I'm not sure that I would recommend our modus operandi, but it was a lot of fun.

That sounds different alright. A little too competitive, (or was it just mischievous?), for my tastes. Sounds like it produced a relentlessly paced piece though, so maybe it was good all in all. Thanks for the caution.

Preowned

 

[sr71plt]

Rather than moving from dilemma to dilemma, in my coauthored works we're usually exploring relationship, which progresses in chronological scenes (or occasionally flashbacks), where the characters trade off in giving their personal perspectives (usually quite different) of what is happening between them and only eventually (if ever) getting on the same wavelength.

 

[xelliebabex]

Hi Preowned,

I guess I have been mentioned a couple of times in this thread so I thought I would weigh in.

I loved co-authoring it was so much fun! It had its downside when i went back to writing on my own. Its very motivational when you are sending pages back and forth and reading someone else's take on the story then being able to edit their little bit with suggestions and add your own extensions.

I co-authored three stories and each and everyone of the authors was different in their approach. I guess my best advice is to try and not make your co-author into another version of you. Accepting their quirks and style can make yours even better. For example:

Swilly was amazing with his acceptance of who I was and what i wanted in the story. We started the whole thing together and could not have wished for a better co-author because he listened to everything I had to offer. I am sure at times my Aussie-isms drove him insane but then again some of the things he wrote about i had to google definitions for as well. Particularly his food choices. As he said though we wrote pretty seamlessly because we were on the same page from the beginning and when someone took the story in a new direction the other person would just go with it. No being so wrapped up in a set plans helps when co-authoring, I think. We also didn't divide up the characters into male and female and though we make have from one point of view we each wrote about all the characters.

LC may call it binge writing but in truth he is like a squirrel with ADHD. He knows exactly where he wants to put all his nuts and is in such a rush to get there that he sometimes forgets to stop and look at the little sidetracks on the way that can lead to interesting berries and things. The majority of our collaboration was me saying, "Slow down and wait for me!" Having said that he showed me how good it can be to start a race (and it was a race for us) with a very firm plan and end goal in mind. He was amazing and drove that story from start to finish despite the fact I came into it a third of the way through (To replace his original partner) and made him change quite a bit of what he had done to accommodate my style. It was very much a male character to female character writing style. It was a truly amazing experience and I have a wonderful friendship from the experience.

Buckyduckman and I, are friends who just get each other these days. We have a similar sense of humor and writing with him was easy. He is a no mess no fuss kind of guy and we pretty much wrote our story in a couple of days taking responsibility for both character rather than dividing them. He had an idea, I liked it, off we went. We, of course, were under time constraints but I imagine it would be that easy if we co-authored again. He's is a great guy who makes me laugh and I enjoy his writing a lot.

I was lucky that all three of these wonderful guys just accepted my quirks (and bad grammar) and let me have my own voice in our stories. Each of them still carry great ratings and receive favorites even though it was over 6 months ago.

We used the back and forth style mostly, though with LC it was more the way you are discussing, where I, very purposefully, took the female lead and he the male and we went back forth sideways and at times upside down to get it right. He's very athletic like that lol!

Hope that helped a little, and that you and your friend write up a storm. :Rose:

 

[PreOwned]

Rather than moving from dilemma to dilemma, in my coauthored works we're usually exploring relationship, which progresses in chronological scenes (or occasionally flashbacks), where the characters trade off in giving their personal perspectives (usually quite different) of what is happening between them and only eventually (if ever) getting on the same wavelength.

sr71plt

I like that emphasis. Especially in erotica, (OK, so they're stroke stories; I can live with that), where the choicest meat is found in the tensions, and dynamics of the characters' relationships. After all, there's only so many places, and ways to stick it in, and only so many ways to describe doing it.

That also seems like a great way to maximize the potential in a collaborative work. Your mention of the surprises regarding what was going on, and what was significant, and why, depending on who was doing the telling--an awful lot like real life.

I'm assuming that you were working from an agreed upon plot outline--would that be right?

Thanks for sharing that with me--I think it will be very useful information.

Preowned

 

[sr71plt]

I'm assuming that you were working from an agreed upon plot outline--would that be right?

I don't work with an conscious outline, even in coauthored work. I have the hook(s) in mind before starting to write, but even if I have an end in mind, what I think is a better one can play through. I find there's a lot more organized in my unconscious, though. I don't always reveal my planned hook(s) to my coauthor, either. Often what he writes inspires me to change the whole direction of the story, including the ending. Writing is a discovery for me, not writing out what I've already decided on. I save outlines for nonfiction. My coauthor seems to go with that OK.

