The Romance Category

[Zootonius]

I'm interested in other's view of the Romance Category. I have a story planned that starts as straight romance between a heterosexual couple in part one. But ends in a Ménage à trois. Looking at some tags it goes. But looking a a few comments. Some are offended by threesomes, etc. In short, I think it's a category that some are purists in.

So what are your thoughts on what is or isn't romance?

 

[KeithD]

You haven't identified the gender of the third. It makes a huge difference.

 

[Rustyoznail]

I'm interested in other's view of the Romance Category. I have a story planned that starts as straight romance between a heterosexual couple in part one. But ends in a Ménage à trois. Looking at some tags it goes. But looking a a few comments. Some are offended by threesomes, etc. In short, I think it's a category that some are purists in.

So what are your thoughts on what is or isn't romance?

It’s the HEA readers are interested in. My second India-vs-Australia story went into romance, and came 3rd in a comp. It had a big MFF scene, and a marriage proposal. Nobody seems to be worried about the multiple people.

 

[Zootonius]

You haven't identified the gender of the third. It makes a huge difference.

Another woman.

 

[NotWise]

I'm interested in other's view of the Romance Category. I have a story planned that starts as straight romance between a heterosexual couple in part one. But ends in a Ménage à trois. Looking at some tags it goes. But looking a a few comments. Some are offended by threesomes, etc. In short, I think it's a category that some are purists in.

So what are your thoughts on what is or isn't romance?

Romance readers reward stories that fit the Romance mold; a man and woman who don't already know each other meet and find a mutual interest. They struggle through barriers to eventually build a relationship, and they live happily ever after or at least happily for now.

The definition from Romance Writers of America allows for homosexual couples, but to the best of my knowledge, homosexual relationships are better off in different Lit categories.

Romance is a fairly small category, and even the committed Romance readers may accept more variations than that definition allows. Also, quite a few of the people who view your story may get to it through the New list, or some route other than the Romance hub.

But menage a trois? I can't predict. It might work as a Group Sex story, but I don't know how well that category accepts sentimental content. My only story there is pretty sentimental, and its acceptance has been OK.

 

[KeithD]

Another woman.

You'll probably do fine in Romance if they all are happy with the arrangement.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I posted a female-female story in Romance. It's done pretty well there even though the ending is only ambiguously HEA.

I got one "this doesn't belong in Romance" comment - I think because of the lesbian themes, but could have been for the ending - but everybody else seemed pretty happy with it. I haven't experimented with poly in that category, but I suspect the other comments are right that as long as there's no male-male, it should do okay.

 

[JuanSeiszFitzHall]

I posted a female-female story in Romance. It's done pretty well there even though the ending is only ambiguously HEA.

I got one "this doesn't belong in Romance" comment - I think because of the lesbian themes, but could have been for the ending - but everybody else seemed pretty happy with it. I haven't experimented with poly in that category, but I suspect the other comments are right that as long as there's no male-male, it should do okay.

Please don’t be offended by this, but your modesty blurs your information content. “Loss Function” was, at the time of the AI event, in the Romance all-time top list (and deservedly so). It shouldn’t be shrugged off as just another story in that category. It was an exception for which standard category expectations didn’t apply.

My own experience in Romance has been baffling. I learned a few things the hard way, but even when I thought I had a story that met what I thought were the consensus criteria, it gathered few views (despite being in a contest) and apparently several yawns. Yes, I know, I should just write better stories.

https://www.literotica.com/stories/memberpage.php?uid=5116173&page=submissions

 

[Bramblethorn]

Please don’t be offended by this, but your modesty blurs your information content. “Loss Function” was, at the time of the AI event, in the Romance all-time top list (and deservedly so). It shouldn’t be shrugged off as just another story in that category. It was an exception for which standard category expectations didn’t apply.

I couldn't possibly be offended by this. I think that's the nicest contradiction I've ever received

 

[Zootonius]

I posted a female-female story in Romance. It's done pretty well there even though the ending is only ambiguously HEA.

I got one "this doesn't belong in Romance" comment - I think because of the lesbian themes, but could have been for the ending - but everybody else seemed pretty happy with it. I haven't experimented with poly in that category, but I suspect the other comments are right that as long as there's no male-male, it should do okay.

