Age disclaimer

[NudeInMaine]

I enjoy reading the stories. But I wonder - why do the authors always state that the participants are 18 or older? This is Literotica, it ought to be assumed that everyone is of proper age. It just seems superfluous to state the obvious.

 

[KeithD]

many of them have done so to get through the first selection screening. (Of course, stating it's so doesn't make it so.) They could better have put the statement in the notes box rather than the story content.

 

[ofbuttons]

I see it a lot when the story includes characters that are in high school, to make sure the readers know they are 18+ (or, more likely, to ensure their story gets past the rules, while the characters still kind of behave like they are under 18, lol).

 

[AwkwardlySet]

I enjoy reading the stories. But I wonder - why do the authors always state that the participants are 18 or older? This is Literotica, it ought to be assumed that everyone is of proper age. It just seems superfluous to state the obvious.

I am not sure every casual anonymous reader knows that all characters involved in sex have to be 18 or older, especially since on Lush Stories the threshold is 16 years of age, if I am not mistaken. Although yeah, writers, myself included, usually put that in hope that it might help their stories get approved faster.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

Age of consent doesn’t matter. The rules elsewhere don’t matter. The only thing that counts here is the iron-clad, concrete-reinforced under-18 Literotica ban. There are a lot of threads started by people whose story was rejected for violating that. Particularly in cases where there might be some doubt (eg high school students), the up-front statement can help.

 

[TadOverdon]

I enjoy reading the stories. But I wonder - why do the authors always state that the participants are 18 or older? This is Literotica, it ought to be assumed that everyone is of proper age. It just seems superfluous to state the obvious.

Belt and suspenders with respect to the approval process.

 

[Euphony]

It's also tangible agreement/reminder that "hey, you know the rules and so do I so I'm gonna write to them and you calibrate your suspension of disbelief to match, k?"

I grew tired of community college (staying home) brothers and sisters. Fraternal twins, etc. etc.

To me it's a signal of "hey, we all know the deal around here, let's not focus on all the logic breaking ways it *can't* work and move to the story I'm trying to tell."

Though, this agreed upon conceit depends on the maturity of the reader fulfilling their end of the bargain. (most can, some can't)

 

[Djmac1031]

Along with all the reasons already mentioned, it's easier, and safer, to put the disclaimer at the top than to constantly have to force a reference to a character's exact age in story.

Especially if you're writing a series.

I have a long running series where the female lead was 19 (eventually turned 20 as the story progressed) and I honestly hated the idea of having to continually remind readers of her exact age each chapter. Then there were new characters or side characters I'd introduce that I didn't see the need to pin an exact age on in story, only to make sure it was inferred they were Of Age.

So the disclaimer is just a way of covering all the bases so Laurel doesn't have to guess at the age of all your characters.

 

[Stopokochac]

I enjoy reading the stories. But I wonder - why do the authors always state that the participants are 18 or older? This is Literotica, it ought to be assumed that everyone is of proper age. It just seems superfluous to state the obvious.

Because child porn laws

 

[ScrappyPaperDoodler]

I also add: "The below is not intended to serve as a guide for real-life sexual encounters or relationships. Stay safe, happy and healthy!"

I’m sure 99.99% of readers don’t need to be told this, so it doesn’t really serve a purpose. I guess it just makes me feel better. The disclaimer sets a tone: This is adult entertainment and the characters/world don’t follow the same rules we should follow in our real lives (e.g., regarding incest).

But again, I’m sure the vast majority of readers don’t need reminding of this.

 

[BobbyBrandt]

A note to the admins when submitting carries far more weight than a disclaimer at the beginning of a story if the intent is getting the story approved.

This is especially beneficial if the story contains underage children or includes certain 'trigger words', such as "Boy", "Girl", "Brother", or "Sister" which the bots providing an initial screening might trip on.

Characters under 18 can be in stories as long as they are not involved in any sexual activities, thinking about any sexual activities, or having any of their senses (hearing, seeing, smelling, etc.) exposed to any sexual activities.

 

[Kumquatqueen]

A note to the admins when submitting carries far more weight than a disclaimer at the beginning of a story if the intent is getting the story approved.

This is especially beneficial if the story contains underage children or includes certain 'trigger words', such as "Boy", "Girl", "Brother", or "Sister" which the bots providing an initial screening might trip on.

Characters under 18 can be in stories as long as they are not involved in any sexual activities, thinking about any sexual activities, or having any of their senses (hearing, seeing, smelling, etc.) exposed to any sexual activities.

This. I've put notes to Admin quite frequently saying e.g. "all references to 12-year-olds etc are to bottles of whisky" or "all kids at summer camp are explicitly 100 yards away so can't hear what's in a tent in the next field". A couple times I've put a couple sentences in the admin field and said "if you think this sentence crosses the line, please change to xxxxx". - my stories often compare adulthood to being younger.

