Gun violence, American style - 1 in 5

[icanhelp1]

THIS --->

It’s tough to stop suicide by cop. If individuals are willing to die committing murder,( mass school shootings ) we need to find a way to help these individuals before they reach that level of evil. Mental health, early treatment and putting flags in place restricting their ability to purchase weapons. That medical information needs to get to the appropriate institutions, the courts, police, background and gun dealers. Parents and friends are the first line of defense. IMHO

 

[icanhelp1]

Law enforcement of illegal guns for dummies (TrailerTrash aka BidudeWI)

1: Individuals comply with the law and stop possessing those illegal guns.

2: Individuals don’t comply with the law and risk the consequences of noncompliance / continued possession of those illegal guns.

That ^ is also how it works with certain drugs that are deemed too dangerous for the public to freely possess due to abuse or lethality.

Hope that helps.

TrailerTrash aka BidudeWI

And yet there’s a movement out there to legalize all drugs.

Enforce laws on the books.

 

[adrina]

Then go live some place where they don't allow gun ownership and tell us how you like it there...

It is only the US where this is a problem. Nowhere else.

I find it amazing that anytime someone points out a problem the conservatives first reaction is to tell them to leave the country. It is irrational.

 

[ll74]

Sounds rough.

Maybe you should do that and please, try to have a better day.

I already have. And it is rough...strange enough people that use guns purposely to assault others (and without insurance) are amazingly more prominent than those who use cars.

And - get this - mass shooters never use automobiles.

Cray cray!

 

[adrina]

Some states are actually making a more positive approach toward protecting children. They’re putting restrictions on children and the internet. Monitoring what children can access will help ( I hope ) provide a safety net and maybe snag dark hearts before things get out of hand. One little step forward to maybe saving the mental health of our children. The internet is just loaded with evil. Maybe forcing parents to play an active role in controlling what children are exposed to.

So it's okay for children to face gun violence and fear of being shot at school, but ban the drag queens and social media.

I'm no fan of irresponsible social media use, but it's not killing children at the rate of gun violence.

Make it make sense.

 

[ll74]

Move that goalpost, just keep moving that goalpost...

You made an absolute claim and it was refuted, easily.
Now you want the refutation defended based upon ever-shifting metrics and your redefinitions simply because you cannot admit to having made a slight error.

Keep on rebelling against that reply button, Sparky. You avoid it like BB avoids providing sources to his threads

 

[VinnyVeritas]

I already have. And it is rough...strange enough people that use guns purposely to assault others (and without insurance) are amazingly more prominent than those who use cars.

And - get this - mass shooters never use automobiles.

Cray cray!

And in our recent history, no one has ever used a car to drive through a crowd.

You make a really great point.

Sounds rough.

 

[adrina]

Move that goalpost, just keep moving that goalpost...

You made an absolute claim and it was refuted, easily.
Now you want the refutation defended based upon ever-shifting metrics and your redefinitions simply because you cannot admit to having made a slight error.

See post number 80. Dumbass.

In the meantime, nothing has changed. You still think guns are more important than American lives and the lives of American children.

 

[ll74]

And in our recent history, no one has ever used a car to drive through a crowd.

You make a really great point.

Sounds rough.

I'm sure it's a one to one comparison of cars and guns. And casualties are probably one to one as well. I'm sure risk analysis is identical too.

 

[IrezumiKiss]

Move that goalpost, just keep moving that goalpost...

Now you want the refutation defended based upon ever-shifting metrics and your redefinitions simply because you cannot admit to having made a slight error.

Sounds rough. I hope your day gets better.

 

[VinnyVeritas]

Sounds rough.

 

[phrodeau]

Then go live some place where they don't allow gun ownership and tell us how you like it there...

That’s such an anti-American thing to post. Don’t you know what being an American means?