If I were to wager a guess, Pt 1 of my story will pass. But some won't like Pt 2, with the turn it will take. Yet it's where I think it should stay.

 

[ElectricBlue]

If I were to wager a guess, Pt 1 of my story will pass. But some won't like Pt 2, with the turn it will take. Yet it's where I think it should stay.

Have the courage of your convictions. Who cares if the category police have a moan - who are you writing for, open minded readers or narrow minded opinionistas? You choose .

 

[yukonnights]

I think you can do fine in romance IF YOU MAKE IT CLEAR WHAT'S AHEAD. Some people still hold on to their refusal to accept the reality of non-hetero sexualities. I take it as my responsibility as an author to be clear what the general theme is upfront. As you probably already know, the Happy Ending is pretty important. Overall, it's been my experience that the romance readers reward the stories that fit the expectations.

I've put three stories in Romance but the only story that's non-heterosexual is this one;

April Can Be So Foolish - A Lesbian and Transgender Romance.
03/05/2018 in Romance Stories
28 favorites - 16.8k views - 4.72 /192 votes - 18 comments

PS: My latest story below is also in Romance, but it is 100% heterosexual

 

[PennameWombat]

This is only because I follow a mainstream Romance author on Twitter (not for her writing, I'm not a fan of what I have read in it, but because she posted about something else, just to let you all know that what I know about the genre can fit in the period at the end of this sentence.)

Some other author, who claimed to be a Romance author, posted a tweet that most assumed was satire, because she said "what is this about Romance needing HEA or HFN? That's never been the case!"

Anyway, I only saw it because the author I follow chimed in, along with, oh, a million others. The original tweet apparently wasn't satire and the woman who wrote it wondered, "well, then, what genre are my books?"

The massed response seemed to come down to "we don't know and we don't care." I stayed silent and just popped up a bowl of popcorn and enjoyed the show.

 

[Bramblethorn]

This is only because I follow a mainstream Romance author on Twitter (not for her writing, I'm not a fan of what I have read in it, but because she posted about something else, just to let you all know that what I know about the genre can fit in the period at the end of this sentence.)

Some other author, who claimed to be a Romance author, posted a tweet that most assumed was satire, because she said "what is this about Romance needing HEA or HFN? That's never been the case!"

Anyway, I only saw it because the author I follow chimed in, along with, oh, a million others. The original tweet apparently wasn't satire and the woman who wrote it wondered, "well, then, what genre are my books?"

The massed response seemed to come down to "we don't know and we don't care." I stayed silent and just popped up a bowl of popcorn and enjoyed the show.

One variation I've seen from some romance orgs is "must have an emotionally satisfying ending that affirms the relationship", or words along those lines. Doesn't roll off the tongue as easily as "happily ever after", but might be a slightly more accurate description of what readers are willing to accept.

"Here's the story of my great-great-grandparents John and Jane! They met when they were working for two rival kitten rescue organisations, at firs they had some misunderstandings and got off on the wrong foot, but eventually they fell in love and made it work. They were happily married until passing away in their nineties, and the Lonely Kitten Animal Home they started all those years ago is still going strong today."

Technically, that's not a HEA/HFN for John and Jane - by the end of the story they're dead. But I suspect a lot of romance readers would accept that.

If the story has a twist "love sucks" ending, OTOH... yeah, romance readers aren't there for that and will say so.

 

[NotWise]

OTechnically, that's not a HEA/HFN for John and Jane - by the end of the story they're dead. But I suspect a lot of romance readers would accept that.

Carry a story out long enough and the main characters are going to die -- barring immortality. I don't think their demise necessarily makes it a sad ending.

I thought the ending to "Love is Enough" was an HEA ending until xelliebabex pointed out that it wasn't, really. TJ wouldn't be reunited with Hannah and Gabby until he died. It was as much akin to a tragedy as a romance. But then, I think tragedies can be used to great effect.

 

[yowser]

Some other author, who claimed to be a Romance author, posted a tweet that most assumed was satire, because she said "what is this about Romance needing HEA or HFN? That's never been the case!"

Another mysterious and unexplained acronym.

HEA I got.

But HFN?