 

[PreOwned]

Hi Preowned,

I guess I have been mentioned a couple of times in this thread so I thought I would weigh in.

I loved co-authoring it was so much fun! It had its downside when i went back to writing on my own. Its very motivational when you are sending pages back and forth and reading someone else's take on the story then being able to edit their little bit with suggestions and add your own extensions.

I co-authored three stories and each and everyone of the authors was different in their approach. I guess my best advice is to try and not make your co-author into another version of you. Accepting their quirks and style can make yours even better. For example:

Swilly was amazing with his acceptance of who I was and what i wanted in the story. We started the whole thing together and could not have wished for a better co-author because he listened to everything I had to offer. I am sure at times my Aussie-isms drove him insane but then again some of the things he wrote about i had to google definitions for as well. Particularly his food choices. As he said though we wrote pretty seamlessly because we were on the same page from the beginning and when someone took the story in a new direction the other person would just go with it. No being so wrapped up in a set plans helps when co-authoring, I think. We also didn't divide up the characters into male and female and though we make have from one point of view we each wrote about all the characters.

LC may call it binge writing but in truth he is like a squirrel with ADHD. He knows exactly where he wants to put all his nuts and is in such a rush to get there that he sometimes forgets to stop and look at the little sidetracks on the way that can lead to interesting berries and things. The majority of our collaboration was me saying, "Slow down and wait for me!" Having said that he showed me how good it can be to start a race (and it was a race for us) with a very firm plan and end goal in mind. He was amazing and drove that story from start to finish despite the fact I came into it a third of the way through (To replace his original partner) and made him change quite a bit of what he had done to accommodate my style. It was very much a male character to female character writing style. It was a truly amazing experience and I have a wonderful friendship from the experience.

Buckyduckman and I, are friends who just get each other these days. We have a similar sense of humor and writing with him was easy. He is a no mess no fuss kind of guy and we pretty much wrote our story in a couple of days taking responsibility for both character rather than dividing them. He had an idea, I liked it, off we went. We, of course, were under time constraints but I imagine it would be that easy if we co-authored again. He's is a great guy who makes me laugh and I enjoy his writing a lot.

I was lucky that all three of these wonderful guys just accepted my quirks (and bad grammar) and let me have my own voice in our stories. Each of them still carry great ratings and receive favorites even though it was over 6 months ago.

We used the back and forth style mostly, though with LC it was more the way you are discussing, where I, very purposefully, took the female lead and he the male and we went back forth sideways and at times upside down to get it right. He's very athletic like that lol!

Hope that helped a little, and that you and your friend write up a storm. :Rose:

Xelliebabex

Thank you, so much. You have echoed a theme of several of the responses I've gotten to my question: There is no 'right' way to do this stuff. And it sounds to me like your success with it owes largely to your flexibility in your approach. I will remember that. Hopefully it will come naturally to me anyway, but if I catch myself becoming too intent on some particular, I'll (hopefully), recall your advice here.

All indications--from your message to me, to the comments others have made about you/your writing--point to your being a prolific writer. No doubt that helped with your collaborations as well, given the number of stories you worked on. I am a non-fiction writer, by training and habit, so this stuff will be a stretch for me, and no doubt my words will come more slowly than yours. I'm looking forward to it though, and hope to get some new skills, and some fun out of it. My co-author is creative, and unpredictable--and just lots of fun, (not to mention kinky), so I think we'll both enjoy it, whatever the final product turns out to be.

Truthfully, I think creative writing is the harder of the two. Non-fiction is mostly about brevity, and clarity, and economy of speech, when it comes to the actual writing. Of course, the work of getting your research, and your arguments right is the main, and often intense part of the job, but as for the writing itself--the logic of the relevant arguments, or the structuring of the appropriate expository bits--it sometimes seems to nearly write itself. The choices tend to seem simple, and obvious, (again, provided you are clear on exactly what it is you mean to say.) With creative writing, the choices all seem to involve a much bigger leap of faith, and offer unsure footing most of the way.

Thanks again for your thoughts.

