Did That Debate Change Your Vote.

[RandyRebecca]

Becky likes liars

I'm not voting for Trump. As I said, Trump lies, takes bits of truth, and rages in a way that connects with people's anger against elites. His supporters mostly know this already.

What did Trump say about foreign policy and inflation in America and which parts of it were correct?

The bits about Ukraine and Gaza, how America is embroiled in those wars. Biden got us into those wars, and it was a deliberate foreign policy strategy by his administration. I've said that all along. Trump's approach was a different one, i.e. to question the point of NATO today, to do deals with Putin and Kim, to isolate Iran. Biden's foreign policy has driven Russia and China into each other's arms, and NATO's warmongering against Russia is going to mean Russia arming the likes of Iran, North Korea etc.

 

[RandyRebecca]

and what was his answer about climate change worries? zilch

Capitalism gives people two choices on climate change.

The Republican approach = Pretend that climate change doesn't exist, and act like the world isn't sinking and burning.

The Democratic approach = Support "green policies" that mean the working class paying the cost of those policies, while the rich continue to get richer.

I don't want either of those, thanks.

 

[ll74]

I'm not voting for Trump. As I said, Trump lies, takes bits of truth, and rages in a way that connects with people's anger against elites. His supporters mostly know this already.

Of course

 

[jomar]

I was watching to see how President Biden rallied from that stumble:

That rally in Raleigh was cause for optimism.



I was honestly surprised President Biden was in such strong form (and voice) less than one day after he sounded like he had a pretty nasty cold.

Was amusing-FOX was taking great pains to say that the real Biden showed up for the debate, and that he can do great with a planned speech and teleprompters. Was a dramatic difference though

 

[adrina]

I'm not voting for Trump. As I said, Trump lies, takes bits of truth, and rages in a way that connects with people's anger against elites. His supporters mostly know this already.


The bits about Ukraine and Gaza, how America is embroiled in those wars. Biden got us into those wars, and it was a deliberate foreign policy strategy by his administration. I've said that all along. Trump's approach was a different one, i.e. to question the point of NATO today, to do deals with Putin and Kim, to isolate Iran. Biden's foreign policy has driven Russia and China into each other's arms, and NATO's warmongering against Russia is going to mean Russia arming the likes of Iran, North Korea etc.

How did Biden get us into those wars? What was the deliberate foreign policy strategy? What mechanism did they use to achieve it?

Trump cowtowed to Putin.

 

[YDB95]

Which is why?

Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. Lovecraft is the very epitome of the "right wingers who think they're independent thinkers" trope, and there's no chance he would ever vote Democratic (he would, of course, say "vote Democrat") anyway. So for him to vote third party amounts to a vote for Biden.

Did it change my vote? Of course not. Biden was obviously not on the stick last night, but at least he answered the questions with facts and with examples of what he has done and what he wants to do next. Trump not only lied in almost every response (I'm really not sure I should have that "almost" in there, to tell you the truth), but he rarely even addressed the question at hand. You can bet his base loved it, but to everyone else it was a stark reminder of why we got rid of him in 2020. The best I can say about Trump's performance is that it was a remarkably succinct summary of all the current right-wing talking points out there; I'm pretty sure I've read every one of them repeatedly right here. It just goes to show, the man and his supporters alike are all singing from the same songbook.

I'd be lying to say I wasn't depressed by Biden's inept performance. But the early feedback I'm hearing from voters - not from pundits, but actual voters - is that the impact was minimal. In CNN's flash poll after the debate, 80% of respondents said it made no difference, 5% said it made them switch from Biden to Trump...and 5% said they switched the other way. His comments about illegals stealing Black jobs hurt him among Blacks and Latinos alike, too, with the subtle (by Trump standards) racism implicit in his assumption that Black Americans would have those low-level jobs the illegals would steal.

 

[RandyRebecca]

Of course

So why do the likes of CNN keep acting as if people can't see that Trump lies? They are obsessed with "fact checking". Was that even a thing before Donald Trump?

 

[lovecraft68]

Which is why?

Two old, out of their mind, corrupt, filthy rich liars, and to top it off, round two of this.

Sorry, if I'm not playing the "If you vote indy you're helping the other side" crap both sides sling.

People here love to pretend they care about democracy, then try to tell you who you better vote for.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

Genocide denial now, like Mr. Biden? How sick can the Democrats get?

The far left has always had a problem with antisemitism. That's one the the reasons American voters reject them.

 

[ll74]

So why do the likes of CNN keep acting as if people can't see that Trump lies? They are obsessed with "fact checking". Was that even a thing before Donald Trump?

