Boring Ass Political Question

[MADDOG]

OK, I appologise in advance for boring the shit out of everyone, but I need to ask a question about American Law making Proceedure.

Supposing the President has a law he'd like to pass. How would he go about it?

What is the proceedure? Does he say what he wants to do in the Senate? Is there a debate type thing going on? If so, who goes first?

I kind of need a step by step process for making laws - specifically when it's the Presidents idea. And it needs to be reasonably accurate too.

Any help from anyone with any knowledge whatsoever would be appreciated.

Cheers to the power of 6 for this one.

MADDOG

 

[MADDOG]

Actually, I'm sorry. I stuffed it up. It's not so much Laws I'm after, it's policy.

Like if he made a promise in an election campaign to do something... like increase welfare, and it was time to deliver, how would he get the thing passed?

And also, if he wanted to do a few things in one like increase welfare, provide more homless shelters, and start up drug rehap clinics or something, are they separate issues? Or can the be bundled together in one policy?

Cheers again.

MADDOG

 

[catlover]

Presidential policy into law

The President would have his staff prepare a piece of legislation, and have one of his political allies introduce it in the Congress, in either house unless it were an appropriation bill, in which case it must start in the House of Representatives. Then he would lobby for it by talking about it publicly to put pressure on the Congressmen to vote for it, in order to appeaswe their constituents at home

Parenthetically, one of the big and valid criticisms of the current administration is that while they do a lot of talking, they havent done exactly what you asked, although in fairness, with an opposition majority in both houses an administration backed or introduced bill might not get far, but politically it would have removed the criticism

In some cases they can be bundled as riders on another bill - in some they cannot. Foir example on an apprpriations bill the riders must be germaine to the subject at hand

[Edited by catlover on 10-28-2000 at 08:38 AM]

 

[Jade]

Ah, the beauty of the three branches! Lmao

Technically it ought to work just how catlover explained. (Smart woman she is!)
However, there are other factors to think about. Because of a lovely little item entitled "veto power" the president has to hope that he/she can gain the favor of the Congress to not kill his bill. Also, if Congress wants to get something done, their president has veto power and so you'd have to hope that he/she is the same party as you (majority or minority, wherever you may stand.)

 

[MADDOG]

Hey, thanks heaps for the info. I'm pretty sure that's gonna cover most of it. But what exactly is an appropriation bill? (And just so I'm straight, this all happens in Congress - Not the Senate right? Or is that the same? And the President has to get someone to introduce it on his behalf?)

The other thing is, would it go something like this...

Introduced into Congress - Lobby for it publicly - Debate it in Congress - Vote?

Is there more to it? Or less?

Also, Once it's introduced, would the President be in Congress for the vote? Does he get a vote?

Thanks again.

MADDOG

 

[MADDOG]

OK, One more question! Say the President was Impeached before the bill could be passed... would that stop it going through if it was an otherwise valid piece of legistlation?

And I don't mean impeached over a cigar smuggling type thing - what if he couldn't be President anyway - like it came out that he was foreign born or something?

MADDOG

 

[Cheyenne]

Where's Lasher when you need him? This thread is right up his alley.

I'd also suggest a little research on the net. I don't know offhand where it would be, but I'm sure everything you're looking for is summarized somewhere on a U.S. government website.

 

[forgetunome]

Maddog...

this may help...

http://www.house.gov/house/Tying_it_all.html

Good luck!

 

[catlover]

Ill try to remember the questions, but first, im not a lady - im a dirty old man,. Back when I was in school, all this stuff was taught in required civics classes

An apprpriations bill is one that appropriates money to pay the bills, either an annual appropriation for a specific department, or a special appropriation for a specific project. All appropriations bill must start in the House of Representatives and be approved by the Senate before going to the President for signature or veto.