 

[Lazaran]

So ineedhelp1 supports the legalization of all drugs???

ineedhelp1



Side note: There was a time when pretty much all drugs were legal in the US: When it became apparent that certain drugs were being abused or were inherently dangerous, they were criminalized.

Even alcohol is criminalized for those under 21. And rightfully so.

Ironically, weed is probably the least dangerous drug there is, but I wouldn’t want it legalized for anyone under 21 because of it’s known effects on cognitive development.

ineedhelp1

 

[phrodeau]

Amendment XVIII
Section 1
After one year from the ratification of this article the manufacture, sale, or transportation of intoxicating liquors within, the importation thereof into, or the exportation thereof from the United States and all the territory subject to the jurisdiction thereof for beverage purposes is hereby prohibited.

 

[Ramone45]

America's children are endangered by your permissive attitude toward guns.

Let's look at Florida. The legislature and governor just signed off on constitutional carry and no training required. I see young men, in their 18s to 30s carrying semi automatic weapons and posting on social media of them firing them. This permissive attitude makes it easier for criminals, unstable individuals and dingbats to get weapons. No checks, no need to register, no training. Just open season on guns. Damned be public safety.

The police are statistically more likely to protect than the good guy with the gun. In fact unarmed citizens are more likely to protect against gun violence than the good guy with the gun.

Again, we have more guns in America than people.

Answer to that: Do you think that it is okay to have more guns in America than people?

It's a hard question to answer because it pre-supposes that ALL guns are bad. I don't think it is okay for bad people to have even one gun. I have two, and I'm in the market for a shotgun. I think is is more than fine that I will be the responsible owner of at least three firearms. My loved ones are more secure, and maybe even my community-at-large is potentially more secure. Clearly this boils down to the fundamental position; Is it the guns or the people?

 

[IrezumiKiss]

Then go live some place where they don't allow gun ownership and tell us how you like it there...

https://www.gototravelguides.net/images/photos/tokyo/nightlife/pubcrawl.jpg

https://media.tenor.com/evgIZZxF8wYAAAAC/leo-shrug.gif

 

[adrina]

It's a hard question to answer because it pre-supposes that ALL guns are bad. I don't think it is okay for bad people to have even one gun. I have two, and I'm in the market for a shotgun. I think is is more than fine that I will be the responsible owner of at least three firearms. My loved ones are more secure, and maybe even my community-at-large is potentially more secure. Clearly this boils down to the fundamental position; Is it the guns or the people?

It's the people with the guns. That's the reality. A baseball bat or a knife or any other number of hand and/or projectile weapons do not have the capacity to kill and injure so many so quickly.

The reality is that we have so many guns that it is too easy for emotionally unstable men and dingbats to get their hands on guns. All kinds of guns.

And because of that, we have mass shootings on a more than daily basis.

As good as water is, even it can be deadly in too great of quantity. We are beyond the saturation point for guns for what can be considered sane and responsible.

 

[Ramone45]

It's the people with the guns. That's the reality. A baseball bat or a knife or any other number of hand and/or projectile weapons do not have the capacity to kill and injure so many so quickly.

The reality is that we have so many guns that it is too easy for emotionally unstable men and dingbats to get their hands on guns. All kinds of guns.

And because of that, we have mass shootings on a more than daily basis.

As good as water is, even it can be deadly in too great of quantity. We are beyond the saturation point for guns for what can be considered sane and responsible.

So, you point to the number of guns as beyond the saturation point of sanity and responsibility. I would prefer to address a culture and a society that is not sane or responsible. I've lived in a society where guns were a part of everyday life. But , the people respected each other and the sanctity of life, so gun violence was virtually unheard of. The high school parking lot had student pick-up trucks with gun racks and rifles in them. The rifle team took their rifles on the School Bus with them. Mass shootings were not even in the realm of possibility. I think I want to live in that society, even in the presence of firearms.

 

[HisArpy]

Just Ignored hisArpy for being another asshole

<--- is an Ass. The only assholes around here are those who don't understand how that works and try to make it into something its not.

