FL House passes 15 week abortion ban

[BabyBoomer50s]

The times they are a changing. The SCOTUS Dobbs ruling will be coming within the next 120 days.

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/florida-house-passes-gop-15-week-abortion-ban-82946349

 

[HisArpy]

I'm amazed that people seem to think Dobbs is going to overturn Roe.

Roe has a ton of things wrong with it, as the never-ending litigation would make anyone who was actually paying attention realize, but the SCOTUS isn't going to overturn a major precedent that they've been solidly supporting for the past 50 years.

My prediction is that neither side is going to be overjoyed with the ruling in Dobbs.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

I'm amazed that people seem to think Dobbs is going to overturn Roe.

Roe has a ton of things wrong with it, as the never-ending litigation would make anyone who was actually paying attention realize, but the SCOTUS isn't going to overturn a major precedent that they've been solidly supporting for the past 50 years.

My prediction is that neither side is going to be overjoyed with the ruling in Dobbs.

We won’t know what’s in the SCOTUS decision until it comes, but clearly many states anticipate greater latitude in setting their own abortion laws.

 

[GothTalk]

We won’t know what’s in the SCOTUS decision until it comes, but clearly many states anticipate greater latitude in setting their own abortion laws.

Well, with the (D)'eez argument leading the way, why shouldn't they be???

No right is absolute, all can be infringed as much as democracy sees fit!!!!

 

[HisArpy]

We won’t know what’s in the SCOTUS decision until it comes, but clearly many states anticipate greater latitude in setting their own abortion laws.

This idea stems from what I posted earlier.

Think about this:

SCOTUS, in Roe, said that abortion is a Constitutional Right. Over the years they've set the national standard on when it's permissible, and when it's not.

Yet, what you're saying here is that people believe the individual states should have the power to decide those things on an ad hoc basis. And that they believe that the SCOTUS is going to give it to them despite SCOTUS holding the line against exactly that sort of thing for decades.

Why? Because the SCOTUS is currently heavy on conservatives? There have been conservative majorities in the past, recently too, which have sided with Roe and against the positions being advanced in Dobbs.

Which ought to tell you that the dream of getting rid of Roe isn't going to happen and anyone who tells you that Dobbs is going to change all of that, isn't thinking with their head or living in reality.

 

[ll74]

Arbitrary much?

Viability should be the measurement. Everything else is just people wanting to completely outlaw a valid medical procedure

 

[Sean Renaud]

Well, with the (D)'eez argument leading the way, why shouldn't they be???

No right is absolute, all can be infringed as much as democracy sees fit!!!!

That's not a Democrat thing, that's a person who can objectively look at the world thing. You know you're really the only person who debates this right?

 

[Rotadom]

The war on women spreads to Florida.

 

[Comshaw]

We won’t know what’s in the SCOTUS decision until it comes, but clearly many states anticipate greater latitude in setting their own abortion laws.

Let's just ban abortion outright. I'll support that IF:

1)sex educate is instituted to a level where every child by the time they reach puberty knows all the information necessary to avoid pregnancy.

2) FREE birth control is offered to EVERYONE starting when they hit puberty. And not just condoms but ALL forms of birth control.

3) That if a girl or woman becomes pregnant and they do not wish to be, they are supported by the government, at a level to live comfortably (an acceptable living space, free medical, appropriate amounts of food and a stipend for incidentals) until the child is 18.

4) That #3 is supplanted or supplemented by the father until the child is 18.

Not acceptable? If not why not? If a government can force a female to carry a child to term, then insist she raise that child, that government should be responsible to make sure they have the amenities to live on.

And please don't come out with the "they already are 'cause most are no welfare". If you are going to insist that's the case, prove the point with FACTS.




Comshaw

 

[ll74]

I support all of these.

If pro lifers push for "life begins at conception", then all laws should support that and all health benefits, taxes and others should reflect it as well

Let's just ban abortion outright. I'll support that IF:

1)sex educate is instituted to a level where every child by the time they reach puberty knows all the information necessary to avoid pregnancy.

