Boycott KFC

[BlackSnake]

Are you aware that there's a connection between childhood torture of animals and adult torture/murder of children and other people?

Absolutely not. No connection what so ever. Maybe signals for parents to pay attention to their child and get help, but no connection to torture and murder of human beings.

I've killed many animals, only those that I intended on eating. Except for a dog I had to put down.

Barring survival, I have no wish to harm another human being. I don't hunt anymore because I can afford to shop in stores.

But, there was a time when "Rockey" was on the menu.

Torture? It is my opinion that all live stock are tortured, because they are not free.

I wouldn't doubt that the people kicked and tossed the chickens against walls need to be fired, but it's because the chickens are the product. Some body has to kill the chickens. Seperate their heads from their bodies. I've done it, and wouldn't want that job. It was really amazing to see a chicken running around without its head.

 

[steve w]

Blacksnake,

I think you may be confusing the initially amusing sight of a decapitated chicken still moving, with the cruel and barbaric abuse of helpless animals, causing them severe pain and trauma before they die. I fail to see any part of the workers' behaviour (or their bosses' acceptance of it) that can be condoned, excused or, frankly, explained.

And for the record, almost every serial killer researched has a history of torturing animals in their earlier life. It's part of a closing down of their moral inhibitions, a desire to have power over life and death, and a morbid fascination with the pain and helplessness of others.

Think about it.

 

[SnoopDog]

This whole thing is certainly disgusting. Why do people do such things ??? What do they get out of that ??? That they are stronger and more clever than .... a chicken ???

What the fuck ?

Since KFC isn'T too much around here in Germany I have eaten only twice at KFC (and one time wasn't even in Germany).
I didn'T like it too much anyways but now that I know these things I might not eat there again.

Snoopy

 

[shereads]

Blacksnake, they didn't just kill the animals, they tortured them to death. I've seen chickens killed and I know their bodies run around for a while. But it's a nervous impulse, and a headess body doesn't feel pain.

There'a vast difference between killing something and torturing it to death for the joy of witnessing its pain. And it's absolutely true that serial killers often have animal-torture as a childhood hobby.

If you know a child who likes to cut up or beat up its pets or trapped animals, the child needs psychiatric help. And all children need to be taught that killing for food should be done with as little suffering as possible.

The Indians and our cave-painting ancestors believed that animals had a spirit that sacrificed its life for their survival, as a gift. They respected its sacrifice.

 

[cloudy]

Blacksnake, they didn't just kill the animals, they tortured them to death. I've seen chickens killed and I know their bodies run around for a while. But it's a nervous impulse, and a headess body doesn't feel pain.

There'a vast difference between killing something and torturing it to death for the joy of witnessing its pain. And it's absolutely true that serial killers often have animal-torture as a childhood hobby.

If you know a child who likes to cut up or beat up its pets or trapped animals, the child needs psychiatric help. And all children need to be taught that killing for food should be done with as little suffering as possible.

The Indians and our cave-painting ancestors believed that animals had a spirit that sacrificed its life for their survival, as a gift. They respected its sacrifice.

Even us retarded cannibals killed our dinner with some mercy...

 

[Wildcard Ky]

Here's an update on what's been happening. The whole situation gets a lot of time on the news because KFC is headquartered in Louisville.

At KFC's insistance, Pilgrims Pride has fired 11 workers at the W.Va facility for the abuse of the animals. KFC issued the statement about it. In the statement, KFC pointed out that they buy 15% of the chickens that come from the W.Va facility. The other 85% of the chickens are sold to other customers.

KFC has also gone on the offensive against PETA. I just heard a report a little while ago, and don't have a link yet. KFC and PETA have been butting heads for awhile now. While PETA was doing it's investigation against KFC, apparently KFC was doing one on PETA. KFC claims that they have proof that PETA support the Earth Liberation Front in the form of canceled checks. KFC also claims that they have proof that PETA financially supports the Animal Liberation Front. ELF and ALF are both classified as terrorist groups by the FBI for acts of vandalism and arson. There have been a few human deaths attributed to some of the arson cases.