What you're voting for is not the same thing I'm voting for.

That continues to be why I vote for Biden.

 

[RandyRebecca]

How did Biden get us into those wars?

He was vice president under Obama at the time of Euromaidan coup in Ukraine, and I believe Hunter Biden has/had business interests there. A little over a year after Joe Biden became US president, Russia and Ukraine are at war, with the US regularly sending billions and billions of $$$$$ of arms to Ukraine. The strategy of NATO going closer and closer to Russia's borders has been a particularly Democratic strategy going back to the Bill Clinton years, and in the period before the Russian invasion of Ukraine involved the bombing of the Donbass and the deaths of over 13,000 people there, not to mention military war games by NATO right near Russia's borders.

And under Biden and Blinken, in the shadow of the Ukraine war, NATO has expanded further, into Sweden and Finland, again close to Russia's borders.

Trump cowtowed to Putin.

Did he? Then what does Biden do with Netanyahu? Zionist lobbyists like AIPAC are running Capitol Hill, and don't give a damn about the American people.

 

[RandyRebecca]

The far left has always had a problem with antisemitism. That's one the the reasons American voters reject them.

The Communist Red Army liberated Auschwitz concentration camp from the Nazis. Those Communists were Allies of the US in WW2. Remember that.

The Red Army also dealt with the predecessors of the people who run Ukraine today.

 

[adrina]

He was vice president under Obama at the time of Euromaidan coup in Ukraine, and I believe Hunter Biden has/had business interests there. A little over a year after Joe Biden became US president, Russia and Ukraine are at war, with the US regularly sending billions and billions of $$$$$ of arms to Ukraine. The strategy of NATO going closer and closer to Russia's borders has been a particularly Democratic strategy going back to the Bill Clinton years, and in the period before the Russian invasion of Ukraine involved the bombing of the Donbass and the deaths of over 13,000 people there, not to mention military war games by NATO right near Russia's borders.

And under Biden and Blinken, in the shadow of the Ukraine war, NATO has expanded further, into Sweden and Finland, again close to Russia's borders.


Did he? Then what does Biden do with Netanyahu? Zionist lobbyists like AIPAC are running Capitol Hill, and don't give a damn about the American people.

Biden is not responsible for the entirety of diplomatic history with Russia for the past 50 years.

Nor is any of that related to Gaza.

Sweden and Finland wanted to join Nato. Should they not have been allowed?

Israel and Gaza is a longterm ongoing conflict. If you don't like Biden, don't bitch - Trump would be worse. I know I know you're not voting for him.

 

[RandyRebecca]

Biden is not responsible for the entirety of diplomatic history with Russia for the past 50 years.

It's obvious that the warmongering of the Biden administration in Europe towards Russia was largely driven by Trump's famous speech to European leaders when Trump was president. Trump asked those European leaders, particularly Germany's, why they were trading so much gas with Russia when Russia were supposed to be NATO's rivals? Those European liberal leaders were almost laughing at Trump (they aren't laughing now!). Trump said that he didn't see why America should be paying so much money towards NATO when other NATO members are trading so much gas with Russia.

It's obvious that this spooked the hell out of the Clintons, Bidens and Obamas of this world. They became determined to make the Europeans, and the Germans in particular, know for sure what NATO was all about, and who really runs the show in Europe. So, the Americans say to the Europeans "Trade for Russian gas is out, and you will help us fight against Russia in Ukraine. Oh yeah, and no more Nordstream pipeline, which we will put an end to, and you will now buy US liquified gas instead of Russian gas."

This has been a clear and deliberate Biden administration policy.

Nor is any of that related to Gaza.

Biden would have loved the October 6, 2023 status quo to have remained, for sure, with a continuation of the "normalization" deals with Israel that sell out the Palestinian people. The October 7 attacks meant that the ruling Arab regimes across the Middle East and North Africa are terrified of being seen as selling out the Palestinians, or they face another 2011 style "Arab Spring" uprising. Israel's actions since have shown the world how genocidal they are.

However, Biden has chosen to be 100% behind Israel. He didn't condemn the October 7 attacks while urging Israel not to indiscriminately target Palestinians in Gaza, but stood fully behind Israel. Netanyahu calls the shots here, in my opinion, along with the AIPAC lobbyists who do Netanyahu's job in the US. Another foreign policy disaster by the Biden administration, not to mention his support for a genocide.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

The Communist Red Army liberated Auschwitz concentration camp from the Nazis. Those Communists were Allies of the US in WW2. Remember that.

