A. Lincoln.

[Colleen Thomas]

I didn't mean to seem facetious, just curious is all.

Didn't assume you were

It's kinda of an odd perspective when your family fought on the opposite side of the "hero" I am sure

 

[cloudy]

It's kinda of an odd perspective when your family fought on the opposite side of the "hero" I am sure

yes.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Didn't assume you were

It's kinda of an odd perspective when your family fought on the opposite side of the "hero" I am sure

Is it because of the slavery issue or is it more...I'm dense on this part of it being a born and bred Yank.

 

[Rumple Foreskin]

Oh darn, I would have liked that too.

The PBS station here is Dallas will be doing a rebroadcast. The one in your area may be planning the same thing. Every woman who thinks she has/had the mother and/or mother-in-law from hell should watch.

Rumple Foreskin

 

[ABSTRUSE]

The PBS station here is Dallas will be doing a rebroadcast. The one in your area may be planning the same thing. Every woman who thinks she has/had the mother and/or mother-in-law from hell should watch.

Rumple Foreskin

I'll have to check for that, thank you.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Is it because of the slavery issue or is it more...I'm dense on this part of it being a born and bred Yank.

Hmmm.

I think it has less to do with slavery than it does with a perception of guilt in starting the war. Basically, the question of slavery had, up until then, been answered in the congress through a series of compromise measures. Obviously, eventually, the question would have to be decided difinitevely, but Lincoln was seen as an abolishionist. His election pretty much solidified the idea that there would be no more compromises. The south would either surrender or fight.

You have to realize, the prevailing political sentiment in the south was that the states had entered the United states voluntarily and could leave it, if they so chose. Abe, therefore, is seen as something of a power mad egomaniac, using military force to compell states who were nominally free to do as they would stay in the union.

Within the context of that viewpoint, you can see where in the states of the confederacy, he isn't given a very sympathetic treatment.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Hmmm.

I think it has less to do with slavery than it does with a perception of guilt in starting the war. Basically, the question of slavery had, up until then, been answered in the congress through a series of compromise measures. Obviously, eventually, the question would have to be decided difinitevely, but Lincoln was seen as an abolishionist. His election pretty much solidified the idea that there would be no more compromises. The south would either surrender or fight.

You have to realize, the prevailing political sentiment in the south was that the states had entered the United states voluntarily and could leave it, if they so chose. Abe, therefore, is seen as something of a power mad egomaniac, using military force to compell states who were nominally free to do as they would stay in the union.

Within the context of that viewpoint, you can see where in the states of the confederacy, he isn't given a very sympathetic treatment.

Thanks Colly, I needed to see that perspective on things. I love history but I'm limited in my knowledge of the political side of things...to be honest it confuses me.

 

[Rumple Foreskin]

Cloudy,

You may have heard of Stand Waite, a Cherokee Indian who walked the Trail of Tears and later became a Confederate Brig. General. Now there's a fellow who couldn't win for losing.

Rumple Foreskin

 

[cloudy]

Cloudy,

You may have heard of Stand Waite, a Cherokee Indian who walked the Trail of Tears and later became a Confederate Brig. General. Now there's a fellow who couldn't win for losing.

Rumple Foreskin

Some, yes. I know more about the before than I do the after, unfortunately. It's very hard to find accurate stories, unless you get them from the source, you know?

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Thanks Colly, I needed to see that perspective on things. I love history but I'm limited in my knowledge of the political side of things...to be honest it confuses me.

One of the more difficult things in history is trying to be objective. We have so many innate and deeply held beliefs.

The civil War is really hard to understand, both politically and culturally. A large number of the questions it answered are so much a part of what we understand our governmental form to be that we loose sight of the fact these things were not always clear and well defined.

 

[R. Richard]

Let's just look at one aspect of Mr. Lincoln. He allowed himself to be called "Honest Abe Lincoln of Illinois." The dude was born in Kentucky!

 

[ABSTRUSE]

One of the more difficult things in history is trying to be objective. We have so many innate and deeply held beliefs.

The civil War is really hard to understand, both politically and culturally. A large number of the questions it answered are so much a part of what we understand our governmental form to be that we loose sight of the fact these things were not always clear and well defined.

It was an incredible loss of life, that's for sure.

 

[Rumple Foreskin]

Let's just look at one aspect of Mr. Lincoln. He allowed himself to be called "Honest Abe Lincoln of Illinois." The dude was born in Kentucky!