2) FREE birth control is offered to EVERYONE starting when they hit puberty. And not just condoms but ALL forms of birth control.

3) That if a girl or woman becomes pregnant and they do not wish to be, they are supported by the government, at a level to live comfortably (an acceptable living space, free medical, appropriate amounts of food and a stipend for incidentals) until the child is 18.

4) That #3 is supplanted or supplemented by the father until the child is 18.

Not acceptable? If not why not? If a government can force a female to carry a child to term, then insist she raise that child, that government should be responsible to make sure they have the amenities to live on.

And please don't come out with the "they already are 'cause most are no welfare". If you are going to insist that's the case, prove the point with FACTS.




Comshaw

 

[GothTalk]

That's not a Democrat thing, that's a person who can objectively look at the world thing. You know you're really the only person who debates this right?

It is when you bring up abortion.

Then SUDDENLY that right is ABSOLUTE and totally beyond any regulations....SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!!!!

Unlike literally all other rights which all according to you lot need to be infringed out of existence.

No I'm not, that's why they are such hot button topics on a national level.

The war on women spreads to Florida.

COMMON SENSE REGULATION is suddenly a war on women now???

Since when was COMMON SENSE REGULATION a problem??

 

[ll74]

COMMON SENSE REGULATION is suddenly a war on women now???

Since when was COMMON SENSE REGULATION a problem??

There's no common sense involved in a 15 week ban. It is literally only being passed to push the envelope on existing law and is a stop gap to full-on banning of abortion which will follow

 

[Sean Renaud]

It is when you bring up abortion.

Then SUDDENLY that right is ABSOLUTE and totally beyond any regulations....SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!!!!

Unlike literally all other rights which all according to you lot need to be infringed out of existence.

No I'm not, that's why they are such hot button topics on a national level.



COMMON SENSE REGULATION is suddenly a war on women now???

Since when was COMMON SENSE REGULATION a problem??

There is no "when it comes to this" because the fact that we are debating whether or not it can be regulated. Because a woman does not have a right to control her own body, she have a privilege and the hopes that people like yourself do not change the agreement that they are more than incubators with legs. Through your actions you've proven what you think they are. That doesn't change the facts of the case.

There are no such things as common sense regulations when it comes to abortion. These are not things that are based at all in the science, just in the fee fees.

 

[GothTalk]

There's no common sense involved in a 15 week ban.

That's a nice opinion midwest.

The people of Florida, democratically disagree.

It is literally only being passed to push the envelope on existing law and is a stop gap to full-on banning of abortion.

I understand you have a problem with American democracy.

But there is no need to spread insane conspiracy theories and dangerous misinformation with your hate speech.

 

[ll74]

There is no "when it comes to this" because the fact that we are debating whether or not it can be regulated. Because a woman does not have a right to control her own body, she have a privilege and the hopes that people like yourself do not change the agreement that they are more than incubators with legs. Through your actions you've proven what you think they are. That doesn't change the facts of the case.

There are no such things as common sense regulations when it comes to abortion. These are not things that are based at all in the science, just in the fee fees.

Exactly. The limits imposed are random...viability is the closest thing to common sense, but even that doesn't account for everything a woman has to deal with.

If they want the baby to have rights at conception,, then you either need a solid regulation point that is consistent.or your provide a woman the ability to accommodate whatever other thing is required without cost.

 

[GothTalk]

There is no "when it comes to this" because the fact that we are debating whether or not it can be regulated.

Of course there is, pretending your hypocrisy isn't a thing doesn't make it actually go away.

Because a woman does not have a right to control her own body, she have a privilege and the hopes that people like yourself do not change the agreement that they are more than incubators with legs. Through your actions you've proven what you think they are. That doesn't change the facts of the case.

Of course she does.

