Can D/s do what therapy can not?

[madetotakeit]

This is an extension of a conversation from last night. Using this as the basis situation. Person A: Has
dealt with something in their past that now affects this person on a daily basis. Therapy has been used
as an attempt to deal with the issue, but has been unsuccessful. Traditional techniques have not aided
and as a result, Person A uses therapy time to toy with the therapist for lack of a better term, due to
the mistrust of therapists in general. As a result no progress has been made. Person B attempts to
help Person A where the therapist has not been able to using the trust and openness found in a D/s
relationship.

Here is where the question lies. Can the D/s relationship allow for breakthroughs for Person A. Is simply trust, caring, and knowledge enough to help this person get over what has affected for years? Would tapping into these areas they've suppressed through time, intent or shame help Person A to face something that would go untouched and/or unresolved? Can personal experience and insight fill in where conventional therapeutic training would be missing. Would this the best avenue to approach the
problem by breaking through barriers that would otherwise remain up? Can the trust Person A has in Person B be enough to facilitate the healing?

Or...can this lead to the possibility of furthering the damage. Can there be a form of transference onto Person B? Is it better to leave dealing with the psyche to those who have been trained to do so? Is the fact that Person A uses therapy time to misdirect the therapist a sign that Person a is not ready or prepared to actually deal with the issue? Does true healing come only from within? In attempting to purge this person of the inner demons, is there not a more likely chance of creating yet another issue? In essence forming a reliance on Person B's dominant nature to cope rather than to actually heal? Or worse yet, intensify the damage by not being trained in dealing with the mind?

 

[Instig8r]

Probably not.
No.
Maybe.
Probably not.
No.
Probably not.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Definitely yes.
Probably yes.
Probably not.
Probably yes.
Probably yes.

I'm glad that we had this discussion.

 

[BiaTcHiNFiRe]

My answear will be very short. Oh yes it can! At least it did for me. Still does.

 

[YourCaptor]

Never underestimate the healing power of a happy mind.

And then theirs always Maslows pyramid.

 

[be_ignited]

Well, what happens should the relationship between person A and Person B end? Particularly if it's on a bad note.

As someone for whom therapy has worked very well (but not a therapist), my advice is find a new one. I was highly skeptical of therapists when I started (granted, I was 14, and pretty easily influenced), but was lucky enough to find a good one. I still have a relationship with her today. Therapists are people, too. They aren't infallible and there are definitely bad ones out there. Person A should try looking around for one that suits her.

 

[catalina_francisco]

My thoughts are too many people come into this lifestyle expecting their prospective partner/s to heal them, or to have magical powers themselves to heal their partners. Just as that is unhealthy in a vanilla relationship, I believe it is in a D/s one also, especially if the person supposedly taking the place of therapist has no real training or experience. Even if they have training of some sort in the area, being so close to the other person on a personal level makes it once again risky and unprofessional.

Therapy is a 2 way street, just like a relationship. If the person does not trust the therapist they need to look at why, and if they feel a legitimate reason for not trusting them, they need to change therapists. It is not unusual to just not click...it doesn't mean the therapist if second rate, it doesn't mean the client is problematic, it just is as so often in life people don't gel. It also happens a lot of times that a person claims they don't trust the therapist, but base that distrust on the fact the therapist will not let them pull tricks, or because they expect instant healing...usually it is simply they are not prepared to be honest in therapy and don't like some of the things that are brought up or offered for discussion. I certainly would think if they have a problem trusting any therapist, they would be very misguided to feel they could trust someone just because they were into this lifestyle.

Catalina

 

[BiBunny]

WARNING: If you don't want to be offended, I suggest you stop reading right now.

I really, really, really, REALLY hate this question. BDSM is never a substitute for professional help. Relationships are never a substitute for professional help. The only substitute for professional help is different professional help. Period.

I have a bachelor's degree in psychology. I am STILL unqualified to "treat" people. A B.S. in psych is a bullshit degree because there is SO DAMN MUCH to learn and to learn to apply that it can't be learned in four years. A master's degree in psych will allow you to become a counselor/therapist/whatever. A PhD. is the only thing that will allow you to become a psychologist. That's seven years' worth of school at the least and more like nine if you get the master's degree first.

So what in the name of FUCK makes people think that somebody who calls himself/herself a Dom/me can fix all their problems that a trained professional can't?

I will be the first to say that there are good therapists and bad ones. Bad ones may even outnumber good ones. But most Dom/mes aren't mental health professionals, and even those who are know that an intimate relationship with the person you're trying to help is going to fuck things up. So, no, BDSM is not a substitute for the help of a mental health professional.