I did a little searching and found this on the PETA ELF/ALF connection:

People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals provides aid and comfort for the Earth Liberation Front (ELF) and the Animal Liberation Front (ALF). The two groups are responsible for more than 600 crimes since 1996, causing (by a very conservative FBI estimate) more than $43 million in damage. ALF’s “press office” brags that in 2002, the two groups committed “100 illegal direct actions” -- like blowing up SUVs, destroying the brakes on seafood delivery trucks, and planting firebombs in restaurants.

The FBI calls ALF and ELF the nation’s “most serious domestic terrorism threat.” Bruce Friedrich, PETA’s “vegan campaign director” and third-in-command, didn’t seem to care when he addressed the Animal Rights 2001 convention in Virginia, telling a crowd of over 1,000 activists that “blowing stuff up and smashing windows” is “a great way to bring about animal liberation.”

“It would be great,” he added, “if all the fast-food outlets, slaughterhouses, these laboratories and the banks who fund them exploded tomorrow.”

PETA’s connections to ALF and ELF are indisputable. “We did it, we did it. We gave $1,500 to the ELF for a specific program,” PETA’s Lisa Lange admitted on the Fox News Channel. PETA has offered no fewer than eight different explanations of what the “specific program” was, but law enforcement leaders have noted that since the Earth Liberation Front is a criminal enterprise, it has absolutely no legal “programs” of any kind.

For instance, in 2003, ELF set fire to an unfinished, 200 unit condominium complex near San Diego. The arson caused $50 million in damage, and according to a San Diego Fire Captain: “It could have killed someone.” ELF left its calling card in the form of a twelve foot sign that read: “If you build it -- we will burn it -- the ELF’s are mad.”

PETA also has given $2,000 to David Wilson, then a national ALF “spokesperson.” The group paid $27,000 for the legal defense of Roger Troen, who was arrested for taking part in an October 1986 burglary and arson at the University of Oregon. It gave $7,500 to Fran Stephanie Trutt, who tried to murder the president of a medical laboratory. It gave $5,000 to Josh Harper, who attacked Native Americans on a whale hunt by throwing smoke bombs, shooting flares, and spraying their faces with chemical fire extinguishers. All of these monies were paid out of tax-exempt funds, the same pot of money constantly enlarged by donations from an unsuspecting general public.

PETA president Ingrid Newkirk is also an acknowledged financial supporter of a publication called No Compromise. This periodical operates on behalf of the radicals of ALF, and often publishes underground “communiqués” and calls to arms from ALF leaders.

Most ominously, PETA president Ingrid Newkirk was involved in the multi-million-dollar arson at Michigan State University that resulted in a 57-month prison term for Animal Liberation Front bomber Rodney Coronado. At Coronado’s sentencing hearing, U.S. Attorney Michael Dettmer said that PETA’s Ingrid Newkirk arranged ahead of time to have Coronado send her a pair of FedEx packages from Michigan -- one on the day before he burned the lab down, and the other shortly afterward.

The first FedEx, according to the Sentencing Memorandum, was delivered to a woman named Maria Blanton, “a longtime PETA member who had agreed to accept the first Federal Express package from Coronado after being asked to do so by Ingrid Newkirk.” The FBI intercepted the second package, which had been sent to the same address. It contained documents that Coronado stole before lighting his firebombs, as well as “a videotape of the perpetrator of the MSU crime, disguised in a ski mask.” Since Coronado was convicted of the arson, we now know that he himself was that masked man. “Significantly,” wrote U.S. Attorney Dettmer, “Newkirk had arranged to have the package delivered to her days before the MSU arson occurred.” (emphasis in the original)

A search warrant executed at Blanton’s home turned up evidence that PETA’s other co-founder, Alex Pacheco, had also been planning burglaries and break-ins along with Rodney Coronado. The feds seized “surveillance logs; code names for Coronado, Pacheco, and others; burglary tools; two-way radios; night vision goggles; [and] phony identification for Coronado and Pacheco.”

Shortly after Coronado’s arrest, PETA gave $45,200 to his “support committee” and “loaned” $25,000 to his father (the loan was never repaid and PETA hasn’t complained). Now free from jail, with an expired parole, and with the benefit of an expired Statute of Limitations on his many earlier arsons (to which he readily confesses in his standard stump speech), Coronado stood before a crowd of hundreds of young people at American University in January 2003 and demonstrated how to turn a milk jug into a bomb. A few days later, ALF criminals tried to burn down a McDonald’s restaurant in Chico, California, using a firebomb that matched Coronado’s recipe.