And how absurd, I'm 100% pro-choice.

Why are you so dishonest as to make up such absurd lies??

Your sad attempt at ascription is what doesn't change the facts.

There are no such things as common sense regulations when it comes to abortion.
These are not things that are based at all in the science, just in the fee fees.

That's a nice opinion. And I think you should live in a state that reflects those values.

However their political ideals are based in science.

Fee fees are on both sides of the argument. Anyone saying otherwise is objectively full of partisan shit.

 

[ll74]

That's a nice opinion midwest.

The people of Florida, democratically disagree.



I understand you have a problem with American democracy.

But there is no need to spread insane conspiracy theories and dangerous misinformation with your hate speech.

No, 15 weeks has no basis in biology. And history has shown the purpose is to push regulation towards conception. Every single timeframe has been replace by a shorter timeframe. Math is simple -> conception

I don't have a problem with democracy...I support more people voting than you do.

 

[GothTalk]

Exactly. The limits imposed are random...

Tell us more about your "COMMON SENSE" gun control.... LOL

THAT'S DIFFERENT!!!!

 

[GothTalk]

No, 15 weeks has no basis in biology.

No but being pro-life is.

I don't have a problem with democracy..

Doesn't seem that way to me.... seems to have you and the other abortion fanatics pretty upset.

But I'm glad you support Florida doing Florida.

 

[Sean Renaud]

There is absolutely not hypocricy. There is a simple fact that there is no "when it comes to this." There are no such things as rights. Its not on this, or on that. If you were even 50% pro choice you wouldn't be defending the right EVER in your life. Everyone reads what you write my friend, we know what you're all about.

The political ideals of the pro-lifers it not based in science. They simply are not. They are based 100% on Fee fees. I didn't say emotions aren't on both sides and I will happily slap down rape and incest excuses down because they are so exceedingly rare there is no reason for them to be part of the conversation. Its underhanded. To pretend that is the driving reason however is a flat lie.
[/QUOTE]

Tell us more about your "COMMON SENSE" gun control.... LOL

THAT'S DIFFERENT!!!!

No its not. You don't have rights, you have privileges, and they can be taken away. They have been taken away and there isn't much of a push to bring them back. After that its just a matter of doing the math, practicallity and whatever else we decide to negotiate on.

Why do you always use the word guns?

 

[ll74]

Tell us more about your "COMMON SENSE" gun control.... LOL

THAT'S DIFFERENT!!!!

Tell us how a gun exists inside of a person.

 

[GothTalk]

Tell us how a gun exists inside of a person.

I never claimed it did.

You're deflecting... anything to avoid acknowledging your hypocrisy.

 

[ll74]

No but being pro-life is.



Doesn't seem that way to me.... seems to have you and the other abortion fanatics pretty upset.

But I'm glad you support Florida doing Florida.

Having an opinion about policy != Being against democracy.

I have no desire to prevent democracy to advance my policy opinions I don't even have a desire to alter legislative process dramatically.

I'm fine with lobbying my reps and electing new reps regarding my opinion.

 

[ll74]

I never claimed it did.

You're deflecting... anything to avoid acknowledging your hypocrisy.

You're equating the two, so I'm assuming you have the "common sense" to understand key differences which make it a false equivalency.

Maybe I shouldn't assume things.

 

[GothTalk]

There is absolutely not hypocricy.

Yes there is.

My rights are infringeable as you feel.

But YOUR rights, YOUR golden cows, those SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!!!

LOL....no hypocrisy you're lying to yourself.

The political ideals of the pro-lifers it not based in science. They simply are not. They are based 100% on Fee fees.

Of course it is, but being a biology denier I'm not shocked you think so.

No its not. You don't have rights, you have privileges,

You're legally, ideologically and factually incorrect.

Why do you always use the word guns?

Because it's the one that highlights the lefts hypocrisy "Absolute rights for me.... heavily regulated privileges for thee!!" and elitism.