This is not going to be a popular view because so many people love to wallow in self-pity and use their "sicknesses" as a way to seek attention, but the onus of "getting well" is on the patient. Period. Nobody else is supposed to "fix" you, therapists, psychologists, or people with whom you have personal relationships.

BDSM is not some mystical "get-well-quick" device. It's just a relationship. To make out like it can cure the sick and raise the dead is just as insulting as insinuating that the only thing wrong with a woman is that she just hasn't found her knight in shining armor yet.

I agree with Abraham Lincoln. "People are about as happy as they make up their minds to be." If someone wants to undermine his/her therapist, then stay "sick," damn you. Let the poor, underpaid professional spend his/her time on someone who fucking wants to get better. If you (general you) want to get "well," then decide that that's what you're going to do and seek the appropriate professionals to teach you how to engage in healthy behaviors. Until then, stop fucking around. Dom/mes aren't appropriate professionals, folks.

 

[madetotakeit]

WARNING: If you don't want to be offended, I suggest you stop reading right now.

I was actually very much looking forward to your input on this Bunny.

Cat, good point in the closeness possibly becoming a hindrance.

be-ignited, another good point. there are no guarantees that a relationship will last either due to people or circumstance.

 

[BiBunny]

I was actually very much looking forward to your input on this Bunny.

No problem. It's just a hot-button issue for me. I hope I helped.

 

[Netzach]

Why?

Why would you put this onus on your partner?

Ugh. What a slimy act of cowardly hate that is, "fix me - and if you fail it's on your head."

I got paid for that. Not enough.

 

[twysted73]

Bunny, as always, your blunt delivery is much appreciated.

I was looking at this conversation in a slightly different light tho.
What if it's the Dom/me who feels the need to assist in the fixing and is taking the possiton as a result of observing the submissive's inability/unwillingness to invest the trust inorder to get better?

Netz, what if the Dominant feels they, through the bond they share, could possibly crack a door for something a therapist could then run with only helping the submissive...encouraging them to seek out the hand that's being professionally extended?

 

[EmpressFi]

my first gut reaction was sure.. well sort of..lemme clarify, there are some things that Master is helping me with but he's not "fixing" them. In fact, for the most part, when he's not here, I fall back to my same set routine... however, wanting to please him encourages me to try. And I guess that's where I had to step back and say no.. it cannot, or at least, it shouldnt.

I wont repeat what's been said except to agree that it's not fair to put the pressure of "fixing" you on a partner. What if you do break up, badly, well then I suppose you can always blame that person for any relapse you have. But then again, you shouldnt be waiting on your therapist to fix you either. A good therapist listens and then gives you the tools to help yourself. No one else should be made responsible for the decisions you make and how you handle things.

In fact, I'd say in some cases, people should walk away from D/s until they do get a better handle on their emotional/mental issues so they not lean on their PYL or pyl as the case may be.

 

[BiBunny]

Bunny, as always, your blunt delivery is much appreciated.

I was looking at this conversation in a slightly different light tho.
What if it's the Dom/me who feels the need to assist in the fixing and is taking the possiton as a result of observing the submissive's inability/unwillingness to invest the trust inorder to get better?

Netz, what if the Dominant feels they, through the bond they share, could possibly crack a door for something a therapist could then run with only helping the submissive...encouraging them to seek out the hand that's being professionally extended?

Support is one thing. Anybody can extend support and refuse to enable self-destructive behaviors. In fact, the best damn thing you can do to someone who refuses to take responsibility for themselves is to let them fall on their asses a few times. Anybody with sense will realize that the concrete's hard if nobody else is there taking the fall for them.

On the other hand, if the person is unwilling to invest the trust, then that person simply doesn't really want to do what it takes to get better. Period. End of story. We can argue this until the cows come home, but that's the way it is. I understand that trust doesn't come overnight, but it's something that has to be worked toward, not something you can get by sitting on your ass and waiting for it to come to you.

And as long as that person is content to sit on his/her ass and whine, then no amount of intervention is going to help, really. Google William Glasser and Choice Theory. It's an unpopular view in the "blame everyone but myself" atmosphere of pop psychology, but the man is onto something.

I think it's one thing to be supportive and not enable bullshit. But anything else is on the person and his/her mental health professional(s). One of the biggest problems therapists face is patient apathy and the willingness of family members/friends/SOs to shelter the patient from the consequences of his or her actions. Those two things combined will create an impenetrable roadblock from a professional standpoint.

 

[BiBunny]

A good therapist listens and then gives you the tools to help yourself. No one else should be made responsible for the decisions you make and how you handle things.

