Building on-going shared universes

[old_prof]

I decided to try to spin off a conversation in the winter event thread to here. That thread needs to have its conversation, but this topic should too.

(That conversation starts here and involved @NaughteeDragon, @taytay4eva, @YmaOHyd, @Voboy , @TheRedLantern and @Kumquatqueen , Hopefully you will all join into this one.)

Many of us have built universe where many, if not most of our our stories live.

I have a couple of questions for people to start with.

Describe how much sharing you do? Are they the same characters, the same locales? If its sci/fi or fantasy, shared tech or shared magic system?
I have seen all these things from writes here.

How do you track all the cross-overs, timelines, etc across multiple stories?

 

[Z_TheWriter]

1) I love the idea of this conversation. I have ideas myself, but haven't gotten that far yet, so I will just lurk and learn.

2) The title made me think you were proposing a project of making a shared-universe to have multiple authors here set stories in. I can't decide if that sounds like a disaster or supremely interesting - probably both.

 

[EmilyMiller]

I’ll let my representative (aka @Djmac1031) revert to you on this.

 

[old_prof]

I will start by talking about my situation. Almost half of my stories (21 of my 46 published under this name) are in my original series, which includes an expanding set of characters surrounding the central four in the original story. A very short story that was supposed to be a standalone. The other twenty are all short novellas (averaging 16K) and take place over the next four months.

I have started writing additional stories directly in the story arc of the original series, the first taking place the month after the end of the series, introducing a new character as its MC, but clearly just a continuation of the original series. I have another half eight of those roughly sketched out, tying up loose ends from the series (and introducing more). I think they will also maintain the higher sex content that the series has than most of my other writing.

Two more stories are kind of direct spinoffs, with major supporting characters coming from that series, although mostly the supporting characters from the original series, not the central four.

Now it gets more tenuous. I have another story where the MC uses the same divorce lawyer as one of the spinoff characters did. And there is leakage of events across the two. So clearly in the same universe, but not tightly tied in at all. The MMC in that story takes credit for writing one of my stories (it's okay, I gave him permission), a story that now has a sequel. So that pair is tied in in a bizarre way.

An occurence in that story gets mentioned in my novel. And then a major supporting character from the series shows up at the end of the novel and discloses a major plot explanation for the series.

In the novel, FMC meets a successful professional writer. It is mentioned that she has written a fantasy series about a world called Miralea, which is the name for the world in my short SF&F series, so that's bizarrely in the same universe.

I played with tying another story by making my original main character in the original series an advisor to the company that is important in another story. I might yet do that, because I am now writing a novel for the backstory of the MC in that story.

And my novel also has a tie-in to a @PennyThompson story, which has at least one sequel. This universe is spreading like a plague.

If this seems confusing, it is. I do have a master timeline trying to tie things together and I already have an issue that will just be there, an inconsistency about when the covid shutdown happened vis-a-vis the story line.

 

[AwkwardMD]

As a writer who has one (my Portland series (which is canonically connected to several other LS series through @BrokenSpokes Blue Girl Universe)), I would caution anyone trying to write one of these. It's hard to have characters appear from crossovers, where in your head these characters are fully formed and established, but still do a good job introducing them and giving a new reader to chance to learn who they are without boring your existing readers who already know these things.

It's a much more difficult balance to manage than I think most people realize.

 

[Djmac1031]

I’ll let my representative (aka @Djmac1031) revert to you on this.

Ive outlined how my collaboration with @EmilyMiller began with our shared Angels And Demons universe in a detailed essay I'll link below:

https://www.literotica.com/s/wiwaw-the-angels-and-demons-saga

The shorter answer is our stories are pretty much independent, but we slowly started sharing little details, like locations. then name dropping and eventually crossing over characters and giving them connected history.

We discussed these things beforehand of course, to make sure there were no disagreements or contradictions. Although im sure we still wound up with a few minor ones here and there.

It wasn't really til the third part of my trilogy that I truly tied both Ems world and characters together with mine for a climactic finale.

There's lots of little world building details I came up with, including oh, just a backstory for the creation of the universe, that I could probably spend hours on.

Em left most of that to me so she could focus on sex and drama

As for my other stories, I'm pretty most of them could be in the same universe and have in fact connected several.

While writing my three part series Caring For Carrie, I realized it could easily connect to my still running series The Jenna Arrangement and so had the characters cross over and connect for a chapter in both stories.

I wrote two short stories about a budding exhibitionist named Brenda then had her and her new girlfriend Millie show up in the final chapter of the Jenna series.

Then theres this bar, Sharkey's Tavern, which has made multiple appearances and / or references in many stories, including the A&D ones.

 

[Jackie.Hikaru]

There's this: https://www.literotica.com/s/tales-of-leinyere-story-event

which nominally had shared lore, timeline, and magic system. It worked out surprisingly well.

There were only two events, but dozens of stories. There were some incongruities - I don't think that's avoidable when you have several authors working on separate stories at the same time.

I think the incongruities mainly stemmed from what the authors enjoyed from their fantasies. As a result, it became a conglomeration of light-hearted fairy-tales, Howard-esque dark epics, steam punk, and DnD adventures. So not very consistent aesthetically or canonically, but I liked it that way. The world felt 'lived in.'