Well, yeah. But face it, "Honest Abe Lincoln of Illinois by way of Kentucky" wouldn't have much marketing appeal.

Rumple Foreskin

 

[Rumple Foreskin]

It was an incredible loss of life, that's for sure.

Echoing what Colly said; in the Ken Burns' Civil War series on PBS, Shelby Foote noted that prior to the CW, Americans referred to their country as, "These United States of America." After the war, the usage became, "The United States of America."

Rumple Foreskin

 

[Colleen Thomas]

It was an incredible loss of life, that's for sure.

It split families. Brother against brother, father against son. It's very difficult to detach yourself from the emotions and view things objectively.

Learning about the civil war challenges you, because many opposing POV's will make you challenge your a priori assumptions about a lot of things.

Almost 150 years after the fact, it still inspires fierce debate.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

It split families. Brother against brother, father against son. It's very difficult to detach yourself from the emotions and view things objectively.

Learning about the civil war challenges you, because many opposing POV's will make you challenge your a priori assumptions about a lot of things.

Almost 150 years after the fact, it still inspires fierce debate.

It fascinating to think we had gone through a revolutionary war only to have a civil war in less than 100yrs later. Now there are more facts available to us then when we were in school and learning all the cookie cutter facts.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

It fascinating to think we had gone through a revolutionary war only to have a civil war in less than 100yrs later. Now there are more facts available to us then when we were in school and learning all the cookie cutter facts.

Civil wars are the norm in human affairs. the real difference with the American Civil war is that it was really the first large scale conflict post industrial revolution. the carnage was on a scale unprecedented at the time. So many innovations were first seeen during it, from rifled weapons, to repeating rifles, to modern artillery, scoped rifples, iron clad stream driven men of war. It rewrote the books on tactics and was observed by most of the european powers.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Civil wars are the norm in human affairs. the real difference with the American Civil war is that it was really the first large scale conflict post industrial revolution. the carnage was on a scale unprecedented at the time. So many innovations were first seeen during it, from rifled weapons, to repeating rifles, to modern artillery, scoped rifples, iron clad stream driven men of war. It rewrote the books on tactics and was observed by most of the european powers.

I've read accounts on what the musket balls did when they hit you, those poor guys died terrible deaths.
I want to go to Gettysburg now in the worst way...will you take me?

 

[BlackSnake]

Would anyone stand against human slavery today, or would you be resigned that its not your problem?

 

[Colleen Thomas]

I've read accounts on what the musket balls did when they hit you, those poor guys died terrible deaths.
I want to go to Gettysburg now in the worst way...will you take me?

I've been to Gettysburg. Been to most of the major civil war battlefields. I'm not a big believer in Ghosts, but I do thing they are haunted places. At Shiloh, sitting alone near the sunken road, I could hear things and see things I knew weren't there.

I'd love to take you to Gettysburg. I think anyone would feel the solemnity of the places, but I think too, having someone knowledgeable about what took place makes the trip even more enjoyable.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Would anyone stand against human slavery today, or would you be resigned that its not your problem?

I think people would and should, there is still human slavery throughout the world. No one has the right to own another human being.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

I've been to Gettysburg. Been to most of the major civil war battlefields. I'm not a big believer in Ghosts, but I do thing they are haunted places. At Shiloh, sitting alone near the sunken road, I could hear things and see things I knew weren't there.

I'd love to take you to Gettysburg. I think anyone would feel the solemnity of the places, but I think too, having someone knowledgeable about what took place makes the trip even more enjoyable.

That is why I would want you to go to fill in the blanks. I believe it's haunted as well, that land was consecrated in blood there has to be some kind of vibration there.

 

[BlackSnake]

I think people would and should, there is still human slavery throughout the world. No one has the right to own another human being.

Would anyone take the time out of their busy schedule to do anything, or even send an email protesting?

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Would anyone take the time out of their busy schedule to do anything, or even send an email protesting?

I would like to think they would, don't you?

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Would anyone stand against human slavery today, or would you be resigned that its not your problem?

Where it still exists, people stand against it snake. But, like many ills, it tends to rare it's head again and again. In the former soviet union trafficing in women is a big money maker for the russian mob. In many african states, it exists.

Erradicating it is like wiping out cock roaches in your home. Even when they are gone, you must remain vigilent, least they return.

I do not believe anyone raised in the west could look the other way if slavery were being practiced in their homeland, but we know it is being practiced elsewhere and we do tend to say not my problem. I'm really not certain your question has an answer.