The Red Army also dealt with the predecessors of the people who run Ukraine today.

Israel has a large community of Russian Jews who fled persecution in the Soviet Union. Calling Israel's actions in Gaza "genocide" while exonerating Russia from the atrocities it's committing in Ukraine is blatant antisemitism.

 

[adrina]

It's obvious that the warmongering of the Biden administration in Europe towards Russia was largely driven by Trump's famous speech to European leaders when Trump was president. Trump asked those European leaders, particularly Germany's, why they were trading so much gas with Russia when Russia were supposed to be NATO's rivals? Those European liberal leaders were almost laughing at Trump (they aren't laughing now!). Trump said that he didn't see why America should be paying so much money towards NATO when other NATO members are trading so much gas with Russia.

It's obvious that this spooked the hell out of the Clintons, Bidens and Obamas of this world. They became determined to make the Europeans, and the Germans in particular, know for sure what NATO was all about, and who really runs the show in Europe. So, the Americans say to the Europeans "Trade for Russian gas is out, and you will help us fight against Russia in Ukraine. Oh yeah, and no more Nordstream pipeline, which we will put an end to, and you will now buy US liquified gas instead of Russian gas."

This has been a clear and deliberate Biden administration policy.


Biden would have loved the October 6, 2023 status quo to have remained, for sure, with a continuation of the "normalization" deals with Israel that sell out the Palestinian people. The October 7 attacks meant that the ruling Arab regimes across the Middle East and North Africa are terrified of being seen as selling out the Palestinians, or they face another 2011 style "Arab Spring" uprising. Israel's actions since have shown the world how genocidal they are.

However, Biden has chosen to be 100% behind Israel. He didn't condemn the October 7 attacks while urging Israel not to indiscriminate target Palestinians in Gaza, but stood fully behind Israel. Netanyahu calls the shots here, in my opinion, along with the AIPAC lobbyists who do Netanyahu's job in the US. Another foreign policy disaster by the Biden administration, not to mention his support for a genocide.

No those are not obvious.

Actually Biden urged Netanyahu to be cautious and not make the same mistake we did.

Your perceptions and recollections of events are inaccurate.

 

[RandyRebecca]

Israel has a large community of Russian Jews who fled persecution in the Soviet Union. Calling Israel's actions in Gaza "genocide" while exonerating Russia from the atrocities it's committing in Ukraine is blatant antisemitism.

Israel is a sick society and has killed far more civilians in Gaza since October 7 2023 than Russia has in Ukraine since February 2022.

But that's just it, Israel considers all Palestinians in Gaza to be soldiers, even babies. As I said, sick! I've seen the mutilated bodies of dead babies online from Gaza.

 

[ll74]

Israel is a sick society and has killed far more civilians in Gaza since October 7 2023 than Russia has in Ukraine since February 2022.

But that's just it, Israel considers all Palestinians in Gaza to be soldiers, even babies. As I said, sick! I've seen the mutilated bodies of dead babies online from Gaza.

Lol

 

[RandyRebecca]

No those are not obvious.

Of course it's obvious. Trump's foreign policy strategy was different from Biden's. Trump's foreign policy across the ocean was less US funding to NATO, attempt deals with Putin and Kim, keep China apart from Russia (a US strategy since Nixon's time), isolate Iran. Biden's foreign policy across the ocean was make the Europeans know what NATO is all about, i.e. that "America is back, in Europe", end Russian gas deals with Europe and drive a wedge between Russia and Europe. Biden's strategy has driven Russia and China close together, and they will now support Iran and North Korea. Good job. Biden actually thought you could isolate one sixth of the world's land (i.e. Russia), which also has a land border with China.

Actually Biden urged Netanyahu to be cautious and not make the same mistake we did.

Purely because Biden has an election, and a lot of the Democratic base hate Biden's policy towards Israel/Gaza. Another Biden blunder, as Netanyahu needs the war to continue for his own political survival and to keep himself out of prison. This basically means that the electoral interests of Biden and Netanyahu are clashing.

Your perceptions and recollections of events are inaccurate.

Not at all.

 

[adrina]

Of course it's obvious. Trump's foreign policy strategy was different from Biden's. Trump's foreign policy across the ocean was less US funding to NATO, attempt deals with Putin and Kim, keep China apart from Russia (a US strategy since Nixon's time), isolate Iran. Biden's foreign policy across the ocean was make the Europeans know what NATO is all about, i.e. that America is back, in Europe, end Russia gas deals with Europe and drive a wedge between Russia and Europe. Biden's strategy has driven Russia and China close together, and they will now support Iran and North Korea. Good job. Biden actually thought you could isolate one sixth of the world's land (i.e. Russia), which also has a land border with China.