Heavenly Fucking Now?
Healthy Female Nookie?
Hedonistic Fornication is Normal?

 

[NotWise]

Another mysterious and unexplained acronym.

HEA I got.

But HFN?

Heavenly Fucking Now?
Healthy Female Nookie?
Hedonistic Fornication is Normal?

Happy for Now.

 

[PennameWombat]

Another mysterious and unexplained acronym.

HEA I got.

But HFN?

Heavenly Fucking Now?
Healthy Female Nookie?
Hedonistic Fornication is Normal?

Yeah, sorry. It's a Romance thread, so I assumed key acronyms would be known.

As already posted, "Happy for Now." The ur-definition of Romance (according to, ahem, the RWA, Romance Writers of America and publishers, etc.) is (part of this has been noted upthread):
(Write for Harlequin: HEA or HFN?)

• A Central Love Story: The main plot centers around individuals falling in love and struggling to make the relationship work. A writer can include as many subplots as he/she wants as long as the love story is the main focus of the novel.
  
• An Emotionally Satisfying and Optimistic Ending: In a romance, the lovers who risk and struggle for each other and their relationship are rewarded with emotional justice and unconditional love.

HFN is hard to describe, but HEA implies the love match is solidified with the wedding, or whatever. The HFN is less solidly defined, but still implies the central love story has resolved successfully, just not with such finality.

Or perhaps your hero has lost his wife, and is completely focused on raising his young son. For this hero, even starting to date the woman who has taught him that it’s okay to open his heart again would be the most romantic HFN that you could offer your reader.

The idea of their marriage and relationship moving into the future (the HEA) is left to the reader's assumption. They're happy, though, together and moving forward. Happy for now.

 

[Rustyoznail]

Carry a story out long enough and the main characters are going to die -- barring immortality. I don't think their demise necessarily makes it a sad ending.

I thought the ending to "Love is Enough" was an HEA ending until xelliebabex pointed out that it wasn't, really. TJ wouldn't be reunited with Hannah and Gabby until he died. It was as much akin to a tragedy as a romance. But then, I think tragedies can be used to great effect.

Romeo & Juliet - romance or tragedy? A romantic tragedy? A tragic romance?

Everyone's opinion will be a bit different - you need to ask yourself how you really feel about it. Does your story meet what you think a romance is? It may have other elements but as long they aren't big category trump cards (incest, gay, etc...) then drop it in romance. That's the only one way to know for for sure how readers feel about it.

 

[NotWise]

Romeo & Juliet - romance or tragedy? A romantic tragedy? A tragic romance?

Everyone's opinion will be a bit different - you need to ask yourself how you really feel about it. Does your story meet what you think a romance is? It may have other elements but as long they aren't big category trump cards (incest, gay, etc...) then drop it in romance. That's the only one way to know for for sure how readers feel about it.

To my mind, there's no question that Romeo and Juliet is a tragedy. They both die unnecessarily, and there's not a happy outcome anywhere in sight. Many tragedies are romantic (my "The Third Ring," for instance). That doesn't make them a Romance.

On the other hand, I imagine readers of the Romance category might take that in stride.

 

[rescatooor]

Back in Shakespeares times there were really just comedies and tragedies. Although love between Romeo and Juliet is depicted as pure and real, it's also a story about teenage rebellion and stupidity of family disputes that results with the plays end.

Romances appear to be a rather modern thing. Fairy tales used to be tales of terror. They warned of possible dangers of strangers. Hell, some versions of sleeping beauty are about rape that depict the prince/king as a semi-villain.

I think Romance readers are a fairly demanding lot. I would say that HFN endings are perceived very differently by authors and readers. Readers just take it as true love, while the author's may have wished to depict two romantic characters struggling with the reality of the situation.

 

[NotWise]

Romances appear to be a rather modern thing. Fairy tales used to be tales of terror. They warned of possible dangers of strangers. Hell, some versions of sleeping beauty are about rape that depict the prince/king as a semi-villain.

As I recall, the Romance genre became a thing in the 1920's or 30's.

 

[MelissaBaby]

Technically, that's not a HEA/HFN for John and Jane - by the end of the story they're dead. But I suspect a lot of romance readers would accept that.

Been there, done that, got a 4.87 rating.