Child Pornography and the Baby-In-The-Bathtub Cases

[Mansa Musa]

1 or 2, or a naked just after birth or the odd buttcrack or bath pic (as infants), no big deal, whatsoever. (Quoted from Turd Ferguson, even though he's on my Ignore list)

This is no big deal. It isn't even a small deal. But, some people go way too far. You start to wonder if they didn't have enough money for onesies or something. And my family may be weird ( scratch that, my family is fucking weird ), but I've done a lot of baby-sitting for my older cousins. And yet, none of my younger cousins had any serious problem with clothes ( or, at least, a serious enough problem with clothing that the idea of taking a picture of their clad children was rendered impossible). Shoes, most definitely. Actually running around naked after shedding every single piece of clothing that was placed on them, no.

 

[TurdFergeson]

1 or 2, or a naked just after birth or the odd buttcrack or bath pic (as infants), no big deal, whatsoever. (Quoted from Turd Ferguson, even though he's on my Ignore list)

This is no big deal. It isn't even a small deal. But, some people go way too far. You start to wonder if they didn't have enough money for onesies or something. And my family may be weird ( scratch that, my family is fucking weird ), but I've done a lot of baby-sitting for my older cousins. And yet, none of my younger cousins had any serious problem with clothes. Shoes, most definitely. Actually running around naked after shedding every single piece of clothing that was placed on them, no.

Why did you ever put me on ignore? I don't remember ever arguing with you.

 

[John Doe]

No such thing as innocence? Sounds like Old Time Religion to me, right?

It's not. I was raised as agnostic. It's an opinion arrived at based on my reading, discussion and especially experience, independently of any religious beliefs I might (or might not) have.

And as for God, it is in Her name that most assholes inflict pain on the undeserving.

Figures that God would be female then...oh right, except there's no logical reason for an omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent being to have gender or at least any kind of gender that we could possibly comprehend.

Don't be obtuse.

 

[John Doe]

Pot, meet kettle. You chose to use Pedobear as an AV.

So?

1 or 2, or a naked just after birth or the odd buttcrack or bath pic (as infants), no big deal, whatsoever. (Quoted from Turd Ferguson, even though he's on my Ignore list)

This is no big deal. It isn't even a small deal. But, some people go way too far. You start to wonder if they didn't have enough money for onesies or something. And my family may be weird ( scratch that, my family is fucking weird ), but I've done a lot of baby-sitting for my older cousins. And yet, none of my younger cousins had any serious problem with clothes ( or, at least, a serious enough problem with clothing that the idea of taking a picture of their clad children was rendered impossible). Shoes, most definitely. Actually running around naked after shedding every single piece of clothing that was placed on them, no.

This definitely proves my first point.

It's not that young children have a problem with clothing so much as the other way around. Adults have a problem with nudity and it takes children some time to acquire that taboo.

 

[isthisdesire]

1 or 2, or a naked just after birth or the odd buttcrack or bath pic (as infants), no big deal, whatsoever. (Quoted from Turd Ferguson, even though he's on my Ignore list)

This is no big deal. It isn't even a small deal. But, some people go way too far. You start to wonder if they didn't have enough money for onesies or something. And my family may be weird ( scratch that, my family is fucking weird ), but I've done a lot of baby-sitting for my older cousins. And yet, none of my younger cousins had any serious problem with clothes ( or, at least, a serious enough problem with clothing that the idea of taking a picture of their clad children was rendered impossible). Shoes, most definitely. Actually running around naked after shedding every single piece of clothing that was placed on them, no.

ok, that's your experience with your family. mine is much different. others' experiences are different than yours or mine. that's why this issue is so touchy. no family is the same with this stuff. it's not uncommon for kids to reject clothes. two of my three nephews went through such a phase. and in my family, it wasn't weird to bathe with relatives of the same age regardless of gender. my male cousin is about a week older than I am and he lives across the country, but when he was around, he and I bathed together until we were like four or five. there are pictures, that's how I know. kids are innocent like that. we didn't care we were naked. my mom and aunt knew we were innocently ignorant and we were goofballs. the four of us can't help but joke when we're together. we always have. we took a bunch of goofball pictures. there was nothing more to it.

eh. I don't know. I'm just very convinced that this is a family-by-family, person-by-person thing.