The following month, Ingrid Newkirk told ABC News that Rodney Coronado is “a fine young man.”

Newkirk wrote a book called Free the Animals! The Untold Story of the U.S. Animal Liberation Front and Its Founder, ‘Valerie.’ In it she writes: “The ALF has, over the years, trusted People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA) to receive copies of the evidence of wrongdoing … I have also become somewhat used to jumping on a plane with copies of freshly purloined documents and hurriedly calling news conferences to discuss the ALF’s findings.” Indeed, PETA has held such press conferences just hours after ALF arsons and other break-ins.

PETA has published a leaflet called “Animal Liberation Front: the Army of the Kind.” In another pamphlet, “Activism and the Law,” PETA openly offers advice on “burning a laboratory building.”

“I will be the last person to condemn ALF,” says Newkirk. And in another interview: “I find it small wonder that the laboratories aren’t all burning to the ground. If I had more guts, I’d light a match.” In ALF’s publication Bite Back (yes, this terrorist group has a newsletter), Newkirk has said: “You can’t have all politeness and patience, all potlucks and epistles … Some people will never budge unless [they are] pushed to budge.”

Perhaps Newkirk’s most telling comment, though, came in a 2002 U.S. News & World Report feature. “Our nonviolent tactics are not as effective,” she admitted. “We ask nicely for years and get nothing. Someone makes a threat, and it works.”

 

[shereads]

I don't condone any act by activist groups that results in injury or death. I won't necessarily extend that to condemning every act that results in property damage, because there have been instances when tortured animals were released and put out of their misery by means of burglary.

It's unfortunate that extremist groups often include people at two ends of a spectrum - the crazies who don't care who gets hurt, and other people whose actions do no more harm than was necessary to bring public attention to the KFC/Pilgrim's Pride issue: the harm of embarrassing two corporations who, until the video was made public, had ignored attempts to end this atrocious behavior.

Just as not all members of right-to-life organizations end up shooting at clinics, not every animal rights activist has an insane agenda. They have learned the hard way that we, the public, don't demand change until we're shocked.

 

[BlackSnake]

Blacksnake,

...

And for the record, almost every serial killer researched has a history of torturing animals in their earlier life. It's part of a closing down of their moral inhibitions, a desire to have power over life and death, and a morbid fascination with the pain and helplessness of others.

Think about it.

First point well taken.

Second point: Some people who have not grown up to become serial killers have tortured animals. It is not an 1 to 1 relationship. It is a broad generalization. Like saying rapist were molested childern.

In my opinion, it is just the choices people make.

Ever been hunting? What do you think happens when "Bambi's" uncle are wounded and it takes a while to find it? It suffers. Sometimes it takes hours to locate. Ever field dress a deer?

Ever tied a string of firecrackers to a cat's tail and lit it? Commanded your dog to attack someone? Released your dogs on a stray? It's cruel, but are you to assume that kids that have done those things will grow up to be serial killers.

Ever got bitten by an ant? Do you kill it? If it really hurts, then I like to break off one of its legs and release it. Why? I'm I a serial killer? No. I want the little sob to feel pain like it caused me.

People have free will, and some choose to do things that are not socially acceptible.

If you say "some" then it could apply to anyone.

 

[Xelebes]

Not KFC (I don't think there are any on this continent?), but there was an episode of jail sentences and general uproar over the same kind of behaviour at several poultry farms over here some years ago. What is it with chicken that makes those people blow their lids?

#L

My father raised chickens. the only thing more stupid than them are turkeys, but they usually kill themselves for some stupid reason (like one drowning turkey means all the rest gotta drown.)

 

[shereads]

Ever tied a string of firecrackers to a cat's tail and lit it? Commanded your dog to attack someone? Released your dogs on a stray? It's cruel, but are you to assume that kids that have done those things will grow up to be serial killers.

No, you are to assume that they are sick, twisted little people who might, if the world is lucky, not grow up to be serial killers.