Any bill not an appropriations bill may start in either the House or Senate, and is sent to the other house for action before going on the the President

The President does NOT HAVE A VOTE IN congress. Impeachement would not affect the process in any way- if ther Pred\sident were impeached (which is the CHARGE - NOT THE RESULT) and removed from office, he would be immediately reoplaced by the next in line, i.e the Vice Pres, and upon his taking office would be the new President,and would act on the legislation.

[Edited by catlover on 10-28-2000 at 09:49 AM]

 

[Dragonlady]

I'm not sure But the answer to the Question is (CONGRESS)
I think any thing the president does goes thro..congress...but i could be wrong but then i'm voting for scobby doo!!





Later
Dragonlady

 

[catlover]

President - Congress

Sorry - not at all - The President controls all govt agencies - they are part of the Executive Branch- he can simply issue an Executive Order and the Bureaucrats in the FAA or the Environmental groups or the agricultural people or whatever follow - with no legislation whatever- with NO ACTION by Congress whatever. Only control Congress has is thru controlling the money thru the appropriation process

 

[MADDOG]

Thanks heaps to everyone who provided info and links in answer to my questions. It was very much appreciated and seriously helpful.

MADDOG

 

[MADDOG]

OK, I have just ONE more question which I forgot to ask, and then I'll piss off.

Supposing the President was Independent - Like Ross Perot or something. How would the rest of the government be made up? Are they individualy elected officials? (Sentators?) Or does the President get to appoint his own representatives?

And how then would the President get anything done? Does he have to just hope he can get enough people on side? And to introduce a bill, does he just have to find a senator willing to support it?

Thanks heaps again.

MADDOG

 

[insideShiraz]

Germaine?...

I'm still wondering wut Congress would have to say about a word like Germaine...Aye...Nay...now Let's spend 10,000 dollars of taxpayer money and go get some Tacos...

I'm still cracking up over MADDOG crashing that rape fantasy...

O.K. that's it! This board needs more ot the infamous Pussy Mullets...Tah-Dah...

Toys in the Attic(for another thread)

 

[catlover]

independent president

Damn good question - exactly why I didnt vote for Perot - (Ive known him personally since we were 18 - Im a Naval Academy classmate). With no party organization as a cadre it would be a total mess. As a practical matter- virtually impossible, altho being a practical man im sure he would accept advice from all sides - it would just take a lot longer to get everything properly settled

Im glad this has been helpful to you, but lets stop this thread right here

 

[MADDOG]

Re: Germaine?...

I'm still cracking up over MADDOG crashing that rape fantasy...

All in a days work for Protecter of the Innocent... MADDOG. Glad you liked it Shiraz.

But seriously, can anyone help with that last question?

MADDOG

 

[forgetunome]

Originally posted by Maddog
Supposing the President was Independent - Like Ross Perot or something. How would the rest of the government be made up? Are they individualy elected officials? (Sentators?) Or does the President get to appoint his own representatives?

Yes, they are individually elected officials that represent each of their States that voted them in (or they are suppose to).

 

[LustyWench]

Brava to catlover! I think she explained it purrfectly.
Thats why it makes me laugh at all the things GORE and
BUSH claim they are going to do if/when elected. They
in all honesty can't guarantee anything. This doesn't
make them liars, just unrealistic.

 

[Curious Guy]

Here's some basic stuff Maddog

The U.S. Congress is made up of 2 Houses. The Senate is 100 voting members, 2 from each state. The House of Representatives membership is based on population of the states. The Vice President of the USA is the President of the Senate, he only votes in a tie situation.

Most Bills (proposed laws), can start in either house. A bill must pass both houses of Congress. Then it goes to the President. He can sign it into law or can veto the Bill. If a Bill is vetoed, it can be voted on by Congress, again. If it passes by at least a 2/3 margin it will become law without the President's approval.

Maybe, one of the lawyers on here can add to or correct this. This is just what I remember from government in high school.

 

[Renee]

What Curious Guy said.. sums it all up... here it is in a little more detail.