PreOwned

 

[PreOwned]

I don't work with an conscious outline, even in coauthored work. I have the hook(s) in mind before starting to write, but even if I have an end in mind, what I think is a better one can play through. I find there's a lot more organized in my unconscious, though. I don't always reveal my planned hook(s) to my coauthor, either. Often what he writes inspires me to change the whole direction of the story, including the ending. Writing is a discovery for me, not writing out what I've already decided on. I save outlines for nonfiction. My coauthor seems to go with that OK.

sr71plt

More of that free-wheeling creative writer stuff. You guys are dangerous. I'm so used to relying on an outline, and at least semi-predetermined structure that I'm feeling a bit out of my element. Oh well, the worst I could do is fuck it all up, and have to start over. I've had decades of experience at that, so, no fears. Thanks.

 

[Hypoxia]

I'm so used to relying on an outline, and at least semi-predetermined structure that I'm feeling a bit out of my element. Oh well, the worst I could do is fuck it all up, and have to start over.

CV: I trained as a technical writer and played as a songwriter but only started writing fiction a little over a year ago. I seem to be doing okay here at LIT.

I've found a useful approach to storytelling: Populate an environment with story players and set a few plot points, then set the characters loose and transcribe their actions. I suppose that everything preceding "set the characters loose" constitutes an outline, but a rather flexible one.

I have so far had one collaborative effort -- nipped in the bud, the other had to bail out for IRL reasons -- but that was the approach we took. We had a basic theme (teamwork) and we bounced ideas back'n'forth to define the setting, players, and a few necessary events. Once that framework was established, writing was not too difficult.

 

[sr71plt]

My coauthor and I don't set up the character list beforehand and we don't agree on any parameters the other is going to write about in his next section. Our enjoyment is in seeing where the other author has taken the story. (That doesn't mean we throw in fantastic twists just to challenge the other author, though). On more than one occasion, the story's protagonist has changed in the unraveling of the plotline.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

sr71plt

More of that free-wheeling creative writer stuff. You guys are dangerous. I'm so used to relying on an outline, and at least semi-predetermined structure that I'm feeling a bit out of my element. Oh well, the worst I could do is fuck it all up, and have to start over. I've had decades of experience at that, so, no fears. Thanks.

I'm with SR on this...most of my stories have been written off the cuff so to speak, except for a few. The more complex the story, the more the need for:

A. a rough outline - more of a synopsis of what should happen.

B. and this is the important part for me - A character outline. I rely on a character sheet of some type. This will contain not only the characters, but the name of places, things and important actions that were taken or are to be taken. This is almost the story bible.

The Walker Brigade had an extensive character sheet, holding information about each primary character. It told me who they were and how they would act in situation presented to them.

 

[sr71plt]

I collect some notes before I start, and that's pretty much it. These are the ones I collected before writing my 12,000-word bisexual Halloween contest story, "For Past Transgressions," and this is about as extensive as these notes get:

Glock 42
Rio Bueno
Discovery Bay [circled]
Halfway between Montego Bay and Ocho Rios
Major Highway (name its called)
Follands Point
Demonde
Madam Lamesha
Josh Cameron
Jason
Elaine
Ellie
Ruaway Bay
Obeah [circled]
All Saints Day (Nov 1)
Hallow's Eve
Wear clothes inside out, walk backwards--can see who's a witch at midnight/dressing as ghost or ghouls will stop Devil from stealing your soul

More typically, the coauthored stories have developed from just one paragraph one of us tossed out. One for one of Lit. stories was:

Ahh, the days of eating lunch, then drifting down to the square beside the ruined abbey, its broken stones clinging to the steep slope of the Kyrenia range, where it tumbled down to Cyprus' northern coast. Then sitting around ogling the local Turkish Cypriot men in the heat of the afternoon and letting them ogle me. Until I got that certain look from one I fancied and took him up to my small rented villa and let him vigorously and noisily fuck my brains out on a lounger under the sun on the terrace overlooking the Mediterranean.


And another:

I hear the boisterous laughter coming from beyond the brightly lit windows of the country inn—the only sign of life in this dark, dark night in the middle of the Black Forest—as a kiss is stolen from me. I accepted the coupling in the back of his carriage as fair payment for the ride this far from the provincial capital, but the kiss was a surprise. I had not discerned any affection in the heat that had risen off him as he was taking me on the leather seat in the dark of the carriage. As I stepped down from the carriage, my embarrassment was heightened by the sense of eyes watching from. . . somewhere. . . perhaps from that convivial chamber between the lit windows.

As I recall, I had thrown out the first paragraph (which was pretty specific on location and action) and my writing partner threw out the other one (which was more open in possibility and led to a period werewolf story for Halloween).

 

[lovecraft68]

I went with a Glock 23 in mine.

As per my usual I went with Rhode Island as the setting so no need to ever have to look anything up.