 

[BlackSnake]

If people were selfless instead of selfrightous, the world would be a beautiful place.

Do you think that it's KFC's fault that the company they buy chickens from hire morons? We have enough of a shortage of jobs without causing employers like KFC's to loose money.

I do believe you can catch more bees with honey. Send well crafted emails to KFC's asking them to look into this serious public relation issue. They will, I'm sure. The customer is always right.

 

[BlackSnake]

No, you are to assume that they are sick, twisted little people who might, if the world is lucky, not grow up to be serial killers.

I don't believe it's luck. Free will.

 

[shereads]

If people were selfless instead of selfrightous, the world would be a beautiful place.

Do you think that it's KFC's fault that the company they buy chickens from hire morons? We have enough of a shortage of jobs without causing employers like KFC's to loose money.

I do believe you can catch more bees with honey. Send well crafted emails to KFC's asking them to look into this serious public relation issue. They will, I'm sure. The customer is always right.

I work in marketing, Blacksnake. A corporation the size of KFC could care less about a letter-writing campaign as long as it doesn't affect their bottom line. The threat of a boycott, thanks to this video, instantly accomplished what people had tried by other means for a long time. Money talks. Letters get a nice reply with a coupon attached.

The only people losing their jobs are 11 people who deserve jail.

 

[shereads]

I don't believe it's luck. Free will.

Free will on the part of someone who enjoys torturing the weak? The odds of that working to anyone's benefit can't be good.

 

[shereads]

Blacksnake, you are losing Smoove points with this defense of animal torture. Don't make me come over there.

Make a silent vow to respect all living things, and not to hurt your food any more than necessary to get it sufficiently dead for dining purposes.

Okay, there. That was easy, wasn't it?



Now you can visit the Smoove Boudoir thread where I have posted Smoove's romantic "Corn for Two" recipe.

 

[steve w]

Blacksnake,

I think you may be taking my logic, and applying it from the wrong end. I said that almost all serial killers researched had evidence of animal torturing in their background. It is a leap (and twist) of logic to assume that all those who torture animals are going to be serial killers. I am English, but not all Englishmen are called Steve. See?

On your other points, no, I've never hunted. No, I've never tied a firecracker to a cat's tail - it is barbaric, cruel and dangerous for everyone involved. No, I don't pull a leg off an ant, and no, I don't consider an animal being deprived of a limb as equating to me getting a minor insect bite.

On a more general point, it is clearly true that some animal rights' groups are extremists. However, the morality of what Pilgrim did remains.

 

[Guest]

Sher.. i found this for you..

never fear the chicks are mounting a good opposition.. perhaps youd like to lead them into battle?

 

[boxofrocks]

that's sick shereads.

And I had chicken for dinner.

 

[BlackSnake]

Blacksnake, you are losing Smoove points with this defense of animal torture. Don't make me come over there.

Make a silent vow to respect all living things, and not to hurt your food any more than necessary to get it sufficiently dead for dining purposes.

Okay, there. That was easy, wasn't it?



Now you can visit the Smoove Boudoir thread where I have posted Smoove's romantic "Corn for Two" recipe.

I wasn't defending those people who tortured the chickens, but I am trying to post a wall for those who hunt for food (not for sport - can't stand that).

When things like this come up. People become outraged. After the issue is handled, they look for the next target. Usually something similar. I'm guessing the NRA. Like I said, I don't hunt any more because I don't have to. What about fishing. If you hook something too small you release it. In doing so, the fish mouth is torn making it hard for it to eat. (Alert! Torture - go get'em).

I'm not fond of special interest groups. Not even the NRA, PETA, NAACP, KKK, or what have you. I think they all are dangerous. Convincing people that they have their best interest at heart, when, in actuality they seek power and control.

Why weren't those individuals arrested? Crulity to animals extends to live-stock. Makes me think that there is more to the story.

 

[shereads]

I wasn't defending those people who tortured the chickens, but I am trying to post a wall for those who hunt for food (not for sport - can't stand that).

When things like this come up. People become outraged. After the issue is handled, they look for the next target. Usually something similar. I'm guessing the NRA. Like I said, I don't hunt any more because I don't have to. What about fishing. If you hook something too small you release it. In doing so, the fish mouth is torn making it hard for it to eat. (Alert! Torture - go get'em).