 

[Mansa Musa]

So?



This definitely proves my first point.

It's not that young children have a problem with clothing so much as the other way around. Adults have a problem with nudity and it takes children some time to acquire that taboo.

So, you're saying that I should allow my cousin's 4 year old son and 3 year old daughter to run naked through the local Macy's? Noted and understood. After all, everyone in the store who's ever raised a child will just look on and say, "Look at those little scamps!" Well, that's the type of thinking that I'd expect from someone who likes to identify himself with an image of a child-raping bear.

 

[Mansa Musa]

ok, that's your experience with your family. mine is much different. others' experiences are different than yours or mine. that's why this issue is so touchy. no family is the same with this stuff. it's not uncommon for kids to reject clothes. two of my three nephews went through such a phase. and in my family, it wasn't weird to bathe with relatives of the same age regardless of gender. my male cousin is about a week older than I am and he lives across the country, but when he was around, he and I bathed together until we were like four or five. there are pictures, that's how I know. kids are innocent like that. we didn't care we were naked. my mom and aunt knew we were innocently ignorant and we were goofballs. the four of us can't help but joke when we're together. we always have. we took a bunch of goofball pictures. there was nothing more to it.

eh. I don't know. I'm just very convinced that this is a family-by-family, person-by-person thing.

And that's all the more reason why people should show a bit of common sense when taking pictures of naked children. IMHO, regardless of tittilation factor involved, you shouldn't take pictures of children if they're in circumstances in which you'd find yourself uncomfortable. (clumsy word structure). If you'd blush crimson at the idea of your SO showing pictures of you at the local beach, naked with legs spread, I'd think that the same level of modesty would be afforded to a child who manages to fall charmingly on his bottom with his legs spread. (Another picture that I confiscated)



























































































































































































OTOH, if you happen to have pictures of yourself on the beach, slathered in tanning lotion and slyly (but willingly) exposing your hidden treasures to your SO's camera, I'd like to see them and judge them for levels of prurience and obscenity. Sorry about the massive space, but I like to keep children and carnal perving as far apart as possible. Too many people with no sense of discernment or tact.

 

[piove_essa]

The English language is fairly unique in the fact that it has different words for naked and nude - with very different meanings. Just a thought- for the thread.

 

[John Doe]

So, you're saying that I should allow my cousin's 4 year old son and 3 year old daughter to run naked through the local Macy's? Noted and understood. After all, everyone in the store who's ever raised a child will just look on and say, "Look at those little scamps!"

How does that even remotely compare to the case about a bearskin rug type photo?

Well, that's the type of thinking that I'd expect from someone who likes to identify himself with an image of a child-raping bear.

Dude, it's just an av.

That and he's not real. I'm hoping you at least have a handle on that one concept.

 

[Mythical_]

fuck it

 

[Guest]

Why do people take pictures of naked children? I've never been able to understand the rationale for possessing naked pictures of children. Christening pictures, baby's first/second/third birthday, the first day of school, visiting Disneyworld, etc., I can understand. But what's a good reason to take pictures of your children running around stark naked?

The same reason Germans let their munchkins run around in the raw-- they're little and innocent and there's no harm in it. They haven't been taught that nudity is bad and that they should be ashamed of themselves. They're just happy little kids splashing in the bathtub, and that brings people joy.

 

[Pookie]

Being raised in a nudist family, pictures at various ages are not uncommon. It's not the nudity that is the problem.

 

[Karen Kraft]

Why did you ever put me on ignore? I don't remember ever arguing with you.

Maybe it was the hat.


... Just sayin' .....