I like putting my stories there as a homage to HPL who featured many of his stories in Providence and areas close by. I am sure his Miskatonic was in Ma.

There's a tour coming up soon that goes around to all the houses and locations he based stories on, think I'll skip it this year, too many other things to take care of before my real life goes into chaos next month.

 

[PreOwned]

CV: I trained as a technical writer and played as a songwriter but only started writing fiction a little over a year ago. I seem to be doing okay here at LIT.

I've found a useful approach to storytelling: Populate an environment with story players and set a few plot points, then set the characters loose and transcribe their actions. I suppose that everything preceding "set the characters loose" constitutes an outline, but a rather flexible one.

I have so far had one collaborative effort -- nipped in the bud, the other had to bail out for IRL reasons -- but that was the approach we took. We had a basic theme (teamwork) and we bounced ideas back'n'forth to define the setting, players, and a few necessary events. Once that framework was established, writing was not too difficult.

Hypoxia ~

Flexible seems to be the word--from you, and most folks here. I'll heed it. Your system seems to be a good middle ground, with enough predetermined elements to lend coherence to the process, but open ended enough to invite creativity, and surprises. Thanks for the recommendations.

 

[PreOwned]

I'm with SR on this...most of my stories have been written off the cuff so to speak, except for a few. The more complex the story, the more the need for:

A. a rough outline - more of a synopsis of what should happen.

B. and this is the important part for me - A character outline. I rely on a character sheet of some type. This will contain not only the characters, but the name of places, things and important actions that were taken or are to be taken. This is almost the story bible.

The Walker Brigade had an extensive character sheet, holding information about each primary character. It told me who they were and how they would act in situation presented to them.

I've never worked with a character sheet, but have looked over a few. I always figured they'd be a real asset for writing a novel, but I hadn't considered using one for short fiction. I'll reconsider. In the absence of a lengthy character history write-up, it might be just the thing. Thank You.

 

[PreOwned]

I collect some notes before I start, and that's pretty much it. These are the ones I collected before writing my 12,000-word bisexual Halloween contest story, "For Past Transgressions," and this is about as extensive as these notes get:

Glock 42
Rio Bueno
Discovery Bay [circled]
Halfway between Montego Bay and Ocho Rios
Major Highway (name its called)
Follands Point
Demonde
Madam Lamesha
Josh Cameron
Jason
Elaine
Ellie
Ruaway Bay
Obeah [circled]
All Saints Day (Nov 1)
Hallow's Eve
Wear clothes inside out, walk backwards--can see who's a witch at midnight/dressing as ghost or ghouls will stop Devil from stealing your soul

More typically, the coauthored stories have developed from just one paragraph one of us tossed out. One for one of Lit. stories was:

Ahh, the days of eating lunch, then drifting down to the square beside the ruined abbey, its broken stones clinging to the steep slope of the Kyrenia range, where it tumbled down to Cyprus' northern coast. Then sitting around ogling the local Turkish Cypriot men in the heat of the afternoon and letting them ogle me. Until I got that certain look from one I fancied and took him up to my small rented villa and let him vigorously and noisily fuck my brains out on a lounger under the sun on the terrace overlooking the Mediterranean.


And another:

I hear the boisterous laughter coming from beyond the brightly lit windows of the country inn—the only sign of life in this dark, dark night in the middle of the Black Forest—as a kiss is stolen from me. I accepted the coupling in the back of his carriage as fair payment for the ride this far from the provincial capital, but the kiss was a surprise. I had not discerned any affection in the heat that had risen off him as he was taking me on the leather seat in the dark of the carriage. As I stepped down from the carriage, my embarrassment was heightened by the sense of eyes watching from. . . somewhere. . . perhaps from that convivial chamber between the lit windows.

As I recall, I had thrown out the first paragraph (which was pretty specific on location and action) and my writing partner threw out the other one (which was more open in possibility and led to a period werewolf story for Halloween).

Well, whoever wrote which, you both get a round of applause--both immediately got my attention, and revved my imagination. Leather seat. Indeed.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

I've never worked with a character sheet, but have looked over a few. I always figured they'd be a real asset for writing a novel, but I hadn't considered using one for short fiction. I'll reconsider. In the absence of a lengthy character history write-up, it might be just the thing. Thank You.

You are welcome.

Even though the story was only 11,000 words, short by my standards - in most cases - the contest story I co-authored had a character sheet so we would both be on the same page when it came to writing their parts. It helped us a lot to keep the characters straight and not have them wander between the two of us.