I hope this helps you.

The Congress of the United States is made up of a Senate and House of Representatives.

The Senate is made up of Senators there are two from every State. This is in accordance with the 17th Amendment. A Senator is elected for a six year term therefore, one-third of the total Senate is elected every second year. The two Senators in each one State do not have the same serving time, therefore we have a Senior Senator, (he one selected first), and a Junior Senator, (the second elected). Each Senator is allowed One Vote.

In the House of Representatives we have 435 members, each one is allowed one vote. So this is our Congress and their cheif function is to make our laws. In order to make a Law you must first introduce a "Bill."

Bills may originate in either the House of Representatives or the Senate with the exception provided in the Constitution. Article I, Section 7, of the Constitution states that all bills for raising revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives but that the Senate may propose or concur with amendments. Also, general appropriation bills also originate in the House of Representatives.

There are two types of bills -- public and private. A public bill is one that affects the public. A bill that affects a specified individual or a private entity rather than the population at large is called a private bill. A private bill is used for relief in matters such as immigration and naturalization and claims against the United States.

A bill originating in the House of Representatives will be specified by the letters HR and numbers that follow it. The Number will follow through it through the Parliamentary stages. The letters signify "House of Representatives" some people assume it stands for "House resolution", but it doesn't. A Senate bill is singaled out by the letter S, and a number that follows it. The term "companion bill" is used to describe a bill introduced in one House of Congress that is similar or identical to a bill introduced in the other House of Congress.

A bill that has been agreed to in identical form by both bodies becomes the law of the land only after --

Presidential approval; or if the President fails to return an objection to the House in which it originated within 10 days while Congress is in session; or by the overriding of a
presidential veto by a two-thirds vote in each House.

It does not become law without the President's signature if Congress by their final adjournment prevent its return with objections. This is known as a "pocket veto".

After a measure passes in the House, it goes to the Senate for consideration. A bill must pass both bodies in the same form before it can be presented to the President for signature into law.

If the Senate changes the language of the measure, it must return to the House for concurrence or additional changes. This back-and-forth negotiation may occur on the House floor, with the House accepting or rejecting Senate amendments or complete Senate text. Often a conference committee will be appointed with both House and Senate members. This group will resolve the differences in committee and report the identical measure back to both bodies for a vote.

If a President wants to pass an idea as a Law he too must follow the same rules as above. If and when it passes through the House of Reps... he can then sign his approval at the end and it is then law.


As far as how does the President get them to do what he wants... sometimes he can't. But like I said before, for the most part they resolve the differences in committee and amend things they can't agree on.

 

[MADDOG]

Wow. Thank you all so much for the info! It's covered pretty much everything I needed to know.

There's just ONE more thing, and I'm really sorry. I know this is a sex board, but I'm naked as I write this, so it's OK.

If an Independent President were impeached, who would take over the role of President?

MADDOG

 

[catlover]

even if he were independent, he would still have a Vice President, who is next in line - following the VP are, in order - the Speaker of the House of Representatives, the President Pro-Tem of the Senate, the Secretary of State, Sec of treasury,Sec of Defense and God knows after that!

 

[MADDOG]

Thanks Catlover. But who would be the vice President if he was independent? How would that role be assigned? Would he simply chose a mate? Or is it an elected position?

 

[Weird Harold]

If an Independent President were impeached, who would take over the role of President?

If impeached and convicted the VP, et al as catlover detailed.

If impeached and aquitted, no one would take his place.

Impeachment is the same as indictment for other people. It's a charge of wrong-doing, not an automatic removal from office. President Clinton was impeached and aquitted when tried in the Senate, so he' still president (unfortunately.)

 

[catlover]

well and correctly said, WH - the Vice President is elected along with the president- they run together (now - it wasnt that way originally in this country- whoever lost the election became the VP) So tghe VP nominee is selected before the election by the presidential candidate