I'm not fond of special interest groups. Not even the NRA, PETA, NAACP, KKK, or what have you. I think they all are dangerous. Convincing people that they have their best interest at heart, when, in actuality they seek power and control.

Why weren't those individuals arrested? Crulity to animals extends to live-stock. Makes me think that there is more to the story.

That is the point of the story. The men weren't arrested because the torture occurred at a packing plant, which is exempt from animal-cruelty laws. PETA and the Humane Society want laws to protect food animals from unnecessary suffering. In this country, to serve McDonalds which is the largest buyer of meat, we allow a "kill-rate" of cattle in slaughterhouses that's nearly three times the rate in other developed countries. The result is an inordinate number of worker injuries and occasional, awful incidents where animals go on the conveyer hook while they're still alive.

You don't want all people who kill animals to be painted with the same brush as animal-torturers; by the same token, you shouldn't assume that the people who try to bring about change by joining PETA or the NAACP or Sierra Club are all power-hungry radicals. You might be surprised by how many of the rights and laws you take for granted wouldn't have existed without the efforts of these groups. Without them, there would be no competition for wealthy corporations when it comes to infuencing legislation.

 

[emap]

I am pretty glad we don't have KFC much, we don't really care for it.

Now while I find the video thing disturbing, Blacksnake even more disturbing I can't really see why kicking or throwing the chickens against the wall is any worse than what they do to them to get the packaged parts.

Ever wonder why they never really show how they slaughter the animals? My guy told me once, I really wish he hadn't but I asked. Chickens are grabbed by the legs by a guy with thick gloves on, their legs are tied together and then they are hung off a hook by the tie, usually a rope, but sometimes a wire is used, depending on where you are and the company, the chickens are then rolled down the line by the machine, their head is nocked against soemthing to calm them down, their neck is then caught between two whirling circles, snapping their necks, after that the head is cut off by two swirling blades, or a few guys with machetes again depending on where you are and the company.

Cows are worse, I kid you not. They load them on a truck pack them in so they can't move and they, well go on each other, they sit on that truck for hours or days depending on where the farm is and where they sold the cows, at the factory they are shoved off the truck, many unable to walk really by then, allowed to stand around in a rather small coop or whatever you want to call it for a few hours then they are shoved onto a conveyor belt, the conveyor belt has a few different paths, to allow them to weed out the young cows, and to not overburden one area. At the other end, they have a few men standing around with a basically taser, they taser the cow, it can't fall over because it has no room to, the conveyor also has curved walls so they can't slump, also why they are sent down different paths, after they are tasered, sometimes they is what kills them, but often not, there are men standing around with big boards and spikes, they get brained. At the end of the conveyor is another man carrying a pistol, he checks the cows if they are not dead, he shoots them or not, sometimes they don't have that man, after that they are treated just like a chicken.

I think that is why there are no animal cruelty laws at slaughterhouses, someone told the lawmakers what they do to the animal before it is packaged. Of course the companies all say how they are working to insure no animal is harmed in the process of slaughtering them, they really need to say besides the slaughtering of them.

Before you ask, he told me how he knows, the chicken one they filmed in Mexico and showed it once, they had gone on to say how the methods shown are basically the same everywhere, and his uncles worked in slaughterhouses and he has seen some video of the cows before going into the slaughterhouse proper. Pigs he doesn't know, he does know how they look at a meatmarket after arriving to be cut up, these were of course private owned pigs after the fair, they looked to have been brained and then field dressed.

After he told me this it took me a couple days to really be able to eat his cooking, he insists on having meat of some sort every day.

 

[BlackSnake]

I am pretty glad we don't have KFC much, we don't really care for it.

Now while I find the video thing disturbing, Blacksnake even more disturbing I can't really see why kicking or throwing the chickens against the wall is any worse than what they do to them to get the packaged parts.

...

This is exactly where I was going. Some places use hammers on the cows heads.

Imagine what's not caught on tape as people swing hammers hitting cows in the head to kill them. "Oops, miss the spot...gotta take another swing."