 

[Karen Kraft]

ok, that's your experience with your family. mine is much different. others' experiences are different than yours or mine. that's why this issue is so touchy. no family is the same with this stuff. it's not uncommon for kids to reject clothes. two of my three nephews went through such a phase. and in my family, it wasn't weird to bathe with relatives of the same age regardless of gender. my male cousin is about a week older than I am and he lives across the country, but when he was around, he and I bathed together until we were like four or five. there are pictures, that's how I know. kids are innocent like that. we didn't care we were naked. my mom and aunt knew we were innocently ignorant and we were goofballs. the four of us can't help but joke when we're together. we always have. we took a bunch of goofball pictures. there was nothing more to it.

eh. I don't know. I'm just very convinced that this is a family-by-family, person-by-person thing.

Unfortunately, your post reveals what has become a seemingly antiquated view of family life -- that each family decides how their kids may behave, what sorts of standards are expected of them, whether they will or will not see mom, dad, each other naked, whether their bodies are dirty disgusting evidence of Original Sin or beautiful mechanisms which are a joy to behold, and so on. Nope -- way too old-fashioned.

Today, everyone (including, no, especially single people) get to decide how you are to raise your own kids: spanking bad, time-out good, use-your-words better than duke-it-out, masturbation is bad, nakedness is okay or not okay, and so on). We presently live in a society that believes it is entitled to express and then enforce its opinions about everything personal in everyone else's life.

Salacious condemnation as an evening-news spectator sport.

But it all works out in the end (NPI), in that half of the population thinks the other half should be punished for moral transgressions involving kids, marriage, fidelity or lack thereof, sex, or whatever: thus every one of us can bask in the light of righteous indignation from somebody.

And that just HAS to be fair, since equality and equity mean exactly the same thing here and your private life is most certainly everyone’s business.

Onward Christian Soldiers. * choke *

 

[isthisdesire]

Unfortunately, your post reveals what has become a seemingly antiquated view of family life -- that each family decides how their kids may behave, what sorts of standards are expected of them, whether they will or will not see mom, dad, each other naked, whether their bodies are dirty disgusting evidence of Original Sin or beautiful mechanisms which are a joy to behold, and so on. Nope -- way too old-fashioned.

Today, everyone (including, no, especially single people) get to decide how you are to raise your own kids: spanking bad, time-out good, use-your-words better than duke-it-out, masturbation is bad, nakedness is okay or not okay, and so on). We presently live in a society that believes it is entitled to express and then enforce its opinions about everything personal in everyone else's life.

Salacious condemnation as an evening-news spectator sport.

But it all works out in the end (NPI), in that half of the population thinks the other half should be punished for moral transgressions involving kids, marriage, fidelity or lack thereof, sex, or whatever: thus every one of us can bask in the light of righteous indignation from somebody.

And that just HAS to be fair, since equality and equity mean exactly the same thing here and your private life is most certainly everyone’s business.

Onward Christian Soldiers. * choke *

interestingly enough, both my parents are Christians. fairly strongly so. but of course, I was never kept from the "secular" world like some Christians parents do to their kids. I went to a Christian K-12 school and my parents were probably the most liberal of all my friends'. one kid couldn't listen to any music with "a beat." I don't know how that's even possible, but it was classical or hymns for him.

anyway, this thread ties into that silly Miley & Billy Ray Cyrus thread for me. it comes down to how a family interacts and acknowledging that no two families function exactly the same. and that is ok. you don't have to be in control of every part of other people's lives. you just don't, ya know?

 

[Karen Kraft]

interestingly enough, both my parents are Christians. fairly strongly so. but of course, I was never kept from the "secular" world like some Christians parents do to their kids. I went to a Christian K-12 school and my parents were probably the most liberal of all my friends'. one kid couldn't listen to any music with "a beat." I don't know how that's even possible, but it was classical or hymns for him.

anyway, this thread ties into that silly Miley & Billy Ray Cyrus thread for me. it comes down to how a family interacts and acknowledging that no two families function exactly the same. and that is ok. you don't have to be in control of every part of other people's lives. you just don't, ya know?

How right you are about that!

As for music without a beat: Although, from a musical theory point of view there can be rhythm without tone, there can be no tone without rhythm. That having been said, however, I suspect the "beat" of Gregorian Chants would probably fall well below those parents' radar, if they had any radar, that is…

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=Gregorian+Chant&hl=en&sitesearch=
.

