British Public Opinion

[Linedrive]

Why was British public opinion in favor of going into Kosovo, yet the majority appear to be against the war in Iraq...?

Was it because the Kosovo/Bosnia conflict was closer to home, therefore threatening the security of Europe, while most Euro's don't consider Iraq a threat to them...?

If intervention in Kosovo was for humanitarian reasons, couldn't the same argument be used against invading Iraq...?

Was it because Britain's muslim population...?

After appeasing Hitler and later appeasement policies by the UN against Milosovic, you'd think that most would realize the path of appeasement leads to nowhere.

In a 1999 phone call between Blair and Clinton, Clinton expressed his disatisfaction with the British public trying to pressure for the use of ground troops in Kosovo.

 

[Linedrive]

Well pp_man must have passed out, I was hoping to hear some opinions on this.

 

[Linedrive]

With all the Brits on this board, nobody has an answer...?

Enlighten me please.

 

[shopperst]

Since you asked

Re Kosovo, the pressure for ground troops came from the concept of a 'just war'. Which basically means that you fight as a last result, but then when you go in, you go in fast & hard to minimise casualties and length of war. The US got pressure over Kosovo because of the willingness to fight piecemeal, even if the bodycount all round was higher. In the words of a friend, 'if you're going to fight, foght, don't just sit there moaning about a hang nail.

Re Britain's muslims, the point is that they are British citizens who believe in Allah, and their taxes and opinions are just as important as mine. I'm sure if you checked the last census, there are many Americans who also happen to be muslims.

 

[Linedrive]

Thanks for offering your opinion, and there was no attempt to put Muslims down in my post as you are insinuating.

 

[bluespoke]

There is no war in Iraq ................ yet.

As far as I can see from all the polls I've read the British public are split down the middle on the potential for war in Iraq.

What the majority want is a second UN resolution and not Bush and Blair going gung ho on their own.

 

[Bachlum Chaam]

Gunner Dailey
Sir,when we were in favour of going in to Kosovo,it was different in as much as obviously genocide was being used,now that is not to say genocide isn,t being used in Iraq,there it appears to be done in unseemly haste,the evidence just has not been forthcoming also a lot of the evidence our government said was there was in fact a thesis by a student in the US.The British public get the idea Blair is using Iraq to draw attention from the real problems we have,also it is seen as tho Blair wants to become President of Europe of which the majority of britains do not want to get further entrenched with the europeans as historically France have been our enemies many times.
That is how I see it and I am not well read so my opinion may or may not be right ,just mine.
Greetings Bachlum Chaam

 

[Linedrive]

Thanks Bluespoke, appreciate your response.

 

[Linedrive]

Thanks for your thoughts Bachlum

 

[shopperst]

Thanks for offering your opinion, and there was no attempt to put Muslims down in my post as you are insinuating.

No insinuation intended (at least not in a bad way) Just trying to answer the question

 

[Linedrive]

Thanks again...and a quote from Kofi Annan during the conflict in the Balkans.

"There is an emerging international law that countries cannot hide behind sovereignty and abuse people without expecting the rest of the world to do something about it," Kofi Annan, U.N. secretary-general, said in a May 22 speech in Stockholm, Sweden.

 

[bluespoke]

Thanks again...and a quote from Kofi Annan during the conflict in the Balkans.

"There is an emerging international law that countries cannot hide behind sovereignty and abuse people without expecting the rest of the world to do something about it," Kofi Annan, U.N. secretary-general, said in a May 22 speech in Stockholm, Sweden.

On that basis....

Where is the war in Zimbabwe, North Korea, China?

 

[Linedrive]

We had similar thoughts on that quote...I found it interesting that Kofi Anan stated such.

Another quote from Blair on the issue:

"I also felt, for our public opinions, what was tremendously important was that we, as leaders, went out there and really told people why we were doing this. The more that we did that, the more that people hung with us through it." - Tony Blair looking back at Kosovo

A couple related points from PBS:

The visceral opposition to the Kosovo conflict on the part of Russia, China, and India revealed just how uncomfortable some nations still are with the apparent abandonment of the principle of sovereignty, especially during a period of unrivaled U.S. military power. They point to the U.N. charter, which enshrines and protects sovereignty unless the five Great Powers on the Security Council agree to breach it.

"We're moving into a system of international relations in which human rights, rights of minorities every day, are much more important. More important even than sovereignty." - Former Nato Secretary General Javier Solana

"By bypassing the United Nations and disregarding the principle of sovereignty because of Serbia's internal treatment of its own people, I think NATO's actions in the Kosovo conflict do represent a significant paradigm shift," said Garrett of the Monterey Institute. "That doesn't mean we're going to see lots of similar humanitarian interventions, or interventions in Great Powers such as China and Russia. However, the days of absolute sovereignty--when governments could abuse their own people with total impunity--are gone forever."