Are we now to boycott all fast food joints?

I have some type of meat at every meal too.

BTW, I never liked KFC, MsWinners, or Chick-Filet and don't purchase anything from the places.

 

[BlackSnake]

...

You don't want all people who kill animals to be painted with the same brush as animal-torturers; by the same token, you shouldn't assume that the people who try to bring about change by joining PETA or the NAACP or Sierra Club are all power-hungry radicals. You might be surprised by how many of the rights and laws you take for granted wouldn't have existed without the efforts of these groups. Without them, there would be no competition for wealthy corporations when it comes to infuencing legislation.

I speak of the organizations as a whole, not individuals, because some people are looking to do the right and just think, while others are looking for chaos. I am not surprised by the number of laws created by the influence of special interest groups. A lot of those laws prohibit individuals while protecting businesses and industries.

I'm guessing the only reason the 11 were fired, was because they were caught on tape.

 

[shereads]

I speak of the organizations as a whole, not individuals, because some people are looking to do the right and just think, while others are looking for chaos. I am not surprised by the number of laws created by the influence of special interest groups. A lot of those laws prohibit individuals while protecting businesses and industries.

I'm guessing the only reason the 11 were fired, was because they were caught on tape.

Of course that's the ony reason they were fired. PETA had been asking for some changes at this plant for a long time, and only by publicly embarrassing the company and its biggest customer were they able to achieve any result. There would be no need for organizations like this if individuals were able to bring about positive change by simply reasoning with corporate CEOs and appealing to their better nature. The world doesn't work that way. You obviously think this issue should have been ignored; I'm glad to know that, if nothing else, there will be a tiny bit less agony in the world today than there was before the release of this tape.

I'm well aware that there are horrible things that happen to animals so we can eat meat and wear leather. Some plants and some people are more humane than others, and I try to limit my purchases to companies that are not known to inflict unnecessary suffering. I'd like to say I'm a vegan, but I'm not. I do try to buy responsibly, choosing free-range chicken and eggs, and cruelty-free cosmetics. I see a vast difference between the use of animals in medical science and their use by cosmetics companies to test a new and better eye makeup, which was frequently done - in pre-PETA days - by applying chemicals to the eyes of rabbits which had had their eyelids cut off to make the process more convenient.

Nobody's suggesting you shouldn't hunt to eat for food. My grandfather fed his family that way, and was as happy to shoot and fry a wild squirrel as he was delighted to have pet squirrels he had rescued from a nest when their mother was shot by a neighbor's kid. It's not a matter of condemning the reasonable use of food animals. It's about being grateful that there are people willing to take on issues that most of us would prefer to ignore, so that we can make informed choices. There are a lot of ways to have lunch without rewarding Pilgrim's Pride for having ignored this sick behavior at its plants.

Have you seen the video? I saw more of it on NBC last night and I wouldn't want any of those men left alone with my children or my pets. It's disgusting to see a big, powerful man gleefully jumping up and down on the struggling bodies of live creatures, while his buddies wait for their turn. To know that supervisors had been made aware of this and didn't give a damn, it's easy to see why the world is the way it is. I'm grateful to PETA.

 

[Wildcard Ky]

I don't believe in the torture or abuse of any animal. Only kill it if you're going to eat it. If you're going to eat it, kill it as quickly and humanely as possible.

With that being said, there's something really starting to bother me about all of this.

Pilgrims Pride is the place where the abuse/torture occurred. KFC buys 15% of the chickens that come out of that facility. PETA is waging a full blown campaign against KFC in this matter, Pilgrims Pride is rarely if ever mentioned in this campaign by PETA.

Why isn't PETA waging the same campaign against Pilgrims Pride, or the other places that buy the other 85% of the chickens that come out of this facility?

Methinks that PETA is using this as a part of their agenda to go after KFC in their longstanding feud. If the interests of truth and fairness were being served by PETA in this particular matter, they would be campaigning against Pilgrims Pride, and the other companies that buy chickens from that facility.

Go to PETA's website and look at all of the info on this issue. Every article they have posted has the headlines of "KFC". KFC only constitutes 15% of the business from the facility that committed the acts, so why is KFC getting 100% of the bad press and blame from PETA?