You can follow the thread for how the lore and magic system was devised. If I remember correctly, the lead, @Nouh_Bdee, who doesn't seem to be active anymore, tracked everything through a shared googles doc and an online mapmaker. It was super fun.

 

[StillStunned]

Is this about a single author placing their stories within one universe, or multiple authors all working within one setting?

 

[Lifestyle66]

1) I love the idea of this conversation. I have ideas myself, but haven't gotten that far yet, so I will just lurk and learn.

2) The title made me think you were proposing a project of making a shared-universe to have multiple authors here set stories in. I can't decide if that sounds like a disaster or supremely interesting - probably both.

There are/were several events where the theme is a shared "universe" open to all authors to participate.

"Amorous Goods" lasted about four years and had only a few standard characters with very little set in stone for their descriptions.

"Literotica Convention" is set for it's upcoming second year of the Convention location in Paris this time. This event asks authors to offer some of their characters described in their own stories for others to use in the weekend convention.

Other "shared universe" ideas are open ended stories, leaving it as a cliff-hanger and inviting authors to finish the story. "Just Once ... If You Don't Mind" is a Loving Wives tale which has hundreds of endings.

But I think the OP is referring to a universe with more limited collaborations and more control for the universe expansion. Movies and TV series writers do that with their "writer's guide" to describe what has happened in the past episodes which becomes a set starting point evolving for all future episodes. It's a living document, which changes to varying degrees with each new episode.

But without professional writers dedicating their full time and attention to one universe and collaboration here in LitE, it must be tough to deterime who maintains control of that writing progressions and sets the minimum baselines as they evolve.

 

[Djmac1031]

But without professional writers dedicating their full time and attention to one universe and collaboration here in LitE, it must be tough to deterime who maintains control of that writing progressions and sets the minimum baselines as they evolve.

it really hasn't been that difficult for @EmilyMiller and I.

Our universes started with a very simple connection; she was writing about an angel and demon pair who fell in love and had adventures.

I was writing about a guy who sold his soul to a She-Demon and had to seduce a nun to win it back.

The supernatural connections came easily enough and grew from there. As the world's grew, became more complex and interconnected, we always exchanged notes to keep everything on track, although again our individual stories remained pretty independent. You didn't have to read mine to follow Emily's and vice versa.

But we did share characters a lot and so of course there were multiple consultations to make sure we were writing each other's characters properly.

 

[RoyalAuthor]

Is this about a single author placing their stories within one universe, or multiple authors all working within one setting?

Our initial discussion (I got left out of the recap) was about single authors setting their works in a shared universe. I suppose a pair of authors is the same thing. Not so much massive multi-author events, which are also fun.

It adds a lot of extra work, but gives more possibilities. I personally enjoy doing it so that I know I never have to say goodbye to a character even if I don't write a sequel - I can always cross them over for a brief appearance if appropriate.

All but two of my stories share a universe, and I have plans to retcon one of them in soon.

 

[StillStunned]

"Bound to the Blade" is set in the same universe as my series "The Rivals", but thousands of years earlier. So not much to keep track of.

And I suppose my series "Flesh for Fantasy" is in the same universe as "The Code" and "While She Watches Them", because the character Allie appears in all of them. And my series "The Dome" exists in fiction in that universe.

But then there's "The City of Scum", which is open to anyone. Besides me, three other writers have contributed. I really need to get back to writing so I can finish a few of my WIPs.

 

[ChuckWolf]

1) I love the idea of this conversation. I have ideas myself, but haven't gotten that far yet, so I will just lurk and learn.

2) The title made me think you were proposing a project of making a shared-universe to have multiple authors here set stories in. I can't decide if that sounds like a disaster or supremely interesting - probably both.

The Thieves World and Wild Cards series are based on this.

 

[EmilyMiller]

Em left most of that to me so she could focus on sex and drama

It’s so sweet that you think that

 

[ChuckWolf]

Describe how much sharing you do? Are they the same characters, the same locales? If its sci/fi or fantasy, shared tech or shared magic system?
I have seen all these things from writes here.

How do you track all the cross-overs, timelines, etc across multiple stories?

Most of my stories take place in the fictional locale of Sierra Diabla, a desert city that is in the financial grip of the various sex-industries, so there tends to be a lot of graft, corruption and kink. It's really just there to try and rationalize/explain why certain things happen in my stories.

One of the characters, Coach Laurie, is referenced in another story, but aside from that, there are no specific events or other things that tie them together in any obvious or significant way.

 

[redgarters]

I've not built a shared universe for my stories yet, but I find it interesting. I have linked my latest story with an older one by having a few older characters appear as cameos in a setting that made sense because both stories take place in London. I've also linked hands with the lovely @THBGato, where characters make appearances in our respective stories, creating a shared universe. I love that idea and it would be fun to explore further.
I've also recently had an idea for stories and characters that loosely tie into the Woman in the Spare Room, taking place or being rooted in Queens, NY. Those are something that in time could become a real shared universe with character paths crossing between stories.