 

[Wyrdlight]

Meh.

I have got tons of photo's in old albums of me an my sis in the bath, running around naked in the back garden having a water fight in mid summer ect

Parents always take pics like that and when i have kids i will too.

As for the bathing thing i can say that pretty much every single parent in my family would have bathed the kids. Its a natural thing to do, stops em crying, and they learn to love the water whihc can only be a good thing.

The idea that a farther cannot give his 2 year old a bath without being labled a pedophile is obsurd. I am in England and i know of no such cases over here.
That a mother would throw her husband out for bathing the kids ect is stupid, you got together and with a bit of each of you made the child and he has as much right to be a part of its upbringing as the mother does.

As for the shcool nurse "finding our about it" or anthing like that, when i was in Primary the school the nurse would not have dared to try to tell parents how to bring up thier kids, she would have been sacked on the spot.

Tbh i dont really "get" it. I mean obviously if their is an abusive and/or un-healthy realtionship between a parent/relative and a child then it should be stopped. The thing is i suppose is that people differ in what they deem to be innapropriate.

 

[Karen Kraft]

Meh.

I have got tons of photo's in old albums of me an my sis in the bath, running around naked in the back garden having a water fight in mid summer ect

Parents always take pics like that and when i have kids i will too.

As for the bathing thing i can say that pretty much every single parent in my family would have bathed the kids. Its a natural thing to do, stops em crying, and they learn to love the water whihc can only be a good thing.

The idea that a farther cannot give his 2 year old a bath without being labled a pedophile is obsurd. I am in England and i know of no such cases over here.
That a mother would throw her husband out for bathing the kids ect is stupid, you got together and with a bit of each of you made the child and he has as much right to be a part of its upbringing as the mother does.

As for the shcool nurse "finding our about it" or anthing like that, when i was in Primary the school the nurse would not have dared to try to tell parents how to bring up thier kids, she would have been sacked on the spot.

Tbh i dont really "get" it. I mean obviously if their is an abusive and/or un-healthy realtionship between a parent/relative and a child then it should be stopped. The thing is i suppose is that people differ in what they deem to be innapropriate.

Well, yes, and more imporantly, unless there is some evidence that a child is being harmed, it's nobody's business how people choose to raise their kids.

Once American becomes The Big Commune, all that will change. Until then, each of us needs to vigilant so as to ward off the Puritan assholes in our midst and the endless lust for power of those who subscribe to the tyranny of the majority.

 

[Cade Is Here]

oh I thought psf was posting pics here again

 

[Karen Kraft]

oh I thought psf was posting pics here again

Say what? What are you talking about?

 

[katiebarthedoor]

as far as the child in the bathtub, or naked running through sprinklers, or whathaveyou - i cant think of anyone that would willingly look at baby pictures or another families home movies.
youre always forced into situations where you see a naked baby in a bathtub. and its usually at christmas.

 

[Karen Kraft]

as far as the child in the bathtub, or naked running through sprinklers, or whathaveyou - i cant think of anyone that would willingly look at baby pictures or another families home movies.
youre always forced into situations where you see a naked baby in a bathtub. and its usually at christmas.

Well, sort of. When one becomes engaged to be married, often one of the more exciting parts for the parents is showing the pics and videos of their child, as a baby, doing all thosre things -- or being naughty. Life goes on just the same.

 

[shoulderblade]

The English language is fairly unique in the fact that it has different words for naked and nude - with very different meanings. Just a thought- for the thread.

A good thought , I think. There are complex issues here re. guilt and innocence, healthy and perverted.

Scrutiny is a little overdone toward the male side, in my opinion.

A cause of low birth rates perhaps?

 

[MechaBlade]

I disagree with the OP that porn isn't obscenity and that obscenity is based on whether or not it appeals to perverts. It's based on whether it offends little old ladies and baptists.

Having said that, I always found it unfair that they show naked baby ass on TV in diaper commercials, but they never air full nudes of Angelina Jolie on network TV.

 

[John Doe]

I disagree with the OP that porn isn't obscenity and that obscenity is based on whether or not it appeals to perverts.

That's the legal basis.