 

[TrailerHitch]

Alcohol and tobacco are regulated. Purchase is restricted by age. Additionally alcohol and tobacco are not the number one killer of kids under 18. Guns are.

Again we have more guns than people in the United States.

You made my point without even realizing it. With all the rules, regulations, and laws kids still smoke and drink. Hm...

 

[adrina]

You made my point without even realizing it. With all the rules, regulations, and laws kids still smoke and drink. Hm...

Except that gun control laws work. If people smoke and drink it is an action upon their own bodies. Killing and injuring others using guns is an action upon someone else.

The argument you are making is essentially that laws do no good so we should not have them. That's a preposterous argument.

 

[adrina]

So, you point to the number of guns as beyond the saturation point of sanity and responsibility. I would prefer to address a culture and a society that is not sane or responsible. I've lived in a society where guns were a part of everyday life. But , the people respected each other and the sanctity of life, so gun violence was virtually unheard of. The high school parking lot had student pick-up trucks with gun racks and rifles in them. The rifle team took their rifles on the School Bus with them. Mass shootings were not even in the realm of possibility. I think I want to live in that society, even in the presence of firearms.

I don't discount mental illness issues. I find it ironic however that so many don't really want to talk about the issue of toxic masculinity and the negative impact it has on men and society in general. Which is at the root of so much of this aggressive gun violence.

I find it inordinately ludicrous that there are people honestly worried about "the government" coming for "my guns" so much that they are willing to allow the unstable, the insane and the unfit to have unfettered access to guns.

We have more than daily mass shootings. Responsible gun owners aren't in the crosshairs.

 

[Lazaran]

It's the people with the guns. That's the reality. A baseball bat or a knife or any other number of hand and/or projectile weapons do not have the capacity to kill and injure so many so quickly.

The reality is that we have so many guns that it is too easy for emotionally unstable men and dingbats to get their hands on guns. All kinds of guns.

And because of that, we have mass shootings on a more than daily basis.

As good as water is, even it can be deadly in too great of quantity. We are beyond the saturation point for guns for what can be considered sane and responsible.

A typical example of the RWCJ confronting the gun debate:

- The RWCJ’ confidently steps forward and presents the argument that modern guns are THE SAME as modern vehicles when used for the purpose of inflicting mass casualties.

- Decent intelligent people conditionally agree and suggest modern guns be regulated THE SAME as modern vehicles.

- The RWCJ slinks away into the shadows.

- The RWCJ claims victory.

RWCJ

 

[ll74]

And in our recent history, no one has ever used a car to drive through a crowd.

You make a really great point.

Sounds rough.

A child is almost as likely to die from a gun as they are to die from a car accident.

 

[TrailerHitch]

Except that gun control laws work. If people smoke and drink it is an action upon their own bodies. Killing and injuring others using guns is an action upon someone else.

The argument you are making is essentially that laws do no good so we should not have them. That's a preposterous argument.

So you discount scientific evidence that second hand smoke is dangerous and even deadly to people that don't smoke? Add to that if smoking only harms the smoker why is it banned in most public places and government buildings? Or that drunken behavior, whether driving or other erratic violent behavior, doesn't endanger and kill innocent bystanders? These actions do injure and kill others in certain circumstances.

That's not my argument at all. My point is simply this laws are only as good as those that obey them. There are laws against murder and yet murders occur. Why if its illegal? There are a multitude of guns laws and yet these shootings occur. Why if its illegal? My point is simply this, another feel good law that accomplishes nothing is worth exactly that, nothing. You repeatedly scoff at my suggestions to improve mental health and to massively increase criminal penalties for any gun law violation or use of a gun in a crime. You answer with talking points over and over but nothing of any real substance. How about you put down the playbook and just talk to me person to person? I would love to see an end to these mass shootings, as well as an end to gangland violence in the inner city. Mental health, punishment, and creating new opportunities economically are viable solutions.