In fact, I'd say in some cases, people should walk away from D/s until they do get a better handle on their emotional/mental issues so they not lean on their PYL or pyl as the case may be.

Quoted for truth. Get your own shit straightened out, and THEN worry about relationships.

 

[intothewoods]

Um, not just no, but HELL NO. Even if the D wants to. The D is not a therapist. Even if the D is a therapist...no, hell no.

 

[MelancholyBaby]

Um, not just no, but HELL NO. Even if the D wants to. The D is not a therapist. Even if the D is a therapist...no, hell no.

This pretty much sums it up for me, too.

 

[WriterDom]

Yeah. Trust your soul to someone who has a BS in BS.

 

[ataxia.girl]

i was going to say a bunch of stuff but i changed my mind.

No i don't think D/s is a replacement for therapy. i've heard of it aiding a few people get past traumatic events in their past by giving them a safe place to relive them and i think that is healthy but that isn't the same as trying to use it as a complete replacement. If the person with the issue uses D/s as a tool for them to help themselves then yes, great, go for it but no one can fix you.

That said, i'm still taking applications for someone to fix me but in the meantime i'll keep doing my DBT.

 

[Homburg]

A lot of folks have come to me for conversational support. I've been told time and again that I am a good listener, helpful, and have been told that I was "better than my therapist" more than once.

And I still told MIS to find a new therapist (those of you who have been here a while know why she left her old therapist, the bitch). I can be a good listener and all that, but I am not a professional therapist. And if I was a professional it would be grossly unethical for me to give her professional help in that way.

 

[FurryFury]

Why?

Why would you put this onus on your partner?

Ugh. What a slimy act of cowardly hate that is, "fix me - and if you fail it's on your head."

I got paid for that. Not enough.

I so agree with you.

Not that I don't think some kink can't help in a more general way in self exploration and knowledge.

 

[desertslave]

I've never been to therapy, though it's possible it might have been a good idea a time or two in my past.

OTOH, I've done a LOT of talking with my M, and through simple, honest conversation he's helped me many times to understand myself and past situations better than I ever had before.

But then, I also believe that BDSM-generated endorphins are better (for me) than any anti-depressant on the market today.

I've never expected M (or anyone else) to "fix" me, but as someone else said, there's an enormous power involved in just helping someone to find happiness (and trust, and confidence) again.

 

[Netzach]

I've never been to therapy, though it's possible it might have been a good idea a time or two in my past.

OTOH, I've done a LOT of talking with my M, and through simple, honest conversation he's helped me many times to understand myself and past situations better than I ever had before.

But then, I also believe that BDSM-generated endorphins are better (for me) than any anti-depressant on the market today.

I've never expected M (or anyone else) to "fix" me, but as someone else said, there's an enormous power involved in just helping someone to find happiness (and trust, and confidence) again.

Isn't that kind of normal good-relationship stuff though?

I know him, he knows me, when he's depressed I urge him to go get pro help, we take care of one another, blah blah.

 

[twysted73]

I've never been to therapy, though it's possible it might have been a good idea a time or two in my past.

OTOH, I've done a LOT of talking with my M, and through simple, honest conversation he's helped me many times to understand myself and past situations better than I ever had before.

But then, I also believe that BDSM-generated endorphins are better (for me) than any anti-depressant on the market today.

I've never expected M (or anyone else) to "fix" me, but as someone else said, there's an enormous power involved in just helping someone to find happiness (and trust, and confidence) again.

This is what I was hinting at.
Not taking full responsability for the complete therapy. But as a minor tool to get things going in some areas where conventional training may not budge them.

 

[Homburg]

This is what I was hinting at.
Not taking full responsability for the complete therapy. But as a minor tool to get things going in some areas where conventional training may not budge them.

Yeah, but it has nothing to do with D/s, and everything to do with a healthy relationship. And that relationship need not be a sexual one. I've done this sort of thing with friends all the time.

D/s isn't some magic wand. It's just a style of relationship and a fun way to fuck.

 

[YourCaptor]

I'm gonna disagree with the general consensus here.

For the right kind of person D/s can be extremely therapeutic.

While D/s cannot replace a therapist, it can do things a therapist can't, and through this chip away much of the structure that is holding ones problems in place.

When people become self fulfilled and have their active place in life many issues are resolved naturally. D/s can often be this safe haven, allowing one to address and deal with less then immediate issues.

The human is also a social animal, and as such require nurturing social interaction to be mentally healthy. Some people have never had such an interaction outside D/s society.

and by the way, human nature is very much D/s.