Purely because Biden has an election. Another Biden blunder, as Netanyahu needs the war to continue for his own political survival and to keep himself out of prison. This basically means that the electoral interests of Biden and Netanyahu are clashing.


Not at all.

No, it's really not. Trump's strategy was to preserve his access to funding with Russia's banks. He wasn't acting with the welfare of America in mind, it was for his own. That you are even trying to rationalize that as good policy is not sane.

First Biden didn't say anything but then he did. The pattern I am seeing is that you just want to criticize Biden.

Yes.

 

[Lazaran]

Those Communists were Allies of the US in WW2. Remember that.

They WERE “enemies of our enemy” THEN. “Remember that”.

They ARE enemies of the free world NOW. “Remember that”.



"Becky"

 

[Lazaran]

No, it's really not. Trump's strategy was to preserve his access to funding with Russia's banks. He wasn't acting with the welfare of America in mind, it was for his own. That you are even trying to rationalize that as good policy is not sane.

First Biden didn't say anything but then he did. The pattern I am seeing is that you just want to criticize Biden.

Yes.

The corrupt orange traitor was trying to cut off Germany from Russian gas to bolster the support from (get money from) domestic / western fossil fuel companies, and to bolster that orange POS’s presidency and re-election chances. (Russian money to the corrupt orange traitor had been sidelined at that point due to investigations.)

The corrupt orange traitor was simultaneously giving winks and nods to Putin that there would still be opportunities to collaborate if that orange POS had been re-elected. (The corrupt orange traitor is still doing it.)



Also:

"Becky" completely misses how the corrupt orange traitor drove China into Russia’s arms by imposing all those tariffs and constantly insulting China / blaming China over the "Wuhan Flu" / "Kung Flu".



"Becky" is completely detached from reality and reason.

"Becky" is basically a logic and sanity sink at this point.

See also: AndersonsBiographer (who very well may be a "Becky" alt.)



JFC

SAD!!!

 

[RandyRebecca]

The corrupt orange traitor was trying to cut off Germany from Russian gas to bolster the support from (get money from) domestic / western fossil fuel companies, and to bolster that orange POS’s presidency and re-election chances. (Russian money to the corrupt orange traitor had been sidelined at that point due to investigations.)

Trump questioning US funding to NATO, to the faces of European politicians, spooked the likes of Clinton, Obama and Biden.

The corrupt orange traitor was simultaneously giving winks and nods to Putin that there would still be opportunities to collaborate if that orange POS had been re-elected. (The corrupt orange traitor is still doing it.)

While Biden keeps sending billions and billions of federal taxes to the Ukraine black hole!

"Becky" completely misses how the corrupt orange traitor drove China into Russia’s arms by imposing all those tariffs and constantly insulting China / blaming China over the "Wuhan Flu / Kung Flu.

The war in Ukraine drove Russia and China together, along with the sanctions on Russia.

"Becky" is completely detached from reality and reason.

LOL. The irony of an establishment Democrat saying this. They don't have a clue about the lives of ordinary Americans and are the craziest warmongers on the planet. How many more billions of dollars of American arms do you want the Democrats to send to Zelensky and the Ukrainian black hole? This is an insane strategy, and completely detached from reality and reason. The truth is, NATO is burying its head in the sand, as Ukraine have lost territory to Russia that they are not getting back. The logical thing to do is to reach a deal with the Russians, but NATO prefer to waste more human lives and more resources on a black hole.

 

[butters]

"I know I'm not a young man − to state the obvious," Biden said near the end of a campaign rally in Raleigh, North Carolina. "Folks, I don't walk as easy as I used to. I don't speak as smoothly as I used to. I don't debate as well as I used to. But I know what I do know: I know how to tell the truth.

"I know right from wrong. I know how to do this job. I know how to get things done. And I know, like millions of Americans know, when you get knocked down, you get back," Biden said, prompting loud applause from supporters.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/poli...1&cvid=914faf4a195a4007b35b17485010f9bf&ei=56

 

[Pad_Foot]

The Communist Red Army liberated Auschwitz concentration camp from the Nazis. Those Communists were Allies of the US in WW2. Remember that.

The Red Army also dealt with the predecessors of the people who run Ukraine today.

??
And killed off how many in the Polish army
wtf?
The Russians sat back and watched the Nazis massacre Jews
The Russians invented Pograms