No rejections in 50 stories, so far.

 

[SimonDoom]

Because child porn laws

It has nothing to do with this. "Child porn" concerns visual images, not written erotica. Generally speaking, there's nothing illegal about writing about people under 18 having sex. There are plenty of erotic story sites that feature such content. There are SOME jurisdictions in the US in which SOME content, especially if it involves particularly egregious violent pedophilia, may be found to be obscene, and therefore illegal, but that's the exception, not the norm (in the USA, anyway).

It's all about the Site's bright-line rule on this subject. That's it.

Personally, I find the disclaimers a little silly and distracting, and I never use them (at least, I can't recall using them). I like Keith's idea of just sending a note to the Site owner upon story submission.

In my stories, I typically refer to the young-ish characters being over 18 somewhere in the body of the story to make it clear I'm not writing about underage characters. I try not to be too obvious about it.

 

[lovecraft68]

Could be an attempt at deflection, hoping the site would say "Oh, they're saying its 18 and over, I'll take their word for it."

Not that I do it, because I have no desire too, and I try to respect site rules even when they're disingenuous, but if people can't see the way around this 'rule' you're nowhere near as creative as you think.

 

[MillieDynamite]

I see it a lot when the story includes characters that are in high school, to make sure the readers know they are 18+ (or, more likely, to ensure their story gets past the rules, while the characters still kind of behave like they are under 18, lol).

Most of us behave as though we are under 18 until we are at least 25!

 

[MillieDynamite]

It has nothing to do with this. "Child porn" concerns visual images, not written erotica. Generally speaking, there's nothing illegal about writing about people under 18 having sex. There are plenty of erotic story sites that feature such content. There are SOME jurisdictions in the US in which SOME content, especially if it involves particularly egregious violent pedophilia, may be found to be obscene, and therefore illegal, but that's the exception, not the norm (in the USA, anyway).

It's all about the Site's bright-line rule on this subject. That's it.

Personally, I find the disclaimers a little silly and distracting, and I never use them (at least, I can't recall using them). I like Keith's idea of just sending a note to the Site owner upon story submission.

In my stories, I typically refer to the young-ish characters being over 18 somewhere in the body of the story to make it clear I'm not writing about underage characters. I try not to be too obvious about it.

When John Ford cast Henry Brandon as Scar in The Searchers, Brandon said he'd been trying to play an American Indian for 10 years and they wouldn't let him because of his bright blue eyes, he asked Ford "So, why did you cast me?" Ford replied "I find exceptions far more compelling than the rules." I think that's why any fetish (age included) will always have an audience. Things that are somewhat or even greatly counter to norm has it own appeal.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

The up-front warning for readers and the Admin note serve subtly different purposes. The latter will get you posted, sure, and I do use such notes when appropriate.

On the other hand, reader complaints can - and have - led to stories being pulled by the site. In cases where there might be any doubt, the standard 'everybody's 18' sentence can prevent a lot of frustration.

 

[MillieDynamite]

If you want that creepy feeling, 60+ year old grandpa fucking girlfriends 18 year old granddaughter would work well, or his own granddaughter. Let's call it, "Shelly does Gramps."

 

[SimonDoom]

Such disclaimers are meaningless anyway. The funniest example of a disclaimer (no hard feelings!) I ever saw, contained:



and the two first sentences of the that story were:

That's hilarious.

I tend to agree with you about this. I'm not sure disclaimers serve any real purpose, despite authors' concerns. There are subtler and equally effective ways of conveying that characters are over 18 and that the story meets Lit's standards. I write plenty of stories with characters in the 18-20 or so age range and I've NEVER had a story rejected on this ground. I've also NEVER had a complaint from a reader that would have been cleared up with a disclaimer.

I also think there's something a bit silly and disingenuous about these disclaimers, in cases where the story is about high school students who clearly act like high school students (and there are plenty of those at Literotica). I have no objection to such stories, but I think the way to deal with the issue is to (subtly, if possible) indicate that any character involved in sexual activity is over 18 in the body of the story. It's not difficult to do, and from my experience it always does the trick. But to each his own.

 

[SimonDoom]

My proposal for a standard age disclaimer:

Danger/warning: This story features young(ish) people who engage in, witness, recall, fantasize about, or are in the physical vicinity of sexual activity. If such stories bother/trigger/upset you or tend to prompt you to report the story to the Site Owner, then please do not read this story.

All characters in this story who engage in, witness, recall, fantasize about, or are within a quarter-mile radius of sexual activity are 18 or over. To the extent that their age is not explicitly stated, then as a condition of reading this story you must assume the character's 18th birthday occurred not less than 24 hours before the activity.

To the extent the character's behavior, circumstances, or level of schooling seem inconsistent, in your opinion, which you admit is subjective and non-authoritative and irrelevant to the story's meaning, with being 18 or over, as a condition of reading this story you are to assume the character has a learning or behavioral disability that caused them to be held back at least one year, or however many years are necessary to ensure that the character is, to your satisfaction, 18 or over.