 

[WittyUserName]

I decided to try to spin off a conversation in the winter event thread to here. That thread needs to have its conversation, but this topic should too.

(That conversation starts here and involved @NaughteeDragon, @taytay4eva, @YmaOHyd, @Voboy , @TheRedLantern and @Kumquatqueen , Hopefully you will all join into this one.)

Many of us have built universe where many, if not most of our our stories live.

I have a couple of questions for people to start with.

Describe how much sharing you do? Are they the same characters, the same locales? If its sci/fi or fantasy, shared tech or shared magic system?
I have seen all these things from writes here.

How do you track all the cross-overs, timelines, etc across multiple stories?

Yes, I have a "Wittyverse." I have a lot of parody names for famous shows, artists, etc.. that I share between stories. I did write a ghost story, so I suppose it's canon that ghosts exist in the universe, but the other stories have no supernatural angle. As for tracking dates, etc.. I have a ton of word documents and regularly tug out what's left of my hair.

 

[crookedletter]

I haven't had many opportunities to play with this yet, because I write slowly and edit slower. There aren't any links between the stories I've published here thus far -- and they wouldn't all fit together anyway.

But I've definitely toyed with this idea. I really like the way Emily St. John Mandel does this. I think others like David Mitchell might as well, but I haven't read him as widely. Mandel (most famous for Station Eleven) will throw little references into her works, easily missed, highly gratifying for close readers, that suggest they're in the same universe, or perhaps even parallel versions. There's a writer character in Sea of Tranquility who describes what she's written as a "scientifically dubious pandemic novel" (possibly misquoted), which seems a pretty clear nod to Station Eleven. There's another character who seems awfully close to one who appears in The Glass Hotel.

One of the most gratifying examples for me as a reader was a seemingly throwaway line in Gaiman's American Gods that described a girl with two different colored eyes, traveling with a dog, and if you don't recognize the description you'll quickly move past it and forget it. But I did recognize it, and realized that's fucking Delirium from Sandman and I about lost my little fanboy mind. Just that one line to suggest a shared universe renders the whole world that much more expansive, and I loved it.

In some works in progress I've toyed with that kind of subtlety, just dropping in a side character that might look suspiciously like a character from another story, or a little aside that might suggest the worlds are shared. Since I doubt I'll have fans as loyal as a Mandel or a Gaiman, no one but me would probably ever notice. But I think it's a fun device.

As for continuity, unless you're really writing sequels and prequels etc., I think it can be seen as optional. Mandel's crossovers are pretty fluid, with variations between. And Ursula Le Guin's Hainish works have just enough links and common technologies to give them the expansiveness of a shared universe, but she herself was very clear that their connections were tenuous at best; she was not at all concerned with trying to make them continuous or consistent. And they suffer not at all for those inconsistencies.

 

[Rambling_Chantrix]

Because I'm a sucker for omission, I mainly use the shared world in which my stories are set to imply countless untold tales. I don't need to keep track of them, because they aren't written. I just show the same characters in very different circumstances at very different times, and then the reader gets to feel FOMO around the gaps between the stories and I get to feel exceptionally clever and sadistic.

 

[Voyeurkenneth]

How do you track all the cross-overs, timelines, etc across multiple stories?

This is gonna sound ridiculous but... I have a spreadsheet with age formulas. When I set a new story, I assign it a date that outputs the age of the characters. It helps me manage continuity over the timeline, so I’m not tripping over age references or implausibilities. It’s been helpful for the themed contests. And helpful when I need to pivot and shift events along the timeline.

 

[RoyalAuthor]

Yes, I have a "Wittyverse." I have a lot of parody names for famous shows, artists, etc.. that I share between stories. I did write a ghost story, so I suppose it's canon that ghosts exist in the universe, but the other stories have no supernatural angle. As for tracking dates, etc.. I have a ton of word documents and regularly tug out what's left of my hair.

This is the issue I'm facing, although I think I have an angle. My universe centers around one couple and their friends and friends of friends. Then I also have a new Christmas story with elves and Santa, so I make that canonical if I tie it in. Still might do it.

 

[RoyalAuthor]

This is gonna sound ridiculous but... I have a spreadsheet with age formulas. When I set a new story, I assign it a date that outputs the age of the characters. It helps me manage continuity over the timeline, so I’m not tripping over age references or implausibilities. It’s been helpful for the themed contests.

Genius and I'm stealing this. It's mine now.

 

[old_prof]

Is this about a single author placing their stories within one universe, or multiple authors all working within one setting?

The original convo on the other thread was single author but multi author is interesting too

 

[redgarters]

The original convo on the other thread was single author but milit author is interesting too

One of the things I find interesting about this is the chance to write characters from other authors, and have them write mine and see how that works out. It's something I've wondered about that universe @THBGato , @SugarStorm and I accidentally (or not so accidentally) share. That kind of thing has been discussed in threads here before, as a kind of fanfiction exercise. It sounds like great fun.

 

[THBGato]

canonically connected to several other LS series through @BrokenSpokes Blue Girl Universe

I didn't spot this at all. What's the connection? I thought all of the Blue Girl Universe stories were East coast...