Thoughts on Mary Sue characters.

[SimonDoom]

Sam Worthington's character Jake from Avatar.

His character also represents another problematic theme, which is that of the white savior who for unknown reasons is able to master what the indigenous folks do and do it as well as or better than they do.

Tarzan is an example.

Tom Cruise's character in The Last Samurai is an example.

The reality is that there are no shortcuts, and the people who achieve the highest levels at things are almost always those who've committed a long time to doing those things over and over. But it's hard to capture that in the space of a two (or even three) hour movie.

 

[onehitwanda]

and please don’t go on about Leia being retconned as a force wielder

Is she being retconned, though?

Leia is definitely force-sensitive, as is shown in Empire Strikes Back:

 

[Kelliezgirl]

His character also represents another problematic theme, which is that of the white savior who for unknown reasons is able to master what the indigenous folks do and do it as well as or better than they do.

Tarzan is an example.

Tom Cruise's character in The Last Samurai is an example.

The reality is that there are no shortcuts, and the people who achieve the highest levels at things are almost always those who've committed a long time to doing those things over and over. But it's hard to capture that in the space of a two (or even three) hour movie.

I'd argue Tarzan spent his whole life in the jungle, so he put in the work.

For the rest, if Hollywood has taught me anything, a good training montage will solve any plot hole.

 

[SimonDoom]

I'd argue Tarzan spent his whole life in the jungle, so he put in the work.

For the rest, if Hollywood has taught me anything, a good training montage will solve any plot hole.

Best montage scene: Team America: World Police.

 

[onehitwanda]

Tom Cruise's character in The Last Samurai is an example.

I think that Nathan Algren gets a pass - he's a soldier by trade, experienced with the use of the cavalry sabre, a seasoned campaigner etc. It is conceivable he might be able to best Ujio in sparring - at least occasionally. And it's often said that the best way to learn a culture is to be immersed in it as he is.

He is also not Samurai - the last Samurai is Katsumoto, who dies in glory on the field of battle - the ultimate aim of any Samurai.

(don't you go hating on movies that make me cry, @SimonDoom )

 

[Kelliezgirl]

I think that Nathan Algren gets a pass - he's a soldier by trade, experienced with the use of the cavalry sabre, a seasoned campaigner etc. It is conceivable he might be able to best Ujio in sparring - at least occasionally. And it's often said that the best way to learn a culture is to be immersed in it as he is.

He is also not Samurai - the last Samurai is Katsumoto, who dies in glory on the field of battle - the ultimate aim of any Samurai.

(don't you go hating on movies that make me cry, @SimonDoom )

Fair point, he wasn't stating from zero.

Someone with a lot more knowledge on the topic could probably opine about the relative pros and cons of the two fighting styles matched against each other.

 

[EmilyMiller]

Is she being retconned, though?

Leia is definitely force-sensitive, as is shown in Empire Strikes Back:

Force sensitive <> Force wielder

I found the Luke and Leia Jedi training montage (was that in The Mandalorian, I’m embarrassed to ask?) pretty annoying.

Em

 

[SimonDoom]

Force sensitive <> Force wielder

I found the Luke and Leia Jedi training montage (was that in The Mandalorian, I’m embarrassed to ask?) pretty annoying.

Em

I don't remember that at all, but I haven't seen The Mandalorian.

I had no problem with Leia being force sensitive, but I balked at her flying through space. There have to be SOME limits.

 

[EmilyMiller]

I don't remember that at all, but I haven't seen The Mandalorian.

I had no problem with Leia being force sensitive, but I balked at her flying through space. There have to be SOME limits.

The phrase is “batshit crazy.”

I liked the Jedi having relatively limited powers. Not big into superheros.

Em

 

[ShelbyDawn57]

I don't remember that at all, but I haven't seen The Mandalorian.

I had no problem with Leia being force sensitive, but I balked at her flying through space. There have to be SOME limits.

Force pull in an environment with zero resistance. Plausible. I’m more concerned with her ability to hold her breath and not freezing her tattas off.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I had no problem with Leia being force sensitive, but I balked at her flying through space. There have to be SOME limits.

That didn't work for me either. At the time I saw it, it felt so off that I wondered if maybe they'd done some rewriting after Carrie Fisher's death. I could understand it if they'd intended to kill off Leia in that scene but then felt they couldn't go through with it when people were still grieving her actor.

But from all I can find, that wasn't what happened, and Leia's scenes weren't changed after Carrie's death. So just everyday glitchy writing I guess.

 

[onehitwanda]

I balked at her flying through space. There have to be SOME limits.

"I'm Mary Poppins, y'all!"

 

[Kelliezgirl]

Force pull in an environment with zero resistance. Plausible. I’m more concerned with her ability to hold her breath and not freezing her tattas off.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/survival-in-space-unprotected-possible/

She could have survived, but no one wanted to see this:

Gas expelled from their bowels and stomachs caused simultaneous defecation, projectile vomiting and urination.

 

[onehitwanda]

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/survival-in-space-unprotected-possible/

She could have survived, but no one wanted to see this:

Gas expelled from their bowels and stomachs caused simultaneous defecation, projectile vomiting and urination.

So she'd be spinning is what we're saying. A Catherine wheel of misfortune.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

So she'd be spinning is what we're saying. A Catherine wheel of misfortune.

Hadn't thought about that...aspect. it just gets worse and worse, doesn't it?

 

[AlinaX]

Force pull in an environment with zero resistance. Plausible. I’m more concerned with her ability to hold her breath and not freezing her tattas off.

You can’t hold your breath in Space and it's best not to try.

The idea that you would freeze instantly in Space is wrong, though, and irritates me in so many films.

 

[Zootonius]

"I'm Mary Poppins, y'all!"

Mary Poppins, the dark side:
https://celebjihad.com/celeb-jihad/images/julie_andrews_nude_sob.jpg

(My little contribution to derail this thread)

 

[onehitwanda]

Mary Poppins, the dark side:
https://celebjihad.com/celeb-jihad/images/julie_andrews_nude_sob.jpg

(My little contribution to derail this thread)

It looks like Meryll Streep and Diana Spencer had a secret love child.

nice noombies, though. I'd take her home...

 

[Zootonius]

It looks like Meryll Streep and Diana Spencer had a secret love child.

nice noombies, though. I'd take her home...

Some hair styles are so dated,
And not bad boobies for a 46 year old.

 

[EmilyMiller]

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/survival-in-space-unprotected-possible/

She could have survived, but no one wanted to see this:

Gas expelled from their bowels and stomachs caused simultaneous defecation, projectile vomiting and urination.

I guarantee that someone on Lit would want to see that!

Em

 

[Kelliezgirl]

I guarantee that someone on Lit would want to see that!

Em

Someone on Lit is probably trying to work it into a story right now.
I regret ever mentioning it.

 

[ShelbyDawn57]

I guarantee that someone on Lit would want to see that!

Em

It wasn’t defecation and vomit, but I recently read of a girl in space experiencing projectile expulsion of the contents of her stomach and intestines. Seem
To remember an octopus, too, but I could have imagined it.

 

[EmilyMiller]

It wasn’t defecation and vomit, but I recently read of a girl in space experiencing projectile expulsion of the contents of her stomach and intestines. Seem
To remember an octopus, too, but I could have imagined it.

Drugs are bad, M’kay?

And said viscera had been “magically” cleaned of all ickiness beforehand.

Em

 

[ShelbyDawn57]

Drugs are bad, M’kay?

Em

I thought those mushrooms tasted funny.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

I thought those mushrooms tasted funny.

That man in the white van assured me they were fine.