To the extent any characters in this story are under the age of 18, you are to assume that none of these characters has engaged in, witnessed, recalled, fantasized about or been within a quarter-mile radius of sexual activity of any kind. For these purposes, "sexual activity" is to be interpreted in the broadest possible sense, including but not limited to any activity you personally, or the Site owners, regard as "sexual."

If you proceed further and read the story, it will be assumed that you have read and agreed to all of the foregoing. Proceed at your risk.

Enjoy.

 

[alohadave]

That's hilarious.

I tend to agree with you about this. I'm not sure disclaimers serve any real purpose, despite authors' concerns. There are subtler and equally effective ways of conveying that characters are over 18 and that the story meets Lit's standards. I write plenty of stories with characters in the 18-20 or so age range and I've NEVER had a story rejected on this ground. I've also NEVER had a complaint from a reader that would have been cleared up with a disclaimer.

I also think there's something a bit silly and disingenuous about these disclaimers, in cases where the story is about high school students who clearly act like high school students (and there are plenty of those at Literotica). I have no objection to such stories, but I think the way to deal with the issue is to (subtly, if possible) indicate that any character involved in sexual activity is over 18 in the body of the story. It's not difficult to do, and from my experience it always does the trick. But to each his own.

When I first started reading here, I kept seeing the disclaimers. It was a little bit odd to me, coming from SOL.

I thought it had to do with UK laws, since many stories here are set in the UK and written in UK English. Lit has more obviously UK set stories than any other site I've been on.

It wasn't until I dig deeper that I saw that it was a site rule.

More than that though, it's kind of a cultural thing here. People add it because it's expected and because it's such a hard line rule, people want to be sure that they are covered.

In the end, it doesn't hurt anything to add it and it covers authors in marginal cases. I find it more amusing than anything else imagining all the 18 year-old high schoolers.

 

[ElectricBlue]

More than that though, it's kind of a cultural thing here. People add it because it's expected and because it's such a hard line rule, people want to be sure that they are covered.

In the end, it doesn't hurt anything to add it and it covers authors in marginal cases. I find it more amusing than anything else imagining all the 18 year-old high schoolers.

But there's no "cover" at all. Authors can say what they like In a disclaimer, but if the content reads as underage, the story won't pass. The age disclaimer is a pointless waste of time. Laurel didn't come down in the last shower, and her word bots won't be fooled.

 

[alohadave]

The age disclaimer is a pointless waste of time.

So don't put it in your stories. Let others do what they want. Problem solved.

 

[Bramblethorn]

It has nothing to do with this. "Child porn" concerns visual images, not written erotica. Generally speaking, there's nothing illegal about writing about people under 18 having sex. There are plenty of erotic story sites that feature such content. There are SOME jurisdictions in the US in which SOME content, especially if it involves particularly egregious violent pedophilia, may be found to be obscene, and therefore illegal, but that's the exception, not the norm (in the USA, anyway).

The catch though is that where websites are concerned, the prosecution can effectively pick whichever jurisdiction is most censorious.

The two cases I'm aware of (Frank McCoy, and Thomas Arthur aka MrDouble) were both convictions under federal law, specifically 18 USC 1462, which AFAIK applies anywhere in the USA. There are state considerations there: that law depends on "obscenity" and part of the definition of "obscenity" is that the content is prohibited under relevant state law, with another part being violation of "relevant community standards". But the crime is considered to happen in all states involved in the "transportation" of the story, so they can just get somebody to download the stories from whichever jurisdiction is most favourable to conviction.

That's what happened to McCoy. He was resident in Minnesota, and the servers for his sites were in Texas and California, but an FBI agent in Georgia accessed them and McCoy was then tried in Georgia. Text at https://casetext.com/case/us-v-mccoy-75 notes that such offenses can be prosecuted where the materials were received, and rejects an argument that McCoy should be subject to community standards in Minnesota rather than in Georgia.

AFAICT the scarcity of such prosecutions is less to do with jurisdiction and more to do with how the First Amendment has been interpreted to restrict "obscenity". SCOTUS of late has been more than usually flexible on precedents, so it might not be a safe time to assume that the line on obscenity will continue to be drawn where it has been drawn.

As you say, there's no law setting an age-18 rule for text stories. But if one had to defend Literotica against obscenity charges, it might be useful to point to the age limit for video as evidence that stories about people aged 18+ don't violate "community standards". (At least for stories about acts that would be allowed in video.)

 

[ElectricBlue]

So don't put it in your stories. Let others do what they want. Problem solved.

I don't, but by the same token, don't suggest to new authors that it makes a difference, because it doesn't. That's the point being made here.

The test is the words in the body of a story, not a few words at the top.