 

[Starblayde]

As far as i can remember, Kosovo was very similar to Iraq, but it was pretty much our back yard. Kinda of a 'we can't let this happen in Europe' thing... and it is a very unstable and economically depressed region.

Whereas Iraq is tangled up with Oil and the first (so far the only) Gulf War... and its so far away, and we can't identify with the people as much, i guess.

Just my tuppeny's worth

 

[Linedrive]

As far as i can remember, Kosovo was very similar to Iraq, but it was pretty much our back yard. Kinda of a 'we can't let this happen in Europe' thing... and it is a very unstable and economically depressed region.

Whereas Iraq is tangled up with Oil and the first (so far the only) Gulf War... and its so far away, and we can't identify with the people as much, i guess.

Just my tuppeny's worth

Thanks Starblayde. From what I've read, the fact that it was in Europe's backyard played a role in public opinion, many vowing that it threatened to create instability in the region. From what I understand, the media really brought the war home to the British Public, showing many scenes and publicizing the Serb attrocities.

 

[cliffchuff]

personally I am sick of an unelected Bush administration thinking it can do what the fuck it likes without reaping the concequences.

The reason most (yes that is a majority) brits are against the war is the blatant hipocracy of it, our media though biased has enough freedom that most of the public are educated (2 milloin on a march!) enough to see through the bullshit spun by the party propoganaists.

I think Sadam should be kicked out, he should never have been put in power or sold chemical wepons (or a nuclear reactor by the french) in the first place. But to try and kick him out no to 'one up' Bush's daddy and win the next election (I don't think he will get away with screwing the American public again).

No one here really supports saddam, but the flimsy lies being bandered about the reason for war are just to much.

The British parliment just voted with 120 Labour MP's voting against war, That the biggest revolt in over a hundred years, If
B-Liar dosen't watch it we will have a new labour party leader.

Turkish parliment just voted to not allow American troups to stage there after America declined to pay the promised aid up front.

No one trusts Bush and concequenty no one trusts B-liar.

American credibility is probably lower than it has ever been.

The whole world is amazed you are standing for it.

 

[Guest]

 

[Starblayde]

Thanks Starblayde. From what I've read, the fact that it was in Europe's backyard played a role in public opinion, many vowing that it threatened to create instability in the region. From what I understand, the media really brought the war home to the British Public, showing many scenes and publicizing the Serb attrocities.

Yes, very much so... 'the serb's are bad' is a general feeling, what with solvodan (sp?) milosevic and all that war crimes stuff. The region was already unstable... has been since time immemorial.

 

[Guest]

I really think Bush and Blair order the assassination of Saddam, Mugabe, Kim Jong Il(I almost typed Dong), etc.

Of course that means Bush and Blair will be legit targets, but self-sacrifice is what ''heros'' are made of, right?

 

[Linedrive]

personally I am sick of an unelected Bush administration thinking it can do what the fuck it likes without reaping the concequences.

Obviously you come to the table with an anti-Bush perspective, and he was elected President of the US, but that's for another debate.


The reason most (yes that is a majority) brits are against the war is the blatant hipocracy of it, our media though biased has enough freedom that most of the public are educated (2 milloin on a march!) enough to see through the bullshit spun by the party propoganaists.

So the reason why there is a fair amount of people that are for military action is because we just aren't educated...?


I think Sadam should be kicked out, he should never have been put in power or sold chemical wepons (or a nuclear reactor by the french) in the first place. But to try and kick him out no to 'one up' Bush's daddy and win the next election (I don't think he will get away with screwing the American public again).

Don't jump to US election predictions too soon. Do you know why a couple of the top Democratic Presidental candidates are not running in 2004...? Because they don't believe they can beat Bush. Guess it'll give the chronic complainer crowd another reason to cry foul election if he prevails.


No one here really supports saddam, but the flimsy lies being bandered about the reason for war are just to much.

The British parliment just voted with 120 Labour MP's voting against war, That the biggest revolt in over a hundred years, If
B-Liar dosen't watch it we will have a new labour party leader.

Turkish parliment just voted to not allow American troups to stage there after America declined to pay the promised aid up front.

No one trusts Bush and concequenty no one trusts B-liar.

American credibility is probably lower than it has ever been.

The whole world is amazed you are standing for it.

Cliff...I'm not looking to discuss the whole justification of the war, anti or not and I appreciate your viewpoint. Were you in favor of interviening in Bosnia and Kosovo in the 90's...?